RFI: Border Community - Nathan Fake, James Holden, The MFA, Petter etc.

Do you mean his admission that he likes to play tracks out? Because as far as I know, none of those was recorded live so it's not like it's even possible the mixing is going to be fucked up unless it's pure laziness or a broken computer.

xpost: i don't hate Mayer. In fact, i really enjoy Fabric 13, Immer and the other mix of his i have, however, his ability to mix records together is subpar.

Ronan, by your description above of a set you witnessed from Mayer, we're saying the same thing about his mixing ability but you translate that into a specific style while i see it as lazy DJing. It's one thing to pick great songs, it's another to be able to sequence them in a seamless mix. I don't consider a person who just selects good songs to be a DJ. I know my opinion is not popular but that's the way i feel about it.

xpost: Border Community have all their releases available to purchase in MP3 format at www.bordercommunity.com

honestly your definition of quality excludes so many DJs, probably every disco "legend", that I'm not sure how it stands up at all.

also how is one style "lazier" than the other? Where does "hard work" come into talent exactly?

This is yet more Joe Satriani Guitar Magazine monthly bullshit. No place on a dance thread.

Honestly no point arguing further with someone who has such a facile grasp of "talent/quality", it is EXACTLY like discussing music with a metal fan.

Another DJ excluded by your definition, Jeff Mills! Not saying anyone is beyond reproach but just to show the variety of DJs who don't do long overlaps.

btw, i hate Jeff Mills' mixing style. doesn't mean he's a shitty dj, but i don't like his style.

it's also difficult to play 4000 notes in 3 seconds on a piano but that doesn't mean it sounds better.

Also it's not cutting Mayer slack for "uninspired djing", you're being too absolute, he can actually mix and he does mix, he just doesn't frequently do long extended segues.

it'd be like talking about gilles peterson's dj'ing.

I still can't see how stylistically the way he mixes is somehow inferior, why is it so hard to believe that someone might choose an "easier" way of creating art (in whatever sense creative processes can be dismissed as "easy") because they believe it to produce superior works?

It's verbatim the same argument as criticising the Beatles or something because their songs are "easy to play".

Can we spin this off into the "Mayer is a crap DJ" thread, I really want to figure out where I'm going to order actual Border Community vinyl from, even gemm is looking good by now.

Ronan, i'm going to ignore the moron remark and move on. Sasha and Digweed's "Communicate" mix consisted of loads of dark, linear progHouse tracks that were overlayed in the mix quite a bit. I don't rate Communicate very highly even though the mixes were long. I dislike the track selection, and only listened to it the week it was released. Mayer's Fabric mix has been caned at my place yet i find the mixing lackluster. Mayer's "skill" as a DJ is purely in selecting the tracks, not in his ability to overlay tracks in a long mix. I enjoy his selection but his mixing falls short in my opinion. I've continuously stated these ideas as my opinion and my preference, not as the definitive chart to grading DJ mixes. Plenty of Dj's who can produce long mixes between tracks have shitty track selection. Plenty of DJ's with great track selection can't mix. It goes both ways and i'm simply stating my belief that a person who can choose the best tracks and fit them together in a seamless mix is the better DJ. This breaks down to 2 simple catagories: Selecting and Mixing. As i see it, Mayer only has 1 of those down. You obviously don't DJ and if you do, you probably can't match beats, which is the only reason i see for you defending unskilled DJ's. Anyone can choose great songs. Most of the folks who post on ILM have great taste, but can they sequence those tracks in a seamless mix?

If anyone needed further proof that your over emphasis of mixing is macho rubbish then there it is.

-- biz (b...), August 25th, 2005.

dude the only reason anyone's arguing with you is because your idea of what constitutes good sequencing and seamlessness is so... i dunno...one dimensional. dullsville.

I disagree. Most dance DJ's can learn basic technical mixing (beat matching and phrasing) in a month or two. Great track selection, at least in dance music, is something that can't be "taught" and requires years of work to master.

I'll take a few botched transitions over uninspired track selection any day, whether at the club or listening to a mix CD.

xpost: what is my idea of good sequencing and seamlessness? the perfect example is Disc 1 from Northern Exposure. Orb/FSOL etc. What is one dimensional or dull about that? Have you heard that mix?

DELETE DANCE MUSIC KTHNXBYE

fe7 brings up a great point about Club vs. Home listening. At home, fade ins and bad mixes are less annoying. Hearing a DJ wreck a couple mixes will make me leave the club, no matter what his name is or what label he's representing. This feeling was even more extreme when i was taking ecstasy. I guess you had to experience a set by Sasha in the mid-nineties on E to understand his ability to work a crowd with his mixing skill. I doubt Mayer could ever come close to that type of performance.

why should mayer want to replicate "that type of performance." the point is he has his own thing going on and generally it's pretty awesome.

Reread my post, that's exactly what I said. You can't teach selection.

well, i doubt he's trying - what i was trying to goad ronan into admitting upthread is that mayer is aiming away from the club scene, or, at least, playing towards a different style of clubber.

really? cause you might be pretty pissed if you spent $50 to get into the superclub, another $50 on really good pills / orange juice / bottled water ...

* = for foreign readers, the olive garden is a chain of low-end american-italian restaurants renowned for their tacky decor and bland, heavy, unadventurous cuisine.

andrew, i don't get why my argument is dull and one dimensional. in my opinion a DJ should be able to match beats, mix in key and select great tracks. Mayer only does one of those things well. I enjoy his mixes but i don't think he's a good DJ. Is that one dimensional?

Is it passe for a DJ to try to take the listener on a "journey"? I know it's a terrible cliche but most DJ's i know still mix with this in mind.

Hearing a DJ wreck a couple mixes will make me leave the club, no matter what his name is or what label he's representing.

So if Mayer had played the Fabric 13 set out and you were there, you would have left in disgust at the shoddy mixing?

when i saw mayer he played very uptempo electro and melodic techno - things like LFO's "freak".