Rolling 2014 Haunted Rocking Chair Thread

i remember seeing a more detailed list at the time but this was a big leak earlier in the year http://www.tsmplug.com/richlist/wwe-wrestler-salaries/

internet got mad over steph and hunter paying themselves twice for office work & a performers salary

Its quite a bleak article but so mamy of its points are depressingly true. Shame he finds Vince so evil he gave Bobby Heenan throat cancer though, because shit like that devalues the legitimacy of the article.

I'm sure there are still many major issues outstanding wrt treatment of talent and so on but it does seem that some of this stuff is starting to change.

I can't recall precise details off the top of my head but as I understand it WWE has started putting into place various safeguards to ensure that their workers aren't totally broke / broken down husks once their careers are over - paying to put former employees through rehab, grants for released talent who want to pursue higher education in order to get themselves another job, taking an active hand in ensuring that new workers are sensible with their money, putting the Wellness Policy in place to prevent steroid abuse etc.

They've also actively banned a number of the dangerous spots that the article flags up (blading, piledrivers, unprotected chair shots) to the extent that it's now increasingly rare to see any of those things happen. Even when it does, it would seem to be the workers taking it upon themselves to do that shit - Jericho told a good anecdote recently on someone's podcast about a match he had with Batista when Big Dave cut himself open and apparently Vince went totally apeshit about it, tried to fine everyone involved a pretty hefty sum (six figures for both Batista and Jericho) and Batista took the hit for the team because it had been his call to do it.

Not saying that everything is rosy for WWE workers by any stretch of the imagination and I'm sure much more could be done to help them out and protect them, but the article's thrust seems to be that up until a decade or so ago things were real bad, and here's a list of all the people from the business a decade or more ago who suffered horrific shit as a result.

Of course there are still recent examples of people who are pretty much broken by the time they get out of the industry (is it Edge who can basically never take a bump again if he wants to keep all his motor functions intact?) but this again would seem to be on the wrestlers themselves to a certain extent. Randy Orton is a good example of a guy who's deliberately developed a style and moveset designed to be easy on his body with longevity in mind.

So yeah, there is no doubt that wrestling is still a dirty fucking business that chews people up and spits them right out again, but this article isn't especially evenhanded.

Cracking post. I mean a lot of stuff still needs to be worked out, Vince has too much past to be anything other than a con man etc. but they've made some incredible strides over the past ten years. Write a paragraph about how piledrivers end careers? Well there have only been three uses of them in the past 2 years, only been done by veterans (Kane, Punk & Undertaker) and been such a rarity that everyone has noticed and made a big deal out of them. Dynamite Kid got left without a doctor 25 years ago? Well matches now stop for the ring side doctor to check on someone on a nearly weekly basis. Chair-shots haven't existed in the past five years, bar Taker giving one to Hunter three years ago.

Sure they still need a union. All pro wrestlers do. What about the TNA guys on minimum wage still expected to pay travel & lodgings? God knows what some indie guys have to deal with then. There needs to be a wrestlers union. There always should have been. More strides have been made in that regard in the past 10 years (see examples in Windsor's post) and the way Jarrett's* promotion is looking, it wouldn't surprise me if a hook like that would be something he does to make them an attractive alternative. The promoters will have the cards at all levels until it can happen.

*Unfortunately its still Jarrett, who has been raised about as carny as wrestling promoters can be.

http://uproxx.com/prowrestling/2014/08/wwe-and-2k-confirmed-over-40-wrestlers-for-wwe-2k15/

are these wwe 2k games ever good?

i had the one with punk on the cover and it was supposed to be the best thing ever. i found it really dull & contrived. it had a storyline mode where you relived the attitude era, down to having to hit a guy w/ a chair in a match if it happened in 1997 etc.

my picks for tnite (based on what i want to happen, not on what i think is most likely to happen):

Lesnar + Heyman beat Cena
Wyatt beats Jericho
McMahon beats Brie
Rusev beats Swagger
Paige beats AJ
Orton beats Reigns
Dolph beats the Miz
Ambrose beats Rollins

probably won't watch tonight, gonna get my wrestling fill by watching this on repeat instead

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHAv0Dhka84

well i thought that was all totally great

great show.

