I'm at the DC Rebirth retailer road show

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Anyone want me to assassinate Dan Deodato?

Kiarostami bag (milo z), Thursday, 14 April 2016 23:44 (five years ago) link

Er, Didio. Whatever.

Kiarostami bag (milo z), Thursday, 14 April 2016 23:45 (five years ago) link

Yeah, why not?

Good idea: getting all but one book in the line back down to $2.99
Bad idea: two issues/month for the biggest titles
Good idea: emphasizing Superman rather than just Bat this and Bat that
Bad idea: everything still pretty much looks the same
Good idea: 'adult' Hanna Barbera character books
Bad idea: "pop up imprint" by the guy who fronted My Chemical Romance

Kiarostami bag (milo z), Friday, 15 April 2016 20:35 (five years ago) link

You definitely have the last two switched.

Andrew Farrell, Friday, 15 April 2016 21:49 (five years ago) link

The Johnny Quest and Scooby Apocalypse books look like goofy fun. God knows if the final product will be that.

Kiarostami bag (milo z), Friday, 15 April 2016 23:05 (five years ago) link

I'd figure comics of some of the Adult Swim properties could be a unique angle for DC like Dethklok or the Venture Brothers. Those are on a Time Warner station, so I would figure easy to license.

earlnash, Sunday, 17 April 2016 00:31 (five years ago) link

Dark Horse (I think) already did some Metalocalypse comics. There's currently a Rick & Morty comic from another publisher. There's probably more I can't remember/don't know about. But apparently the comics publishing rights for AS shows are up for grabs.

I Pith On Your Quip (Old Lunch), Sunday, 17 April 2016 00:46 (five years ago) link

I think Boom seems to have a lock on a lot of Cartoon Network properties

Nhex, Sunday, 17 April 2016 01:10 (five years ago) link

Yeah totally missed this one.

http://www.darkhorse.com/Comics/17-767/Metalocalypse-Dethklok-1-Eric-Powell-cover

earlnash, Sunday, 17 April 2016 02:23 (five years ago) link

Oh my GOD, DC is just the worst these days. And this is almost immediately after Shelly Bond was just announced as the editor on the Young Animal line, which sounded like one of the more interesting directions they've taken in a while. What the fuck are they thinking?

Your Ass Is Grass And I Will Mow It With My Face (Old Lunch), Tuesday, 26 April 2016 12:48 (five years ago) link

I imagine he'll quietly leave/quit/get his notice in the next few months; meanwhile those who tolerated his abuses will probably get away with it.

Chuck_Tatum, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 11:04 (five years ago) link

This has been publicly known and "managed" internally for years, why would WB change their policy now?

glandular lansbury (sic), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 12:49 (five years ago) link

Because it's really big news.

Andrew Farrell, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 12:58 (five years ago) link

What looks like Big news on comics blogs probably doesn't mean shit to WB

Remember how Scott Allie got fired last year and the one web journalist making apologies for his behaviour and disparaging Asselin didn't promptly get hired as a publicist at Dark Horse? Good times.

glandular lansbury (sic), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 14:32 (five years ago) link

It'll be interesting to see what happens! Although I agree Nothing Happening At All seems a likely bet.

God knows boycotting DC would not make any difference to my pull list - haven't bought a DC comic since Multiversity, and Batman Inc before that.

Chuck_Tatum, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 15:03 (five years ago) link

The last new DC thing I bought since the very titles you mention was Wonder Woman: Earth One. I'm sensing a pattern here...

Your Ass Is Grass And I Will Mow It With My Face (Old Lunch), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 15:11 (five years ago) link

I've actually been buying Azzarello's Wonder Woman (in trades) - otherwise my answer would be the same, I think.

Andrew Farrell, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 15:20 (five years ago) link

what did scott allie do

scarcity festival (Jon not Jon), Wednesday, 27 April 2016 15:22 (five years ago) link

http://www.comicbookresources.com/article/dark-horse-editor-scott-allie-apologizes-amid-accusations-of-misconduct

(the hair is amazingly not the worst of it)

Andrew Farrell, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 15:28 (five years ago) link

While Wiesch declined to provide comment in the article, he did tweet at 2 a.m. in the night in question, "Hey! Maybe you just shouldn't lick someone's face at comic con. Just saying."

ulysses, Wednesday, 27 April 2016 15:30 (five years ago) link

two weeks pass...

