Election (1999)

GET HIM

I did like in the commentary how Payne said that the whole movie could 've been called "The Janitor's Revenge".

Maybe it's just Nicholson vs Broderick. Neat how he's got Ferris Bueller on the other side of the desk and Robert Dubea accepting no substitutions.

easily payne's best, long way down thereafter. payne is a snooty dbag who claims he's never seen 'ferris bueller's day off' and got lucky with this one.

I loved and still love Election but was kinda indifferent to About Schmidt. As far as latter-day Nicholson-offerings, I enjoyed "Something's Gotta Give" way more. But, I also liked Sidways lots, so take that as you will...

i've enjoyed all of his movies but "election" is easily the best. kind of a transition between the pure nastiness of "citizen ruth" and the more human "about schmidt" and "sideways," maybe?

i love it when he throws his pepsi at the limo

About Schmidt is terrible.

This film is so redemptive as far as any misgivings I may have had regarding Matthew Broderick.

why would you have misgivings about matthew broderick? other than sarah jessica parker?

i remember liking about schmidt but i only saw it the one time, i've seen election like four or five times and this thread is about election

jaymc, have you seen election? what did you think?

I liked it. I don't remember much about it, though. Kr said the other night (after we watched this) that she wasn't a fan, but I forgot to follow up. You should ask her the next time you see her.

this film is great - his other stuff is all pretty meh (altho Citizen Ruth is funny, copout ending notwithstanding. About Schmidt and Sideways both really annoyed me)

"fuck me mr. mcallister"

why would you have misgivings about matthew broderick? other than sarah jessica parker?

Just vague misgivings, like sjp, I guess...I dunno.

election -- great
citizen ruth -- pretty good
sideways -- eh
about schmidt -- zzzzz

paul... popular.... peanut

I guess I sometimes conflate actors with their roles. In that respect I love his character's all-too-human qualities in Election as contrasted with Ferris Bueller. I mean, I like the Ferris Bueller movie lots, and I recognize the faults of the character underneath the smugness, but still, for me Election played partly as an examination of the Broderick character's vulnerabilities that were glossed over in Bueller. That's a fucked-up way to read movies, I guess, but there ya go.

Wasn't there a discussion on some film thread here about Bueller's sociopathic tendencies?

I absolutely loved Sideways the first time I saw it (maybe because I watched it directly after Closer, one of the most loathsome films ever made). Second time I thought it had some great jokes, but was ultimately quite annoying and full of itself.

xpost - I can totally see how Bueller is a sociopath! Still a top film though.

Wasn't there a discussion on some film thread here about Bueller's sociopathic tendencies?

I took a lot of shit for pointing out that Beuller's basically an unsympathetic exploitative asshole embodying Reagan-era rich-white-selfishness... but what do I know

lol at actually taking Ferris Bueller seriously as a character study.

sideways -- eh

I held out on watching this for 4 years, and when I finally did, it rocked me. But then I am thirty-three.

I wouldn't say I take it seriously, I just don't enjoy it

Election's a 9 or 10, Sideways a 7 or 8, About Schmidt a 6

Ferris Bueller's been worse to the youth vote than standardized testing. But points to John Hughes for the Bryan Ferry poster on Bueller's wall.

I took a lot of shit for pointing out that Beuller's basically an unsympathetic exploitative asshole embodying Reagan-era rich-white-selfishness... but what do I know

Okay, yeah...it wasn't even a proper Bueller thread, though, was it? I'm thinking that it was one of those Apatow throwdowns or something.

Some of the scenes between him and Cameron always struck me weirdly poignant though...there is all kinds of crazy manipulative, but at the same time, knowingly manipulative shit going on there, which always fucks me up.

One of my excuses for enjoying Sideways is my love for the Ned and Stacey dude.

blueski pretty much Otm.

