no boys allowed in the room!!!!

Online; I am probably overreacting it is also none of my business and the correct answer is "stop freaking yourself out by reading".

it's different when the person is attacking you or someone you care about, imo. There have been times when I've turned a blind eye out of relief because the "target" wasn't me (for a change).

It's someone alleging a bunch of unpleasant stuff about someone who is not here to defend herself, we're hearing only one side of the story and everything about the narrator screams "unreliable narrator" covered in red flags with little icons of red flags printed all over them.

I know why this is bugging me. Because of that guy last year, finding out all of the bizarre lies he spread about me, how he represented the situation as the complete opposite of what actually happened, in similar ways to how this guy is now talking. I literally could not answer back to any of them to say "you are actively delusional and living in Opposite Land" but I just wanted *someone* to stand up and say "I don't believe you. You are lying."

So seeing someone raging through what looks, to me, like a very similar situation is kind of rubbing salt in old scars.

I don't know the whole situation, it's not my place to stand up and yell "I don't believe you; you're lying, and here's a list of all the red flags that creep me out". But it is seriously digging up bad memories of a thing I had hoped I had put behind me. It's putting me in an unpleasant place I don't want to be in any more; that's all.

I just feel icky and needed to register my discomfort rather than do anything about it.

I'm gonna go read some Ralf und Florian slash instead; thanks for listening. :)

I read something like that recently, and had the same red flags go up.

Me too

This guy is completely beyond the reach of of a sensible talking-to - his side of the story is one enormous red flag and I'm sure if we could get her side it would be a whole lot different and more believable

Is it possible to explain what's going on? I'm confused.

LL I don't want to spell it out because the guy has shown through his online behaviour that he simply does not understand soft noes; he powers straight through hard noes the moment he's drinking; he reacts really badly to being contradicted and Justine is right, he is beyond sensible talking to. I don't want to attract his attention, Christ especially not to this thread, but I just wanted to know if anyone else was getting not a "harmless pathetic dude" vibe but a red flag vibe from his story and his actions and it looks like some people are.

It bothers me - a lot - that her government name is just still sitting out there. It bothers me too when guys respond to him with "yeah, exes be psychos" without any awareness or thought of "holy shit what would it be like to be on the receiving end of the Guy That Doesn't Understand No for 2 years."

Like I said, I am reacting to this so badly because of my own bad experiences. I have no idea what a community should do in response to something like this!

i messaged LL with more details.

i'm majorly creeped out by his posts, and i honestly think ppl should just not engage him at all, if not outright ban him. it's not like he actually takes in anything anyone else posts, anyway.

it's funny, i instantly knew who you were referring to, bc it's been bothering me so much as well.

it's not like he actually takes in anything anyone else posts, anyway.

yeah, that was/is my biggest frustration, the reddest of the red flags.

Alright, got it. Thx for writing. Every no is a straight up no imo. Doesn't "understand" no = u are being a menace.

I did draft out a whole post which was "you might not be intentionally lying, but from your posts it looks like your view is ridiculously distorted" but failed to post it multiple times, b/c I just don't know whether that would be helpful or detrimental to the situation. I kind of feel like dude is mentally ill, surely it's wrong to turf him out? But equally I don't think we can help him, so... I don't know.

emil.y I've appreciated a lot of your posts.

This is a hugely emotive topic, so I'm going to try to say what I need to say, making it plain that I am speaking from a place of highly charged emotions, having been on several sides of this.

There are "people who suffer from mental health difficulties who are aware of their own issues and do their best to live within their limitations." There are "people who are seriously mentally ill and not capable of understanding why what they are doing is fucked-up because their thinking is so distorted". Then there are "people who have some seriously fucked-up ideas around women and consent". These are not distinct or discrete groups. I have been in some if not all of these groups, at various stages of illness, so I not saying this as an accusation, but an observation of something I am part of. There are people who are definitely in one group but not in any of the others, but there are also people who swirl all around all three groups. There are also very definitely people in the third group, who use the possibility that they *might* be in one of the other two, to get away with some frankly awful shit.

I have no interest in internet-diagnosing our little friend. I have no interest in working out which if any or all of these groups he belongs to. I am actually not interested in banning people or turfing them out, but I am interested in cleaning up or containing behaviour which is actively harmful to people, especially women, who fall foul of people in group number three.

For personal reasons, it freaks me the fuck out, having a woman (who is not a member of this community or able to defend herself) being put through an internet ringer, with her government name all hanging out there in the breeze (red flag: he asked for his government name to be removed from the post, but not hers!) for a guy of super-questionable motives and even more questionable sanity to just throw all kinds of deeply fucked-up allegations at, and invite strangers to internet-diagnose her, based on what are clearly extremely distorted views by someone who has demonstrably shown an inability to understand, let alone cope with rejection. That freaks me the fuck out.