SERIOUSLY DC GET A SINGLE THING RIGHT

http://comicsalliance.com/dc-new-logo-rebirth/

Chuck_Tatum, Tuesday, 17 May 2016 20:02 (five years ago) link

it's honestly worse than the peel back "D revealing C" which is hard to imagine
/posts out of context

ulysses, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 13:57 (five years ago) link

It's not though, which may be it's one redeeming characteristic.

Andrew Farrell, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 14:02 (five years ago) link

i dunno man, the arbitrary sharp corners and weird angles really make it hard on the eyes. at least the peelback logo looks considered.

ulysses, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 14:05 (five years ago) link

Peelback logo looks dumb as shit, this is a kind of charming, kind of clunky throwback to the '70s logo, but anyone talking about this logo instead of a culture of protecting sexual abusers, or about a cultural contempt for readers, or executive insulting of women to their face at conventions, or the last few years' enhanced stripping of rights from authors, or any of the bullshit that LEADS them to rebrand for the third time in nine years, is falling for the branding

glandular lansbury (sic), Wednesday, 18 May 2016 14:30 (five years ago) link

'instead' there is, as it nearly always is, a straw man.

Andrew Farrell, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 14:33 (five years ago) link

the company is handling their PR in an attempt to deflect from the real issues with their approach, culture, and output*. The laughable ineffectualness of last week's sexual harassment press release, quietly sneaked out from a raised cheek on late Friday afternoon Burbank time**, contrasted with the pride with which they publicise this wgas.jpg logo design

*deflecting internally as much as publicity-wise, obv - it's plain that there is no ability or mechanism to reconsider their corporate culture and hasn't been since before Nelson, despite what any individuals working there might wish

** imagine the joy that the move from NY brought faceless publicists - as faceless as the designer of this logo, or the artists of any newly-announced swathe of titles - tasked with handling these elements of corporate messaging!

glandular lansbury (sic), Wednesday, 18 May 2016 14:57 (five years ago) link

Yeah, I get it, but I'm not having the wool pulled over my eyes if I simultaneously have opinions on the logo and the shitstorm.

Andrew Farrell, Wednesday, 18 May 2016 16:09 (five years ago) link

hostile workplaces and indecent treatment of writers/artists/editors is a reason to react through writing, informing others, and boycotting, among other actions

a dumb logo is an opportunity to react to a dumb logo and can be thrown on the prior trashheap, but you can still just complain about a dumb logo

μpright mammal (mh), Wednesday, 18 May 2016 16:41 (five years ago) link

Wow. Except, yeah, I totally believe DC Comics has gone there ('there' being a creatively bankrupt 'fuck you' in response to a writer's wishes with respect to characters he created for them).

Corn Elephant, Jr. (Old Lunch), Saturday, 21 May 2016 20:38 (five years ago) link

*toilet flush*

μpright mammal (mh), Saturday, 21 May 2016 21:07 (five years ago) link

jesus christ waht

hey at least wally west is back I guess

(main prostitute from Game Of Thrones) (bizarro gazzara), Saturday, 21 May 2016 21:23 (five years ago) link

hilarious

El Tomboto, Saturday, 21 May 2016 21:53 (five years ago) link

Abhay with The Case Against Dan Didio

glandular lansbury (sic), Sunday, 22 May 2016 17:20 (five years ago) link

is there a case for didio rly?

(main prostitute from Game Of Thrones) (bizarro gazzara), Sunday, 22 May 2016 17:44 (five years ago) link

Inertia.

Andrew Farrell, Sunday, 22 May 2016 17:45 (five years ago) link

What's scary is that this appears to be less of a turd in a punch bowl than Civl War II.

