when did inverted look stop being the default?

Message Bookmarked
Bookmark Removed

and why do you use normal look you fuckin newbies

cutty, Friday, 28 September 2007 14:54 (fourteen years ago) link

it's never been the default for as long as I can remember

my little bros both use it means it sucks

inverted look 4 life

czn, Friday, 28 September 2007 14:57 (fourteen years ago) link

then why are we trained to use inverted look?

cutty, Friday, 28 September 2007 15:00 (fourteen years ago) link

i think somewhere around turok, normal became the default. anyone remember what goldeneye had as default?

cutty, Friday, 28 September 2007 15:00 (fourteen years ago) link

I'm used to inverted too, why is this? Flight sims?

Jordan, Friday, 28 September 2007 15:08 (fourteen years ago) link

i'm almost certain golden eye was normal look

carne asada, Friday, 28 September 2007 15:12 (fourteen years ago) link

well you have to consider when a mini-joystick type thumbstick was added to consoles--which was n64. i think the first n64 games were inverted look. someone plz confirm/deny.

cutty, Friday, 28 September 2007 15:13 (fourteen years ago) link

anyway i can't fathom using normal look

cutty, Friday, 28 September 2007 15:13 (fourteen years ago) link

yeah, inverted just feels way more instinctive to me

carne asada, Friday, 28 September 2007 15:15 (fourteen years ago) link

inverted is from computer games, i am pretty sure, esp. flight games... anyway I got used to normal, but I suck with it so i think i am going to train myself for inverted again, becaue when i used inverted it ruled.

Will M., Friday, 28 September 2007 15:21 (fourteen years ago) link

i couldn't find any confirmation on default Goldeneye look controls. but i did find this:
http://kotaku.com/assets/resources/2007/09/controlbong.jpg

carne asada, Friday, 28 September 2007 15:34 (fourteen years ago) link

was goldeneye the proto-halo?

Will M., Friday, 28 September 2007 15:45 (fourteen years ago) link

goldeneye was THE first console multiplayer FPS

cutty, Friday, 28 September 2007 15:46 (fourteen years ago) link

i still play Goldeneye to this day

carne asada, Friday, 28 September 2007 15:59 (fourteen years ago) link

well not in the last few months

carne asada, Friday, 28 September 2007 16:00 (fourteen years ago) link

I always felt people who used inverted look were TOTAL throwbacks, the kinds of people who were playing flight simulators before Quake came out and couldn't get "up means up" into their heads.

antexit, Friday, 28 September 2007 16:18 (fourteen years ago) link

i'm looktarded

carne asada, Friday, 28 September 2007 16:20 (fourteen years ago) link

but i think, physiologically, inverted still makes more inituitive sense than normal look, even in FPS's

cutty, Friday, 28 September 2007 16:27 (fourteen years ago) link

the stick follows the direction your head would physically move (not your eyes)

cutty, Friday, 28 September 2007 16:28 (fourteen years ago) link

confirmed by my GF who's at home today. Goldeneye default is inverted

carne asada, Friday, 28 September 2007 17:09 (fourteen years ago) link

first i'm psyched that you asked your girlfriend to check

second i'm psyched because i was right!

cutty, Friday, 28 September 2007 17:15 (fourteen years ago) link

Dude, she's at home watching soaps. the best part was talking her the through the set up of the console since it wasn't even connected

carne asada, Friday, 28 September 2007 17:19 (fourteen years ago) link

Why is inverted look better? Is it just something you're used to, or does it have added benefits I am unaware of?

