la dargis:
He hasn’t changed cinema, but with blue people and pink blooms he has confirmed its wonder.
― hellzapoppa (tipsy mothra), Friday, 18 December 2009 01:42 (fourteen years ago) link
how does this compare to, say, Beowulf 3D
― 囧 (dyao), Friday, 18 December 2009 03:04 (fourteen years ago) link
Angelina Jolie's boobs weren't nearly as immersive.
― Zoo Snickers (Deric W. Haircare), Friday, 18 December 2009 03:20 (fourteen years ago) link
This "confirming cinema's wonder" type argument really STICKS IN MY CRAW. Go on a fuckin motionmaster or something if you want ooh wow it looks so cool type crap, man. Or take some drugs, I dunno. I could be entirely wrong, it just seems silly to think that the wonder of cinema consists of special effects w no decent context (haven't heard anyone standing up for the plot etc so far, after all)
― The reverse TARDIS of pasta (Niles Caulder), Friday, 18 December 2009 03:40 (fourteen years ago) link
Most of the positive reviews I've read are basically 'eh the movie mostly sucks but FUCKIN A 3-D'
― mayor jingleberries, Friday, 18 December 2009 04:00 (fourteen years ago) link
yes, this makes sense, the future of hollywood should be 300 million dollar productions
― avatar brothers (Tape Store), Friday, 18 December 2009 04:12 (fourteen years ago) link
the "confirming cinema's wonder" argument depends on more than just eye appeal. it depends on the film's ability to immerse (that word) you in the its universe and moment, so the eye candy becomes real to you, becomes a better-than-real world. it works best on kids, and that's why people who were kids in the late 70s will always be the biggest star wars fans. the measure of avatar probably isn't how adult critics react to it in the here and now, but how young adults remember it a decade or two down the line.
― a dimension that can only be accessed through self-immolation (contenderizer), Friday, 18 December 2009 04:29 (fourteen years ago) link
Like the way kids who are 26 now think fondly of Titanic?
― Astronaut Mike Dexter (Jimmy The Mod Awaits The Return Of His Beloved), Friday, 18 December 2009 04:32 (fourteen years ago) link
I wasn't born when Star Wars came out and I love it, tho
― The reverse TARDIS of pasta (Niles Caulder), Friday, 18 December 2009 04:38 (fourteen years ago) link
in terms of pure escapism video games have had movies beat for the past 10 years or so
― 囧 (dyao), Friday, 18 December 2009 04:40 (fourteen years ago) link
uhhh
― avatar brothers (Tape Store), Friday, 18 December 2009 04:40 (fourteen years ago) link
Dude, that's the thing! Why're movies competing w a medium they can't beat? Unless you can tell the characters what to do etc, this is a stupid principle to be acting off
xopost
― The reverse TARDIS of pasta (Niles Caulder), Friday, 18 December 2009 04:41 (fourteen years ago) link
except, most ppl don't play video games on cinema screens, with cinema sound systems.
― jabba hands, Friday, 18 December 2009 04:55 (fourteen years ago) link
immersiveness is a false grail imo
any good art should be immersive
― akira goldsman (s1ocki), Friday, 18 December 2009 05:03 (fourteen years ago) link
yeah, when i want this kind of jolt, i just play a game
― fictional, homosexual, Baltimore hoodlum (forksclovetofu), Friday, 18 December 2009 06:06 (fourteen years ago) link
http://img.slate.com/media/1/122939/2207695/2237022/2238895/CA_091217_avatar.jpg
― ice cr?m, Friday, 18 December 2009 06:06 (fourteen years ago) link
^^^think this is going to be indicative of the HARD JOURNALISM directed at this for the next 48 hours
― fictional, homosexual, Baltimore hoodlum (forksclovetofu), Friday, 18 December 2009 06:08 (fourteen years ago) link
really cannot believe in this day and age people are still talking abt movies and video games as if they do the same things
― ice cr?m, Friday, 18 December 2009 06:12 (fourteen years ago) link
seems silly to think that the wonder of cinema consists of special effects w no decent context
Kinda agree there, but on the second hand I also think a lot of movies these days hinge wholly on plots that are so unbelievable and half-assed the suspension of disbelief is getting worn out. Maybe some big budget eye candy with no narrative would be a cool future for cinema.
