― dave q, Wednesday, 30 April 2003 10:20 (twenty years ago) link
― Pete (Pete), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 10:23 (twenty years ago) link
Hopefully I will get myself to a few of the screenings at the Film Center.
― amateurist (amateurist), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 14:07 (twenty years ago) link
i've seen a lot of disturbing films, but titicut follies is the absolute most disturbing thing i have ever seen.
― j fail (cenotaph), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 14:10 (twenty years ago) link
― Nordicskillz (Nordicskillz), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 14:22 (twenty years ago) link
Actually seeing films there can be a frustrating experience, since they often have problems with the prints and projectors so you never quite know what (or how long) you're in for.
― amateurist (amateurist), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 14:23 (twenty years ago) link
― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 15:39 (twenty years ago) link
This is the company that distributes all of Wiseman's films on 16mm (and video as well); I believe it may be Wiseman's own.
― amateurist (amateurist), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 15:45 (twenty years ago) link
Both were great movies, but pretty heavy viewing
― Chris Barrus (Chris Barrus), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 16:44 (twenty years ago) link
― j fail (cenotaph), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 17:49 (twenty years ago) link
― Andrew L (Andrew L), Wednesday, 30 April 2003 22:19 (twenty years ago) link
I've seen High School 1 & 2 and loved them. I'm so ass-deep in documentary here that I don't even bother to check the rest out - maybe I'll do that this weekend.
Documentaries are extremely expensive to purchase - the Wiseman ones are about $400-500.
Any ?s about film / video buying, you can direct right here.
― K#rry, Friday, 2 May 2003 15:58 (twenty years ago) link
― jaymc (jaymc), Friday, 2 May 2003 16:02 (twenty years ago) link
― K#rry, Friday, 2 May 2003 16:08 (twenty years ago) link
I was curious, though, about a comment made in the Chicago Reader review of High School (by Dave Kehr): that Wiseman's roving camera, with its "pointless" close-ups, obscured the social issues and was thus "intellectually dishonest." He claims that Wiseman later learned to tame his camera and developed into a better filmmaker. I can understand this point theoretically, but it seems harsh to apply to this example, which I don't think suffered for its camera-work. And doesn't this ignore the fact that Wiseman (or any documentarian) manipulates his films in myriad ways through editing?
― jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 5 May 2003 04:52 (twenty years ago) link
I think it's careful to note that even though all documentarians manipulate their material via editing and other means, one shouldn't jump to the fashionable conclusion that all is subjective and there are no more or less truthful documentaries. Manipulations can be in the service of the truth or of lies.
Noël Carroll has a brilliant essay on this issue in a book entitled Post-Theory. I believe it's called something like "The Documentary Film and Postmodern Skepticism." Also worth reading on truth and form in the documentary is an essay in Gilberto Perez's The Material Ghost which touches on Robert Flaherty and Buñuel's Las Hurdes.
― amateurist (amateurist), Monday, 5 May 2003 05:16 (twenty years ago) link
But I do agree with you about the potential of manipulation to serve truth. The reason I mentioned editing was merely to say that all movies are manipulated in some way, whereas Kehr seemed to be wary of manipulation period.
I'll have to check out the Carroll essay -- I generally enjoy his work, even when I disagree with him.
― jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 5 May 2003 14:28 (twenty years ago) link
― mark s (mark s), Monday, 5 May 2003 14:37 (twenty years ago) link
― Yakuza Ghost Six (nordicskilla), Thursday, 9 June 2005 18:38 (eighteen years ago) link
― Casuistry (Chris P), Thursday, 9 June 2005 22:14 (eighteen years ago) link
― the D Double signal (nordicskilla), Friday, 10 June 2005 15:41 (eighteen years ago) link
He said that most of his films are getting DVD releases over the next year, by the way.
