Rolling Teenpop 2006 Thread

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And maybe not so coincidental that a lot of these stars are actresses, too?

xp - I always thought of Cheap Trick's version as a kind of believable '50s nostalgia. believable because it was about '50s rock and roll as a very rocking music! I think it's quite dynamite.

Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Friday, 6 January 2006 22:02 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Chuck and Tim, the question is whether you think she wants you to want her. I'm convinced that she wants everyone to want her.

Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Friday, 6 January 2006 22:03 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Guys, she wrote a song about being a drama queen!

Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Friday, 6 January 2006 22:04 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Ha, I always thought Cheap Trick's '50s nostalgia ("All Shook Up," "Ain't That a Shame") sounded totally perfunctory too. So maybe that explains it. Lindsay also does more interesting covers than them. (Though they were pretty great covering Move songs, I guess.)

xhuxk, Friday, 6 January 2006 22:11 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

OK, folks, in further attempts to define the "Fly" sound I will need your adjectival assistance: so far I've used "haunted," "haunting," "gorgeous," "melancholy," "catchy," "heartbreaking beauty," "reverbed-mystery-lament feel," and "aching." That pretty much leaves "ghostly," and then I'm all out of words. (Noun assistance in regard to "beauty" would also be appreciated.)

Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Friday, 6 January 2006 22:14 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Also from the country thread (featuring the word "heartbreaking"):

Speaking of Cougar rocks - though this is off-topic - last week I listened to Jessica Simpson's "I Think I'm In Love With You" for the first time in four years. It's the one that samples the brief bass-guitar fillip from "Jack and Diane" and otherwise is a basic dance-r&b number where she shows off Mariah melismas. It's likable, since she's willing to make the notes fluffy (which isn't to say that she fluffs any of the notes). But what's amazing is the Peter Rauhofer Club Mix that's included on the single. No Cougar notes, just driving, ominous techno and Jessica's "I think I'm in love"s sounding icy but heartbreaking, darting up and down above the jagged synths. Might as well be a totally different song.

(In general, I'm not one of these guys who says, "No, you gotta hear the remix.")

-- Frank Kogan (edcasua...), December 28th, 2005. (Frank Kogan)

Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Friday, 6 January 2006 22:19 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

here are some words for frank and hilary: "saudade" (the portuguese/brazilian word for the happiness in sadness and vice versa), "wistful," "doomladen," "goth-blasted," "coked-up," "cynical"

Haikunym (Haikunym), Friday, 6 January 2006 22:19 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

all the pop girls sound like holly & the italians these days but I think they're actually trying to sound more like "since u been gone"

Fritz Wollner (Fritz), Friday, 6 January 2006 22:23 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

"Girlfriend" doesn't Cougar-rock at all, Frank; it Abba-rocks! And I just prefer "Jack and Diane" to "Does Your Mother Know," I guess. Though I love them both. And in the long run, I may regret not voting for Hope's album (which three P&J voters did, though I can't say who.)

And yeah, she's 17 (and I think the songwriting is often really good).

Mikael Wood's appraisal of her, Brie Larsen, etc, can be found here:,wood,71326,22.html

And the fact that she picked peas on her family farm in Tennesse is pretty country, I guess! Perhaps country fans will eventually agree.

-- xhuxk (xedd...), December 28th, 2005.


Hope Paltrow is far too pretty to remain in the peapatch, for sure.
-- edd s hurt (eddshur...), December 28th, 2005. (ddduncan)

Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Friday, 6 January 2006 22:24 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

And I've used "tremulous beauty ache" too.

Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Friday, 6 January 2006 22:27 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

By the way, sorry to keep bringing this back to Cheap Trick (though
"Surrender" IS one of the best songs ever about being a teenager, so there), but Rick Neilson appears on the new Revolting Cocks CD, which is unlistenable, and his photo on the inner gatefold makes him look much younger than Gibby Hayes and Al Jourgensen and Jello Biafra, all of whom appear there also, and appear to be about 80 years old apiece.

xhuxk, Friday, 6 January 2006 22:29 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

I didn't think Lindsay;s version (I want you to want me) was anywhere near as good/popjoyful as the Letters to Cleo version from a few years back!

Abby (abby mcdonald), Friday, 6 January 2006 22:45 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

the only part of lindsay's version I can see as superior is the percussion. I like the clatter. I definitely prefer the Zander vocal.

'Twan (miccio), Friday, 6 January 2006 22:50 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Hey, frank, what do you think of Evanescence?

'Twan (miccio), Friday, 6 January 2006 22:51 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

zander's vocal is probably less 'believable' but I can enjoy his vocal on a simple musical level in a way I don't dig Lohan's. But I think I'm looking for something different than Kogeddy are.

'Twan (miccio), Friday, 6 January 2006 23:00 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

I've somehow avoided exposure to the Amy Diamond phenomenon completely (before this thread), which is a bit strange since that single was top 10 in Norway for 18 weeks!