― Adam Bruneau, Friday, 18 December 2009 06:20 (fourteen years ago) link
pretty sure this movie would do roughly the same thing for me as playing uncharted 2
― fictional, homosexual, Baltimore hoodlum (forksclovetofu), Friday, 18 December 2009 06:24 (fourteen years ago) link
just not in all EYEPOPPING 3-D but i will trade you that for being in a theater on opening night any day
I might be more receptive to the idea of "all spectacle" if the spectacle wasn't so blandly unimaginative.
I'm sure it'll be a fun 3 hours and whatnot, but it still looks like Delgo with a bigger budget. Which is really just removing half of what was lame about Delgo.
― Matt Armstrong, Friday, 18 December 2009 06:26 (fourteen years ago) link
yeah cause movies are always filled w/scenes of u trying to jump over a pit and falling on spikes repeatedly for two hours - movies and video games are less similar than wikipedia and a novel - they both compete for yr entertainment time but past that xp
― ice cr?m, Friday, 18 December 2009 06:29 (fourteen years ago) link
That's a terribly poor point
― The reverse TARDIS of pasta (Niles Caulder), Friday, 18 December 2009 07:01 (fourteen years ago) link
yeah cause movies are always filled w/scenes of u trying to jump over a pit and falling on spikes repeatedly for two hours
don't give lars von trier any ideas.
― hellzapoppa (tipsy mothra), Friday, 18 December 2009 07:12 (fourteen years ago) link
as someone who's done his fair share of both, movies and video games do NOTHING like the same thing to me... even so-called cinematic ones like uncharted. i've never, ever been emotionally invested in anything that happens in a video game (or any character), never wondered how the story was going to develop... they are barely in the same universe for me
― akira goldsman (s1ocki), Friday, 18 December 2009 08:00 (fourteen years ago) link
i saw this today. i won't say much 'til people have had a chance to download it or wahtever, but it was better than i thought it would be.
― richie aprile (rockapads), Friday, 18 December 2009 08:10 (fourteen years ago) link
i just came back from it. basically slocki otm BUT
― krampus activities (latebloomer), Friday, 18 December 2009 08:12 (fourteen years ago) link
...
― akira goldsman (s1ocki), Friday, 18 December 2009 08:14 (fourteen years ago) link
yeah i agreed with slocki's review, though the blue people didn't bother me as much. thing about them that i admired was that i it really didn't take too long for me to think of them as "people". there was no uncanny valley distraction (which is good because this movie would have failed utterly if it had, since the movie depends on the audience empathizing with them to work on any level).
― richie aprile (rockapads), Friday, 18 December 2009 08:16 (fourteen years ago) link
it is TOTALLY ferngully with guns btw
― krampus activities (latebloomer), Friday, 18 December 2009 08:18 (fourteen years ago) link
...in a good way, mostly!
the earth mother gaia hooey does get to be a bit much after a while
― krampus activities (latebloomer), Friday, 18 December 2009 08:21 (fourteen years ago) link
yeah, and some of the more sentimental scenes sort of made me cringe. the two things i found the most annoying were the music and the accents. just this sort of generic indistinct ethnic otherness.
― richie aprile (rockapads), Friday, 18 December 2009 08:25 (fourteen years ago) link
thing about them that i admired was that i it really didn't take too long for me to think of them as "people". there was no uncanny valley distraction
yeah, i was impressed the most by this. overall the f/x were great. they generally had a nice tangible, physical feel to them despite not being 100% photoreal.
also nice to see action sequences that had clear geography and were easy to follow. don't know why that's so rare in modern movies.