― the D Double signal (nordicskilla), Tuesday, 14 June 2005 14:27 (eighteen years ago) link
― Casuistry (Chris P), Tuesday, 14 June 2005 14:53 (eighteen years ago) link
― the D Double signal (nordicskilla), Tuesday, 14 June 2005 15:10 (eighteen years ago) link
― a spectator bird (a spectator bird), Tuesday, 14 June 2005 15:40 (eighteen years ago) link
― Ben Ewart-Dean (DrAlfredNecessiter), Thursday, 17 August 2006 07:07 (seventeen years ago) link
― Haikunym (Haikunym), Thursday, 17 August 2006 13:16 (seventeen years ago) link
― Casuistry (Chris P), Saturday, 19 August 2006 18:33 (seventeen years ago) link
Why didn't anyone tell me there was a new Wiseman movie out?
http://www.zipporah.com/calendar/press/7
STATE LEGISLATURE A new documentary film by Frederick WisemanSTATE LEGISLATURE shows the day-to-day activities of the Idaho Legislature, including committee meetings, debates of the House and Senate, informal discussions, meetings with lobbyists, constituents, the public and the press. The workings of a democratic government are not of interest solely to Americans, but, because so many countries in the world are currently trying to adopt a democratic form of government, the issues presented have relevance on a global scale. The film is an example of the achievements, values, constraints and limitations of the democratic process.
A new documentary film by Frederick Wiseman
STATE LEGISLATURE shows the day-to-day activities of the Idaho Legislature, including committee meetings, debates of the House and Senate, informal discussions, meetings with lobbyists, constituents, the public and the press. The workings of a democratic government are not of interest solely to Americans, but, because so many countries in the world are currently trying to adopt a democratic form of government, the issues presented have relevance on a global scale. The film is an example of the achievements, values, constraints and limitations of the democratic process.
― Elvis Telecom, Thursday, 28 June 2007 05:37 (sixteen years ago) link
Just watched Public Housing - a revelation, honestly.
Anyone else have recommendations along this line? I added Robert Drew's Primary and Crisis to my queue; any other direct cinema types working today?
― vermonter, Saturday, 29 November 2008 01:15 (fifteen years ago) link
i saw meat MEAT once, about 25y ago, and still can remember images.
― meisenfek, Friday, 20 February 2009 18:27 (fifteen years ago) link
This has been going on here, gonna try to catch some:
http://www.moma.org/visit/calendar/films/1028
― Rage, Resentment, Spleen (Dr Morbius), Friday, 29 January 2010 19:33 (fourteen years ago) link
i was actually kinda disappointed when all of this guy's stuff became available because it meant having to sit down and watch it all, rather than just talking about how it was tragic that it wasn't in print.
how long's meat? i have a thing for les sang des betes
― schlump, Friday, 29 January 2010 20:01 (fourteen years ago) link
From whom is it available? the NYPL only holds VCs you have to watch IN the library!
― Rage, Resentment, Spleen (Dr Morbius), Friday, 29 January 2010 20:04 (fourteen years ago) link
last time i was at kim's they had a shelf of his stuff?
― schlump, Friday, 29 January 2010 20:06 (fourteen years ago) link
for purchase btw, not rentalseems like zipporah has put out pretty much all of them, $30 each - maybe a lil cheaper at kim's.
― schlump, Friday, 29 January 2010 20:10 (fourteen years ago) link
ah, I very seldom buy.
― Rage, Resentment, Spleen (Dr Morbius), Friday, 29 January 2010 20:36 (fourteen years ago) link
im guessing i shd go see Titicut Follies tonight if I'm not buying, then
― Rage, Resentment, Spleen (Dr Morbius), Friday, 29 January 2010 21:23 (fourteen years ago) link
if you're feeling long-ass documentary fatigue, you can use 'i'll see it on dvd' as the new 'i'll wait until it plays at the cinema'.
― schlump, Friday, 29 January 2010 21:28 (fourteen years ago) link
Boxing Gym is one of the best things I've seen this year tbh
― ralph NAGLer (admrl), Wednesday, 17 November 2010 21:12 (thirteen years ago) link
There are a number of Wiseman films I love--Welfare and Near Death topping the list--but I didn't get much out of Boxing Gym. I just found that an inordinate amount of time was devoted to various people pummelling the practice bag.
― clemenza, Saturday, 20 November 2010 17:00 (thirteen years ago) link
Just watch The Store! Didn't realize it was going to be two hours long, but still really enjoyed it. Felt like I had spent the day at Neiman's but without having a nice shirt or shoes to show for it. I want to watch more docs like this.
