― s1ocki (slutsky), Thursday, 28 September 2006 13:22 (seventeen years ago) link
Rorschach really is the most interesting character in the whole comic; everyone else sort of serves the function they've given in the story, but he's goes through an arch of personal change. Okay, there's also Dr. Manhattan "humans are worthy" realization, but I never found that (or the whole character) as convincing as Moore may have intended.
― Tuomas (Tuomas), Thursday, 28 September 2006 13:51 (seventeen years ago) link
― Tuomas (Tuomas), Thursday, 28 September 2006 14:03 (seventeen years ago) link
I think the whole conclusion of Watchmen is a lot more morally ambiguous than certain people are making out - Moore never really asserts an authorial opinion on Veidt's plan. Obviously our gut reaction is that it's an atrocity, but if it does, debateably to be sure, 'save the world', then can it be a wholly bad thing? I think Moore's intention is more to show notions of good and evil to be far more fluid and nebulous than they are generally portrayed in this type of fiction than to provide a simple reversal of expectations.
― chap who would dare to contain two ingredients. Tea and bags. (chap), Thursday, 28 September 2006 15:27 (seventeen years ago) link
― DV (dirtyvicar), Thursday, 28 September 2006 15:58 (seventeen years ago) link
Oh, I think he does, though in a clever way. The ending of Watchmen is well-known for it's openness - "I leave it entirely to your hands"; does Seymour pick up Rorschach diary or not? - and it's clear this is Moore's way of saying, "I leave it to readers to decide whether or not Veidt did right or wrong"... But he also sneaks in his own opinion inside the pirate story, which parallels the main story all the way through, and in which the protagonists ends up doing most hideous things only because he thinks he's protecting his loved ones, so in the end he is condemned for his sins and has to enter the black pirate ship. The fact that Veidt is his alter ego is made clear when Veidt says, "sometimes I dream of swimming towards a black ship...".
― Tuomas (Tuomas), Thursday, 28 September 2006 16:40 (seventeen years ago) link
This is the only time I can remember ever being tempted to use the acronym QFT.
― Young Fresh Danny D (Dan Perry), Thursday, 28 September 2006 17:30 (seventeen years ago) link
― Huk-L (Huk-L), Thursday, 28 September 2006 17:32 (seventeen years ago) link
― c('°c) (Leee), Thursday, 28 September 2006 17:34 (seventeen years ago) link
― Huk-L (Huk-L), Thursday, 28 September 2006 17:51 (seventeen years ago) link
Wait, so we're both right, except you're righter. Yellowcard for you.
― c('°c) (Leee), Thursday, 28 September 2006 17:57 (seventeen years ago) link
― Huk-L (Huk-L), Thursday, 28 September 2006 17:59 (seventeen years ago) link
― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Thursday, 28 September 2006 18:05 (seventeen years ago) link
― It's the lazy and immoral way to become super hip. (Austin, Still), Thursday, 28 September 2006 18:28 (seventeen years ago) link
― Casuistry (Chris P), Thursday, 28 September 2006 21:31 (seventeen years ago) link
― Huk-L (Huk-L), Thursday, 28 September 2006 22:08 (seventeen years ago) link
― Huk-L (Huk-L), Thursday, 28 September 2006 22:27 (seventeen years ago) link
― Tuomas (Tuomas), Friday, 29 September 2006 08:20 (seventeen years ago) link
― chap who would dare to contain two ingredients. Tea and bags. (chap), Friday, 29 September 2006 10:43 (seventeen years ago) link
― Young Fresh Danny D (Dan Perry), Friday, 29 September 2006 11:59 (seventeen years ago) link
18. Scrooge McDuck (Uncle Scrooge)
(134 points)
ihttp://www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com/archives/mcduck.gif
There was a sober, stoic quality to Carl Barks'stories and artwork that reached its ultimate expression in the brisk, no-nonsense character ofScrooge. Initially a cartoonish miser in the mold ofhis Dickens namesake, Scrooge eventually evolved intoa remarkably original character – a modern version of that classic American archetype, the self-made man. Hemade his fortune, he says, by "being tougher than thetoughies, and smarter than the smarties – and I madeit SQUARE!" (Justyn)
His Scrooge can be greedy as hell, but ultimately Scrooge always chooses his fellow beings before money - witness the tear-jerking story where he's willing to give up everything he owns to save his beloved sled dog from drowning. (Tuomas)
Best moment: Rolling around in his money bin. (d a simpson)
― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Friday, 29 September 2006 14:22 (seventeen years ago) link
http://www.iwillteachyoutoberich.com/archives/mcduck.gif
― Daniel_Rf (Daniel_Rf), Friday, 29 September 2006 14:36 (seventeen years ago) link
This is actually a part of the plot in one of Barks' stories - the Beagle Boys have robbed Scrooge's money, and he asks for one last swim. Seeing Scrooge bathe in the money, the Beagle Boys want to do that as well, and jump into the pile of coins, only to hit their heads and lose their consciousness. Then they're arrested, and Scrooge reveals that only he can actually swim in money, after years of practice.