Though I might downgrade About Schmidt a notch...is one of the only reasons that people latched onto that film b/c Nicholson was playing against type/his persona? Because, if so, I think that was dealt with more gracefully and subtly in Something's Gotta Give.

i remember enjoying About Schmidt but it left very little impression on me. It seems to be HATED by some people though. I should watch it again.

yeah i don't get the hate, maybe it was too plodding...LIKE AN OLD MAN.

lol at actually taking Ferris Bueller seriously as a character study.

I dunno; personally, I don't think it's so crazy to read it as being a sad Reagan years update on The Wild One or Rebel...

It seems to be HATED by some people though.

Speaking for myself, I felt this way probably as a reaction to the over-praising it got from critics. I went in expecting something extraordinary. What I got was merely charming and pleasant.

is one of the only reasons that people latched onto that film b/c Nicholson was playing against type/his persona?

One of the reasons I hated that film is that I could detect Nicholson's congratulating himself at playing against type. Plus, the emotions at the end aren't earned when most of the film is about pratfalls, caricatures, and other cheap jokes.

LIKE AN OLD MAN

Yeah, but one thing I remember from watching it is that it seemed like he was playing his version of a caricature of an old man...as great as an actor as he is, I think that his personal eternally arrested adolescent lifestyle led to it being too much of a stretch to take plausibly.

Again, I think Something's Gotta Give took a more honest take on that whole territory, at least as far as Nicholson's performance is concerned.

btw Nicholson HATED Ferris Bueller -- "are these kids trying to put me out of business?" or something.

Really? Wow...

One of my excuses for enjoying Sideways is my love for the Ned and Stacey dude.

haha otm."you wrong biscuit buying slut!!!"

yeah, that show ruled!

Nicholson begrudging Bueller just seems weird, though; there are any number of his performances that one could point to which are filled with such nuance and depth that they put F.B. to shame. It goes without saying that there are no Five Easy Pieces or Carnal Knowledges or what have you in John Hughes' resume.

Yeah, but the audience at whom FB is aimed is expected to applaud FB for his embrace of Reagan-esque values.

sideways is some bullshit.

xpost

Seriously? I thought it was just aimed at a generic, politically-unaligned teen audience. I guess I'm not sure what you're saying.

I took a lot of shit for pointing out that Beuller's basically an unsympathetic exploitative asshole embodying Reagan-era rich-white-selfishness... but what do I know

-- Shakey Mo Collier, Thursday, February 7, 2008 12:10 AM (31 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

so basically he's a teenager

slocki, what didn't you like about Sideways? I'm just curious, b/c I remember all the hype when it came out, but never saw it until last year, under sorta weird circumstances of watching it with family members on cable...so maybe I was partly just grateful for the opportunity of pleasant distraction, and turned whatever critical part of my brain off for the time being.

so basically he's a teenager

Point conceded, partially...but there is a weird aspect to that film in that it does exalt as a hero someone who seems to exhibit a slew of borderline-sociopathic qualities, or at least a ready willingness to exploit the shit out of others with only a modicum of conscience present to keep his charisma in check. One could imagine his character growing up to be a cult leader...or powerful politician?

or Ivan Boesky.

or John DeLorean.

I couldn't stand this movie when it came out. I wonder if I'd like it any better now.

Election = About Schmidt (I am a sap) >> Sideways

election equals about schmidt?

like I said, I like sappy movies.

This movie is amazing, and heart-wrenching in a way that About Schmidt doesn't touch -- because rather than ending on a now-typical "meaningful" fadeout it makes you stare hard at the fact that, in real life, people's lives continue long after the story you're telling about them is over. Shorter version: I also like when he throws the Coke at the car.

One of my three favorite movies ever.

She has intentions fuelled only by ambition and narciscissm she's no heroine

― rum dmc (darraghmac), Monday, February 19, 2018 12:59 PM (one minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

this describes 99% of politicians, and while i don't necessarily disagree, she at least focuses her ambition toward a more noble goal than everyone else in the film.