― JacobSanders, Monday, 23 January 2012 08:01 (twelve years ago) link
i finally broke down and t0rr3nt3d a bundle of wiseman films... this stuff just isn't available ANYWHERE to buy or stream. Already seen Boxing Gym, Missile and Zoo; all so very good. Now I have beat up copies of Public Housing, High School, State Legislature, Meat, Adjustment and Work, Essene, Juvenile Court, Law and Order, Primate, The Store, Hospital, Welfare, Blind, and Titticut Follies. Kinda excited.
― let's have sex and then throw pottery (forksclovetofu), Friday, 19 October 2012 06:49 (eleven years ago) link
u can buy them directly from his company fyi - http://www.zipporah.com/films
― johnny crunch, Friday, 19 October 2012 11:40 (eleven years ago) link
Hospital is on youtube in a high quality rip, in full.
― Johnny Hotcox, Thursday, 22 August 2013 13:50 (ten years ago) link
His latest will be at the NYFF
http://www.filmlinc.com/films/on-sale/at-berkeley
― Miss Arlington twirls for the Coal Heavers (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 22 August 2013 13:59 (ten years ago) link
opens in US Nov 8
― Miss Arlington twirls for the Coal Heavers (Dr Morbius), Thursday, 29 August 2013 15:31 (ten years ago) link
Thought At Berkeley was very good. I don’t like every Wiseman film I see--found Boxing Gym a bore, didn’t care for his horse-racing film from the early ‘70s. But I’d put At Berkeley just a notch below Welfare and Near Death.
There’s so much that, unless you were taking notes for a review, it’s hard to summon everything afterwards. (The film runs four hours.) There was a point in the first half where I thought, “This is well made, no surprise, but it’s not the ‘70s anymore, and all those sequences of incredible tension and confrontation that would flare up all of a sudden in Welfare and Hospital, you’re just not going to have that here.” And you don’t; Wiseman never manufactures drama, so mostly it’s an endless procession of meetings and seminars. I don't think Mario Savio's even mentioned for the first couple of hours, and when he finally is, it's at a talk given inside something called the Free Speech Movement Cafe. But it did start to involve me more and more as it went along; the last hour, given over to a student protest/building-takeover concerning fees and other grievances, is not handled like you might expect (especially the resolution), and that’s the hour I’m mulling and puzzling over right now, in the best way possible. I do think Wiseman is editorializing there, but I also know my own personality and biases come into how I viewed his handling of the protest. Maybe he isn’t--I don’t know. From a review I found: “Has Frederick Wiseman, the patient filmmaker whose long documentaries listened to the voices of ordinary people in public housing and on welfare, gone over to the dark side of authority? He clearly gives credence to the Cal executives, but, as ever with Wiseman, he leaves plenty of footage with information that gives you a chance to make up your own mind.” Yes--people will see that hour different ways.
Not a great deal of humour, but three things did made me laugh. A couple of shots of a guy on a John Deere mowing the campus lawns--you need the set-up for that one. There’s one seminar where a white girl identifies herself as “squarely middle-class,” says her mom’s a teacher whose income is stagnant while her own fees go up, and the only support she can get are unsubsidized loans; she starts to cry, and the black girl beside her gives her a supportive “now, now” pat on the shoulder. I don’t think there was any intentional irony there, but I did laugh. And I found it funny when Robert Reich showed up halfway through to lead a class, sharing anecdotes from his Clinton days. There was a jarring disconnect between the world of a venerated documentarian and the much-despised political class. I figured that would be enough right there to ruin the film for some people, and that amused me.
― clemenza, Sunday, 15 September 2013 21:03 (ten years ago) link
From the same Indiewire review: "Another question: Based on the proportion of women filmed by Wiseman in At Berkeley, you might think that the student body was 80% female. That's more a question of taste than reporting chops. Remember, Wiseman is the first person to say he’s not objective. He clearly likes attractive women -- not a sin, even at 83."
Well, at 51, I wasn't immune. Especially noticed the girl to the immediate right of the Thoreau/Emerson lecturer, and Sofia in Reich's class. Shame on Wiseman, shame on me.
