Come Anticipate "Brokeback Mountain" With Me

Message Bookmarked

Bookmark Removed

Not all messages are displayed: show all messages (509 of them)

No, they can't. He's about 60, read between the lines.

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 1 December 2005 15:27 (eighteen years ago) link

There's nothing between the lines to read. He says nothing about the past, or Beatty circa 1971. He's talking today - they're not big enough stars to claim this is a big risk on anyone's part.

That he's an old fogey may just underscore the fact that he's out of touch. No one cares about Beatty or Streisand. They could play gay grandparents all day long and no one would care - 'cuz no one will see them.

― Erick Dampier is better than Shaq (miloaukerman), Thursday, 1 December 2005 15:49 (eighteen years ago) link

You're right, Indiana must be an idiot.

How many big grossers have centered on JG or HL? None (Jarhead
is doing OK).

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 1 December 2005 16:07 (eighteen years ago) link

No, he's just wrong on this. That is possible, you know. An older person can, in fact, be out of touch with the cultural zeitgeist and hanging on to the cultural values of their youth.

― Erick Dampier is better than Shaq (miloaukerman), Thursday, 1 December 2005 16:20 (eighteen years ago) link

milo, are you seriously saying that even in this day and age and despite the fact that the woman is WELL past her sell-by date, that barbra streisand is a star of the same magnitude as jakey & heathy?

― Allyzay must fight Zolton herself. (allyzay), Thursday, 1 December 2005 16:27 (eighteen years ago) link

because that's fucking insane.

― Allyzay must fight Zolton herself. (allyzay), Thursday, 1 December 2005 16:28 (eighteen years ago) link

No, Milo is claiming that that's what Gary Indiana is saying, and he agrees with you that it's insane.

Now, Morbs, you're right that neither Gyllenhaal or Ledger have single-handedly carried a box-office smash (unless A Knight's Tale counts, which it probably shouldn't) -- but I'd argue that both are very much A-list stars. (And I bet lots of people went to see The Patriot and Day After Tomorrow because of Heath and Jake, respectively.)

― jaymc (jaymc), Thursday, 1 December 2005 16:36 (eighteen years ago) link

jay, I think you misunderstood my point. Which is that Gary Indiana is actually kind of right vis a vis Jake G. v Barbra S. and their respective star magnitudes. A-list star is not the same thing as being absolutely enormous. If this movie starred Brad Pitt and Johnny Depp, that'd be the sort of magnitude being hinted at (whether or not I agree with the idea that smaller level stars makes a mainstream film by an A-list director "less risky").

The argument seems to take hold if you want to take on Warren Beatty tho, I mean I'm not really sure why he was Indiana's example.

― Allyzay must fight Zolton herself. (allyzay), Thursday, 1 December 2005 16:42 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh, I see what you mean now.

― jaymc (jaymc), Thursday, 1 December 2005 16:45 (eighteen years ago) link

Is Babs enormous among any group of people not getting ready to collect a social security check?

― Erick Dampier is better than Shaq (miloaukerman), Thursday, 1 December 2005 16:46 (eighteen years ago) link

Since the last time either WB or BS made a film no one except their moms knew who Jake and Heath were, you're mistaken.

I am pretty sure that Streisand was one of the stars of the top-grossing comedy of 2004.

― monkeybutler, Thursday, 1 December 2005 16:49 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah, I guess Ledger and Gyllenhaal are not yet HOLLYWOOD ROYALTY.

― jaymc (jaymc), Thursday, 1 December 2005 16:51 (eighteen years ago) link

Is Babs enormous among any group of people not getting ready to collect a social security check?

I would be willing to bet you really good money that more people know who she is than know who Heath Ledger is.

― Allyzay must fight Zolton herself. (allyzay), Thursday, 1 December 2005 16:52 (eighteen years ago) link

http://www.screenselect.co.uk/images/products/2/6722-large.jpg

http://www.online.rtlklub.hu/kepek/0507/203749/kolumbusz.jpg

(xpost)

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 1 December 2005 16:54 (eighteen years ago) link

Ally OTM! (except, really, Warren Beatty was A HUGE STAR in the '60s and '70s. He got an epic about American Communists financed by a studio, and showed it at the White House to Reagan.

