Every huge artist has their "New Jersey" - a huge event album that ultimately feels a bit hollow & signals a career decline

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from the Lady Gaga ARTPOP thread:

i have a theory that every super popular artist has a "New Jersey" - like Bon Jovi's album New Jersey -- where it's still super popular and even more popular than the albums that preceded it but there's some sense that the gig is up.

― Elrond Hubbard (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, August 7, 2012 11:21 AM (41 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

^^^
that'd be a nice thread (if it doesn't already exist)!

― mr.raffles, Tuesday, August 7, 2012 11:24 AM (38 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

btw dudes i was like a kid when New Jersey came out...but even me as just a fan, i kinda *wanted* to like New Jersey as much, and there was some sense that it was a "big deal" and i should like it and i bought the cassette but i think we all could sense it just wasn't *as good*...i'm not sure what critics thought but i bet they did, i didn't read reviews or have access to them.

so i wasn't talking critically.

but anyway like as time goes by you'll find that people going to gaga show would be way more jazzed about like "bad romance" than "edge of glory"...

like I'm trying to think of another example....Graduation is Kanye's New Jersey.....that's another example....

― Elrond Hubbard (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, August 7, 2012 11:40 AM (22 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

You're black, white, beige, POLLa descent: Lady Gaga - Born This Way (poll)

― lex pretend, Tuesday, August 7, 2012 11:46 AM (16 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

and people get on me about MY poll titles!

(j/k, i am curious to see how this one turns out...)

― Doctor Casino, Tuesday, August 7, 2012 11:49 AM (12 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Graduation is Kanye's New Jersey.....that's another example....

I think it's a stronger case to say 808s was his New Jersey

― keeping things contextual (DJP), Tuesday, August 7, 2012 11:50 AM (11 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i think of a band's New Jersey as their bigger but hollower victory lap album so def Graduation not 808s

― da croupier, Tuesday, August 7, 2012 11:54 AM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

"bigger" meaning bombast not necessarily sales

― da croupier, Tuesday, August 7, 2012 11:55 AM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

NJ had five top tens including two #1's and except for "Bad Medicine" they've all vanished from the face of the earth

― a regina spektor is haunting europe (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, August 7, 2012 11:55 AM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

fuck that noise "I'll Be There For You" will always be there for me

― da croupier, Tuesday, August 7, 2012 11:56 AM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

"Born To Be My Baby" and "Lay Your Hands On Me" are definitely arena filler though

― da croupier, Tuesday, August 7, 2012 11:56 AM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

all i remember about "living in sin" is that the video seemed risque when i last saw it in elementary school

― da croupier, Tuesday, August 7, 2012 11:57 AM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

omg I had completely blocked "Living In Sin" from my memory

― keeping things contextual (DJP), Tuesday, August 7, 2012 11:57 AM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

parents got upset when "Living in Sin" showed two mulleted youths defying society and good fashion taste and I think MTV banned it from playing during daylight hours or something

― a regina spektor is haunting europe (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, August 7, 2012 11:57 AM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

seriously mad at all of you right now, gah

you are ruining my JAMC because all I can hear over "Catchfire" is the chorus to "Living In Sin"

― keeping things contextual (DJP), Tuesday, August 7, 2012 11:58 AM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

To be a New Jersey:
- follow-up to a huge, (possibly) defining record
- has less and/or smaller hits than prev album - or - hits based more on momentum than appeal
- brings with it the feeling that the NEXT record (if there is one) will see the bottom fall out (relatively speaking)

Sound about right?

I'll go ahead and nominate 'Here's to Future Days.'

― mr.raffles, Tuesday, August 7, 2012 12:00 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

then I nominate Huey Lewis and the News' Fore!.

― a regina spektor is haunting europe (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, August 7, 2012 12:01 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

^^ SO otm

― mr.raffles, Tuesday, August 7, 2012 12:01 PM (38 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Did Around the World in a Day feel that way in '85?