Maybe the answer is as simple as "have someone (not me) have a word with moderators to edit that post to remove her name" - which is the bare minimum of what I'd expect. (Maybe this has already been done.) Beyond that, I do not know. But I do need to register my "I am really explicitly not OK with what is going on here, and why."

Now I'm kind of worked up and would prefer not to be, so here is a picture of my boys to lookit and calm me down.

http://media.gettyimages.com/photos/photo-of-ralf-hutter-and-florian-schneider-and-kraftwerk-florian-and-picture-id85853934

Thank you so much for that post, Branwell. You articulated stuff I'd been thinking very well and added a lot extra to think about too.

By the way, I am a mod - I redacted the woman in question's name and I honestly have no idea why I didn't do that immediately, especially because I know I thought I should as soon as I saw it. Completely on me for not taking action sooner. If any of you want to contact me about stuff relating to this or other moderator issues, or if you feel uncomfortable raising something with other mods, please do feel that you can contact me. One word of warning, though, b/c of my own mental health issues I sometimes get avoidant about checking my emails so it is not a 100% guarantee that I will see something even within a month. So maybe give me an oblique 'check your messages' prompt if you do get in contact.

yeah i really don't see anything good coming from engaging with him at all. he is absolutely NOT open to any type of real discussion, he just wants agreement and sympathy.

not a lot of ppl have been engaging him, which i think is great.

Thanks, Emil.Y!

(So someone I've known since childhood posted some asinine thing on fb recently about porn and then made a comment in the thread where she said, "This is why we have little blue pills, ladies. Whose victimizing who? Back to porn. More porn please!! Feminists I dare you to soapbox here and now. I'm in the mood." in response to absolutely nothing and she's been driving me nuts so I just posted a big long thing in response, right on her wall, which read in part "Your whole captain save all men/bitches be crazy/I'm only friends with guys thing is so strange and sad. You come off as catty and petty as the women you often insult. You're entitled to choose your own friends for any reason but reinforcing stereotypes that actually contribute to your own marginalization as a woman probably isn't a good idea. None of this makes you seem smart or cool and it's pretty cringe-worthy to witness. You're a smart woman but this crusade you seem to be on often undermines that." Really want to ruin and delete it because it seems mean but I've had enough and UGH. Fully expecting to be deleted and or blocked any min which would be totally OK with me.)

unfollowing people on facebook is quite a joy. You don't have to deal with the "why did you unfriend the person" drama ... I'd probably just delete the comment and unfollow the annoying person.

But she's such an asshat and it feels pretty of good to actually tell her so.

no "of"

Also, I agree with Branwell and Justine on all of the above but don't really know what to do except not engage.

good for you for telling her off! it's so satisfying!

xxp - lol! hit and run.

idk, what you said seems pretty otm? :)

it's just fb, she can't harm you for saying it. and if she gets into it just unfollow the thread & you're gold

There's a time and a place for engaging, if you genuinely think that you can have a dialogue with someone*. But trust me, from experience, having a rant on social media about someone who is driving you nuts can come back to haunt you in really unpleasant ways, no matter how necessary or good it felt to do at the time.

* (My rule on social media used to be: do not enter an argument unless there is a chance, no matter how slim, that *I* might change my mind. Now it's that, plus an additional "enter arguments where you don't think you will change your mind if and only if you have a *relevant* viewpoint which has so far been missing from a conversation, if you think there is a chance that more than 50% of the conversants might be open to hearing this view.")

Mute, unfollow, soft block, block are tools. Use them wisely but often.

can we talk about clothes and shows? specifically clothes to wear while playing shows? i am enjoying thinking about the possibilities but i wondered if y'all had any words of wisdom to share?
i'm not going to wear a skirt, but i have to be comfortable. i want to look cool and powerful and not like a slob. and not like i'm wearing a costume.
it's not that i have a lack of options, i just can't really make up my mind. it's at an arts space and there is no stage.

leggings & a dope blazer?

it depends on the show, what you're playing, and of course things like weather and temperature of venue

playing in a blazer might be difficult bc of the structure -- i like having bare arms but nothing floppy and no visible pits because it's february
the top has to be kinda snug so it doesn't get in the way but not too snug
i think i am actually enjoying this problem more than i want to solve it and talking about clothes is fun

no lie i saw a guy get totally butt naked (butt was audience-facing) on stage last fall while his band was setting up and he played in his underwear. i'm kind of envious of that kind of bold privilege even if i don't really want to play in my underwear myself.

sarahell any definite DNWs in your experience?

last night I DJ-ed an art opening and a wore a dress that had a sparkly top, but didn't care that much about my outfit below the waist because I was behind a table.

