balzac - old goriot - classic or dud?

Yeah, "Pere Goriot" really blew me away with its evocation of a whole milieu. Paris in the early 19th century - its classes, culture, morals, manners, fashion - really seep out of every page. Balzac also has a kind of detachment from his characters which is fascinating - he brings them to life, but lets them succumb to their own foibles, or the hands of impersonal fate, or occasionally triumph - all with a knowing eye that's seen to much of life to be surprised by anything. It's also interesting how almost everyone has an angle - his pages are peopled with ambitious social climbers. "Cousin Bette" was also fascinating. I need to remind myself to read more Balzac.

I've only read a few of his novellas and short stories, but they were great. I also want to read 'Lost Illusions', about social climbers/backstabbers in the literary world.

anybody who likes Balzac should go see "The Last Mistress" if you can - with Asia Argento mmmmm - for a visual and textural immersion in exactly the kind of society Balzac depicts, and actually many of the same things happen - supposedly good friends delighting in causing a scandal; the warring of people in love; the dangers of opening one's heart; the politics of seeing and being seen; the insanity and inanity of duels; the theatre of "proper" behavior; the function of gossip

And Rivette's "Don't Touch The Axe", a very proper adaptation of a Balzac novella that I must get round to reading.

almost at the end of this - the speeches go on a bit too long to be realistic but jesus what an epic tale of selfishness and treachery

balzac = marx's favourite novelist (tho his favourite novel was tristram shandy)

balzac = marx's favourite novelist

I could see that, since class often seems to be destiny in Balzac - would have sat well with Marx's view of history.

but i think he also liked em bcz they were gossipy and ruthlessly veil-lifty ("behind every fortune lies a great crime" etc)

Yeah, I guess he would have liked the fact that Balzac undercuts the bourgeois prejudice that says that the privileged classes are where they are because of moral superiority.

and the fact that his name sounds like "ball sack"

if a book club was going to read some ballsack, what would be the easiest/most fun?

Cousin Bette is marvelous fun; he's as good with the devastating caricature as Dickens. Lost Illusions and its sequel A Harlot High and Low offer a terrific view of pre-Second Empire France, from the high and low.

Balzac is never a hard read. I'm no expert, but maybe the short, The Unknown Masterpiece, would be a good place to start? There's a nice, recent edition from nyrb http://www.nybooks.com/shop/product?usca_p=t&product_id=48

Ooh, that's a good one.

alfred i'm going to search for those in my local (i.e. tiny selection) bookshop

if i'm going to read either cousin bette or lost illusions, which one should it be?

Both get out of the gate fairly quickly. Cousin Bette is meaner.

this book rules

too bad there's some blurb on the back by stefan zweig because now I see dude's books as just ripoffs of balzac's shit

Balzac rules and Père Goriot is really good. I don't think I've ever been disappointed by one of his books and I've read quite a few. I remember in school most of my friends who didn't like reading still being able to enjoy his novels. Also, almost every time I read one of his books I feel the urge to read everything he's written ... and then I realise how that amounts to a shit load of books and kind of let go. Actually, I think I'm gonna read another one of his as soon as I'm done with my current book.

As for Zweig, has anyone read his biography of Balzac and is it worth it? I think I have it somewhere at home and I guess I should read it.

Happy Birthday Balzac! (actually it was last night)

also, Zweig's bio on Balzac is grate!

balzac is the #1 reason why I regret never pursuing french after high school seriously

this is one of my favorite books in the world

what is "this"?

the book in the thread title?

oh

Claims and counterclaims over the interpretation of words came during closing submissions to chief magistrate Howard Riddle as the trial neared its end. At one point Riddle referenced a French novelist to point out that the argument was about the use of everyday language: "We're not talking about Balzac."

At another point, the defence claimed Terry may have misheard or misinterpreted what he thought Ferdinand had said as he made a fist pump gesture on the pitch, taunting Terry over an alleged affair with former team-mate Wayne Bridge's ex-girlfriend.

