A Thread for Starting Pitchers That Are Jacob deGrom

I think his HOF chances are pretty safe. He can be mediocre for the next 4 years and I think he’d still be a shoe in. But it’s not like he’s in any sort of decline right now.

i think to get in he'll have to have either keep up for a few more years (better than mediocre, not necessarily world-beating) and/or have some sort of Legendary Moment near the end

if puts up a 4.08 ERA from 2022-25, in other words, the mystique will be gone. people forget quickly

To me it comes down to two things: Cys and how much the value of wins has been discounted (or will have been discounted by the time he's eligible) compared to, say, 20 years ago--50%? 70% completely? One good thing is that his lack of run support has probably been scrutinized and publicized more than any pitcher ever. Don't think I'd go so far as "pretty safe," not yet.

https://i.imgur.com/Chdcl9L.png👍

deGrom is pretty good but he's no Dutch Leonard

looking at Sanata as a possible comp for falling short of the hall – I guess clemenza might have a point.
both won two Cy youngs, 4 all star appearances (assuming Degrom this year). Sanata had a few more years in before losing 2011 to injury and only getting just one so-so year in after that; so his counting stats look a better (139 vs 77 wins, 1988 vs 1485 strikeouts 51 WAR vs 41). But Degrom has a significant edge in ERA (2.50 vs 3.20), ERA+ (157 vs 136), FIP (2.63 vs 3.44), SO/W ( 5.07 vs 3.51)the list goes on.
so i guess if he gets the Cy this year, it could cement him as a HoF no matter what happens after... more Koufax than Sanata at that point. but it's not like a sudden end to his career is eminent or anything.
i'm also now curious what the most dominant season a non-HOF starter has had (not counting pre-deadball).

a few quick results i got were Clemens in 97 (tho obvious a hall of fame calibre pitcher but not in for other reasons, currently) plus Wilbur Woods AND Vida Blue in '71

johan santana, right?

I wasn't watching much baseball during his prime years, so i had to look it up to make sure myself

definitely not Ervin!

Not sure how they did in WAR without checking, but McLain and Tiant in '68, Dean Chance in '64, Gooden in '85, and Guidry in '78 all come to mind.

Lolich was pretty great in '71 too.

Jacob DeGrom, former Hall of Fame contender, current fading superstar with 2 ER today and a 1.08 ERA

How the mighty have fallen.

To slightly less mighty, but still pretty mighty.

Second fewest starts (198) after Darvish (197) to 1,500 strikeouts.

https://i.imgur.com/EDLi8QP.png

no idea why they chose those for comparison, but it's been the exact same layout for over a month now. it's true that MLB just doesn't generally understand what their own fans like to see

Do you mean the ERA chart or the Darvish comparison? The latter seems meaningless to me, especially when they call it "fastest to 1500 strikeouts," but Leonard (official record, Negro League mark aside), Gibson (modern-day record), and Gooden (best since 1968) make sense, no?

to me, the ERA comparison is useless for the same reason of "fastest to 1500 strikeouts" - they were all playing in different eras

but also, just from a PR/stats perspective, i'd guess only a small portion of the fans would intuitively understand why the players in the chart above were chosen (to represent different eras and run-scoring environment). and even then...to keep the same little stat template up for like 6 weeks when it only takes 20 minutes to come up with something different and interesting? eh, what do i know. the pandemic has been hard for everyone, including mlb.com data visualizers

To clarify, I thought the "fastest to 1500" was useless because they used starts rather than age (or, at the very least, IP). Darvish and deGrom are the same era, though.

They could use some parenthetical explanations on the ERA chart, for sure.

I think the record he's actually vying for is an the unofficial, esoteric Greatest Injury-Riddled Season Ever record.

https://www.mlb.com/news/jacob-degrom-right-forearm-tightness

On the shelf two more weeks.

Making his first major league start in 13 months tonight. With some first inning adrenaline, his fastball hit 102 MPH. Doesn’t look like he is overthrowing so far.