― Tuomas (Tuomas), Friday, 29 September 2006 18:31 (seventeen years ago) link
― Jordan (Jordan), Friday, 29 September 2006 18:43 (seventeen years ago) link
― Jordan (Jordan), Monday, 2 October 2006 19:20 (seventeen years ago) link
― It's the lazy and immoral way to become super hip. (Austin, Still), Monday, 2 October 2006 20:51 (seventeen years ago) link
― disappointing goth fest line-up (orion), Monday, 2 October 2006 20:52 (seventeen years ago) link
― chap who would dare to contain two ingredients. Tea and bags. (chap), Monday, 2 October 2006 21:00 (seventeen years ago) link
― j blount (papa la bas), Monday, 2 October 2006 23:01 (seventeen years ago) link
― occasional mongrel (kit brash), Tuesday, 3 October 2006 02:59 (seventeen years ago) link
― J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Tuesday, 3 October 2006 06:42 (seventeen years ago) link
(136 points)
http://flakmag.com/books/images/bizarro.jpg
A silverage foe of Superman which shares with Braniac the distinction of unobtrusively slipping into mainstream vocabulary.
"Me hate Bizarro. Bizarro am most useless example of uncreativity of Silver Age. Bizarro am joke that am alway get serious. Best Moment: "Bizarro Creates a Monster!", Adventure Comics #292, Jan 62. By Jerry Siegel and John Forte." (Huk-L)
I'm sure everyone's been Bizarro once or twice as a kid. The idea "what if we did everything exactly the other way around than how we usually do it?" and the increasingly convoluted logic that springs from this are staples of childhood imagination. But the sheer genius audacity of applying this concept to fiction – how could you not love that? Comic books do "WTF" better than most any other medium – what in literature might seem slappeable, and on film mannered, could so often be saved by inserting it into the colourful, intrinsically bizarre medium of comics. And no one does WTF better than Bizarro (Daniel RF)
― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Tuesday, 17 October 2006 05:20 (seventeen years ago) link
― Tuomas (Tuomas), Wednesday, 18 October 2006 05:46 (seventeen years ago) link
Alan Moore killed off Bizarro immediately pre-Crisis, and Htrae was removed from continuity during the Crisis. Since then, however, there have been two Bizarros in DC Continuity - the one created by LexCorp and the one created by the Joker using Mr Mxyzptlk's powers. Since the first LexCorp Bizarro appeared in 1986 (i.e. the same year as the Crisis) there's an argument that can be made that he nearly appreciably left continuity.
Of course, he's most recently been associated with Bizarro Comics and Bizarro world. Collections of non-hero superhero stories by indie authors - I would have thought they would have been exactly your sort of thing?
― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Wednesday, 18 October 2006 08:41 (seventeen years ago) link
― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 18 October 2006 09:26 (seventeen years ago) link
Superman had been off the Earth, doing research for the government. When he returned, he found complete city blocks horribly destroyed, and was told Bizarro had gone berserk, smashing buildings and injuring innocent people.
Confronted by Superman, Bizarro told him, "This am part of genius Bizarro self-improvement plan." Bizarro tells Superman that he had destroyed Bizarro world, as Krypton had been destroyed.