Is Babs enormous among any group of people not getting ready to collect a social security check?

Been to the Castro or Chelsea lately?

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 1 December 2005 16:55 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah, Warren Beatty was a pretty big star but I don't think he's really...held it as well as Babs has. Like I can see Jake G. becoming a Warren Beatty, but not a Barbra Streisand (not just for obvious reasons) (though that would be totally hot)

― Allyzay must fight Zolton herself. (allyzay), Thursday, 1 December 2005 17:04 (eighteen years ago) link

I just think that cos of Warren Beatty's kind of slide off, you know, he coulda used a better example...like why not Redford? Or, christ, DeNiro. I would pay a lot of money to see DeNiro break character and go gay at this point.

― Allyzay must fight Zolton herself. (allyzay), Thursday, 1 December 2005 17:05 (eighteen years ago) link

No Yentl or The Mirror Has Two Faces for Jake! (c'mon, surely you'd take Dick Tracy or Bulworth over those.)

DeNiro's lack of "slide off"? Like, The Fan or Rocky and Billwinkle!? :o

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 1 December 2005 17:08 (eighteen years ago) link

No that's what I meant by I'd pay good money to see him go Brokeback Mountain! His recent films are all like almost universally crap! Though The Fan is great for comedic value. BUT he's someone who still gets a lot of respect, whereas Beatty makes Dick Tracy and people decide he's gone insane. But really DeNiro was a tangent brought on by Barbra Streisand via Meet the Fockers.

Redford though, he still stands as a valid example!

― Allyzay must fight Zolton herself. (allyzay), Thursday, 1 December 2005 17:11 (eighteen years ago) link

More people have heard of Streisand - but how many care about her, aside from the elderly (and apparently the gay)? I'd wager that as many people have heard of Bette Middler as Jake G - but that doesn't mean they care, or that she's culturally relevant.

― Erick Dampier is better than Shaq (miloaukerman), Thursday, 1 December 2005 17:11 (eighteen years ago) link

Indiana would have had a much better point with a couple of current, legitimate royalty - Tom Cruise (not playing too far out of himself), Tom Hanks, Harrison Ford.

― Erick Dampier is better than Shaq (miloaukerman), Thursday, 1 December 2005 17:12 (eighteen years ago) link

Does anyone still care about Tom Cruise???! Besides for comedy purposes??!

― Allyzay must fight Zolton herself. (allyzay), Thursday, 1 December 2005 17:17 (eighteen years ago) link

Plenty. War of the Worlds is one of the year's top grossers.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 1 December 2005 17:18 (eighteen years ago) link

I wouldn't blame that on Tom Cruise, though.

― Allyzay must fight Zolton herself. (allyzay), Thursday, 1 December 2005 17:19 (eighteen years ago) link

Though now we're going into that dreaded Spielberg territory that it is best we all just avoid ;)

― Allyzay must fight Zolton herself. (allyzay), Thursday, 1 December 2005 17:22 (eighteen years ago) link

What about Indiana shooting down the 'first Hollywood gay male relationship' myth? Hello, Kiss of the Spider Woman, with an Oscar even? It's the COWBOY element that's the magnet here -- these are real men, y'know.

Jams remarking his GF loved it -- the b.o. success will depend on straight women.

Indiana would have had a much better point with a couple of current, legitimate royalty

But see, you get his POINT. Screw the example.

(Dick Tracy had several dozen times the Fun Quotient of every 'serious' comic-book adaptation since, and a Screaming Al Pacino that fit, for once...)

What if Brokeback had been makeable in 1980? Jeff Bridges and Dennis Quaid... mmmm...

Ally, I promise to be rational about 'Spielberg sucks' if I can point out the massive silliness of The Thomas Crown Affair, one hot chess match aside. ;)

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 1 December 2005 17:31 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh dude, I will never debate that The Thomas Crown Affair is fairly silly. My '60s ballot was cutthroat visceral-immediate-reaction choices only otherwise I woulda spent 8 days on it.

Veering dangerously off topic but Dick Tracy has a terrible rap. The worst part about it is actually probably Warren Beatty but even he is ok. I haven't seen it in quite a while though. Both Madonna and Al Pacino were actually great choices, despite their obvious flaws in like virtually every other movie thrown at them. Even Bullworth wasn't really horrible! It is a little unfair, Warren Beatty's drop off had less to do with the actual quality of his work vis a vis others and more to do with Warren Beatty as a person.