― clemenza, Monday, 16 September 2013 01:16 (ten years ago) link
...
― Very gud laser controled organ. (Matt P), Monday, 16 September 2013 04:22 (ten years ago) link
I wonder if the Kanopy selection is different depending on your library, but all 43 Wiseman films are available in mine. I've been going through them chronologically and recently saw Meat, which was another gruesome one in the vein of Primate
― Dan S, Saturday, 22 May 2021 23:33 (two years ago) link
yea kanopy varies dramatically by library
― flopson, Saturday, 22 May 2021 23:39 (two years ago) link
Canal Zone (1977) was interesting, mostly visually, but I thought Sinai Field Mission (1978) and Manoeuvre (1979) were both kind of dull
― Dan S, Wednesday, 30 June 2021 23:31 (two years ago) link
Wiseman’s four-part film series on disability - Deaf (1986), Multi-Handicapped (1986), Adjustment and Work (1986) and Blind (1987) - were all interesting.
― Dan S, Sunday, 3 April 2022 00:33 (one year ago) link
I thought they expressed really well that communication is not just about speech or writing but also touch, sound, gesture, comportment
― Dan S, Sunday, 3 April 2022 00:35 (one year ago) link
Apologies for recycling social media posts, but I've been thinking about Sinai Field Mission a lot.
But what it’s really portraying is a group who have fenced themselves off in the desert and (in the name of trying to maintain peace between Israel & Egypt) can’t even make peace among themselves. pic.twitter.com/v0aDfw21c2— Chris Barrus (@quartzcity) October 29, 2021
― Elvis Telecom, Friday, 22 April 2022 23:30 (one year ago) link
It opens with a near wordless scene of a guy driving out in the middle of the desert to brush sand. Legit thought that Wiseman was making an Antonioni movie. pic.twitter.com/nXXvrh8Xcu— Chris Barrus (@quartzcity) October 29, 2021
Some of the best depictions of boredom. pic.twitter.com/2feH2ypj3M— Chris Barrus (@quartzcity) October 29, 2021
thought that film was inscrutable
― Dan S, Saturday, 23 April 2022 00:32 (one year ago) link
I like that he moves methodically from subject to subject
going through them chronologically, the next one for me is Missile (1988)
― Dan S, Saturday, 23 April 2022 00:44 (one year ago) link
"Frederick Wiseman Goes Fictional for the First Time - After nearly 60 years of non-fiction filmmaking, Wiseman tells IndieWire why he picked "A Couple" as his first fiction film."https://www.indiewire.com/2022/08/frederick-wiseman-interview-a-couple-1234747847/
― Elvis Telecom, Monday, 22 August 2022 20:15 (one year ago) link
I am about halfway through a VHS rip of The Garden, his doc about Madison Square Garden filmed from '97-98 that is apparently his only currently suppressed film. James Dolan apparently withdrew legal permission to release it due to scenes of MSG execs plotting labor negotiation strategy (more info here: https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2005/04/25/secret-garden). It would no doubt have been up there as one of his most colorful and accessible films were it released, and Stone Cold Steve Austin and Mary J. Blige among others would officially be considered Wiseman vets.
― Chris L, Monday, 12 September 2022 04:50 (one year ago) link
A couple months back I asked one of the hosts of Wiseman Podcast (big, big recommendation for this BTW - better than all film podcasts) if they were going to cover The Garden - they will and apparently the film will get an official release next year.
― Elvis Telecom, Monday, 12 September 2022 05:49 (one year ago) link
Whoa, cool; thanks! I think I follow the Wiseman podcast guy on Twitter but have not checked it out yet.
― Chris L, Monday, 12 September 2022 06:01 (one year ago) link
If you check out any episode, listen to their interview with Wiseman himself. It's good and covers a lot of subjects that I haven't heard in any other interviews with him.
― Elvis Telecom, Monday, 12 September 2022 07:17 (one year ago) link
I'm in the middle of Belfast, Maine right now. Heavy, miasmic, rough road of American gothic but some of the scenes are among Wiseman's best.
