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to return to garland v. o's other night...i don't think i've ever seen so many gd broken bats in a game.

― jonathan quayle higgins (j.q. higgins), Saturday, 14 May 2005 17:30 (twenty-one years ago)

I have to say, I'm still skeptical of the ChiSox and their success, but I'm starting to come around to Ozzie's finer points. A quote from the NY Daily News (courtesy of BP): "How many managers can win a game for their team? I tell my team, 'You want to win? Don't give me a chance to [bleep] it up. Go throw a shutout and then I'll just sit here and look smart. Don't give me a chance to [bleep] it up.'"

― David R. (popshots75`), Monday, 16 May 2005 18:52 (twenty-one years ago)

awesome

― ()ops (()()ps), Wednesday, 18 May 2005 04:14 (twenty-one years ago)

Garland -- Buehrle --

two all-* starting pitchers? witha Jon G as starter? can a chicagoan dream? Ok so we've got maddux and glavine, but where the hell is our Smoltz? Fredy Garcia what is your damage?? can Damaso Marte (my guy!!) stop losing games for the guys? A.J. Pierzysnki is a cancer NOT!

Good guys wear black!

― Stormy Davis (diamond), Thursday, 19 May 2005 01:15 (twenty-one years ago)

see, I love them too

― Haikunym (Haikunym), Thursday, 19 May 2005 02:07 (twenty-one years ago)

i love that garland is 8-0. jon garland! 8-0!

― jaymc (jaymc), Thursday, 19 May 2005 03:43 (twenty-one years ago)

two weeks pass...

i watched today's extra-inning loss to the indians on wgn. and dear god what annoying announcers. at least harry caray had the excuse of being blind/drunk.

― mookieproof (mookieproof), Monday, 6 June 2005 02:35 (twenty-one years ago)

What happened to Hawk? I tend not to catch many games on TV, so I didn't realize he was out of the announcers' booth for a while.

― jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 6 June 2005 02:47 (twenty-one years ago)

yeah i was just thinking earlier today that the main reason why i don't watch much of the sox games (other than the fact that baseball is boring. face it, it is) is due to how grating i find hawk and dj. now if they would have their lil spats with greater frequency, i'd be glued to the screen..

― oops (Oops), Monday, 6 June 2005 03:46 (twenty-one years ago)

whatever happened to WIMPY?

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Monday, 6 June 2005 03:56 (twenty-one years ago)

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Monday, 6 June 2005 03:57 (twenty-one years ago)

other than the fact that baseball is boring. face it, it is

On this board, you might have some trouble getting people to agree with this statement.

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Monday, 6 June 2005 04:18 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, perhaps you mistook this board for the I Love Baseball Despite Its Boringness board.

― David R. (popshots75`), Monday, 6 June 2005 04:56 (twenty-one years ago)

"HE GONE"

― mookieproof (mookieproof), Monday, 6 June 2005 06:03 (twenty-one years ago)

Yeah, perhaps you mistook this board for the I Love Baseball Despite Its Boringness board.

I just took that as being understood, as there's no other way to love it. boring things are ok. boring gets a bad rap.

― oops (Oops), Monday, 6 June 2005 17:48 (twenty-one years ago)

Methinks you are confusing LEISURELY with boring.

"I didn't like what they did to that young pitcher, whatshisname, sending him up against Texas. That was stupid. That was terrible."
--Chicago mayor Richard M. Daley, on the White Sox starting prospect Brandon McCarthy against Texas (Chicago Sun-Times)

"I wouldn't touch that with a 10-foot pole."
--A spokeswoman for the White Sox, when asked for a comment on Daley’s remarks

"Well, everybody has their own opinion. I think I've been criticized by so many people it doesn't shock me."
--White Sox manager Ozzie Guillen, on Daley’s comments

"Well there is a thing I would say to the mayor. I would say I've been in this country for 25 years and I don't have American citizenship. He should help me do that. I'll criticize him because they don't give me American citizenship."
--Guillen

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Monday, 6 June 2005 18:13 (twenty-one years ago)

haha Ithinks I am too! I was in fact searching for a term besides boring.
still one man's leisurely is another man's boring. let's just say baseball has a higher propensity to be boring. there's about 5 minutes or so of action stretched out among 3 hours.
but i digress...

― oops (Oops), Monday, 6 June 2005 18:43 (twenty-one years ago)

Ozzie is quickly climbing my Most Favorite Baseball Person Ever list. Even if he was a crap manager, his pullquotes have justified his extension.