The death of Bizarro. Art from Superman #423 (Sept 1986), by Curt Swan."Bizarro? Come on out and show yourself! I want an explanation for this!""Ha! That easy! It am part of genius Bizarro self-improvement plan! See, me suddenly realize that me am not perfect imperfect duplicate! Maybe me not trying hard enough. Example: when your planet Krypton blow up by accident, you am coming to Earth as baby... so me decide to blow up whole Bizarro world on purpose and come to Earth as adult!""The Bizarro World? Blown up?!""Th-that's right! Ha ha! Pretty imperfect, huh?""Bizarro... what's happened to you? I can't believe you've really destroyed your homeworld!""Ha! That am only the beginning! Next, me realize that Superman never kill, so me kill lots of people! Them very grateful! Scream with happiness!""Killed people? Oh, merciful Rao...""...But then me finally understand what me need to be perfect imperfect duplicate: it am little Blue Kryptonite meteor that me carry in lead case for good luck!"Bizarro holds the Blue Kryptonite before him."See... you am alive Superman... and if me am perfect imperfect duplicate, then me have to be... h-have to be..."Bizarro staggers and collapses to the floor."Bizarro!""Uh... everything, him go d-dark... Hello, Superman. Hello."Bizarro dies.
Not much later, Superman's secret identity was exposed and all the members of his rogues gallery attempt to kill him and everyone associated with him. Superman later discovers that Mr. Mxyzptlk is the villain orchestrating the attacks, and was most likely also the one responsible for Bizarro's strange behavior.
and a page that looks like this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Bizarrodeath.PNG
FWIW, I barely remember it either and it never appears as part of Moore DC collections.
― aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Wednesday, 18 October 2006 10:05 (seventeen years ago) link
― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 18 October 2006 10:37 (seventeen years ago) link
― Stone Monkey (Stone Monkey), Wednesday, 18 October 2006 10:49 (seventeen years ago) link
Aldo's point remains, though - dead or not dead, there's no silver-age Bizarro any more.
― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 18 October 2006 11:29 (seventeen years ago) link
I believe that the story appears in the second edition of Across the Universe: the DC Universe Stories of Alan Moore, the one with the Brian Bolland cover.
There's an episode of Superman, the Animated Series, that focuses on Bizarro. Excellent, but not as good as the one what has Gilbert Gottfried as Mr Mxyptlyk.
― veronica moser (veronica moser), Wednesday, 18 October 2006 11:38 (seventeen years ago) link
― occasional mongrel (kit brash), Wednesday, 18 October 2006 12:07 (seventeen years ago) link
― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Wednesday, 18 October 2006 13:10 (seventeen years ago) link
sissy boy that i am, I wept while re-reading the story in the mid-90s.
― veronica moser (veronica moser), Wednesday, 18 October 2006 13:29 (seventeen years ago) link
THIS IS MY CONTRIBUTION TO DC DISCUSSION.
― Jessie the Monster (scarymonsterrr), Wednesday, 18 October 2006 15:11 (seventeen years ago) link
Plus it was specifically written immediately pre-Crisis so that it would be written out the next month obv.
("the times" - it actually happens MUCH MORE these days but they think there's such a thing as canon now!)
― occasional mongrel (kit brash), Wednesday, 18 October 2006 20:31 (seventeen years ago) link
(137 points)
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Zone/9923/hopey.gif
Dark-haired, bitchy, full of herself and utterlymagnetic – was Hopey an older version of Lucy? (Justyn)
I had an only half-joking crush on Hopey Glass in Love&Rockets — despite my Grate Critic's Brane being perfectly aware that she is nothing if not a Comicbook- Device-by-Which-to-Produce-Pash-in-the- Punky-Fanboy — which I then managed to transfer into a non-joking crush on an extremely Hopey-like friend, with DISASTROUS consequences. crushes on the Hopey-like in Real Life: DON'T TRY THIS AT HOME KIDS!! THEY ARE ALL AS MAD AS MAD JACK McMAD!! (mark s)
Greatest moment: "Hay's for horses, ass-bite!" (Douglas Wolk)
― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Friday, 20 October 2006 10:33 (seventeen years ago) link
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/0/0e/Judge_dredd.png
The flagship character for the galaxy's greatest comic, a not entirely subtle parody of the Thatcherite police state that survived that and a lot else over the last 30 years. I've never been that fond of the big epics, but the little done-in-ones where he ends up arrseting everyone are fantastic.
The greatest comment ever on the fascist overtones of the fantasy of the costumed hero. (Douglas Wolk)
Like Batman, Dredd is good because of his world, not himself (Pete Baran)
Greatest moment: Too many to count. Dredd's worst day under JohnWagner is better than 80% of other comics. (Vic Fluro)
― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Friday, 20 October 2006 10:54 (seventeen years ago) link
― Andrew Farrell (afarrell), Friday, 20 October 2006 10:55 (seventeen years ago) link
― Tom (Groke), Friday, 20 October 2006 11:57 (seventeen years ago) link