Nothing was bad, but nothing was great either. How many more PPV matches can they get out of Rollins/Ambrose? Hopefully the heat for this feud doesn't die before WWE gets around to booking a proper blowoff. I'm getting tired of all these non-matches and screwy finishes.

does Lesnar have much of a record for injuring people? (I remember him powerbombing Bob Holly onto his head.) He has an aura of violence to him that not many in American wrestling have ever had (Vader is the only real comparison that comes to mind) but it kinda seems that a lot of that comes from him legit tossing people around with not much concern for how they land.

vince supposedly drove in the ambulance w/ undertaker?

WWE.com can confirm that, following last's night historic match with Brock Lesnar, The Undertaker was immediately taken to Ochsner Medical Center. After a CT scan and other medical testing, he was diagnosed with a severe concussion and was kept overnight for further evaluation. He was discharged early Monday afternoon.

Brock almost killed himself in doing a moonsault in a Wrestlemania match with Angle

Sorry, a shooting star press. I just watched it again for the cringing laughter it brings.

aw ziggler pointing at the WWE universe and cheering, "you did that," "you did that"

Between the Brock squash and the breezeblocks, that was a bloody fun two nights of wrestling.

Despite suffering what was deemed to be extensive head and spine trauma after being Curb Stomped through a pile of cinder blocks by Seth Rollins on Raw, Dean Ambrose has not only refused treatment but is reportedly missing after escaping WWE medical personnel altogether.

...

"At the time of bringing him backstage, he was responsive and was refusing transport to a local medical facility for further evaluation," said Amann. "He had removed the straps and surgical collar, said he refused to go and we haven't seen him since."

lol

in unrelated news, shooting for the WWE studios film Lockdown has begun

would wear: http://shop.wwe.com/Stephanie-McMahon-%22Steph-Steph-Steph%22-Authentic-T-Shirt/W08149,default,pd.html?dwvar_W08149_color=Maroon&start=4&cgid=New

Go for it! I keep getting tempted by a Wyatt trucker hat:

http://shop.wwe.com/Wyatt-Family-Trucker-Hat/W07693,default,pd.html?dwvar_W07693_color=No%20Color&start=94&cgid=New

loved this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=reJblljv5p4

http://uproxx.files.wordpress.com/2014/08/dean-ambrose-what.gif?w=650

follow dean ambrose around for 24 hours and i think you'd be able to compile a few hundred entries for dirt bag style

Ambrose vs Rollins on RAW this week -- wow. Why didn't they book that match for the PPV?

former WWE Creative member Andrew Goldstein was on Straight Shoot (podcast) this week and he claimed it was bc of the Network. that i guess they want ppl to be more invested in watching the network all the time and not so ppv dependent, so they're using the PPV to set up stories + matches that then get completed on RAW. idk if that makes a lot of sense to me, but ok.

I think that logic is reversed -- the PPV's are shown live on the network, and they're selling the network largely based on the value of getting all the PPV's when you sign up. RAW isn't shown live on the network, and there's a four week delay before the episodes are uploaded.

It's not like it's the first time they ran a match for free on TV the day after trying to get people to pay for it on PPV, but maybe we're in for a lot more of this. When people pay $40 for a PPV you're really screwing them over if you have a rematch on TV the next day, but now they're paying only $10 for the PPV plus everything else on the network.

my personal guess is that they wanted to give rollins + ambrose more (they're both super talented in the ring, on the mic, and they needed to give ambrose a send-off) but they didn't have time during the PPV to do a full thing. so they did some the night before and wrapped it up the next day. it was a pretty packed summerslam.

Sure, but the PPV is supposed to have the longer and better matches -- that's what people expect and it's why they're willing to pay to see those matches.

how amazing would it be if wyatt beats cena tnite

So I'm out of the loop right now as my internets is down. I only get scraps of information, but is Dean Ambrose dead?