― David R. (popshots75`), Monday, 6 June 2005 18:44 (twenty-one years ago)

I think Wimpy is doing Braves games for Fox Sports Net?

WTF is up with this pic, tho?

http://atlanta.braves.mlb.com/images/team/broadcasters/broadcaster_atl_paciorek.jpg

― jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 6 June 2005 18:45 (twenty-one years ago)

Upon further inspection, it's the same as the one Gear! posted but the colors are slightly more ... intense.

― jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 6 June 2005 18:46 (twenty-one years ago)

mmmm ketchup

― jaymc (jaymc), Monday, 6 June 2005 20:44 (twenty-one years ago)

Baseball can take a swerve into boring quite easily. The third time the pitcher steps off the rubber or the hitter needs to adjust his crotch, etc., I'm out. Throw the damn ball, hit the damn ball, git r done.

― milozauckerman (miloaukerman), Monday, 6 June 2005 21:00 (twenty-one years ago)

I'm sorry but oops has a point.

― Thermo Thinwall (Thermo Thinwall), Monday, 6 June 2005 21:17 (twenty-one years ago)

i've always thought there should be a pitch clock a la basketball's shot clock. and limit the number of times any player or coach/manager can walk out to the mound. in a weird way though, this looseness that exists in baseball is part of its charm.

― oops (Oops), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 00:05 (twenty-one years ago)

there's about 5 minutes or so of action stretched out among 3 hours.

The same could be said about football.

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 00:10 (twenty-one years ago)

Or soccer.

― Thermo Thinwall (Thermo Thinwall), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 00:27 (twenty-one years ago)

But for whatever reason they are less charming somehow.

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 00:42 (twenty-one years ago)

Soccer is all action, all the time, what are you talking about?? If you can't appreciate the spontaneous rearrangement of formations, like chess but with spikes and running and tackling, if you're not interested in how people open up the field or close it down, that's fair props. But if you just look at the format of the game: there are no time-outs, and even the ball going out of bounds results in more jockeying, running, etc.

American football, off the top of my head, has about twice as much time where literally no playing at all is happening -- i.e. people walking around, the referees placing the ball, players being substituted in and out, the "huddle" -- than time where the ball is actually in play. With baseball, even the moments where the pitcher is tugging at the brim of his cap and trying to figure out what to throw next is potentially a moment that a baserunner could run off to second base. It doesn't mean you have to like it, of course.

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 01:13 (twenty-one years ago)

I don't know if the action to inaction ration is as quite as low in football as it is in baseball, but let's say it is; those 5 minutes of action are generally much more intense than and the athletic skill on display much more evident.
But baseball is fine! Anyone who can't find the drama and tension in it, in every at bat, is missing out. There's no need to defend it. It is what it is, and you either find it boring or you don't. People now, including myself, seem to be getting shorter and shorter attention spans. Or, more accurately, seem to need a more intense stimilus to sustain their attention.

xpost yeah my friends would say how boring soccer is, and I think that's being narrow-minded and equating scoring with excitement. Americans want results!

― oops (Oops), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 01:18 (twenty-one years ago)

I was forced to watch many a soccer match while in the Uk and was bored stupid. That's not to say actually attending a match is the same - that's actually a ton of fun! Being a chess player and a baseball fan you'd think I'd have the patience for it but it just never caught on with with me. But you do make a good case, Trace. maybe if I knew more about all that seemingly pointless running around was going on behind the ball I might enjoy it much more (as is the case with baseball).

― Thermo Thinwall (Thermo Thinwall), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 02:01 (twenty-one years ago)

Soccer's way less interesting to me because there's less to quantify.

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 02:59 (twenty-one years ago)

Garcia put together one of his best starts of the year -- in Coors Field, of all places. And to think, when he gave up a taco in the first I was feeling so good about my decision to bench him tonight.

― MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 03:09 (twenty-one years ago)

Err on the side of caution, MIR.

― David R. (popshots75`), Tuesday, 7 June 2005 11:27 (twenty-one years ago)

Big Hurt!

― Gear! (can Jung shill it, Mu?) (Gear!), Thursday, 16 June 2005 01:12 (twenty years ago)

god I love this team.

― Stormy Davis (diamond), Sunday, 19 June 2005 00:44 (twenty years ago)

Stormy, I was there! First game I took the missus too, this season.

MERCY.

― Baked Bean Teeth (Baked Bean Teeth), Sunday, 19 June 2005 02:45 (twenty years ago)

you can put it on the board, YES!