In Forza I have the downshift on LB and brake on LT, but I notice that a lot of people have this inverted to downshift on RB, which makes sense because you can use your right finger for one button and left finger for the other instead of having to cycle back and forth, but I don't see a real advantage to the inverted look thing other than familiarity.

polyphonic, Friday, 28 September 2007 17:28 (fourteen years ago) link

Dude, she's at home watching soaps. the best part was talking her the through the set up of the console since it wasn't even connected

-- carne asada, Friday, September 28, 2007 5:19 PM (2 hours ago) Bookmark Link

did you tell her why you were asking?

s1ocki, Friday, 28 September 2007 19:26 (fourteen years ago) link

she really didn't question it. she's good like that.

carne asada, Friday, 28 September 2007 19:30 (fourteen years ago) link

yeah, i've played flight sims since the mid 80s. Non-inverted look feels too wrong.

kingfish, Friday, 28 September 2007 19:59 (fourteen years ago) link

For some reason I don't like to change anything in the control options in the games I play. If the buttons are mapped weird, I just deal with it. If the camera is the opposite of what I think it should be, that's that.

Take Halo 3 - I suppose I could have changed the reload button back to where it was in the first two Halo games, and the look controls while I was at it, but I always learn a game with the defaults. The only real advantage to this, I guess, is that I never have to complain that a game doesn't allow you to mess with the controls. I wouldn't do it anyway.

marmotwolof, Saturday, 29 September 2007 08:13 (fourteen years ago) link

So given that no-one plays flight sims nowadays, is this really an age-gap thing? I played a few in the 90s, not too many, but yup I'm inverted4life.

couldn't get "up means up" into their heads.

C'mon, it's not up on the mousepad, it's forwards!

ledge, Saturday, 29 September 2007 08:42 (fourteen years ago) link

For some reason I don't like to change anything in the control options in the games I play. If the buttons are mapped weird, I just deal with it. If the camera is the opposite of what I think it should be, that's that.

hell no. I map everything to GTA standards. left button = attack, bottom button = jump, etc etc.

kingfish, Saturday, 29 September 2007 18:15 (fourteen years ago) link

I am actually similar to marmotwolof in not changing things. Changing controls was beaten out of me by playing a lot of street fighter w/ my friends, and every time people switched out, they changed buttons...

Will M., Saturday, 29 September 2007 19:55 (fourteen years ago) link

I kind of imagine it thus, what if I had my hand on top a persons head and I wanted to force the to look up or down, which way would move my hand?

Jarlrmai, Sunday, 30 September 2007 13:20 (fourteen years ago) link

would I

Jarlrmai, Sunday, 30 September 2007 13:23 (fourteen years ago) link

Okay, I should revise my above statement to read "the kinds of people who were playing flight simulators before Quake and the kinds of people who are used to forcing other people to look up and down by grabbing a fistful of their hair."

antexit, Sunday, 30 September 2007 15:26 (fourteen years ago) link

the hand-on-head makes so much sense it's crazy. i kinda love that example.

i tried switching to inverted this weekend, but it didn't go well.

Will M., Tuesday, 2 October 2007 16:32 (fourteen years ago) link

if I had my hand on top a persons head and I wanted to force the to look up or down, which way would move my hand?

this is OTM

(if kind of a crepey image!)

Jordan, Tuesday, 2 October 2007 16:56 (fourteen years ago) link

Changing controls was beaten out of me by playing a lot of street fighter w/ my friends, and every time people switched out, they changed buttons...

Just hold Select! Besides, anyone who played SF a lot could change their buttons in no more than 10 seconds.

Weird how when I played GoldenEye again on Sunday (i.e. after reading this thread), I just picked the inverted look up without even thinking about it. If not for carne asada's GF, I wouldn't have been able to tell you if it was inverted or normal.

Leee, Tuesday, 2 October 2007 17:33 (fourteen years ago) link

Inverted all the way. Anything else is bonkers! That said, I only have one inverted friend, as far as I know. Everyone else is plain regular.

melton mowbray, Wednesday, 3 October 2007 13:04 (fourteen years ago) link

normal look = fucking nubcakes

i think flight sims are the cause of inverted ppl
ppl who use normal look should be whacked on the back of the head with a metal ruler like left handers were in the 50s or whatever.

k bai

g-kit, Wednesday, 3 October 2007 14:47 (fourteen years ago) link

I've always been inverted too. It really doesn't make much sense though, does it? The back of the head argument sounds like a nice one, but if that was really how it worked then left/right should be inverted too.

