Pixies: Classic or Dud

The docu stimulated - even moved - me. Sense of PERIOD, mainly. We can't ultimately separate the Pixies from their time (late 80s / early 90s) - is that right?

So - I like them in the way that I like Steady Mike's SNUB TV video: A LOT - BUT thoroughly 'conditioned' and 'historical'.

Most of what was said by rockers went way OTT. It's great to see Bowie and certain others talking (but not the utter tosser Coxon - he'd be OK maybe if he never spoke) - but no, no, they overrated.

Period, this is the key. We need to understand the Pixies in History. No?

And in Space, too. This is the thread I didn't start, but intend to.

When I was a kid, yeah they were fantastic. I'm starting to realize that kids really like music that makes them feel at odds with everything in an abstractly alienating way that is somehow a comforting cacoon. It's kind of a depressing feeling that's hard to identify as "depressing". It sounds passionate and interesting, with dissonance and screaming and yelling, lyrics that identify no real problem but are delivered with a sombre tone and offset with just the right amount of cutesy tongue-in-cheekiness. That stuff bores the piss out of me now.

well, duh.

well, duh.

(pinefox and alex in NYC in agreement shocker)

(me too shocker, come to that, tho i often agree with em separately) (also secretly)

I'll be quoting that for as long as I'm writing about pop I think. But you can't have any performance royalties.

He seemed far more charitable towards them in the C4 documentary that sparked this thread - but then I missed the first 20 minutes... perhaps he was slating them then. Strange docu - the only footage they had was from the Town & Country Club show (supporting Throwing Muses) in '88, so by the time they moved on to "Bossanova" and "Trompe", there was no illustration of the music at all. Maybe it's difficult to get the rights to the (never very interesting) videos.

"Monkey Gone To Heaven" changed my entire perception of loud-guitars- and-shouty-voices and I really did Buy The Record The Next Day. "Doolittle" remains my favourite. They may have quickly lost the intensity, but there are still traces of the ol' magic as late as '93 (4AD's last good year) with "The Last Splash", and FB's solo thing. However, the high regard in which "Teenager of the Year" is held by a certain forum contributor baffles me like few other of his opinions.

I love the Pixies dearly (and the doc made me want to dig out Come on Pilgrim again). But here's the thing: when I first heard Surfer Rosa, in a small, cold student flat in Norwich 1989, I thought it was abysmal, shouty, formless and stupid. One year later, driving around downtown Portland, Oregon it all made fantastic sense. Which makes me wonder: how does location and geographic cultural space affect the way you hear music? As an English box bedroom boy I grew up favouring the intimate confessional indie (Smiths) and domestic disco (Pet Shop Boys) one would expect, and I'm not sure the Pixies could ever make sense to me in that context. However, blasting out of a car stereo on an open Oregon highway there was suddenly *room* for the music. Maybe only a certain type of uptight, claustrophobic Englishman needs to actually go to the US to understand rock, but it puts me in mind of something Gertrude Stein said - what makes America what it is "is that there is more space where nobody is than where anybody is". And I think I heard something like that in the sound of Surfer Rosa.

The only Pixies album I ever had was Doolittle. Now I want it back again!

What is "guitar tone", and should I know about it?

And Frank Black's 1st album has just as much to offer as _Teenager of the Year_. I have no idea how his other stuff is (though the word is to beware of later albums, regardless of his semi-newfound fondness for the 2-track demo get-it-on-the-first-take ethos).

Plus, great lyrics.

Vamos (Come on Pilgrim vers.)
Isla de Encanta
Bone Machine
Break My Body
Something Against You
Gigantic (album vers.)
River Euphrates (album vers.)
Where is My Mind?
Debaser
Wave of Mutilation (album vers.)
Here Comes Your Man
Monkey Gone to Heaven
La La Love You
Hey
Winterlong
Cecilia Ann
Velouria
Allison
Ana
Dig for Fire
The Happening
Havalina
Evil Hearted You
Trompe Le Monde
Alec Eiffel
Palace of the Brine
Letter to Memphis
Motorway to Roswell
The Navajo Know

(80:36)

Caribou
The Holiday Song
Nimrod's Son
Bone Machine
Something Against You
Broken Face
Gigantic
River Euphrates
Where is My Mind?
Debaser
Here Comes Your Man
Monkey Gone To Heaven
Mr. Grieves
No. 13 Baby
Gouge Away
Velouria
Dig for Fire
Trompe Le Monde
Planet of Sound
Alec Eiffel
The Sad Punk
U-Mass
Letter to Memphis

(It's been a while since I've heard Bossanova, so I may be forgetting some other tracks I like from that.)

she wrote a bunch of stuff on beyond the eirie or whatever it's called, but it's still not like, great. It's ok.

yeah but there's always more, i can't think of one time when an artist had some little flirtations with right wing/terf whatever stuff and it didn't end up being worse

Neil Young, but that was the '80s - most of America was crazy for Reagan.