― krampus activities (latebloomer), Friday, 18 December 2009 08:41 (fourteen years ago) link
anyway that's not to excuse the film's flaws, just to say that it does the spectacle part very very well.
― krampus activities (latebloomer), Friday, 18 December 2009 09:05 (fourteen years ago) link
i will paste this everywhere
― moullet, Friday, 18 December 2009 10:25 (fourteen years ago) link
― akira goldsman (s1ocki), Friday, 18 December 2009 08:00 (2 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
^yes
― cozwn, Friday, 18 December 2009 10:41 (fourteen years ago) link
well, see, no in my case. I've had some emotional involvement and intellectual curiosity about plot development with games and it feels about as properly placed as if I had same with a cameron film.obvs this is personal so i don't feel the need to really argue a point here, but I will say that I don't need to see a big visual spectacular with no plot anymore and it ain't that I'm above it or something; it's just less likely to leave me really engaged. I've seen a gazillion lush gorgeous films and i'd rather do yimou than bay i guess; I gotta have some meat in the plot and characterizations OR i gotta be able to have physical control of the characters themselves or my mind wanders.
― fictional, homosexual, Baltimore hoodlum (forksclovetofu), Friday, 18 December 2009 11:31 (fourteen years ago) link
lol I'm not saying games = movies; I'm just saying in terms of spectacle/worldbuilding games do it better, and so far avatars big draw is how much of a spectacle it presents
― 囧 (dyao), Friday, 18 December 2009 11:58 (fourteen years ago) link
I'll also freely admit that the last game I played was modern warfare 2 so that probably colors my viewpoint
― 囧 (dyao), Friday, 18 December 2009 12:02 (fourteen years ago) link
as an aside, I see the PS3 can handle 3D apparently but we'll all need another telly upgrade or alternatively expensive glasses to use it
― cozwn, Friday, 18 December 2009 12:03 (fourteen years ago) link
Flick was fun. Definitely some Starcraft moments (a friend said it was Terrans + Night Elves, so a cross-property Blizzard affair).
― Mordy, Friday, 18 December 2009 12:06 (fourteen years ago) link
desplechin = video gamescameron = cinema
― moullet, Friday, 18 December 2009 12:47 (fourteen years ago) link
cameron = cinemadesplechin = video games life
― queen frostine (Eric H.), Friday, 18 December 2009 12:59 (fourteen years ago) link
I don't need to see a big visual spectacular with no plot anymore and it ain't that I'm above it or something; it's just less likely to leave me really engaged.
^This, basically. And the thing is, that isn't really how Cameron used to be. The reason why his older stuff (Aliens, The Abyss, the Terminators) worked is because it wasn't all spectacle. There was also an engaging (if somewhat facile) featuring characters you cared about somewhat. From everything that's been said about Avatar thus far, the story appears to be pretty weak, so if it's all just Arnie rampin' off an overpass in 3-D, I can prolly just wait for the home theater showroom demo at the Best Buy.
― Zoo Snickers (Deric W. Haircare), Friday, 18 December 2009 13:56 (fourteen years ago) link
"engaging (if somewhat facile) story", I meant.
Deric otm! It's so disappointing because we have proof the guy was a great storyteller; he just didn't seem to care anymore when he could instead be playing with 3d blue titties.
― "can´t you be just normal?? be normal just once!" (a hoy hoy), Friday, 18 December 2009 14:04 (fourteen years ago) link
― krampus activities (latebloomer), Friday, December 18, 2009 7:41 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark
this line alone makes me want to see it! we should do a thread on 00s action sequences that manage this
― jabba hands, Friday, 18 December 2009 14:09 (fourteen years ago) link
― ice cr?m, Friday, December 18, 2009 1:29 AM (8 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
― The reverse TARDIS of pasta (Niles Caulder), Friday, December 18, 2009 2:01 AM (7 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
you are a terribly poor point
― ice cr?m, Friday, 18 December 2009 14:51 (fourteen years ago) link