The Afterglow Has Co$t Us Dearly, Toronto Blue Jays 2026... yadda yadda

new thread to discuss Hoffman wins, Gimenez RBIs and bush party installations

Another thought on the ASB system: Cavan Biggio, your moment has arrived.

where's he at now?

Gausman: K's for everyone, setting records!

Cease: hold my beer

Dylan Cease is something else today: 11 strikeouts through 5, working on seven straight.

Fluharty getting hit with two line drives in a row - yikes

To what extent does your life revolve around Alejandro Kirk!

(I’m watching A’s-Jays and that Kirk nuke in the 9th was incredible)

My dad--I mean ME--turned the game off and missed all that...I'm back, though!

I didn't deserve that.

I also tuned out after the Langeliers GS ... came back for the 10th!

Think Clement got a missed call on that checked swing.

Ya he def went around imho. Anyways… what a game! Cease, Kirk, other new guy, Ernie!

bump

Looking for another walk-off win here.

i will take a scoreless save from Hoffman. Lauer looked amazing and loved seeing Sanchez and Okamoto get their first homers for us too.

they set a record for most (pitching) Ks in an opening series too (49 by my count)

My needs-context joke worked...Jays pitchers struck out 50 (!) in their first three games, a franchise record (one extra-inning game in there). I've got to wonder if that isn't an MLB record--to open the season, obviously, but over any three-game stretch?

Sorry, was typing...I got 50, I don't know.

First 3-0 start since 1996!

Not to worry, but a 77-85 team...Looking back at them, I was surprised to find out that Hentgen's Cy Young year (I remembered that, of course) was close to 9.0 WAR on B-Ref.

Looking at old Jays teams on B-R, I noticed that after the win today, the Jays are exactly at .500 all-time following the win today (3857-3857).

Looking at that '96 Cy, pretty sure there are still Yankee fans convinced that Pettitte should have won. I recall that it was considered a toss-up at the time because of W-L records: yeah, maybe Hentgen pitched a little better, but 21-8 vs. 20-10, award should go to Pettitte.

Hentgen pitched a lot better. (I was arguing for him at the time--no WAR then, just looking at all the old-school stuff--and trying to tell people it wasn't just because he was a Jay.) Forty more innings, 10 CG vs. 2, more than half-a-run edge in ERA, better WHIP. Pettitte had a better K/BB rate.

Hentgen won 110-104 (16 firsts to 11, though).

Re strikeout record for any three-game stretch: the Astros struck out 52 in 2016:

https://www.mlb.com/news/astros-mlb-record-52-strikeouts-in-3-game-set-c180433878

But 50 is an opening-the-season record, yes.

Bo is off to a brutal start (1-14)...he's always been streaky; Jays fans a little more patient than in NY, I'm sure, but not all that patient.

Saw him getting boo’d. Not exactly the best start

Whatever just happened to Cody Ponce there, did not look good at all

Not home, but just read that:

https://www.mlb.com/news/cody-ponce-injured-in-blue-jays-debut

Yuck. Why you load up on seven or eight starters.

Yeah, I'm expecting the worst here.

Five runs in two innings for Heineman. Still a better ERA than his twelve runs in 3.1 innings last year.

As expected, not great: "Blue Jays are 'holding onto' hope of a return this season."

https://www.mlb.com/news/cody-ponce-acl-sprain

Hope springs eternal: six very strong innings from Max tonight, his 298th career QS. It's a stat that's barely ever mentioned anymore, but I got curious:

https://www.statmuse.com/mlb/ask/who-has-the-most-quality-starts

Assuming Verlander falls short of 300 wins, I think 300 QS will be more or less as unlikely as 300 wins. So two more, and maybe Max will be the last.

I was kind of hoping the Gatorade dump would be on Max tonight, but I guess that's something that just doesn't happen.

Hardly ever happens to a SP. who got it (my computer died)?

Jesus (many jokes in the offing here).

i would be very afraid of pouring gatorade on max scherzer

I know--that's exactly what I was hoping for...Had this vision of Vlad doing his thing, then making a mad dash for the clubhouse.

How's that for a nightmarish loss? Up 3-2 in the 10th, two outs from a win. Next guy strikes out, but Kirk is injured from a foul tip during the AB. So two out, runner on third, Heineman in the game. Next guy drops down a surprise bunt, Heineman throws it away. (Would Kirk have made the out? Have to look at it again--maybe he would have at least held on to the ball.) 3-3 now, next guy doubles him home.

Looking at the replay, Kirk would have had the good sense to hold on to the ball.

On top of which, as the post-game commentators just pointed out, the idea that you're going to come off the bench and instantaneously pull off this incredibly difficult throw is wishful thinking. I realize it was a great bunt and a bang-bang play, but Heineman's supposed to think of the possibilities ahead of time. Guy bunts, no play, hang on to the ball.

It wasn't that hard of a play, Heineman should have thrown him out to end the game, he just blew it.