JimD, Wednesday, 3 October 2007 17:27 (fourteen years ago) link

when did two dimensions stop being the default. you people and your comprehension of a 3d space represented on a flat surface with no peripheral vision

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 3 October 2007 17:32 (fourteen years ago) link

(ok I'll go away now)

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 3 October 2007 17:33 (fourteen years ago) link

nah, for left/right you grab bro's ear of choice and pull him that way

Will M., Wednesday, 3 October 2007 17:36 (fourteen years ago) link

If they ever put a networked match shooter on the Wii it's really going to fuck this up for you inverts

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 3 October 2007 17:58 (fourteen years ago) link

That will never happen though

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 3 October 2007 18:06 (fourteen years ago) link

are you not an invert?

cutty, Wednesday, 3 October 2007 19:10 (fourteen years ago) link

I am not even a First Person or a Shooter

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 3 October 2007 19:15 (fourteen years ago) link

I am and always will be a Third Person Turn Taker, sad as it is

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 3 October 2007 19:15 (fourteen years ago) link

so basically you only like final fantasy

cutty, Wednesday, 3 October 2007 19:59 (fourteen years ago) link

cold but not undeserved

El Tomboto, Wednesday, 3 October 2007 20:00 (fourteen years ago) link

C'mon, it's not up on the mousepad, it's forwards!

do you scroll forwards and backwards through websites or up and down

webber, Wednesday, 3 October 2007 23:18 (fourteen years ago) link

It's nice to see so many inverts here, when I'm ridiculed by my peers for playing backwards. However, when I played a lot of PC shooters I used normal, because I like the idea of the game being like an animated wallpaper and just clicking on faces to make the baddies die in an elaborate fashion.

I think it was third-person shooters on consoles that turned me into an invert, although I did used to play an extraordinary amount of Flight Simulator on the ST when I was a sprout. In third person it's not so much moving the character as it is the camera, so it's got to be inverted.

Something I've always wondered is whether anyone uses invert left/right in anything. Perhaps I did on Colossus, but again this was a camera issue rather than the character's POV. Any left/right inverts on first person shooters?

In answer to the original question: maybe it was when first person shooters changed their name from Doomalikes (or is this term not actually as widespread as I thought?)

melton mowbray, Thursday, 4 October 2007 21:28 (fourteen years ago) link

one year passes...

INVERTED 4 LIFE

cutty, Saturday, 8 November 2008 18:02 (thirteen years ago) link

anyone wants to play me (normal look nub) in cod4, c'mon and bring the ruckus

Your original display name will be displayed in brackets. (dan m), Saturday, 8 November 2008 18:04 (thirteen years ago) link

Totally inverted, totally got it from Wing Commander 2.

Doctor Casino, Saturday, 8 November 2008 22:44 (thirteen years ago) link

more like perverted look, regular 4 life

s1ocki, Saturday, 8 November 2008 23:47 (thirteen years ago) link

i fuckin miss wing commander 2 that was my shit in grade 4

HOOS HOOS HOOS on the autosteen (BIG HOOS aka the steendriver), Sunday, 9 November 2008 00:10 (thirteen years ago) link

inverted is more sensical

❤ⓛⓞⓥⓔ❤ (CaptainLorax), Monday, 10 November 2008 05:20 (thirteen years ago) link

one year passes...

INVERTED 4 LIFE

robster craws (cutty), Friday, 11 December 2009 21:48 (eleven years ago) link

"And the doors were where the windows should be. And the windows were where the doors should be.."

bracken free ditch (Ste), Friday, 11 December 2009 22:58 (eleven years ago) link

INVERTED 4 LIFE

^^^

hey trader joe's! i've got the new steely dan. (Jordan), Friday, 11 December 2009 23:00 (eleven years ago) link

more like perverted look, regular 4 life

― s1ocki, Saturday, November 8, 2008 6:47 PM (1 year ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

more like perverted CROOK now that i think of it

donde está mia farrow, fa la la la la, la la la la (s1ocki), Friday, 11 December 2009 23:01 (eleven years ago) link

it's kinda interesting to see someone try a 3-D game who's never done it before and seeing if inverted or "regular" is more natural. like a kid finding out if they're right or left-handed.

hey trader joe's! i've got the new steely dan. (Jordan), Friday, 11 December 2009 23:06 (eleven years ago) link

one year passes...

http://www.wired.com/reviews/2011/07/osx-lion/

First, let me finish my rant about inverted scrolling. I wanted very badly to adapt to Lion’s new so-called “natural scrolling” behavior, but I had to shut it off after two days because it just felt too awkward.