― Eric H., Tuesday, August 7, 2012 12:02 PM (28 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Elrond Hubbard (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:04 (ten years ago) link

Fore! is the fourth album by American rock band Huey Lewis and the News, released in 1986 (see 1986 in music). The album hit number one on the Billboard 200 album chart and contained five top-ten Billboard Hot 100 singles, including the number-one hits: "Stuck with You" and "Jacob's Ladder."

a regina spektor is haunting europe (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:04 (ten years ago) link

this is American Life in a nutshell

keeping things contextual (DJP), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:05 (ten years ago) link

or wait, is it Music? I think actually Music is the album that qualifies

I'm so bad at this

keeping things contextual (DJP), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:06 (ten years ago) link

ZZ TOP - Afterburner

mr.raffles, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:07 (ten years ago) link

are we conflating "victory lap" albums with Huge Event Albums That Ultimately Feel Shallow?

cuz Music feels like both!

a regina spektor is haunting europe (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:07 (ten years ago) link

Cher - Heart of Stone

mr.raffles, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:09 (ten years ago) link

how i phrased it in the other thread:

it's just an album that survived mostly on zeitgeist and professionalism that in hindsight served as a stopgap before a major drop or left turn

not everyone has one!

da croupier, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:10 (ten years ago) link

This would technically have to be an album that really DID mark the end of an artist's era, right? Like, we're talking artists that only ascended to the apex once and then fell almost just as fast? If so, Madonna probably doesn't exactly qualify.

Eric H., Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:10 (ten years ago) link

ZZ TOP - Afterburner

― mr.raffles, Tuesday, August 7, 2012 12:07 PM (49 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

^^bingo

Dan, for most people Madonna is an 80s artists or an early 90s artists at the very latest....she wasn't huge in pop culture by then, you could make a case for Erotica but i don't think she has a New Jersey.

Elrond Hubbard (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:10 (ten years ago) link

but either way madonna was no where near her zeitgiest or sales peak on ray of light, which is what i think dan is suggesting?

Elrond Hubbard (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:10 (ten years ago) link

R.E.M. - Monster

From Wikipedia:
Monster debuted #1 in the US and UK charts. "What's the Frequency, Kenneth?" and "Bang and Blame" were the band's last American Top 40 hits. Their following album New Adventures in Hi-Fi debuted at number two in the US and number one in the UK. The five million copies of the album sold were a reversal of the group's commercial fortunes of the previous five years.

Moka, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:11 (ten years ago) link

Mj's "bad"

Listen to this, dad (President Keyes), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:11 (ten years ago) link

Music doesn't count cuz "Don't Tell Me" is like one of her biggest late era hits and people love that album

da croupier, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:11 (ten years ago) link

Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness.

skip, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:11 (ten years ago) link

An element of buyer's remorse also factors in. The "I realized one album too late that he/she/they were never all that."

Eric H., Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:11 (ten years ago) link

it's funny....Watch the Throne ISN'T one of these because of where it fits in their careers, but man does it FEEL like one.

Elrond Hubbard (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:12 (ten years ago) link

Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness.

― skip, Tuesday, August 7, 2012 12:11 PM (34 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

^^great example

Elrond Hubbard (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:12 (ten years ago) link

xpost I mean, that's the pulse reading everyone's giving Born This Way now.

Eric H., Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:12 (ten years ago) link

Melon Collie has too many fans to count. Plus "1979"!

da croupier, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:13 (ten years ago) link

Smashing Pumpkins fans aren't saying "oh man I can't even remember those Melon Collie singles"

da croupier, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:13 (ten years ago) link

interesting though how some bands react to this: so I'd say Rattle & Hum is U2's New Jersey but their best albums came afterward; or am I f'ing this up?

Euler, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:14 (ten years ago) link

Monster is probably a much better mid 90s example of this though... Mellon Collie certainly has its "hollow" moments but "The End Is The Beginning Is The End" is probably the real beginning of the end for SP.

skip, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:15 (ten years ago) link

This would technically have to be an album that really DID mark the end of an artist's era, right? Like, we're talking artists that only ascended to the apex once and then fell almost just as fast? If so, Madonna probably doesn't exactly qualify.

well, the thing about being the end of Bon Jovi's era is that it was the end of the era where they got automatic radio play; they still sell out practically every venue they play and every album they've released since Slippery When Wet has hit the top ten, most often #1

so, I feel a lot of this is based on perception rather than actual performance; Ray of Light has sold more copies than Like A Prayer, for example

keeping things contextual (DJP), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:16 (ten years ago) link

I don't want to admit Monster counts cuz I love it but the sheer number of copies sold back probably defines "buyer's remorse"

Rattle & Hum probably counts in that it was definitely followed by a left turn and people today would be like "um, Angel In Harlem was a top 20 hit? Really?"

da croupier, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:16 (ten years ago) link

I get the sense artists don't recover from their New Jersey.