I'm starting to think, though, that the Big 2 are doomed to a constant cycle of disappointing their fans. I'm closing in on my third anniversary officially in the business and I've been around it for much longer - I have difficulty remembering a time when fans approved of major changes/events from either one. Which isn't a criticism of fans so much as wondering if there's even a way for the big 2 to do better or if it's going to take an outside publisher creating a new universe to do things well.

Kiarostami bag (milo z), Sunday, 22 May 2016 19:47 (five years ago) link

I wouldn't say I'm exactly excited about Civil War II but I fail to understand how that's a bigger misstep than DC's endless slow-motion fumble.

Corn Elephant, Jr. (Old Lunch), Sunday, 22 May 2016 20:42 (five years ago) link

I am guessing whoever he reports to up the the chain is less competent, or completely uninvested in comics and more interested in licensing. Having a less competent person report to you is a good way to not be overshadowed?

μpright mammal (mh), Sunday, 22 May 2016 20:50 (five years ago) link

Half of Marvel's big events are dumb, but the paths of individual characters through them tend to show some development or at least have plot beats that don't involve rape or trashing the character

I mean, unless Loeb was involved

μpright mammal (mh), Sunday, 22 May 2016 20:52 (five years ago) link

how many times have they rebooted in the last decade? three? four? I genuinely have no idea what is up in the dcu now - there's two supermen and three jokers and somehow dr manhattan might have caused the reboot before this one? I dread to think what hawkman's status quo is now if they can't even keep their tentpole characters like superman accessible for a dyed-in-the-wool comics dork like me

(main prostitute from Game Of Thrones) (bizarro gazzara), Sunday, 22 May 2016 22:25 (five years ago) link

is there a case for didio rly?

he repeatedly refers to Davis' hilariously / tragically vmic piece

glandular lansbury (sic), Monday, 23 May 2016 00:14 (five years ago) link

I am guessing whoever he reports to up the the chain is less competent, or completely uninvested in comics and more interested in licensing.

that's exactly why Nelson was appointed; she had been in charge of Harry Potter licensing at WB, and then an executive VP in Global Brand Management

the only creative decision of hers that's ever been reported afaik was on arrival, looking at Sandman revenues vs all other DC revenues, asking why they weren't doing more Sandman, being told that the NYT best-selling author had tried hard to do a 20th anniversary series but had been told to fuck off by DC, and schmoozing said author by taking him to a Nolan Batman movie premiere

glandular lansbury (sic), Monday, 23 May 2016 00:24 (five years ago) link

so dr. manhattan is the beyonder now? that's a terrible idea.

ulysses, Monday, 23 May 2016 00:49 (five years ago) link

Every single bit iof sic's last post is depressing

"Hmm, what makes money. Sandman? Do more of that."
Didio: "um hmm errr yeah.."
"Oh, the author doesn't like you, I will take him to this premiere of our licensed blockbuster film based on anothe property. I am sure he loves money and will be swayed."

Do you think they'll eventually catch the hint that Vertigo trades -> tv and movies can't continue when there are no more titles coming? Might take another decade or so until they mine out all the adaptable ones, maybe accelerated if the Preacher tv show is a hit

μpright mammal (mh), Monday, 23 May 2016 02:16 (five years ago) link

Torrented Rebirth, it was rubbish

Xpost

Yeah, Moore's worst stories feel like a prototype for Didio's DC - nostalgia mixed with ultraviolence - rather than the progressive grim and grit of the 80s-90s, which at least pushed some new narrative ideas, if too often humourlessly. In "whatever happened..." bizarro commits genocide, lana lang burns to death, superman cries alone in a room - it's quite a nasty, cynical comic, not the elegiac tone I remember.

Chuck_Tatum, Thursday, 26 May 2016 23:55 (five years ago) link

I tried to read Rebirth. How can anyone get through this many badly written captions? Geoff Johns has absolutely no sense of language, of rhythm.

Frederik B, Friday, 27 May 2016 00:12 (five years ago) link

This was such a hit I didn't even get to read it to find out if it was complete shit (as I assume) before selling out.

Kiarostami bag (milo z), Friday, 27 May 2016 01:54 (five years ago) link

seriously?!