Three out of four games dropped to two of the worst teams in MLB, Ponce injured, Kirk may be injured, the vibes are bad after that 3-0 start.

Looked at it again...I think it's a more difficult play than that because he picks up the ball facing the other way and had to wheel around. I don't know--it he'd made it, I would have been impressed, especially having just gotten into the game.

He should have held into it imho- play was going to be close and looked like it *could* roll foul. Runner wasn’t going to score on the play - they would have just had to get the next guy out.

Kirk out for probably close to two months. Ugh

Heinemen's adequate, but what do they do? I guess they're long past the point of giving Varsho some games there...Anyone at Triple A? Trade for a stopgap?

For a second, I forget about Tyler Heineman's controlled demolition thing.

He had a pretty bad day today

I've been watching baseball long enough, that I'm sure I've seen many errors uglier than his rundown-toss to third today. Nothing immediately comes to mind, though.

They traded for Brandon Valenzuela in the offseason, who looks like he could maybe be a slightly better option than Tyler?

He sure did look demoralized in the dugout.

Apparently he was inconsolable after the game.

Taking a bit of solace from that mini-comeback. But still nursing ominous feelings till their next win.

One of the Jays colour guys cracked me up after the game, talking about the Sanchez injury. Supposedly it was a 13-year-old kid who, in all innocence, was responding to Sanchez waving his glove (as in "throw me the ball"). He pointed out the odds of hitting Sanchez's wrist from the stands, how you could try 20 times and never come close. (Paraphrase) "Either that kid's a prospect with elite command who you might want to pursue, or it's another example of the Jays being cursed this year."

20-1? I'd take those odds and trade Hoffman for him even up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FBd_WlM3EQ

Our pitching is so bad that we need a guy who's 0-7 with an ERA north of 7?

Bring in the gimp

I wasn't watching (following in a pub), but Varland closes the 8th--good that he's in--they score 4 to go up 7-2, and Varland comes back for the ninth... That does seem a little weird to me with seven straight games coming up, but I guess they'd used up enough pitchers by that point.

He'd come in with two outs in the eighth, getting him warmed up to record only one out would be a bit of a waste (if it wasn't the last out of the game). And he only threw 17 pitches in total.

The team leader in SLG? Ernie Clement, of course! I love Clement, but that sort of encapsulates this team's problems (third last in HR in the AL, last in OPS+).

I voted Clement for the ASG, and I honestly believe he's the best choice; A.L. second base is not a strong position this season.

I look forward to being enraged at who the masses vote in instead

At which point name recognition carries the day, so I'd expect either Altuve or Jazz Chisholm or Gleyber Torres. Mind you, Toronto does get out the vote, plus Clement was as visible as could be during last year's WS run, so who knows.

HR and 3B for Clement today. Even if he doesn't get voted in--and I will boldly predict that, in a weak year, he does--he's gotta be close to a sure-thing as a reserve (leading the league in both doubles and hits).

Extremely curious as to whether the Jays will bring Hoffman out for the 8th. (They've come back today from 4-0 to lead 5-4; yesterday Hoffman came in with the Jays leading 6-1 and gave up a 2-run HR.)

Thankfully, no--they let Rogers go longer (love watching him pitch) and brought Varland in an out earlier...I've got to believe Valenzuela is here to stay. Honestly, with him being a switch-hitter who, at least this year, hits better from the left side, and Kirk a right-hander, I'd go to almost a straight platoon when Kirk returns. Is that ever done anymore? I can't think of a reason why you wouldn't--plus I'm old enough to remember 1983, and Mulliniks/Iorg and Whitt/Martinez. (I'm not old enough to rmember Casey Stengel, but he seems to have had some success with platooning.)

Nice comeback, and Ernie Clement schooled me on the "running outside of the baseline rule". That was a 200 IQ play.

i feel like the rest of baseball/fans are all big mad that he shoulda been out

Listening to Schneider, sounds like pretty much everyone is back within the next week-10 days. Then we can start figuring out if this is a good team.

i feel like the rest of baseball/fans are all big mad that he shoulda been out

I think they got it right -- the rule says that the runner can establish their own baseline, and can't veer outside that baseline to avoid a tag. Clement changed direction before the ball was fielded, and there was no immediate attempt to tag him. I didn't know the rule as it is written. But I figure that Jomboy or someone will collect a bunch of similar plays from the past few years where the rule was interpreted differently.

i'm sure he wil do everything he can to make the jays look like monsters

Vlad vs. Bo:

VG - 274 PA, 38 runs, 14 XBH, 3 HR, 32 BB, 25 RBI, .282/.372/.368, 105 OPS+
BB - 284 PA, 30 runs, 14 XBH, 5 HR, 19 BB, 32 RBI, .234/.285/.330, 75 OPS+

A few more singles, a few more walks, and that's about the difference.

Yes--George is getting frustrated. (Speaking of which, Springer is periously close to dropping below the Mendoza Line.)