― hstencil (hstencil), Sunday, 19 June 2005 15:37 (twenty years ago)

BBT, that's awesome! what a game. I relistened to the Hawkaroo's call like three times this morning.

http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/multimedia/tp_archive.jsp?c_id=cws&ym=200506

it's nice to be on the good end of AJP's bat after years of despising him and his Sox-killing ways. between last night and Thursday's win over the D-Backs, it's been a helluva week. the Flubs getting flat-out embarassed over three games in the Bronx is just the icing on the cake.

hey, also, check your email BBT...

― Stormy Davis (diamond), Sunday, 19 June 2005 19:26 (twenty years ago)

Big Hurt is back in a major way, 7HR already. Scott Podsednik doesn't have the biggest OBPS, but I reckon that's alleviated somewhat by 38 SB. This team is just solid all across the board, it looks like everything is coming up Ken and Ozzie this year.

― Gear! (Ill Cajun Gunsmith) (Gear!), Saturday, 25 June 2005 00:28 (twenty years ago)

The Sox's offense has been taking a big siesta the last 3 games -- they've scored 2, 0, and 2 runs -- but at least their pitching has been solid enough to keep them afloat, with Burly getting his 10th W tonight even w/o his best stuff (he was high in the zone all night, and left in the 7th, which is uncharacteristically early for him). So right now they remain 10 above the Twins, who are "battling" the bottom-feeding Royales with Cheese.

― Baked Bean Teeth (Baked Bean Teeth), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 00:50 (twenty years ago)

did Jermaine Dye just reach 16 HR without anyone noticing?

― Gear! (Ill Cajun Gunsmith) (Gear!), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 01:04 (twenty years ago)

Scott Podsednik has sailed past Garret Anderson as the Most Overrated "Underrated" Player in the game. He is 81st(!!!) among AL position players in VORP, and I can see him being the Know-Nothings' candidate for MVP.

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 18:14 (twenty years ago)

I really do think the SBs help out his case a little bit.

― Gear! (Ill Cajun Gunsmith) (Gear!), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 18:16 (twenty years ago)

He's stolen 38 and been caught 9, which is better than break-even. But that's roughly as productive as Rowand (11 for 14).

When you include pitchers, Podsednik is 13th on the *team* in VORP, behind Neal Cotts. Rickey he's not.

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 18:22 (twenty years ago)

I was curious whether SB are taken into account with analytical stats such as vorp, because the argument could be made that the 38 steals, minus 9 (+29, then), could be taken into account as an extra base. like slugging percentage, but not resulting from swinging the bat.

does that make sense?

― Gear! (Ill Cajun Gunsmith) (Gear!), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 18:28 (twenty years ago)

i'd be stunned to hear anyone mention pod for mvp w/ a straight face, but then i haven't been watching bbtn this year...didn't even realize he was considered underrated in the same way as garret anderson.

VORP should take SBs into account, btw. (but 38/47 /= 11/14!!!!! there's a big cumulative effect there.)

― John (jdahlem), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 18:29 (twenty years ago)

I think the problem with the SABRized discount applied to the SB is that it is not merely an additional base, it is one base closer to scoring position... and for a player who possesses speed like Podsednik, that can equal more opportunities to score from 2nd on a single or from 3rd on a sacfly.

One idea that occured to me is that if a SABR formula could factor SBs into SLG (ie, bases per AB), that may add a proper contextual weighting adjustment. Then again, I just ate lunch and am a little lightheaded from climbing the 10 flights of stairs just now.

― gygax! (gygax!), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 18:35 (twenty years ago)

SBs can't be added as-is into total bases since they don't knock in runs. i'm not sure how SBs are scored...can anyone do a C&P job? yr obv right that podsednik on second/third > avg player on second/third. and don't you have a god damn elevator??

― John (jdahlem), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 18:42 (twenty years ago)

you're right!

it's strange to think that if Podsednik wasn't a SB threat at all, but he had an additional 29 "bases" because of extra base hits (bases that would be taken into account via slugging %), his OBPS would be higher and he wouldn't be called overrated, really.

but RBI are just a counting stat anyway!! xpost

― Gear! (Ill Cajun Gunsmith) (Gear!), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 18:43 (twenty years ago)

Anderson (#36 in AL VORP) is way more productive than Podsednik.

>(but 38/47 /= 11/14!!!!! there's a big cumulative effect there)

Barry B can clarify this one, but as far as I understand the concept, no. The principle being that the 6 extra CS hurt the Sox about as much as the 27 extra SB help them (depending on the specific situations).

― Dr Morbius (Dr Morbius), Wednesday, 29 June 2005 18:54 (twenty years ago)

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