Nhex, Friday, 27 May 2016 02:34 (five years ago) link

Yep. Every retailer I know has blown through these. IDGI, but whatevs.

Kiarostami bag (milo z), Friday, 27 May 2016 03:38 (five years ago) link

Moore has much to answer for wrt modern day DC's embrace of the grim and the grit.

Yes, it's definitely his responsibility.

glandular lansbury (sic), Friday, 27 May 2016 03:42 (five years ago) link

yr literalism is striking as always

μpright mammal (mh), Friday, 27 May 2016 03:44 (five years ago) link

although he has answered, raised incantations, and summonses protective beards many a time against such accusations

μpright mammal (mh), Friday, 27 May 2016 03:44 (five years ago) link

https://www.instagram.com/p/BF6Mx7lm_F4/?hl=en

Chuck_Tatum, Friday, 27 May 2016 16:57 (five years ago) link

Tom E on Rebirth: http://tomewing.tumblr.com/post/145207290801/danare-we-the-baddies

glandular lansbury (sic), Wednesday, 1 June 2016 02:18 (five years ago) link

The ad for Wonder Woman Rebirth at the back has copy along the lines of “EVERYTHING she KNOWS and TRUSTS will be TAKEN FROM HER”. Marketing quiz! Do you think this copy is written to appeal more to a) a woman who wants to jump on board the adventures of DC’s most iconic female superhero or b) a guy who likes the idea of women being taken down a peg?

ulysses, Wednesday, 1 June 2016 04:27 (five years ago) link

headline is a reference to this sketch btw America

glandular lansbury (sic), Wednesday, 1 June 2016 08:22 (five years ago) link

Tt, we may be generally pig-ignorant over here but we aren't complete savages.

I Do Dumb Things And Then I Cry (Old Lunch), Wednesday, 1 June 2016 10:31 (five years ago) link

Mitchell and Webb are taught in most American public schools these days.

I Do Dumb Things And Then I Cry (Old Lunch), Wednesday, 1 June 2016 10:32 (five years ago) link

I definitely appreciated "The Case Against Dan Didio". I don't follow the comics scene anymore because it's too toxic and depressing, so it's nice to have a digest-form version that explains _why_ I stay as far away from anything having to do with DC Comics as possible.

Sgt. Coldy Bimore (rushomancy), Wednesday, 1 June 2016 11:38 (five years ago) link

I know the business side isn't something ILC particularly gives a damn about but sales on the other Rebirth titles are absolutely insane today. IDGI, I just can't get excited about what I've read from either this or Civil War II.

Kiarostami bag (milo z), Wednesday, 1 June 2016 23:59 (five years ago) link

do you think people buy that stuff thinking it's an investment because "it'll be worth money someday" or is it a legit proof of a sucker born every minute? or both?

ulysses, Thursday, 2 June 2016 00:09 (five years ago) link

I really like getting that kind of updates. I don't understand it either. Perhaps people just think it will be a good jumping on point?

Frederik B, Thursday, 2 June 2016 00:15 (five years ago) link

if i was DC i would just number every issue of every comic i put out "1".

Sgt. Coldy Bimore (rushomancy), Thursday, 2 June 2016 00:18 (five years ago) link

I don't think DC has a lot of readers, outside of select titles. Buyers, yeah, but it's people who buy every fucking Batman/Superman comic and two copies if it's #1 on the cover

Or more depressingly, they read them and actually want this shit

μpright mammal (mh), Thursday, 2 June 2016 00:47 (five years ago) link

I don't hear about many speculators these days. I have one guy who buys one of every Image #1 because a few of their titles like The Walking Dead and Saga have gone way up, but no one that I know of with Marvel or DC, people have figured out that they print tens/hundreds of thousands of copies and a significant chunk of those are bagged and boarded even by people who just read and collect so scarcity is unlikely.

Only being able to sell Batman has been DC's biggest issue, the weird thing here is that all the other characters are selling at the same pace or even a little better than today's Batman. Let's say I normally order 20 Green Arrow, I ordered 50+10 of the monthly variant (because they were returnable) and they're all gone now. I would guess people actually believe that DC is going to push the rest of the universe this time instead of just Batman. Whether that sticks, God only knows.

