Batman: The Animated Series

batman fights clayface in cramped television studio control room while video monitors show kaleidoscopic shifting of disfigured actor matt hagen's pre-clayface roles; clayface goes insane with disassociative grief, madly shapeshifts through assorted old roles/hideous forms before settling on the form of bruce wayne; cops burst through door, guns drawn, to find batman in fistfight with clayface-wayne; "mother of mercy," one says, "it looks just like bruce wayne."

― difficult listening hour, Thursday, August 14, 2014 3:17 AM (3 months ago)

yes holy shit this episode did something to me as a child -- see also "heart of steel"

"heart of steel" freaked me the fuck out as a kid, so awes

The name 'Rossum' refers to R.U.R. (Rossum's Universal Robots), a Czech play by Karel Čapek, where the term 'robot' was first coined. Randa is seen driving a car early in the first episode with the license number 'RUR'.

shit. this was a children's show??

i know it's annoying to wax effusive about cartoons and no tvtropes.com but the level of artistic intent in this show is really mindblowing.

the riddler? what is that, nygma-- some kind of joke on your name?

http://media.giphy.com/media/wsvYfaCGUoejK/giphy.gif

The Batman Adventures and other tie-in comics to these series were often brilliant too. I think someone mentioned the Ty Templeton/Rich Burchett issues here before and they're great (and I believe that creative team did the majority of them), but the initial run by Kelley Puckett and the late Mike Parobeck should not be overlooked. Parobeck had a real talent for fluid, kinetic art which let the stories speak for themselves without the need for much exposition (alas, it was to be his last extended run on a comic). Plus, the initial run had an absurd trio of villains based on veteran DC writers!

Needless to say, it was often a lot more entertaining than the "proper" Batman comics of the time, which were then grumbling their way through the endless Knight-saga.

Got my dad a bunch of the feature films for xmas cause they were going cheap at fopp & I remembered he likes the Nolan trilogy a lot & also that he had a brief anime phase when I was a kid, thought it would be nice to have some good clean fun to watch together as our tastes don't usually intersect (we both liked John Wick tho)

As people have said, they really hold up, excellent for what they are (nostalgia plays a big part too I'm sure) - basically I think Joel Schumacher is right that these films should all be cartoons. Like I was saying the other day about being made to sit thru suicide squad, method dorks being all "I had to go to a real dark place to play the role of Clowny McBadguy... (stares into middle distance) a real dark place" can't be mocked enough, even those who are no longer with us rip fuck you 2016, cause the correct answer is clearly "I'm not shaving off my moustache for this shit" or "show up, get in the booth, do the lines", both of which result in infinitely better performances

Unfortunately I think they must have heard the people saying "wow some of this stuff is pretty mature for a kids film" because they seem to be trying way too hard in the more recent ones to make it dark or (even worse) "racy". The best, ie funniest, example of this is in the film of the killing joke, where they pull a fire walk with me in that the first half hour is given to a "prologue" that has little relation to the rest of the film. Further fwwm connections: the rather ingenious casting of Ray Wise as inspector Gordon (yes he gets to sob "my daughter, my daughter") and - not making this up - a creepy quasi-incestuous bit of slashfic in which batman bones batgirl. This actually happens:

http://image.newsdog.today/origin_8f57bb1f14517ab5b5c878e9556d6910

it is gross and hilarious

lol bruce's unchanging face, ok i have to see this now

That's from the prologue part, to be clear, and the whole thing is amazingly misjudged - batgirl has a sitcom GBF who gives her relaysh advice

the rest of the film is the Alan Moore silly grossness you'll be familiar with, but well done - hamill is excellent

not making this up - a creepy quasi-incestuous bit of slashfic in which batman bones batgirl.

So I guess no-one told Batman why not then?

Not saying this is a good idea, but why would it be "incestuous"? Is Batman related to Barbara in this continuity? Or is she underage, and what you meant to say was "pedophilic"?

1. a combining form meaning “resembling,” “having some, but not all of the features of,” used in the formation of compound words

I always thought the batman & robin (+robin substitutes) relationship was meant to be read as a parent-child relationship, which is a small part of why people went so crazy about perceived allusions to pederasty back in the day (the greater part being good old-fashioned gay panic obv)? But I happily admit i don't know what I'm talking about here, it just fitted my tortuous twin peaks comparison

But Barbara was never a Robin substitute, at least not in the comics. Maybe it's different in the animated continuity tho, I'm not familiar with that?

She was for a long time a love interest for (the grown up) Robin / Nightwing though, so Batman hooking up with her in comics would be awkward for other reasons.

I think wins is right tbh, the whole idea of the "Batman family"

http://static2.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_small/0/4/14420-2727-16126-1-batman-family.jpg

creepy quasi-incestuous bit of slashfic in which Batwoman bones Bathound while Batman and Robin watch:

https://feexby.files.wordpress.com/2012/08/bathound.jpg

deviant arf

Tuomas, I really don't know - felt like a Robin substitute to me when I watched. it's a mentor/pupil relationship at the least

for some reason I forgot that there's a Jonah Hex episode of B:TAS (using a Ra's al Ghul framing device) and it's scripted by Joe Lansdale! the jokes are funny but kid safe, really good stuff

Just saw that one for the first time recently. I've been slowly working my way semi-chrolologically through the entire Timmverse.