Varland gives up his second run...for the win!

My god this team would be nowhere without Valenzuela this season. What a wild, under the radar grab he was.

His slugging average is creeping near .500...him, Sanchez, and Pinango, three new guys stole the game.

Pinango has also been another pleasant surprise

Or maybe not… -0.1 WAR so far to go with his 121 OPS+. His glove has not been good - but didn’t realize it was that bad

BABIP is pretty high too, which could also be factoring in?

McAdoo in three games actually has a higher WAR than Sanchez and Pinango together

Intuition says there's no room for Pinango once everyone returns, especially in view of his defensive limitations. 97/100 times I'd say "keep the hitter," especially a team that struggles offensively as much as this one, but Straw's glove, flexibility, and baserunning really is important in the late innings.

Over the last month, Valenzuela's OPS is among the best in baseball. And he can pitch frame!

In 107 regular season inning with the Jays, Max's ERA is now 6.22.

Good time to walk away, Max: got your 3,500th strikeout, bad last start (and all other sporting news from yesterday) obliterated by the basketball game. But he won't. A few more moves him into 10th, and Perry, Verlander, and Sutton (7th with 3,574) are all within view. Maybe the team will reluctantly make that decision for him when Bieber gets back.

I really hope Kirk's big return last night--3-3, walk, RBI double first time up--sparks them into something resembling a hot streak. Not that the fundamental problem--anemic offense--has been magically solved. The thought of slogging away at near-.500 for the rest of the year, always at the edge of a WC spot, isn't appealing, even if I realize there's a worse option.

Stage is set for a PH, bottom-of-the-9th walk-off HR from Vlad...would also accept runs in the bottom of the 8th.

Maddening beyond words. NY gift-wraps the lead to the Jays by walking the first two batters in the bottom of the 8th. Coming up, Ernie Clement (the guy who's 100% a baseball player, who does all the little things right) and Brandon Valenzuela, the team's rookie sensation and hottest hitter as of late. Clement pops a bunt up, Valenzuela strikes out. NY wants to give them one more chance, though, so they walk Pinango; bases loaded. Charles McAdoo pops up, inning over.

Guessing Schneider might catch hell for not sending up Vlad to hit for McAdoo--irony--but I wouldn't have either. He's sitting out for a reason, and making out in that situation isn't going to get his confidence/head back on track.

Was just following on the computer, so I didn't realize Vlad was out for back tightness--second paragraph there moot.

Second consecutive NHBM (non-Hoffman bullpen meltdown).

This game unraveled in a hurry. Why are they still batting Springer leadoff?

They should probably move Lukes or Clement there, but not sure if they'd be affected by the extra visibility. Slogging away...they need more slug but they've got slog to spare.

Max back on the IL. This is starting to mystify me as much as the attachment to Hoffman as closer did.

You may remember a vintage four-game stretch from Max last August: 25 IP, 5 ER, 20 hits, 17 K, 7 BB, 3-1, 1.80 ERA. If you take that away, here's his regular-season line as a Jay: 82 IP, 69 ER, 94 hits, 79 K, 27 BB, 3-8, 7.57 ERA.

i'm not sure what i learn with that. we take away any pitchers hot streak, they look bad.

For me, that August stretch was a last bit of glory (that and the WS start). If he were 32, I'd agree that your point--which is true--were applicable in this case. At 41, I think the evidence is overwhelming he's finished.

What a game. Yesavage was cruising along, gave up HR to the first two batters in the 8th for a tie game. In the ninth, Clement leads off with a piddly little infield hit halfway up the third-base line. Still standing there two outs later, Valenzuela pops up to the catcher--who's completely flummoxed by the wind and lets it drop untouched. Valenzeula somehow hits a triple off the Monster against Chapman, who looks untouchable, for the lead. Fluharty (with no other options) gets the save in five pitches.

Check that, Valenzeula's hit was a double.

Last thing you want to hear upon tuning into a Jays game you didn't know was almost finished already: "...and a scoreless frame for Straw."

I did learn about this fascinating story, which I'm positive I never knew before: Brian Milner, father of Cubs' pitcher Hoby Milner.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_Milner

1) still the youngest Jay ever (18 years, 218 days)
2) career .444 hitter

Looks like today's game already postponed, likely till another day--massive rainfall all through the afternoon and early evening. Damn.

Aug 6 is the make up day

Okamoto: headed for 30 HR/90 RBI, both good, but barely league-average as a hitter (102 OPS+). Yesterday's HR was huge.

Also--always important--if you shorten Kazuma to Kaz, he has a Mister Dobalina name.

Ernie Clement's ASG prospects:

Mind you, Toronto does get out the vote, plus Clement was as visible as could be during last year's WS run, so who knows.
― clemenza, Friday, June 5, 2026 12:12 PM (two weeks ago)

As of today: "The only player besides Ohtani to crack 2 million votes..."

The elusive mountaintop again beckons: a winning baseball team.