What's the consensus Balzac to read after Goriot and Lost Illusions?

cousin bette, i imagine.

I recommend The Marriage Contract, too

Any opinions re: his secret society one? (Cannot recall title...The Thirteen or somesuch?)

I haven't read any of the others. When I got a Kindle I got Tolstoy and Balzac bundles, Kindle shattered halfway through "The Devil"

*crosses self, spits over left shoulder*

Eugenie Grandet is a favorite.

I read the last part of The Thirteen, The Girl with the Golden Eyes, a while ago; not quite enough loopy Grand Guignol to make up for the overall thinness. A lot of Balzac just kind of sits there as a catalog of his preoccupations without building into anything more; which can be fascinating or boring depending on your own interests.

^ makes me wonder if any of his novels turn into full-on cookbooks or biology textbooks, probably not though

Splendeurs et miseres des courtisanes is great

Yes

Still far prefer Zola

this is a good one

http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/23060

can't believe he wrote like fifty of these comedie humaine books

i got nothing to add except you really can't go wrong with pere goriot, cousin bette and lost illusions

Yes agree and I also love Zola

I really like and would recommend Colonel Chabert.

also be sure not to say "cousin bette", always say KOOOZAN BET

Splendeurs et miseres des courtisanes is great

― buzza, Friday, July 13, 2012 3:21 PM (2 months ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

am reading this right now. not bad. i am not thrilled with the translation which I feel is a bit more, hmmm, opaque?, than the translation I read for Lost Illusions

So the film of LOST ILLUSIONS

It's very readable in English, at least until he gets to the part where Goriot dies. His expiration is ludicrously prolonged.

I do enjoy Balzac's cynicism.

Need to read more of him. Think I picked up a few from charity shops over last few years.
Do remember enjoying him a few decades back when i found his work in the library. Found de Maupassant at around the same time who is also good. But I may only be linking them cos they're both French writers from a while back.

I have at least A Harlot High & Low floating around teh flat. Think there may be others but don't have things organised. I'm seeing reviews saying that is a great novel now that I'm looking it up. I just know its by this guy whose name i know and wonder where it was I initially picked up the idea he was worth reading, possibly cited as an influence on Dylan or Kerouac or something. I did read at least part of Old Goriot but again may have been trying to read too many things at the same time.
So now need to read that harlot book . & see what else I have around.

Reread Pere Goriot last month. After the overstuffed start -- radical at the time -- it really gets going.

the short story sarrasine thru the lens of barthes' S/Z is grebt (also nutso)

Can’t remember if I’ve ever read a single thing, but really liked the film of LOST ILLUSIONS which recently opened here, so maybe it’s time.

Did not know this translation existed

https://www.penguin.co.uk/books/34956/history-of-the-thirteen-by-balzactrans-herbert-j-hunt/9780140443011

i have that version & haven't read it. I got scared off by the introduction that called it not some of Balzac's best.

https://i.imgur.com/ant8M2H.jpg

the history of the thirteen is the basis for jacques rivette's out 1: noli me tangere (running time: 12 hr, 55 min)

so i shd read it and watch the movie for a second time

I love out 1 and assumed the source was never translated.

basis is doing a lot of work there. the overt balzac talk, and idea of a secret society is about it. even in the stories 'the thirteen' themselves only figure very loosely. worth pointing out that rivette did do a fantastic straight adaptation of one of the stories: 'duchess de langlois'

think i read the ellen marriage trans of the history of thirteen so cant speak to the one upthread; but would agree that its not peak honore

big rec for the black sheep which is my fav of course the long novels

Started "The Quest for the Absolute". There is a genius for description of rooms here that an AI would struggle to compete with. You can really feel him having so much fun with his power.

That can also provoke some frustration. You feel this could be half of the length (even in a short book like this) but the material is so good.