Kiarostami bag (milo z), Thursday, 2 June 2016 01:24 (five years ago) link

if i was DC i would just number every issue of every comic i put out "1".

This is Marvel's strategy - everything is a miniseries. Darth Vader is one of their top-10 titles and is getting wrapped at 25, presumably to see an All New Darth Vader three months later.

Kiarostami bag (milo z), Thursday, 2 June 2016 01:25 (five years ago) link

I get it but I don't like it.

What's Your Definition of a Dirty Baby? (Old Lunch), Thursday, 2 June 2016 02:20 (five years ago) link

i'm fine with that, at least it kinda guarantees a closed story arc / hopefully continuous creative team for that run

Nhex, Thursday, 2 June 2016 02:36 (five years ago) link

btw milo I am super interested in your business takes. i know very little about that side

Nhex, Thursday, 2 June 2016 02:46 (five years ago) link

Yeah, my comics speculation begins and ends with speculating about why people buy the stuff they buy. It's fascinating to get the inside scoop.

What's Your Definition of a Dirty Baby? (Old Lunch), Thursday, 2 June 2016 03:30 (five years ago) link

The Darth Vader writer has been pretty clear that he'll have told the story he wanted to tell, it could of course be a line.

Andrew Farrell, Thursday, 2 June 2016 07:47 (five years ago) link

It fits in with Gillen's style for short-medium-ish self contained runs.

Comics were always a huckster business to some degree. I guess hucksters are in their reboot phase.

Chuck_Tatum, Thursday, 2 June 2016 07:58 (five years ago) link

I get wrapping up a creator's run before things get stagnant, but I don't like the series jump - even if you take a few months off, just have a new team for Darth #26 unless you really intend to retire the book (which I find highly doubtful). That's how we get stupid titles like All New All Different Avengers.

Kiarostami bag (milo z), Thursday, 2 June 2016 16:04 (five years ago) link

I am very possibly being naive, but I think they might retire it. It started up with three questions unclear - what were the repercussions of being the senior survivor of the largest military disaster in history, when did he find out he was Luke's father, how did he know those bounty hunters in Empire - and by the end of Gillen's run they'll have answered those and left him roughly where he is at the start of Empire.

Which is not to say that I wouldn't read 25 no-effect issues of Ellis's Darth Vader Escapades, but I can see restarting the series.

Andrew Farrell, Thursday, 2 June 2016 16:16 (five years ago) link

The Darth Vader book is almost certainly immune to this phenomenon, but it seems more often that titles are being stealth cancelled to give the illusion that they were meant to be limited series all along. The frequent lack of a satisfying resolution (as if the creative team were scrambling to tie up all of their threads) and the weird lengths of some of these runs (several Marvel series have ended at issue 11, for example) seem to back this up. I guess I'd be more okay with everything being a miniseries if the approach seemed more intentional in its execution.

What's Your Definition of a Dirty Baby? (Old Lunch), Thursday, 2 June 2016 16:33 (five years ago) link

To clarify, I don't think the people buying up books are "collectors" in the aftermarket sense, but in the way that they will buy at least one Batman comic regardless of writer and artist and might not even know who the writer is.

μpright mammal (mh), Thursday, 2 June 2016 16:53 (five years ago) link

I have heard some anecdotal evidence to support that. It seems like an eight-year-old's approach to buying comics but whattayagonnado (says the dude who buys pretty much every Earth-616 comic just because it says 'Marvel' on the cover).

What's Your Definition of a Dirty Baby? (Old Lunch), Thursday, 2 June 2016 18:14 (five years ago) link

i understand that completionist approach but can't imagine doing it with paper.

as of late i found the online "complete marvel" / "complete dc" torrents (about two terabytes total) and am slowly absorbing full years

ulysses, Thursday, 2 June 2016 18:27 (five years ago) link

Speaking of ill-gotten DC torrents, I just spotted this precocious letter writer at the back of a Neal Adams Batman issue:

http://i.imgur.com/28M5BzQ.jpg

Chuck_Tatum, Thursday, 2 June 2016 22:22 (five years ago) link

dave sim, champion of grim and gritty

ulysses, Thursday, 2 June 2016 23:37 (five years ago) link

I came across a few George R.R. Martin letters in silver age Marvel titles.