But yeah, I can't say it's a big loss. I can't see anyone getting nostalgic for the Paz-era of the Pixies 20 years from now.

maybe they'll hire a third Kim

Jong Un

nah the band already has a dictator

They shouldn't hire but they should back Kim Carnes for an album, how random and awesome would that be?

nah the band already has a dictator

ha ha ha

Kim Gordon joins and they reinvent themselves as mumbletrap.

As long as it isn't Kim Mitchell.

Thought the thread revive was for the BBC Sessions album which came out today and rocks super hard. Version of “In Heaven” is brutal and beautiful.

It's just the vinyl reissue of the same one from 1998, right?

As long as it isn't Kim Mitchell.

― MarkoP, Friday, March 8, 2024 3:40 PM (twenty minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

might as well go for a broken face

Oh, wow, never mind. I see that it is, but with more material. Going to have to check it out then, I was under the impression it was just a straight vinyl reissue.

sounds like it's time for a zwan reunion. paz & billy can patch over their personal issues with whatever weird conspiracy stuff they may be into

I was thinking that, lol

wait can someone gimme the cliffs on the timeline of the kims, and departures of each?

Zwan gets back together, then Frank Black hires D'arcy and Billy's head explodes

xposts: no, it's all tracks they recorded for 6 complete sessions at the BBC 1988-1991.. 3LP/2CD/digital. The previous release was just a selection.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rdLiTQRP0o

I think about this interview a lot, about him painting to clear his mind after a concert, the bit where the interviewer brings up Lynda Barry (which led me down a rabbit hole) and also about him saying he doesn't care if he seems a shadow of his former self, that keeping away from a day job is his top priority. I guess like a lot of older rock musicians he doesn't have the luxury of spending several years writing and recording.

Always considered the idea that he shouldn't keep Pixies going without Kim Deal laughable

Trompe Le Monde is the best album album Charles / Black etc ever made, Kim wasn't really involved. She did other great stuff.

I read that oral history about the Pixies, which was illuminating. Yeah, Charles was pretty high strung, but Kim seemed like a tremendous pain in the ass. Iirc she was barely involved in either of the last two records. There's something to be said for bands that burn bright but fast. CCR, Smiths, Pixies, VU, even the Beatles, just this compressed productivity with a huge impact.

I kinda always thought the reason she did not have any tunes on the later records was more they were not really welcome.

Never really got it myself as I thought the real pixie dust was when both of them sang on a tune. Oh well…

I was quite shocked when I found out how she doesn't actually have have any of her own songs on Doolittle, not even as much singing as I recalled, but what is there is memorable

i would like to register my discontent with this line of Kim dismissal itt

i have nothing to add except that it’s gross and i hate it that is all

Kim of course has nothing to prove to anyone, but even "Gigantic," that was a co-write based on I think Charles's repetitive bass riff and maybe he had the chorus too, at least the repeating title. She really didn't have much creative input in the Pixies, which no doubt led to some friction, but if the book is much indication I think it was more her unpredictable behavior and unreliability that ticked him off. Like, skipping sound checks, being late to places, vanishing on tour, that sort of thing.

That said, I can't imagine the band without her, she rules and is of course a key component of what makes that band so great.

Who is dismissing her? Most people thinks she has the most vital longevity of all the band members but she was kind of sidelined from Doolittle onwards.

I finally listened to Frank Black's Oddballs, it's fun and worthwhile but not really up there with the best of his early albums.

I was quite shocked when I found out how she doesn't actually have have any of her own songs on Doolittle, not even as much singing as I recalled, but what is there is memorable

Some listings say that's a co-written song. Is there any handy listing of all the Pixies songwriting credits? Did Joey write "Levitate Me"?

"silver" and "gigantic" are credited to deal/black (though deal is responsible for most of "silver" at the very least), "levitate me" is black/lovering/jean walsh (black's then-girlfriend i think), lenchantin co-wrote a few tracks on head carrier and beneath the eyrie and santiago co-wrote a few on doggerel

"Into The White" is all hers?

black is the sole writer on that despite deal singing lead

"bam thwok" is the only pixies track that's credited only to deal afaik

I love "Bam Thwok", strange that she'd get a sole credit so late on. Seems like only months later that she left

Worth mentioning the recent unearthing of "Go Man Go" that was stapled onto the Last Splash reissue which gives a co-credit to Black Francis:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zcYCyzvNY1M

(sounds like a stepsibling of "Where Is My Mind?"/"Caribou"/"Velouria")

and here is the "Silver" demo:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GH_g46UfHVQ

"bam thwok" was the first and only reunion song the original lineup made back in 2004, and i guess deal/black relations were pretty decent at the time since he let her write it

they also did Ain’t That Pretty At All for a Zevon trib


Kim had Bam Thwok sitting around intended as a Breeders song and Charles suggested recording one of hers as an olive branch for excluding her writing the previous time around

Thwok shows that a whole album of Deal songs backed by the Pixies blokes could have been great, but Bam / Ain’t is a great imaginary A-side / B-side commemoration of their whole reunion. She was right to quit rather than risk blowing their legacy; whatever the name has done since, it’s fine to think of as a different band.