Unfortunately, on first listen, it triggers loads of "naff" detectors in me – I think it's because being from "the rest of Europe" (ie not UK and probably Ireland), I've heard loads of terrible Euro stuff employing that not-actually-proper-reggae device, and associate it with Lame Continental Backwaterism. (Examples that have crossed over into UK/US(?) are "Live Is Life" by Opus and "Susanna" by "The Art Company".)

The Vintner's Lipogram (OleM), Friday, 6 January 2006 23:46 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Rick Neilson appears on the new Revolting Cocks CD, which is unlistenable, and his photo on the inner gatefold makes him look much younger than Gibby Hayes and Al Jourgensen and Jello Biafraa

He more than made up for it on that DVD I reviewed early last year, where he looked like someone's scary old grandmother. It's those sweaters. I never liked "I Want You to Want Me" on "In Color" and even less on the Japanese album. There Zander says this song is called "I --- Want -- You --- To ---- Want ---- Meee" like he's talking to retards and lots of small children. I could never get it out of my head. Irritating.

George the Animal Steele, Friday, 6 January 2006 23:57 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Yeah, both versions kinda reeked. They were a weird group, because they could be so great (and, uh, so weird), but sometimes I really felt they were knowingly pandering and condescending to some imaginary lowest common denominator audience--and I almost never say that about *anybody*, so they must have hit a nerve, somehow. I dunno, maybe the spoon-feedy stuff was aimed at their English as a second language fans. The way I felt about those '50s covers is probably close to how some folks feel about smashmouth now.

xhuxk, Saturday, 7 January 2006 00:41 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

when did this "oooh grr smashmouth" thing happen

'Twan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 00:52 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

ha ha you don't have teenage kids, 'twan

xhuxk, Saturday, 7 January 2006 00:59 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

actually, though, smashmouth are some kind of unique case, since at some time they (or at least it seemed they) started doing *only* cover songs for little-kiddie movies, and every kiddie movie wound up having an obligatory smashmouth cover. i sort of respect their utter don't-give-a-shit lack of integrity myself; the singer's a big fat ugly guy, and it's nice to some big fat ugly guys can still make money in this biz, and it's kind of cool how they found their niche. and it seems like they'll basically cover *anything*, not just ? and the mysterians and war and the monkees -- i mean, you can't sink much lower than "ain't gettin nothin for christmas," I don't think. and for all i know, some of their covers are totally great. supposedly they did an all-christmas-covers album available only on the net, including the kinks' "father christmas" and something by the sonics and i forget what else. i'd be curious to hear if it's any good. not curious enough to seek it out myself, though.

xhuxk, Saturday, 7 January 2006 01:15 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

yeah, i totally get why young people might hate them once they started dancing with shrek, but that doesn't seem like the kind of thing you guys would hold against them. i pretty much like all their big hits and I've heard some respectable album tracks too (though i'm tempted to say that the debut is OVERrated, since the only people who talk about it pretend they never did anything good after).

'Twan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 01:22 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

last year was depressing in the sense that a bunch of fine 90s singles bands put out comps but they were all 19 track with b-sides monstrosities rather than the 11 song "platinum edition" things that would actually make them look good.

'Twan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 01:24 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

The Sonics' Christmas song was "Santa Claus" - "I want a brand new car, a twangy guitar, a cute little honey, and lots of money." I wouldn't mind hearing Smashmouth do this (or "Father Christmas," for that matter).

Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Saturday, 7 January 2006 01:30 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

I'm listening to Duff's "Beat of My Heart" right now, and it seems to be a lot more succesful take on what Kelly Osbourne was attempting on her last album: it's more electro, it's slinkier, it's more pop, it's more accessible, and it rocks harder.

So Hillary Duff is better at being Kelly Osbourne than Kelly Osbourne is.

Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Saturday, 7 January 2006 01:51 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

what the fuck are you on, "beat of my heart" sucks ass. how do humans sit through that awayawayawayawaaaaay shit

'Twan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 01:52 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

"wake up" at least pulls some sort of chirpy new wave petual clark thing, but "beat of my heart" is just some shrillass nonsense, easily the worst of the three dead prez tracks on that thing.

'Twan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 01:53 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

petula clark, rather.

i guess you could kelly's album does the new wave thing more sloppily than those new hilary tracks do, but i'm surprised courtney love fans would take offense at that.

'Twan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 01:55 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

easily the worst of the three dead prez tracks on that thing



cancer prone fat guy (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 7 January 2006 01:55 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

hee hee yeah benji and joel call their duo dead presidents

'Twan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 02:02 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

oh wait dead executives SORRY FOR THE CONFUSION

'Twan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 02:03 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

oh and from waaay up thread frank I will take you to the fucking mat over "1985." That song is probably the best pop-punk song post-Young & The Hopeless.