sheer bodysuit? :D

for example, i remember wearing a baggy tshirt to a yoga class, which was a mistake that i repeated years later by wearing baggy shorts to a yoga class

i have been dreaming of a sparkly top -- like a sweetheart-neckline sequined stretchy tshirt
mr goodbody suit would be ideal

mr goodbody suit with sequins i mean

haha

not really
like i said this is a fun problem

i do have a long-sleeved green leotard

omg i was just going to say leotard

i think my problem is that my first instinct is to dress like i'm in the circus :-/
probably best to go with something unshiny

in terms of playing drums? It depends on how "hard" you are playing. If I was playing like Mo Tucker or something, it wouldn't really matter, because that's pretty low-impact physically, but if I was really "going for it" these would be my dress tips:

3/4" sleeves or shorter
top: loose-fitting or if tighter, no non-stretchy fabrics that are tight in the shoulders or upper arms.
nothing itchy or with ribbon ties.
nothing binding in the neck.
i generally go for a strapless bra, because I suck at adjusting the straps of my bras, i guess (i have gotten distracted by bra strap slippage during a gig)
no top or dress that's dry-clean only
no tight skirts that go below the knee (I don't really care if I have to hitch my skirt up to play, the kick and snare cover the crotch)
no long wide-legged pants (they can easily catch in the kick drum beater)
comfortable shoes or you can play barefoot or just in socks (I have friends that swear by no shoes) -- the importance of footwear choice largely depends on how fast you have to play kick or hi-hat -- if you're not in super fast jazz or blast beat territory, it's not as "contentious" a subject

just figure that if you're playing a standard drum set configured in the standard way, people are only gonna see you from the waist up. maybe boobs up depending on rack tom placement.

yes! def no binding, ribbons, neck shit, itchy shit, wide-legged pants (they make me look like a troll), or boots that aren't snug to the leg. skirts are probably ok if they're not snug. i don't wear heels so that's not a prob.

i have some ideas. this helps. mostly i'm looking forward to it!! i'm not anywhere near blast beats or super fast jazz so no prob there. also i am v short so i'll probably just be a neck and a head. that's ok with me!

it helps if your shoes aren't heavy. I remember going from boots to just light leather sneakers, (Zach Hill wears converse fyi) and it really helped with leg fatigue.

like I was just thinking about the parts of my body that are most engaged when drumming and those are: hands, wrists, shoulder/upper arm, feet and ankles, and to a certain extent neck and waist movement is involved.

also if something can fall off, don't wear it or secure it tightly: scarves, capes, wigs, masks (have dealt with all of these)

i'm prob just gonna wear the shoes i practice in, which are pretty light. and super ugly! they're grey orthopedic shoes like not quite SAS oxfords but close

no wigs/masks/capes this time…maybe later

The only gig clothes advice I have to give is: DO NOT WEAR FLAPPY SLEEVES.

Seriously, the first time I did a proper "out of the house" gig, I dressed up and wore this amazing paisley shirt with super-wide draping cuffs with ruffles that spilled elegantly all over the place. I thought, you know, Jimi Hendrix wore this kind of thing, so it will be OK to wear onstage, right?

NOPE. All those psychedelic dudes wore ruffled trailing sleeves in PHOTO SHOOTS. On stage, they wore more SENSIBLE sleeves which did not interfere with the STRINGS of their guitars.

So I think you already have "something without sleeves" on your list but still, I would definitely like to second that.

I just had my period 2 weeks ago & now nature has seen fit to give me a lighter "bonus" period

apparently this is a thing that happens

ugh wtf

Oh, I get those sometimes! They are fun*.

*By fun I mean incredibly painful, messy and leave you feeling like you've got no bones anaemic.

(For me, it's usually happened when my cycle was kind of resetting itself after spending a long time with someone who was in the pill or pregnant.)

yeah i read that it can also be caused by drop in hormones etc

it's not super painful thankfully but it at least explains my bloating & endless trips to the bathroom today

oof

I get "spotting" from time to time, sometimes w bloating/pain/other side effects, and a while after I last came off the pill I had a period which was p. light but seemed to go on foreverrrrr and keep resuming a day or two later every time I thought it had stopped. but nothing on that scale, it sounds horrible. bad luck, hope it goes away soon

also, "no bones anaemic" reminded me: if I talked about periods featuring a draining* sensation in the idk ovary area would people here have an idea what sensation I'm talking about? lately I have had a similar draining feeling elsewhere and I don't know how to describe it but I don't think that description is really going to help. especially not if I see a male doctor. just wondering

(* prob just my mind being a combination of overdramatic yet also overly literal)

also also I would like to thank anyone who still has the patience to counter fedora-isms on the Sw*ns thread (obv not just women but) because jfc