Metal Box -- does anyone hate this as much as me?

But really, it is genius. Levene's riff on "Poptones" is incredible! It goes around and around and around...forever! And ever! And EVER! And listen to Lydon's lyrics!! They rule!!

Not easy listening, though. But Levene is hardly wanking. He, even more so than Wobble, is the anchor of that band. Thus, the suckage following his departure...

But I do like about half the songs. Poptones is great.

I think this is my favorite quote of the thread.

It doesn't have anything to do with whether I like it or not. It has to do with being one of the ways in which the record is overrated.

It may not have an effect on how you like the music, but it does affect you you like the *album*. For instance, I'd hate the new Björk "Family Tree" because of its format. Actually, if I liked Metal Box a lot and wanted to play it often, I'd be annoyed at having to flip the records so much. But the fact that it comes in an actual metal box makes me like it again. Packaging does bleed over into how I perceive the album.

Still...."Poptones" and "Swanlake" are uproariously, gloriously ugly in the most intriguing way.

Alex in NYC is OTM. (snuff films and Killing Joke (same difference) aside)

The good thing about its rosetta-status is that people keep writing about it, and when one of the writings-up is good (as today) it prods me back into listening to it and enjoying the bits I do enjoy.

Killing Joke, however, I do tend to like quite a bit. But....you knew that.

This is funny then, because supposedly the original idea for Led Zeppelin IV was to release the 8 tracks as 4 ep's. (it's true - read all about it in "Hammer of the Gods"!)

Anyway, I don't have the box I only have Second Edition, and for me it's a stone classic. Best bass sound ever. In fact, I think I once blew out a woofer on a cheap Cerwin-Vega speaker cranking this thing up.

(Yes, I have that American Bandstand performance on tape. No, I don't have time to dub it for anyone yet. Yes, I do plan on getting a video card and digitizing it someday. Yes, the possibility of, uh,... some HORRIBLE NET THIEF appropriating it for peer-to-peer sharing is possible as well.)

I'm willing to be convinced but I basically agree with most of what Ben and Alex are saying. Aside from side 2, especially "Poptones" which is great, I find it a fairly tiring and not-particularly-rewarding listen these days. (I hadn't played it in a long time but I just put it on because of this thread. It made me want to put on New Order afterwards, whom I've also not listened to in a long time. I'm liking them though.) I never really got the vocals. Is the sound quality on Metal Box better than that on Second Edition? Otherwise, I don't even see what's good about the mastering.

Wait, they did this in order to *smell funny*?

I have long said that if Mark David Chapman had gotten the last names wrong and killed John Lydon in 1980, he would now be the most deified dead rock star EVER. Except for maybe Elvis.

Try the Wire's claim that Tortoise's Millions Now Living Will Never Die is Gen X's Metal Box.

EURGH. That's not damning with faint praise, that's abuse that makes all the hatred on this thread for Metal Box seem like warm cuddles.

Bloody fantastic album, of course, and I'd also be interested in knowing if the sound quality on Metal Box differs greatly from Second Edition.

sure. most stuff that gets 'classic' status is.

''Albatross is turgid (people always go on about what a challenging intro to the album it is--yes, putting a tedious moan up front is challenging, I suppose).''

yes, but no one 'sings' like this. It can come off as tedious because he is repeating things over and over again but this is a good groove. repetition in this case is good.

They really should have gone with the original design of using sandpaper on the outside jacket.

..And I loved it from day 1. .. Curious what you think of "Four Enclosed Walls" ...?

The News That Should Have Been, from 1980: EX-PISTOL ROTTEN'S BAND HIT WITH PLAGIARISM CHARGE BY OBSCURE AVANT-GARDE SECT: Bizarre Lawsuit Sure To Result In "Trial Of The Century" Say Legal Experts. "I'll fight this to the bitter end," vowed Mr Debord at a news conference before refusing to answer any more "cuntish questions" and firing a water pistol repeatedly into the crowd. (Settled out of court six months later after Debord is unable to provide any evidence that a 'Situationist International' ever existed...)

