truth bombs

well its an anagram of racehate so

yeah man, it is beside the point, the same exact way that it's beside the point that the education is absolutely stellar at the local 95% white "classical academy"

i don't think it's the same exact way

It's literally the same way that it doesn't matter whether "separate but equal" schools were actually equal!

kinda feel like issues about privilege and equity that are mostly agreed upon in other contexts are being ignored here

chin stroke emoji

my understanding is that unlike a segregated school, nobody is being forced to go to a charter

It's literally the same way that it doesn't matter whether "separate but equal" schools were actually equal!

and after integration, one of the things that happened was "tracking" -- which regularly ended up segregating the students of color into remedial classes

tracking existed before school integration, but it made for a perfect vehicle for racism

i think if there are charter schools that racially discriminate then the state should intervene. if they are "encouraging" de facto segregation by appealing more to some groups than others and thereby creating class compositions that are weighted towards one ethnic group or another, i don't see that as a problem.

well, I'm still at work, so with a heavy heart I bid y'all and the myriad challops you're dropping in the truth bombs thread adieu

afaik charter schools cannot deny students on the basis of race am i wrong?

― Mordy, Wednesday, November 28, 2018 4:59 PM (ten minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

are you asking this in good faith? you and i have talked about this quite a bit on other threads. it's sort of grand secondary gain of the entire urban charter school movement, and also the, silicon valley, uh, "school reform" edvestors.

it's a bit uneven, but the first part is really great -- he has a great anecdote about the Direct Action Network being given a car as a donation and how anarchist/radical org structures are challenged by things like that

― sarahell, Wednesday, November 28, 2018 9:47 PM (twenty-four minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

ah yeah i def read this specific excerpt somewhere

Since their inception, a defining characteristic of charter schools has been their tendency to serve highly racially concentrated student bodies. For example, national attendance data gathered during the 2014-2015 school year showed that 54 percent of charters in the United States were nonwhite segregated and 12 percent were predominantly white.69

this is from the stancil piece- i'm not sure that it's obvious what someone should read out of this information tbph.

remy i remember discussing charter schools here on ilx before but if you think we reached some kind of consensus between us about the racial discrimination policies of charter schools i def don't remember that. maybe u can link me to the other discussion tho i'm happy to reread if i'm forgetting something.

i'm interested in his understanding of the data bc he seems to be arguing that charter schools mostly exist for white parents to take their white kids out of public schools and send them to charter schools instead and afaiui that is not substantiated by the demographic information tho maybe tlg can speak better to this

I don't know if charter schools are the same as free schools in the UK, sorry England, but that's pretty much what free schools are for here - I suppose more accurately they're for white middle class parents to take their kids out of state schools where there are too many kids from poor or ethnic minority backgrounds, often the same thing in London.

look at the quote i just posted tho. does that support a narrative that charter schools exist for white parents to put their kids in?

... without the expense of having their children go to private schools. (xp)

Tom D - yep, it's very similar

fair enough, mordy. i searched for the thead but i can't find it. i know it was about the 2016 ballot measure question in massachusetts. for those interested:

this is nearly ten years old, and still holds water: https://www.civilrightsproject.ucla.edu/research/k-12-education/integration-and-diversity/choice-without-equity-2009-report
this is from the brookings institution (of all places!) and summarizes more recent observations https://www.brookings.edu/blog/the-avenue/2017/12/11/how-charter-schools-are-prolonging-segregation/
and this is the union line: http://neatoday.org/2018/05/04/racial-segregation-in-charter-schools/

i think of myself as a pragmatic anarchist (though sometimes the pragmatist wins out -- ) so it's an issue, of how to set up a system where people have agency to resist oppressive structures without allowing rich and powerful douchebags to take advantage of the system for their douchey ends.

The fact that, over here, the supporters of the free school system tend to be hideous right wing ideologues is a bit of a clue.

