no boys allowed in the room!!!!

Yeah, multiple of the men who were holding the floor last night also dropped their "activist" qualifications into the conversation! It's helping me understand the controversy around the word "ally" and how ppl sometimes act like it's a label that, once you achieve it, just stays with you like it's your resume, instead of being a *state of being* that you have to work at with your actions, forever.

How are you feeling as you deal with that? Are you getting support from a wider circle? You don't have to share anything more specific but if you want to I'm interested.

Hearing this a lot, particularly with respect to a Breaking Bad thread wherein some of ILX's MOST PROMINENT AND IMPORTANT FEMINIST DUDES just would not stfu and it just drives me nuts. I mean preaching white male privilege as a feminist authority when you are a white male is nagl when you are harping on and on and just not fucking shutting up and sitting down. OH THE IRONING.

Er that should actually read more like "Condescending to others about how you are so much more aware of white male privilege than anyone else in the room" is nagl when you are a white male and the topic is feminism.

i checked out of that thread once there started being more than a few dozen posts per day, what was the topic?

Topic was whether disliking the Skyler character made one anti-feminist and/or misogynist. And things got super preachy and I'm like fuck this I just want to talk about breaking bad, not be condescended to about the proper way to feel about the character and the actor who plays the character (lol I typed "actress" and changed it). It was captain save-a-ho shit such as I have never seen.

oh geez

I mean can we all agree that Skyler kinda sucked? I mean maybe we can't agree but that doesn't mean I think people who did not embrace that character actually have a deep-seated hatred of all of the womens.

she was one of my fave characters

and discussing how one feels about characters that are not "privileged" in terms of real world bias can be a worthwhile discussion -- i mean, this was a lot of what i studied in college -- but the dynamics of the discussion as you put it forth sounds aggravating

I thought her character and Anna Gunn's performances were both irksome, and yeah of course the writing of this particular female character was an issue and the fact that there were not a lot (any?) impressive female characters in Breaking Bad is also irksome, but basically it was some card-carrying (and waving it about dramatically) feminist dudes preaching about how we all just didn't understand oppression was just ugh too much for me.

i liked both Skyler and Marie, even though they weren't given as many interesting things to do or say as the male characters -- but maybe that was me projecting onto them?

I liked Marie! We named one of our cats for Marie (the other cat is Gus).

I mean maybe we can't agree but that doesn't mean I think people who did not embrace that character actually have a deep-seated hatred of all of the womens.

yeah, it is more complex than that, for sure

I wish you had been there during that threadpisode! Bunch of people with penises telling everyone how female oppression all works!

haha! I grew wary of discussing tv and movies on ilx after a film poll where i got shit from a couple of male posters for saying that I just couldn't get past the sexist stereotypes in "Almost Famous" in terms of appreciating that film

i love skyler!

I liked Marie! We named one of our cats for Marie (the other cat is Gus).

― quincie, Monday, November 4, 2013 10:09 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i too have named a cat Gustavo during the run of Breaking Bad. you'll be pleased to no he currently runs our entire neighborhood.

i also love skylar and marie but it tookj a little time (more so with marie than skylab)

I really liked Skyler as a character but I got fed up of pointing out on that thread that she was kind of normal compared to regular 'tv wives'.

please forgive me but i was looking for a caption and this seemed amusing enough

Bunch of people with penises telling everyone how female oppression all works!

http://25.media.tumblr.com/a9012d58f82f60e7474d7dabf01952d3/tumblr_mtaqh4LxWr1rcq6xho1_500.jpg

haha! I grew wary of discussing tv and movies on ilx after a film poll where i got shit from a couple of male posters for saying that I just couldn't get past the sexist stereotypes in "Almost Famous" in terms of appreciating that film

― sarahell, Monday, November 4, 2013 11:16 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

you were totally otm fwiw

there is this guy at work. he always talks over everyone! especially the ladies. one day i'm gonna lose it.

you know that phenomenon where you'll say something otm and a dude in your midst will agree but attribute your comment to some other dude in your midst? aka graduate school? seems related, makes me crazy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DE3r_CgScms

i can totally hear this in your voice and it is killing me!
that phenomenon where you'll say something otm

oh yeah this guy is the office know-it-all. he does know a lot but sometimes he's just wrong. a lot of times he has repeated things i've said and art of pretend forgetfulnessed where they came from. i'm the real office know-it-all tbh.

you know that phenomenon where you'll say something otm and a dude in your midst will agree but attribute your comment to some other dude in your midst? aka graduate school? seems related, makes me crazy.