Rollins curb stomped him into a pile of concrete. Supposedly he escaped from the ambulance taking him to the hospital and has not been heard from since.

i'm no doctor but imo he should really get that crushed skull seen to

i heard that ambrose is currently hiding inside corporate kane waiting to strike

http://uproxx.com/prowrestling/2014/08/paul-heyman-called-out-god-in-his-als-ice-bucket-challenge-video/

Just catching up with Raw and man are the Bella's horrible actresses. I get the storyline, but ditch the long-ass promos. They suck so bad.

Ambrose is busy bandaging up his skull with the skin of wolves he fought in the desert, roaming endlessly until he finds his way back to a raw where he can find and kill seth rollins

Cheers for that, love the idea of Ambrose turning savage and roaming 'merica with a crushed skull looking all Cray Cray!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=rqAOMnTDwQw

http://rumblemetrics.blogspot.co.uk/

Been dipping in and out of these as a bit of light bedtime reading and they are bringing me improbable amounts of joy.

"the last bit was good even if at first I was like "oh, these guys; alright I guess." I liked Angle/Benoit *a lot* and Triple H/Freakzilla was not without its odd pleasures and oh yeah Torrie Wilson and Dawn Marrie wrestled because *Dawn Marrie married Torrie Wilson's father Al and fucked him to death* so on the whole this was a solid show

So I’ve barely touched the whole Network thing since like March (actually forgot I had it for a while there) but I’m on holiday at the moment, still waiting for the new term to start, so I’ve finally gone back and started watching some stuff. This has all been pretty revelatory for me, cause beyond a certain point (end of ’99, start of 2000 maybe) I’ve always read way more about wrestling than I’ve ever bothered to watch, aside from a few isolated shows and matches. But boy, there’s some pretty fucking cool shit available on this service.

I just finished watching Great American Bash ’92, chosen pretty much at random because a tag team tournament sounded like super fun, although tbh as it turned out most of the tag team stuff on this show just sort of floated by without leaving very much impression. But man, Sting - Vader was something else!

One of the things I liked most was the way the crowd sounded, particularly when the little Stingers were getting riled up a bit - dunno if it was the acoustics or the way it was mic’ed or what, but I found it highly evocative, reminded me of barely remembered swimming galas in provincial swimming baths, those ones where the seats were all up in the rafters and the noise didn’t quite travel right. struck quite an emotional chord with me. also had the effect of making these guys seem less like internationally-renowned film-star celebrity demigods, more like slightly amateurish pantomime performers or children’s entertainers being recorded on VCR with kids sitting at the front and the parents standing at the back - Sting playing to the adoring screams of his pre-pubescent acolytes, Vader mugging to the hissing and the roars of the mob.

Best bit was maybe the test of strength spot where Vader and Harley Race try to goad Sting into locking up and Sting keeps looking to all the kids in the audience for help in deciding what to do, before eventually going for it (NO STING YOU IDIOT WHAT ARE YOU DOING YOULL NEVER BEAT THIS GUY THAT WAY) and losing, only for consternation to turn to delight as HA HA! Trickster Hero Sting jabs the eye of the Monster and draws delighted laughter from the multitude, only for delight to turn back to consternation as Vader immediately bodychecks him, killing the momentum and reminding all the little kiddies out there that this ain’t no fucking pantomime and there ain’t gonna be no happy ending, and no song and dance number to follow neither.

I’m rambling now but something about all this just feels so different to the wrestling I’ve been used to watching in my lifetime. Less like television performers playing a role or video game characters wearing down the opponent’s health bar. As I say, more like a pantomime; two dancing bears being sent out before a crowd of pissed-up parents and excitable infants to provide some good wholesome Sunday night entertainment for all the family before moving onto the next town and doing it all again. I realise that this is what pro-wrestling always was and still is, but this felt rawer, somehow, then a lot of the stuff I’ve watched before. Anyway, I loved it.