*sigh* yeah ... we have a similar issue w/r/t live/work housing.

just to be clear -- i think the quote above suggests that charter schools mostly exist to serve nonwhite communities. compared to the 12 percent of predominately white charter schools "30 percent of traditional schools were predominantly white"

remy from that neatoday article: "While only 4 percent of traditional public schools have student bodies that are 99 percent minority (2014-15 school year data), 17 percent of charter schools are 99 percent minority. Furthermore, of the 6,747 charter schools in the country, more than 1,000 had minority enrollment of at least 99 percent." bc we're talking about charter schools we're talking about segregation of nonwhite student populations by choice. this is hardly the same thing as white segregation to "protect" white kids from minorities.

Should we do the same thing with waiting rooms and water fountains if people are opting in?

im kind of ok about segregation on group basis from non-majority populations (i mean i personally went to a state catholic school in scotland, where the introduction of such schools in the early 20th century was vehemently opposed by political protestantism with the slogan "No Rome on the rates!") but the other forms of "social selectivity" which in some cases comes along with the free or charter school model as it exists in Sweden, England and the U.S. is pretty sus' imo

For real –– I don't mean to be zingy. But, I mean,. urban public schools often suck and are unfair and ESPECIALLY terrible at teaching non-white students. And they're actually trying to fix things. Even if it's bureaucratically difficult. Unhappy, nad aware of these issues, parents of non-white students respond to enticements to bring their students to charters that frequently practice extreme discipline practices, skirt teaching regulations, exploit their labor force and chronically underserve students needing special education. Often these schools are white-owned, for-profit entities. At best this is a profiteering dodge of the real issue; at worst it's resegregation.

Should we do the same thing with waiting rooms and water fountains if people are opting in?

i'm sure there are waiting rooms and water fountains with extremely segregated clienteles and i don't believe we should forcibly desegregate them

"this water fountain in a 99% black community is used 99% by black water drinkers and is reifying segregation we must bus in white water drinkers and bus out black water drinkers to other water fountains to achieve equality" i mean c'mon

You realize this an argument in favor of Jim Crow laws, right?

no it really isn't related at all

Wish this was all in a different thread at this point

truth bungs

Charter schools in the United States

made yall a thread

very US Politics-centric but:

---
Never believe a sentence that contains the words "Schumer" and "insist."

― grawlix (unperson), Friday, December 7, 2018 12:22 PM (two hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I don't discuss my personal life or problems online

tbf half of ilm is people doing exactly this, they're just couching it in language that makes it look like they're commenting on popular music

― mh, Thursday, March 14, 2019 3:25 PM (yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

most bands don't have one good song

― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown)

"sapiosexual" as a concept is such a gigantic crock of shit and I will continue to hold this opinion until someone shows me a sapiosexual group full of dudes going "you know, Stephen Hawking could get it"

― brigadier pudding (DJP), Friday, 20 September 2019 19:02 (nine minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

what is the opposite of sapiosexual? i am only sexually attracted to absolute fucking dumbasses

— a a dril (@demarionunn) September 20, 2019

etymologically "sapio" is more "wisdom" than "intelligence" so if anything you should be into like Tibetan lamas or something

haha that's a coincidence, i was just talking about alternative sexualities with one of my co-workers at lunch and she brought up "sapiosexual" and i immediately without thinking said "that's not a sexual orientation, that's something assholes say to make themselves sound clever"

i try not to be rude in general but i guess i was already on my high horse when the topic came up

It would be, at most, a very specific fetish, right? If you couldn't get off if someone *wasn't* actively being smart at you?

Saying "I like smart people" is no more deep or revealing, and is no more indicative of a "sexual orientation", than saying "I like pretty people". Yeah I am attracted to people who are beautiful and smart and rich, I AM SUCH A REBEL AGAINST SOCIETY

I like people who make my ding a ling go bing

I like people who like me

^^^ truth bomb

Seconded

Wow

I'm extremely suspicious of people who like me

I like people who like me

― sarahell

that's a good system!