49% of the student body != the entire student body, your argument sucks

(xposts) I like that guy! I don't think he was self-righteous, he just knew he'd counted the votes correctly and was perplexed as to why the numbers didn't add up. (Spitting on the car was just kind of flourish to punctuate McAlister's abject downfall--maybe didn't need to be there.)

Tracy really doesn't need to have any sympathy for Dave, but her reaction is more interesting as she views the relationship through this prism of individual responsibility rather than personal feelings of animosity for having taken advantage of her.

yea it's actually very reminiscent of Monica Lewinsky's view of her relationship with Bill Clinton, which is coincidental because her interview with Barbara Walters aired the same month Election came out.

@tombot - good point, tho tbf we never hear from any Tracy stans. but you're right

and actually i'd argue that that is another analogue to HRC- the disinterest and derision crowds out the considerable support

Tracy's politics are never explicitly stated, but it's clear she is going to be a callous Randian type, this film is sympathetic with her as a person but clearly she is going to be a normal, horrible career politician.

The movie does not presuppose that we the audience consider 99% of politicians as heroes cmon man down if this horse before you throw a fit

perhaps, but considering Tracy's circumstances, her goals & her path are aspirational if not inspirational. every character has major trauma, Tracy and Tammy are the only ones that don't let it curdle their souls

The vote counting kid is a good example of people trusting rules and procedures to an almost pathological level, this seems to be a plague on the UK right now.

The other thing is--and you have to step back a bit from Tracy herself--is that she's obviously right: the idea that anyone would vote for Paul before her to run anything is ludicrous.

That's the funny thing about the film -- this is about high school students! I know there are student councils in rare schools that have a voice, but the stakes are so incredibly low, even when you listen to Tracy's campaign platform. Outside of organizing some student events, the most they do is make some recommendations to the administration. It's so incredibly low-stakes, and in a lot of schools it plays out as a popularity contest with a few students genuinely wanting to affect change (or pad their pre-college resumes).

This is one of the movies I've seen a number of times over the years where my life experience really colors my perception. The juxtaposition of each character's inner monologue and their actions on screen, along with how they appear to the audience, is where it really shines.

Paul's inner monologue is the best, obviously

I think the challenge the film and the novel took on is how to make Tracy not the obvious hero of the story - there are no good people or winners in Tom Perrotta novels afaict - despite all of the traditionally unassailable attributes of the responsible, hard working underdog accruing in her favor. IMHO they pulled it off by making her as narcissistic and unabashedly ambitious as Jim is needy and feckless.

I think Senator Flick would be Nebraska's own Susan Collins fwiw

always lol at "then we'd go to my house to fuck and have a hot tub"

I graduated from high school the year Election was released and, at the time, Tracy reminded me of one of my classmates. There was an incident where, related to an extracurricular group I was involved in, the teacher running it got angry at her lack of attention and snapped, "If you were actually interested in this instead of having to be in every group and making it about you, you'd pay attention!" and she was in tears. I only heard about it when she showed up to the next class and couldn't regain her composure.

I mean, in retrospect, he wasn't wrong, but it wasn't something to snap at a kid about. At the time, I definitely didn't see that.

NB, I ran for student prez on Tammy's platform (dissolve the SGA) as a junior in college, one year before this movie came out, and even got a referendum on the ballot to that effect (we only got something like 47% of the vote for the referendum so it didn't even get put before the senate). All the kids I ran against were variations on Paul and Tracy.

Election is like bueller in that ppl always inform you that you shouldn't sympathise with Matthew Broderick like they're imparting the secret of the fucking universe when it's like no duh

Tracy is obv way more compelling but being asked to find her inspirational reminds me a bit of the "hire more women guards" gag

well yeah exactly. i said that she's HRC

She's not compelling at all rly

Election is like bueller in that ppl always inform you that you shouldn't sympathise with Matthew Broderick like they're imparting the secret of the fucking universe when it's like no duh

As a person who was a kid when Ferris Beuller came out and saw it in theaters, let me assure you that millions of people around the world need to have it explained to them why you shouldn't sympathize with Matthew Broderick, and I was one of them

Ferris is an entitled little shit, yes, but if you take Roger Ebert's reading of the film--that his motivation for the day off was help his friend gain some self-respect--he becomes a lot more bearable.