“I’m trying to use a computer, not play freakin’ Golden Eye,” I complained to a friend.

cutty, Thursday, 21 July 2011 15:23 (ten years ago) link

three years pass...

Realised too late that I'm raising a non-inverted child. It started when he was playing minecraft and I just didn't think to change his controls from the default, now we're playing Destiny together and every time we pass the pad we have to go into the bloody options menu first.

I have failed as a parent.

JimD, Tuesday, 28 October 2014 10:42 (seven years ago) link

i always invert-y but never x-axis

am0n, Wednesday, 29 October 2014 17:17 (seven years ago) link

one year passes...

man, the inmates have truly taken over the asylum on this one now huh

Dadjokke (Sgt. Biscuits), Thursday, 31 December 2015 16:14 (five years ago) link

Once upon a time a man would come home after a hard day's work defending his home from the Nazi menace in a Supermarine Spitfire and relax with a game of Mario 64, the controller's little joystick working just the same as in his aeroplane. Now kids don't even know how an aeroplane works and the invert axis toggle is rusted stuck in a cobwebby corner of the options menu. Society is in the gutter.

ledge, Thursday, 31 December 2015 16:31 (five years ago) link

I remember playing MS flight simulator in the mid 80s and crashing a buncha times into the O'Hare Hilton because I didn't get inverted look. I deserved it.

droit au butt (Euler), Thursday, 31 December 2015 16:44 (five years ago) link

five years pass...

(So as not to hijack the 'terrible opinions' thread):

If you don't think "inverted look" is default your brain doesn't work properly; the lunatics have taken over the asylum

Obviously this is true but when my 5yo daughter is looking at photo thumbnails on the computer screen and says 'go up' she gets cross when i swipe up on the trackpad to see what's higher up, which scrolls the screen down.

And yet on my phone i swipe down to scroll the screen down - exactly the opposite, but both feel perfectly natural. In the computer screen (= inverted look), conceptually I'm moving my point of view of a static information field; on the phone (= non inverted) my POV is static and I'm moving the information field. So it's not that non inverted is fundamentally wrong but it would seem like its adherents have a different conception of the game world, it's something they move around not something they move around in.

namaste darkness my old friend (ledge), Friday, 5 November 2021 11:35 (three weeks ago) link

So maybe it's phones that caused the change. Inverted look (moving up to go down) doesn't make sense when you are effectively directly manipulating the information field, and if that's your first UI experience you then apply it across the board.

namaste darkness my old friend (ledge), Friday, 5 November 2021 11:40 (three weeks ago) link

Used to be fully inverted believer but past few years for some reason I totally hate it. It was definitely initially because I'd played flight sims a lot on 16 bit computers, then first person shooters on pc it just felt right. These days though, nope, up is up and down is down for me.

sorry for splitting.

Chicks and Ducks and Geese better scurry (Ste), Friday, 5 November 2021 11:43 (three weeks ago) link

mouselook games were never inverted look by default were they? it was a joystick thing

ciderpress, Friday, 5 November 2021 13:40 (three weeks ago) link

Hmm, you maybe right. In fact the first fps game I played on pc might have been Dark Forces where I used a flight stick to control - of course it was inverted and felt right.

Chicks and Ducks and Geese better scurry (Ste), Friday, 5 November 2021 13:45 (three weeks ago) link

also possible that I played most of my fps and third person games on consoles, things like GTA3 etc

Chicks and Ducks and Geese better scurry (Ste), Friday, 5 November 2021 13:48 (three weeks ago) link


You must be logged in to post. Please either login here, or if you are not registered, you may register here.