FYI, WB is FINALLY getting around to putting out the remainder of Static Shock and Zeta Project on DVD, thusly sating my OCD completist impulses.

Oh, and DC seems to be making good on collecting all of the Timmverse companion comics. They just finished Batman Adventures and they're well into Superman Adventures now.

I don't know what the occasion is or why it's suddenly 1995 again but I'll take it.

I think they're having some success with animation, but the new projects aren't necessarily good. So releasing the old shows that were actually good makes sense.

my kids are going through the Batman Adnetures/Superman Adventures tpbs, they're v good

the post-JLU new stuff (mid 2000's-on) released DTV is generally pretty mediocre. The Killing Joke was in particular was pretty bad, as you probably heard

xpost Yes, quality control of that entire franchise was surprisingly high. Exceptionally rare that a TV tie-in comic is good for much more than wrapping paper.

I haven't seen a single damn thing post-JLU, and nothing I've heard has suggested that I'm missing anything.

yeah they aren't good. Is Timm even involved w any of those?

i remember he produced some of the earlier ones which but even those were generally below the standard set by JLU

speaking of... I just watched Batman vs. Harley Quinn, which while fairly serviceable, is again just kind of barely above mediocre with some PG-13 gags that wouldn't have made it into the original BTAS run. Timm did produce this, so I guess he's still involved which is better than not, I suppose.

as a bonus feature, they included the BTAS episodes of "Harley and Ivy" and "Harley's Holiday" which were both so much better it was kind of sad that in 2017 the bar has fallen so low

woops, it's "and" Harley, not "vs" Harley. being brainwashed by DC storylines

Watched Mask of the Phantasm for the first time a few days ago. Fun! It's my favourite type of Batman story: a gangster story wrapped around a romance wrapped around a whodunnit. Could have done without the Joker though - needed more ANGST, less ACTION

I am... resistant to Harley Quinn in most formats. I gather she's basically DC's Deadpool now, but character seems hella sexist

she's based on a '40s gangster moll stereotype, so... yeah, kinda true. but many stories since her origin have given her different angles and motivations besides just being lovestruck and "dumb", eventually turning her into a full blown sympathetic anti-hero. (partially why she ended up pairing well with Poison Ivy, who was sort of a femme fatale stereotype rehabilitated over many decades) the inherent jokey sexism she came from gets balanced out a bit, and she's straight-up a really fun character in the right hands.

Mask is still great. i need to pick up that new Blu-ray release at some point

Mask of the Phantasm is the best Batman movie.

Yes.

And, additionally, I don't understand why DC keeps putting out new animated product (I mean, for the $$$ obviously, but still) when they already made the best superhero cartoons ever. You did it guys. You're done! Let it go!

dc in ‘making bad decisions’ shocker

I watched Wonder Woman yesterday, it felt like the first DC movie since Batman Returns to capture a certain DC-ness as well as the Dini stuff does. (DC-ness being a weird mix of soapy melodrama and dorky retro superhero stuff, which is different to Marvel.)

I think you just sold me on watching Wonder Woman.

it’s entertaining! mostly!

it’s easy to nitpick it away but it’s heart is def in the right place and the performances are charming

It's fun! Definitely goes off the rails In the last half hour, but without retroactively ruining the whole movie. Looking forward to the next one.

I love that the praise for the most highly-acclaimed DC movie is still saddled with qualifications (which, TBF, is also true of every decent non-MCU Marvel flick). But I'll check it out.

i mean it’s no mask of the phantasm, that’s fer sure

Well, I'd feel bad giving it a 100% thumbs up as it's not a 100% great movie. But like Biz says, the flaws aren't dealbreakers - whereas e.g. I still wish I could get back the hours of my life I wasted watching Dark Knight Rises. I had a similar feeling about Homecoming - charming but too long.

Oh man, Homecoming was fantastic! Completely exceeded expectations.

But this is not the place!

To give DC props, they are still treating the DCAU with the respect it deserves. BTAS is coming out on Blu-ray early next year, and they're surprisingly still releasing trades of the companion comics (my faith in their follow-through on that front being super low, having gotten burned most recently on the Sandman Mystery Theatre reprints which they cancelled after a whopping two collections).

Is the Superman show any good? It's the only one I've never seen.

Oh yeah. That, All-Star, and the first several years of Byrne & co.'s reboot are pretty much all the Superman I'll ever need.

STAS started off kinda slow but got real good by the end in my memories, same thing with Batman Beyond

I especially dig how Kirby's Fourth World stuff slowly encroaches upon the light-hearted Superman adventures taking place in the foreground.

Wonder Woman was so dull and slow and colourgraded and not-about-a-woman that I walked out halfway through and saw The House instead

same with the justice league cartoon - started slowly then knocked it out of the park when it became unlimited