A challopy one.

j/k I like this album

http://blogfiles.wfmu.org/KF/0510/Public_Image_Ltd_-_American_Bandstand_-_800517.mpg

In addition to a lot of this being about Malcolm McLaren, just as much or more is about his mum dying, which i don't think got mentioned

"what kind of mood do you have to be in to enjoy this?"

UK release 1979. Mood music.

I'm not sure I can define the mood, but I spent a lot of time in it when I was in my early twenties, certainly.

"Stoned and angry" might come close?

It's a lot more mellow than it's sometimes prtrayed though.

Sorry, anything that has Poptones and Death Disco/Swan Lake on it is never going to be mellow in my book.

it does have other tracks on it

Yes, but those rather dominate the mood.

(YMMV, of course. But woah, I'm never coming round your gaff to chill out.)

Despair and anger. Very big in 1979 - see also Joy Division.

This album is fun.

Despair and anger. Very big in 1979 - see also Joy Division.

and Fear of Music...and...

WTF I can't believe you haters

That clip is making me rethink life in a good way.

Boy, Dick Clark sure yanked down that American Bandstand clip in a hurry. Bummer.

How much of the Lydon bio deals with the PIL era? Because the idea of reading yet another history of the Pistols or about anything after Flowers of Romance hardly seems worth the effort.

Speaking of, Metal Box is kinda screaming for the 33 1/3 treatement, no?

That clip is making me rethink life in a good way.

― Pete Scholtes, Saturday, 16 May 2009 17:51 (4 hours ago) Bookmark

I agree, but I can't believe it's not butter

i read lydon's book a long time ago and IIRC he doesn't discuss the PIL era at all.

Typical. There's a book about PIL but it's not available in the states. Maybe one of these days I'll splurge and buy it at the import price.

NO BLACKS, NO IRISH, NO DOGS does not cover the PIL era.

I shouldn't still get wound up about people hating the Pistols, because the records were meant to be hated, but face it, no Pistols, no PIL. No Punk, no post-punk. I've recently been bingeing on the various Mark E. Smith bios, and one of them describes him listening to "Holidays in the Sun" obsessively. But Mark is just another "Tuneless, rhythmless wanker who clearly makes no effort to sing anything that even remotely relates to what the musicians are doing".

Yes. I need to hear that sometimes.

OK, this thread then.

I was running through the PIL album pages on Wikip, and noticed that when recording one track for Metal Box, the thought went round "yeah, it sounds like The Doors, dunnit?" to general approval.

So, officially, "Albatross" is their sort-of take on "Riders on the Storm"

Metal Box is hard to love, but then PiL never really wanted anyone to send flowers. Can't agree with this general slagging of Levene, however. The guitar on the first changed something fundamental about how guitars sounded, distorted but also shiny and clean. It was something genuinely new and exciting. Loads of people ripped it off, or went trad in opposition to the trend. You could make similar arguments for Poptones.

should read "guitar on the first single changed somehthing etc.."

Nobody is slagging Levene on the basis of his Guitar playing.

Still, now I have to sing it:

Riders on the storm
riders on the storm
getting riid of the al-ba-trossssss

The OP most certainly was!

I didn't mean you Mark. I had been reading early threads.

I mean posts. Brain barely functioning tonight

WTF I can't believe you haters

― akm, Saturday, May 16, 2009 4:23 PM (1 year ago) Bookmark

this album is perfect.

also, for how "difficult" it's supposed to be i remember thinking it was poppier than i expected when i first heard it.

it's basically a ramones record compared to flowers of romance.

seriously

Kind of a downer, though.
I have to be in the mood for it.

yeah, not really getting this thread. i've never thought it was that super difficult of a record. loved it the first time i heard it as a teenager and still do.

let the take flood down!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmfzuAd_u2E

s/b takes ffs never mind

A take is raining, across the border.

thought this had been revived for this

As I’ve commented before -j can’t stand some of the trivial puerile shit that you see on Twitter . I mean I co wrote metal box-that’s heavy shit, but whatever , I often ponder -what’s better ? Munchies or Rollo ? The crunchy biscuit base of the former or the classic chewy latter pic.twitter.com/a6r6exdCn5

— Jah Wobble (@realjahwobble) November 20, 2021

ive got a mind to buy the best, before the rest

(maltesers)

pil stinks.