― Elvis Telecom, Monday, 12 September 2022 07:40 (one year ago) link
(I love that he's into Down By Law)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kOpRVNqOZUA
― Elvis Telecom, Wednesday, 9 November 2022 21:19 (one year ago) link
Love that clip. Going to guess he and Jarmusch know each other, but if not, can you imagine sitting there and watching this and hearing Frederick Wiseman say he loves your film and he's seen it six times?
― clemenza, Thursday, 10 November 2022 01:13 (one year ago) link
Watching “Central Park” over the last few days.
― The Triumphant Return of Bernard & Stubbs (Raymond Cummings), Tuesday, 27 December 2022 01:28 (one year ago) link
Early takeaway: I would like to visit this park, but, um, not in the late 1980s.
― The Triumphant Return of Bernard & Stubbs (Raymond Cummings), Tuesday, 27 December 2022 01:31 (one year ago) link
We watched City Hall over the weekend and I sorta think it should have been called Mayor??
― Piggy Lepton (La Lechera), Tuesday, 27 December 2022 05:08 (one year ago) link
The Midnight Oil show wasn't that bad!
― Elvis Telecom, Tuesday, 27 December 2022 09:04 (one year ago) link
It was nice to see LeVar Burton!
― The Triumphant Return of Bernard & Stubbs (Raymond Cummings), Sunday, 1 January 2023 03:51 (one year ago) link
And yeah, the Midnight Oil performance is great!
― The Triumphant Return of Bernard & Stubbs (Raymond Cummings), Sunday, 1 January 2023 03:57 (one year ago) link
Damn, people seemed to love Ed Koch.
― The Triumphant Return of Bernard & Stubbs (Raymond Cummings), Sunday, 1 January 2023 04:13 (one year ago) link
Happy 93rd birthday today Fred!
― Elvis Telecom, Monday, 2 January 2023 02:42 (one year ago) link
La Danse: The Paris Opera Ballet (2009), the last Wiseman joint shot on film and the first in a wide format (though interestingly 5:3 rather than 16:9 or 1.85 like the films that follow) is a good deal weirder than you might expect going into it. pic.twitter.com/Py1RQQUIBO— arlin golden (@cerealburrito) May 13, 2023
― Elvis Telecom, Tuesday, 16 May 2023 07:34 (ten months ago) link
Watching “Missile”.
― The Triumphant Return of Bernard & Stubbs (Raymond Cummings), Saturday, 1 July 2023 23:28 (eight months ago) link
worth turning on the subtitles on that just for the “bland music “ cues
― Elvis Telecom, Saturday, 1 July 2023 23:37 (eight months ago) link
Kinda electric to encounter “Planet Claire” and “Pop Music” in Model.
― The Triumphant Return of Bernard & Stubbs (Raymond Cummings), Sunday, 9 July 2023 19:44 (eight months ago) link
And … there’s Andy Warhol!
― The Triumphant Return of Bernard & Stubbs (Raymond Cummings), Sunday, 9 July 2023 19:46 (eight months ago) link
We had to pause Crazy Horse midway through because I outbursted with "this is Fredrick Wiseman's verison of the James Bond opening credits!" and then we wondered what a Wiseman James Bond movie would even be like - we made up more and more preposterous and funnier scenes. Frederick Wiseman's UNIVERSAL EXPORTS: Endless meetings with photo-interpreters, do we/do we not burn fuel on the spy satellite to get a better photo? Lots of one sided telephone calls, many pained looks into screens, others repetetively cleaning up audio transcriptions. A janitor empties the paper shredders and burn bags and night, Bond himself is never direcly on camera, we only see him through drone overheads and surveillance video.
― Elvis Telecom, Tuesday, 11 July 2023 07:27 (eight months ago) link
Will never forget the critic who dubbed that movie Tittie-butt Follies.
― fair but so uncool beliefs here (Eric H.), Tuesday, 11 July 2023 13:36 (eight months ago) link
The restaurant movie gets a title: Menus-Plaisirs Les Troisgros and a premiere at TIFF this year. It's 4 hours long too - stoked!
― Elvis Telecom, Thursday, 27 July 2023 06:45 (eight months ago) link
I hope it gets a decent run in the U.S.