― Allyzay must fight Zolton herself. (allyzay), Thursday, 1 December 2005 17:51 (eighteen years ago) link

What if Brokeback had been makeable in 1980? Jeff Bridges and Dennis Quaid... mmmm...

*eyes roll back into head.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 1 December 2005 17:52 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't know this Anne Hathaway, but I could tell Michelle Williams could act on Dawson's Creek, which was a feat.

More bits on the MSM hypefest (Heath: "But in the end, it was just like kissing a person"):

http://towleroad.typepad.com/towleroad/2005/12/the_brokeback_j.html

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Monday, 5 December 2005 18:49 (eighteen years ago) link

i'm seeing this tomorrow morning. will report back.

― s1ocki (slutsky), Monday, 5 December 2005 18:52 (eighteen years ago) link

You can read the original story here:

http://www.newyorker.com/archive/content/articles/051212fr_archive01

― o. nate (onate), Wednesday, 7 December 2005 22:10 (eighteen years ago) link

Yes, the EW story from which the Heath quote is drawn is prissy in the most revolting way.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 7 December 2005 22:16 (eighteen years ago) link

the sight & sound article on this ws so FKN dumb

― cozen (Cozen), Wednesday, 7 December 2005 22:16 (eighteen years ago) link

Did it make you gay, Slocki?

― Erick Dampier is better than Shaq (miloaukerman), Wednesday, 7 December 2005 22:20 (eighteen years ago) link

i'm sure it would have if i hadn't slept through the screening!

― s1ocki (slutsky), Wednesday, 7 December 2005 22:24 (eighteen years ago) link

i should clarify that--i slept IN and missed the screening. thus i am still straight!

― s1ocki (slutsky), Wednesday, 7 December 2005 22:25 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh -- I thought it was so boring it put you to sleep.

― Lars and Jagger (Ex Leon), Wednesday, 7 December 2005 22:26 (eighteen years ago) link

it was so boring it made you gay.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 7 December 2005 23:07 (eighteen years ago) link

yes. the only thing to do in the theatre to distract me from the boring movie was to be gay with other members of the audience.

― s1ocki (slutsky), Wednesday, 7 December 2005 23:10 (eighteen years ago) link

Any more reviews? It's swept the New York and L.A. film crit awards.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Tuesday, 13 December 2005 18:34 (eighteen years ago) link

David Edelstein no like: "Ang Lee's formalism is so extreme that it's often laughable, and the sex is depicted as a holy union: Gay love has never been so sacred..."

http://www.slate.com/id/2131264/?nav=fo

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 13 December 2005 18:43 (eighteen years ago) link

I still haven't seen it, but I appreciate Edelstein's (and Stephanie Zancharek's) contrarianism.

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Tuesday, 13 December 2005 18:47 (eighteen years ago) link

edelstein is terrible! like armond white, he only reacts to others. our metafilmcritic.

― Jams Murphy (ystrickler), Tuesday, 13 December 2005 18:49 (eighteen years ago) link

i like edelstein!

― s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 13 December 2005 18:49 (eighteen years ago) link

a) no style from a pure writing perspective
b) reviews the reviews rather than the movie

― Jams Murphy (ystrickler), Tuesday, 13 December 2005 18:51 (eighteen years ago) link

i.e. don't be shocked when he gets chosen to replace denby

― Jams Murphy (ystrickler), Tuesday, 13 December 2005 18:51 (eighteen years ago) link

i disagree with both points!

― s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 13 December 2005 18:52 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't like Edelstein much. I do, however, plan on using Armond White's "I pity you" a lot in conversation.

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 13 December 2005 18:53 (eighteen years ago) link

"armond white pities you!"

― s1ocki (slutsky), Tuesday, 13 December 2005 18:55 (eighteen years ago) link

b) reviews the reviews rather than the movie

Read his lovely review of The Lion, the Witch, & The Wardrobe

― Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Tuesday, 13 December 2005 18:57 (eighteen years ago) link

Skipping 409 messages at this point... Click here if you want to load them all.

You must be logged in to post. Please either login here, or if you are not registered, you may register here.