Looks like he pitched very well tonight.

Either finished for the day or one more inning, but what a game: 5 perfect innings, 10 K.

Retired the first 17! Then Swanson hit a homrerun :/

I caught his last two batters--didn't realize the Jays network had switched over to the Mets game. He came real close to 6 perfect innings with 13 strikeouts.

Kind of relieved they didn’t have to take him while he was throwing a perfect game though. He was at a limit of around 75 pitches, so next time he will get a chance to go deeper.

6 shutout innings tonight, 10 Ks. So great to watch him pitch again.

Small sample size, I know, but: deGrom went into yesterday's start with a 37-1 K/BB ratio. After striking out nine and walking one, his ratio has plummeted to 23-1.

Pedro 1999: 213.1 IP, 23-4, 2.07, 234 ERA+, 1.39 FIP, 0.923 WHIP, 8.46 K/BB, 9.8 bWAR

Pedro 2000: 217.0 IP, 18-6, 1.74, 291 ERA+, 2.17 FIP, 0.737 WHIP, 8.88 K/BB, 11.7 bWAR

DeGrom 2020-22: 203.1 IP, 16-5, 1.64, 250 ERA+, 1.61 FIP, 0.689 WHIP, 9.48 K/BB, 9.0 bWAR

Staying healthy and playing means everything, of course.

10 Ks through four innings so far

13 Ks today, but Cruz got the better of him.

https://i.imgur.com/ESUg3c4.png

“Days since injury” conspicuously missing. Heroes: none is extremely funny though.

i guess there's the small chance he was trying to be funny? i don't know much at all about degrom the person or personality. but i agree, hero "none" is good stuff

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/qY6ZaJK_ARc/maxresdefault.jpg

i want to believe he drew the cactus and sun and baseball

“I fully anticipate making my next start”: The New Jacob Degrom Thread

I was sure after they pulled him he was gonna be out for at least a month

Woop

he fully intends to make his next start

Shit in one hand and wish in the other etc

Out for a couple of more weeks.

he fully intends to make his next start
― Michael F Gill, Friday, April 28, 2023 11:46 PM (one week ago)

Missed that--nice deadpan, reminds me of Mia Farrow in Rosemary's Baby on her excruciating pain: "Oh, haven't you heard? It'll go away in a day or two."

I am irrationally angry at deGrom for being injured so much. I want to watch him pitch and I want the rangers to win the AL West. Get it together Jacob!

I am irrationally angry at deGrom for being injured so much. I want to watch him pitch and I want the rangers to win the AL West. Get it together Jacob!

:(

“Fighting through tears as he addressed the media on Tuesday evening, Jacob deGrom expressed his frustration with his unfortunate situation.

deGrom's Rangers tenure was dealt a significant blow on Tuesday with the announcement that the two-time Cy Young Award winner will undergo surgery to repair a tear in his right ulnar collateral ligament. Rangers GM Chris Young didn't specify if the procedure will be reconstructive Tommy John surgery or another surgery, but either way, the celebrated right-hander is done for the season.”

No better distraction than being in first place and playing .650 baseball. If they were floundering around near the bottom, they'd be getting crucified in the media right now.

It’s probably better that this happened in Arlington instead of Queens, for sure. He only made 6 starts this year and he may be out for most/all of next season too if it’s a full recovery from Tommy John surgery.

Wherever this had happened--and you're right, being far away from New York helps--I think the media would be much tougher on the team that signed him than on deGrom himself--who does get subjected to jokes, here and elsewhere, but that someone signed him for 185 million/5 years still boggles the mind.

His upside is as high as almost anyone who has ever pitched, and I assume that can be enough for a team that already a billion dollar infield. It’s not very logical. The way he pitched during his 2 Cy Young seasons, along with one of the greatest half-seasons ever, that is high level magic/sorcery that everyone wants a piece of, hoping it will rub off on them. It’s almost hall of fame worthy, but it feels like too short of a peak.