I thought netflix’s American Vandal had a character that was pretty reminiscent of Dave, although younger

That is a misreading xp

How so?

Because that is not his motivation

As a person who was a kid when Ferris Beuller came out and saw it in theaters, let me assure you that millions of people around the world need to have it explained to them why you shouldn't sympathize with Matthew Broderick, and I was one of them

― Guayaquil (eephus!),

and still do.

Because that is not his motivation

Not only is it not his motivation, it's exactly the story Bueller tells himself about himself in order to avoid having to understand and accept who he really is

Tammy is the hero, duh.

Ferris Bueller is about wish fulfillment for teens, thinking you can break the rules and do magic and be celebrated for it

Election is not quite the opposite, but it does make you wonder why people think their actions are ever truly in the service of their goals

Tammy isn't a hero she's the easy popularity of the opt out slacker

she gets the girl, though

90s chicks loved opt-out slackers

New Sequel Novel: https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Tracy-Flick-Cant-Win/Tom-Perrotta/9781501144066?

Tracy Flick is a hardworking assistant principal at a public high school in suburban New Jersey. Still ambitious but feeling a little stuck and underappreciated in midlife, Tracy gets a jolt of good news when the longtime principal, Jack Weede, abruptly announces his retirement, creating a rare opportunity for Tracy to ascend to the top job.

Energized by the prospect of her long-overdue promotion, Tracy throws herself into her work with renewed zeal, determined to prove her worth to the students, faculty, and School Board, while also managing her personal life—a ten-year-old daughter, a needy doctor boyfriend, and a burgeoning meditation practice. But nothing ever comes easily to Tracy Flick, no matter how diligent or qualified she happens to be.

Among her many other responsibilities, Tracy is enlisted to serve on the Selection Committee for the brand-new Green Meadow High School Hall of Fame. Her male colleagues’ determination to honor Vito Falcone—a star quarterback of dubious character who had a brief, undistinguished career in the NFL—triggers bad memories for Tracy, and leads her to troubling reflections about the trajectory of her own life and the forces that have left her feeling thwarted and disappointed, unable to fulfill her true potential.

As she broods on the past, Tracy becomes aware of storm clouds brewing in the present. Is she really a shoo-in for the Principal job? Is the Superintendent plotting against her? Why is the School Board President’s wife trying so hard to be her friend? And why can’t she ever get what she deserves?

Would have thought she'd end up at Fox.

...or married to Ted Cruz

https://thumbnails.texastribune.org/jacMx0hZvy7S7E0Ul9HikzknMnM=/850x570/smart/filters:quality(75)/https://static.texastribune.org/media/images/2016/02/26/Heidi-5.jpg

https://theplaylist.net/tracy-flick-cant-win-an-election-sequel-is-in-the-works-at-paramount-with-reese-witherspoon-director-alexander-payne-returning-20221208/

I felt this movie was pretty perfect and felt quietly happy that the book sequel didn't make much of a splash but, well, I guess there's gonna be another movie. With Payne and Witherspoon involved I guess it's likely to be as good as it can be, but -- I sort of don't want it.

(checks Alexander Payne filmography, confirms suspicion that Alexander Payne peaked with Election 23 years ago) Yeah, I don't think I need this.

I've liked a couple of Payne films since then, but an Election sequel seems quite unnecessary (and will interfere with the fun of trying to imagine where Tracy ended up).

Y’all seen this? It’s pretty obscure and was allegedly discovered at a flea market in 2011. Even the Criterion didn’t have it..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vhezOPupmj4