Match itself was fucking tight, especially interesting to watch in the context of the recent Lesnar / Cena monster vs champ ding-dong. Sting’s comeback spots were really well timed. They didn’t overdo it, gave Sting just enough to make you believe that there could be an outside chance while always being pretty much up-front about the fact that Vader had got this one in the bag. Not like the first Cena / Lesnar match from Extreme Rules where they barely had Cena land a punch throughout the entire match, making Lesnar look like a total punk when he got pinned out of nowhere to finish. Another little spot I really enjoyed here was when Vader went for a massive slam and Sting had started to wriggle out just as he got planted, meaning that to escape the pinfall he didn’t have to actually throw massive fucking Van Vader off of him but could just use the momentum of the slam to roll through and out of the pin. It’s the little things that make the difference, especially when the commentators are allowed to draw attention to them.

Anyway, those were some of my thoughts, very much looking forward to watching their Starrcade match tomorrow night now. Anyone else been enjoying the network recently?

If you didn't see it before, I really enjoyed Clash 19, which was the earlier rounds of that tag tournament a bit before the PPV. It has Joe and Dean Malenko representing 'Europe' because they're fake-Hungarian, and Gordy and Williams massacring an Australian father-son jobber tag team on the way to a great match with the Steiners in the main.

I really enjoyed here was when Vader went for a massive slam and Sting had started to wriggle out just as he got planted, meaning that to escape the pinfall he didn’t have to actually throw massive fucking Van Vader off of him but could just use the momentum of the slam to roll through and out of the pin. It’s the little things that make the difference, especially when the commentators are allowed to draw attention to them.

The Starrcade Vader-Sting is great too, has a lot of of similar well-executed small details like Vader punching himself out, subtly fucking up the execution of his moves and delaying the pin etc

On a semi-related note, the Steiners vs Curtis Hughes and Vader at Clash 18 is an insane, insane power match I would never have known existed without the WWE network for just £6.01 per month

I recently watched the three Flair v. Steamboat title matches from '89. Stupidly good.

I really need to sit down for a Sting-Vader marathon one of these days. I think I've seen only one or two of their matches.

I’m rambling now but something about all this just feels so different to the wrestling I’ve been used to watching in my lifetime.

WWE has almost always been about the babyface superhero champion, they really have no idea how to do book monster heels. The best example I can think of would be Yokozuna. They could have done it with Brock's comeback in '12 but they didn't. Even during HHH's reign(s) of terror (2002-6), which was the only time they ever ran with a heel champion for an extended period, it was more in the style of Flair in the 80's (barely escaping with the title every night), he was never really dominant.

Not got round to Sting vs Vader from Starrcade yet, but I did rewatch a couple of my fav matches from the last few years yesterday afternoon to see how they held up, and man, I'll be amazed if I can ever find a better monster vs underdog match than Punk vs Lesnar from Summerslam 2013. I loved it at the time but I think watching Bryan beat Cena 30 minutes later kinda took some of the shine off. On a second viewing this just blew me away. the kimura / triangle choke / powerbomb / still triangle choke / elbows / running powerbomb reversal sequence was out of this world.

It was a great match, but Lesnar bumped like a madman for Punk and for me it took away some of the believability. Putting it another way, Punk went toe to toe with Lesnar and would have beat him if not for Heyman's interference, but now one year later, Cena gets literally no offense against Lesnar at the same PPV.

idk, i take the point, but if you look at the shots that Punk actually lands on Lesnar (going high to take him by surprise, lightning knee strikes to the head, low blows, biting) I think if anything it goes to show that Punk, the smaller man, knows how to box clever, while Cena, as a bigger guy who's not needed to fight dirty in years, didn't have any response.

gotta remember that Punk was just coming off the back of the longest title reign anyone had had since Hogan-times, and had also gone the distance with The Undertaker at WM, which in recent years had become a spot reserved for the likes of HBK, HHH and so on. I don't have a problem with him looking competitive in this match, he still gets the shit beaten out of him and loses in the end.

It was probably the importance placed on the Heyman interference that hurt it most

They had Lesnar need Heyman's help to beat HHH and Punk, then he had that weird chairshot-heavy non match with Show then at WM it was suddenly all I'm ending the streak clean btw

If only Taker had been a three stripe jiu-jitsu white belt :(

good match though yeah, fuck it