― horseshoe, Tuesday, November 5, 2013 9:18 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

my life, i swear

i feel like that happens to me like 1000 times a day. not that im otm 1000 times a day, but that something ive said is attributed to a dude, or a dude takes credit for it, etc

I've been gone awhile...lots to catch up on.

It's weird bc usually I have a decent ear for things that are shitty but I don't think that has ever happened to me irl but it has on ilx at times--my post up top somewhere, 100 posts of ppl der-rama, a guy says the same thing, everyone agrees with him.

Maybe irl my very direct stare gives ppl second thoughts? Jk personal magnetism doesn't erase patriarchy.

yeah i mean, i have a pretty loud personality

I've been invisible on the porn thread.

a lot of guys (and some women) just only listen to/hear guys

This happens aaaaall the time at work.

"That 'no boys allowed' thread is always at the top of SNA but there are never any posts. So weird." xp

hahaha

"only occasionally do i see a post, but then it disappears soon after. what gives"

Ha!

related in women/language/being ahead of the curve
I FEEL LIKE

"So my tentative hypothesis would be that 'I feel like' is an idiom that's increasing in frequency in the language, so that younger people use it more than older people," he wrote. "Women use it more than men, because women are generally about a generation ahead of men in most cases of language change."

says Mark Liberman, hero/linguist

http://jezebel.com/ladies-whats-up-with-the-i-feel-like-verbal-tic-1184374148

i feel like that happens to me like 1000 times a day. not that im otm 1000 times a day, but that something ive said is attributed to a dude, or a dude takes credit for it, etc

Reminds me of this OTMness - about how women should 'avoid getting raped', from here:
"The other thing that cracks me up about that is, there's just so much energy put into that argument. Can you name me one other instance at your workplace, or in history, that a man hasn't been given full credit for his actions? You know what I mean? How often does a man do something and they're like...hmm...I think she's responsible. So this is not the one instance when we're gonna be like, "Thanks you guys! We should take credit for that!""

On another note, an acquaintance told me that their office interviewed a candidate who declared beforehand that for religious reasons he would not make eye c0ntact or any physical contact with women. This is in a very female office. I'm not sure how I would react to that.

That shit has no place in public, no one can stop you from being a religious bigot on your own time but keep it on your own time.

I have worked with people who would not shake hands with/touch/accept items directly from the hands of women.

Yeesh... that sort of thing rubs me the wrong way...

In my old office we had a woman who was slowly in decline and I kept bringing it to the attention of the supervisor because I suspected a lot was going on. I was told not to get into her personal life. She smelled like she was living on the street. She started pooping in her pants in the office leaving a mess on the floor all over the office. Finally she didn't show up for work after a freezing cold weekend and I told people she was probably dead. No one listened. After three days a co-worker who knew where she lived went to check in on her and she had died over the weekend. She had a diabetes problem and was refusing to take meds, had lost her husband earlier that year and he was found covered with a tarp decomposing in the backyard. ANYWAY! Point is, no one listened, everyone ignored all these HUGE signs and tried hard to ignore her.

Meanwhile, going on at the same time, male in the office was refusing to do his job duties claiming the government was tracking him online and they got him all sorts of help asap. For some reason EAP couldn't do a thing to help the female employee but did all it could to help the male.

It's just an extreme example of not being heard is what I have always thought.

The shocking lack of compassion for that poor woman aside, failing to address the fact that one of your employees is pooping in her pants and on the office floor is just really, really bad management.

Yeah, that's so sad and insane and omg I can't even believe that!

I work pretty much exclusively with women (there are 2 men in our office of maybe 40?) so I find all of this really bewildering. Likewise both my undergrad and grad programs were overwhelmingly female (go figure) so I feel like this something I've been really fucking lucky not to have to deal with often. My new office will be much more mixed. I'm going to be on the lookout for this kind of thing.

Also, what? Are you fucking kidding me?

I have worked with people who would not shake hands with/touch/accept items directly from the hands of women.

― carl agatha, Wednesday, November 6, 2013 1:12 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Oh wait - for religious reasons? Wow. Still.

Yeah, religious reasons.