― The Triumphant Return of Bernard & Stubbs (Raymond Cummings), Wednesday, 23 August 2023 20:08 (seven months ago) link
sounds really good
going through all of his films in order by year I have still only made it up to High School II from 1994
― Dan S, Wednesday, 6 September 2023 00:05 (six months ago) link
There are a couple of reviews of Menus-Plaisirs Les Troisgros out - this one maybe the most considered?https://outskirtsmag.com/Menus-Plaisirs
― Elvis Telecom, Sunday, 24 September 2023 10:01 (six months ago) link
Tonight: Essene.
― The Triumphant Return of Bernard & Stubbs (Raymond Cummings), Saturday, 4 November 2023 00:57 (four months ago) link
oh man, the scene with the flyswatter
― Elvis Telecom, Wednesday, 8 November 2023 06:05 (four months ago) link
watched Ballet, about the American Ballet Theater, from 1995. It is one of my favorite films of his so far. It is, as always for him, about an institution but features an amazing extended interview with Agnes de Mille before she died and many beautiful rehearsal sequences and performances
― Dan S, Saturday, 13 January 2024 00:37 (two months ago) link
"Most striking might be the sounds Wiseman captures, not just of the music, hardly at all of the music (there isn't even an orchestra at the Athens performance: Wiseman gives us a close-up of the giant tape recorder filling in for the band), but rather the grunts and thuds and squeaks of the dancers' shoes on the surface of the stage. The sound of gravity in an artform that aspires to weightlessness."
https://theendofcinema.blogspot.com/2014/09/on-frederick-wisemans-ballet.html
― Dan S, Saturday, 13 January 2024 01:25 (two months ago) link
this goes about exactly how you'd expect fred wiseman appearing as a talking head in a documentary called "cinema verite: defining the moment" might. pic.twitter.com/hiZR7s4irT— arlin golden (@cerealburrito) February 3, 2024
― Elvis Telecom, Tuesday, 6 February 2024 22:21 (one month ago) link
(last bit of it) pic.twitter.com/FJE5IHuAOD— arlin golden (@cerealburrito) February 3, 2024
― Elvis Telecom, Tuesday, 6 February 2024 22:22 (one month ago) link
Man, the judge in “Juvenile Court”… what a job
― Marten Broadcloak, mild-mannered GOP congressman (Raymond Cummings), Thursday, 14 March 2024 00:57 (two weeks ago) link
Apparently you can watch the latest film here
https://www.pbs.org/video/menus-plaisirs-les-troisgros-rbfnou/
― Marten Broadcloak, mild-mannered GOP congressman (Raymond Cummings), Thursday, 21 March 2024 11:28 (one week ago) link
we just watched that -- it was very long and medium enjoyable imo. i enjoyed the kitchen scenes and seeing the chefs foraging and clowning around, but it was definitely bougie Wiseman (not my favorite)
― Piggy Lepton (La Lechera), Thursday, 21 March 2024 13:47 (one week ago) link
i did like that it was an entry into the behind-the-scenes kitchen films/media that did not portray the kitchen as a chaotic/abusive/stressful place. everything was extremely placid.
― Piggy Lepton (La Lechera), Thursday, 21 March 2024 13:49 (one week ago) link
I’m sure i will eventually get around to it and probably enjoy it, but even as a Wiseman buff i’ve had a hard time working up much enthusiasm for it just based on the subject
After years of having it on my watchlist i finally got around to Near Death a couple weeks ago and it completely rocked my world, i havent been able to stop thinking about it since, might be his masterpiece imho. It wasnt as disturbing or difficult to watch as i’d always feared, but just unbelievably rich & complex.
― waste of compute (One Eye Open), Thursday, 21 March 2024 14:10 (one week ago) link
Such a great film--my second favourite (seems like a weird word to use) after Welfare.
― clemenza, Friday, 22 March 2024 14:04 (six days ago) link
His new film is not as good as "Near Death", however, it is still worth checking out. Wiseman has great rhythm to his films. This latest one is no exception. The 4 hours zoom by really quickly.
― Vintage, Monday, 25 March 2024 04:45 (three days ago) link