What's Your Definition of a Dirty Baby? (Old Lunch), Friday, 3 June 2016 00:17 (five years ago) link

is there a tumblr or something for scans of before-they-were-famous letters that appeared in comics and magazines?

(or just scans of letters pages from old comics in general, I love that stuff.)

soref, Friday, 3 June 2016 00:27 (five years ago) link

these scans of letters that appeared in 50s and 60s Superman comics and Mort Weisinger's responses are quite something

http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/category/dont-send-me-no-more-letters-no/

soref, Friday, 3 June 2016 00:31 (five years ago) link

The crazy thing is that the Darth Vader boo being stopped it is selling well. Vader and Star Wars are like #2 and #3 of all the books at my small local shop on the pull list with Walking Dead being #1.

To me, I think if Marvel really wanted to get it together they should do what they did on those Star Wars titles, which are in someways the most old school Marvel books they have done in a while. They have an inner continuity, they are written for a wide audience and are both stylistically and content wise true to the original creations with room for the creators to tell a story.

What could be fun if they do Empire Strikes Back as like a 25 issue (4 trade series) both adapting the movie and filling in back story with Jabba, Boba Fett and other players in the background like the search for Hoth etc.

earlnash, Wednesday, 8 June 2016 21:21 (five years ago) link

like the radio play adaptions

the star wars radio play, which i listened to obsessively as a child before we had a vhs machine, was 13 30-min episiodes, so there was a LOOOOT of extra material

I came across a few George R.R. Martin letters in silver age Marvel titles.

― What's Your Definition of a Dirty Baby? (Old Lunch)

true fact: he was the first paying attendee at a comics convention

hypnic jerk (rushomancy), Wednesday, 8 June 2016 23:24 (five years ago) link

To me, I think if Marvel really wanted to get it together they should do what they did on those Star Wars titles, which are in someways the most old school Marvel books they have done in a while. They have an inner continuity, they are written for a wide audience and are both stylistically and content wise true to the original creations with room for the creators to tell a story.
According to New Star Wars Rules (tm) all spinoff media is now officially canon and goes through Disney for approval (I believe, someone correct me if I'm wrong) I can see how it can be more limited, but it's kinda cool that all these little things are now canon in all media, comics/novels/tv series/video games etc.

Nhex, Thursday, 9 June 2016 07:57 (five years ago) link

I think they had the same rules with the previous (pre-Episode VII) canon? All comics, games, novels, etc. had to be approved by Lucasfilm's continuity guards, and they were all considered canon... And then what happened was that, once The Force Awakens was in the works, obviously a lot of the old canon would have to be abandoned (since it depicted post-Episode VI events in ways that would contradict with Episode VII), so they decided that all of the old canon except for the movies + the Clone Wars TV series was now set in an alternate universe. I think the old canon is now called "Star Wars Legends" or something.

AFAIK Star Wars has been pretty unique in this regard that they've tried to include all stories in different media into the canon, so that the timeline of their universe includes all that material, and different stories shouldn't contradict each other. With Star Trek, for example, only the TV series and the movies are considered to be official canon, everything else is non-canonical.

Tuomas, Thursday, 9 June 2016 09:31 (five years ago) link

IIRC there were levels of canon, so the book level was canon unless it was contradicted by the films, the comics were canon unless it was contradicted by the books or the film, and so on.

Andrew Farrell, Thursday, 9 June 2016 10:59 (five years ago) link

I like earlnash's point about the Star Wars books being "old school Marvel" - i.e. mild continuity, one author just getting on with it for several years, each new story really *is* a potential starting point for new readers, etc

Chuck_Tatum, Thursday, 9 June 2016 11:25 (five years ago) link

i.e. the days before continuity was a beartrap and american otaku and children were the key demographics

De La Soul is no Major Lazer (ulysses), Thursday, 9 June 2016 13:57 (five years ago) link


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