'Twan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 02:03 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

yeah it is okay
unless you listen to the
lyrics which are ASSS

Haikunym (Haikunym), Saturday, 7 January 2006 02:28 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

plus, it's "kokomo"

Haikunym (Haikunym), Saturday, 7 January 2006 02:30 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

One of the central tenents of C.Love fandom is the realisation that you really only need one Courtney. Plus the only track with replay value on Kelly's album is the one that would have fit on the debut album, "Don't Touch Me When I'm Sleeping". Based on a genuine date rape experience, fact fans.

Dom Passantino (Dom Passantino), Saturday, 7 January 2006 02:37 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

yeah it is okay
unless you listen to the
lyrics which are ASSS

only if you can't take the ribbing, ya old fart.

'Twan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 02:39 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

and don't give me the 'oh but blondie didn't coexist with u2' horseshit, cuz old farts getting their facts wrong when waxing nostalgiac about the commerce of their youth is common enough to deserve the ridicule they give it. it's basically like "i'm the type of guy" where people hated ll cuz they identified with the dude he was cuckolding.

'Twan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 02:40 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

though the 'kokomo' thing helps explain why i love the melody.

'Twan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 02:43 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

haha ant if there is a song in a few years that messes up your teenaged icons and you get cranky about it...remember this moment.

Haikunym (Haikunym), Saturday, 7 January 2006 02:44 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

and if bowling for soup's factual errors WEREN'T intentional that's even better, cuz who gives a shit. answer: old farts.

'Twan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 02:44 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

actually i would love it if somebody mixed up lou barlow with rivers cuomo, my adolescence isn't something i look back on with pride.

'Twan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 02:45 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Plus the only track with replay value on Kelly's album is the one that would have fit on the debut album, "Don't Touch Me When I'm Sleeping".

I'd also throw in "Suurbia," "I Can't Wait," "Red Light," and "One Word" in the replay corner, with the rest still being more listenable than "Beat Of My Heart."

'Twan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 02:49 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

and "Don't Touch Me" wouldn't fit in with Shut Up! (which kicks the ass of pretty much everything else being discussed here), its way more "Danger Zone" glossy guitarwise.

'Twan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 02:50 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

also, as far as songs being irreverent about my adolescent treasures, my favorite offhand is Bloodhound Gang's "Foxtrot Uniform Charlie Kilo," which uses all the usual quiet-loud/ feedback squalls/Blue Album uplift and malkmus cryptography to do nothing but describe penis-in-vagina for 3.5. I love it.

Zwan (miccio), Saturday, 7 January 2006 02:57 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

ant, I'm glad yr back
no one is a bigger pain
in a real fun way

Haikunym (Haikunym), Saturday, 7 January 2006 02:59 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Haha, it is "Kokomo!" Good call.

Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Saturday, 7 January 2006 04:48 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

I'm having trouble comparing Kelly Osbourne's dead monotone on "One Word" to Hilary Duff's irritating chirp on "Beat of My Heart." Wait, I'm having no trouble comparing them. The first is a dead monotone, the second's an irritating chirp! There!

Also, "One Word" is cartoon-doom synth goth that swells into massive disco voluptuousness in its chorus, whereas "Beat of My Heart," synth or no synth, is basically Go-Gos cheep-cheep wave. So I don't see how one outdoes the other, as they're doing different things. Also, I love "One Word," whereas "Beat of My Heart" has so far only reached the category "I Have To Admit That This Is Somewhat Catchy, Even If It Makes Me Grit My Teeth." But once I admit that something is catchy, I'm well on my way to describing it as "catchy."

(The rest of Kelly O's alb is more rock than dance, and her dead monotone is correspondingly deadening. Some of it I can tolerate for minutes at a time. The rest of Hilary D's album is... well some it's this, some it's that, and some of it is yet some other thing.)

Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Saturday, 7 January 2006 05:41 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

Anthony, my interest in Evanescence was evanescent, though I still own one of their albums, and I may give it another spin of these days.

Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Saturday, 7 January 2006 05:43 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

I'm so glad glad to hear appreciation for Lohan.

If she doesn't self-implode, she'll be a great, great actress. Her sense of timing is impecable--she nearly blew Jamie Lee Curtis off the screen in Freaky Friday--no easy feat. And how many Disney queen-ettes jump from Herbie to Robert Altman or a David Chapman bio-pic?

Her voice has a fascinating timbre; she's singing from her throat which lends it that elastic-about-to-snap quality that makes it blend wonderfully with overdubbed Lohans.

And yeah--I always felt like Cheap Trick did their song like they were embaressed at having come up with such a confection. Lohan totally nails it.

Ian in Brooklyn, Saturday, 7 January 2006 05:49 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

I don't know if you'll find this relevant, but Popular has now made it to where, as a twelve-year-old, I started once again listening to pop music. So as Rolling Teenpop 2006 Thread rolls along here on ILX, my own adolescence will be developing over at Freaky Trigger. (Currently topping the chart: Reg Presley's perky chirp.)


I barely remember the Cheap Trick original, to tell you the truth. I suppose it's possible to like the two versions easily, but apparently this is not likely.

Frank Kogan (Frank Kogan), Saturday, 7 January 2006 05:54 (thirteen years ago) Permalink

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