Eric H., Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:16 (ten years ago) link

Dancing on the Ceiling - Lionel Richie

mr.raffles, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:18 (ten years ago) link

xpost - Monster is, in many ways, the iconic Used CD.

on an indie rock level:

The Shins - Chutes too Narrow

interesting though how some bands react to this: so I'd say Rattle & Hum is U2's New Jersey but their best albums came afterward; or am I f'ing this up?

― Euler, Tuesday, August 7, 2012 12:14 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yeah but Rattle & Hum is a New Jersey...U2 just did the trick of pulling a Kid A after a New Jersey

Elrond Hubbard (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:18 (ten years ago) link

haha raffles is good at this

Elrond Hubbard (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:18 (ten years ago) link

Bon Jovi has certainly had a ton of hits and made a ton of cash since but it was definitely a game changer. Madonna doesn't quite work because basically she was Queen Shit and aging gracefully (with a mild mis-step around Erotica) and then made American Life.

da croupier, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:18 (ten years ago) link

Human touch/Lucky town

Listen to this, dad (President Keyes), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:19 (ten years ago) link

well, the thing about being the end of Bon Jovi's era is that it was the end of the era where they got automatic radio play; they still sell out practically every venue they play and every album they've released since Slippery When Wet has hit the top ten, most often #1

Maybe then it's less a signpost of "career decline" and more a mass discovery of career limits that didn't previously seem obvious/relevant.

Eric H., Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:19 (ten years ago) link

Mj's "bad"

I would say it's probably Dangerous, that was MJ's first CD-length album and clearly was meant to be the start of a new era, free from QJ, on to a different sound, etc. etc. And there were a ton of singles from it but compared to Off the Wall, Thriller, and Bad, only maybe one of them is still ubiquitous today (and that one is one of his most routinely mocked).

frogbs, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:19 (ten years ago) link

Even less-huge artists have this. e.g., Replacements and Don't Tell a Soul.

something of an astrological coup (tipsy mothra), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:20 (ten years ago) link

Genesis - I Can't Dance (in re: the career of Phil Collins)

da croupier, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:20 (ten years ago) link

Don Henley - The End of the Innocence

Elrond Hubbard (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:20 (ten years ago) link

that album still has a lot of respect for a Don Henley album - in Don's career I'd argue Eagles' Hell Freezes Over

da croupier, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:21 (ten years ago) link

Wait a sec, what about NIN - The Fragile

frogbs, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:21 (ten years ago) link

nice one frogbs

skip, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:22 (ten years ago) link

yeah but i don't think a New Jersey is necessarily terrible or even critical reviled, it can be good and popular etc but there's this inexpressible sense that the era of this artist is slipping away even as they are super popular at the moment.

Wait a sec, what about NIN - The Fragile

― frogbs, Tuesday, August 7, 2012 12:21 PM (58 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

^this would be a great pick but Trent lets too much time go in between albums, it was a different era when he reemerged, but if it were like a year or two after the downward spiral i'd be totally on board

Elrond Hubbard (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:23 (ten years ago) link

thing is, an album like End Of The Innocence or Melon Collie isn't loaded with the sense of somebody slipping away, it's just the last album they made before it happened.

da croupier, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:24 (ten years ago) link

and with the pumpkins it's more like Madonna where they had to go and push the envelope too far on the next album

da croupier, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:25 (ten years ago) link

Mellencamp "Lonesome Jubilee"

chr1sb3singer, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:25 (ten years ago) link

ultimately i am not the world's foremost don henley expert....so i will defer.

melon collie DID have some hits, and at least one (1979) that's beloved, but man even at the time that was a fucking SLOG

Elrond Hubbard (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:25 (ten years ago) link

I hate myself for writing this but... Wild Mood Swings

keeping things contextual (DJP), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:26 (ten years ago) link

INXS - Welcome to Wherever You Are

A True White Kid that can Jump (Granny Dainger), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:26 (ten years ago) link

Mellencamp "Lonesome Jubilee"

― chr1sb3singer, Tuesday, August 7, 2012 12:25 PM (28 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

^good one

Elrond Hubbard (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:26 (ten years ago) link

I hate myself for writing this but... Wild Mood Swings

― keeping things contextual (DJP), Tuesday, August 7, 2012 1:26 PM (10 seconds ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

wouldnt wish be a better examp

Author ~ Coach ~ Goddess (s1ocki), Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:26 (ten years ago) link

I wish Weezer's Make Believe had been one of these but they are just as popular as ever.

skip, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:26 (ten years ago) link

this would be a great pick but Trent lets too much time go in between albums, it was a different era when he reemerged, but if it were like a year or two after the downward spiral i'd be totally on board

I see what you mean, this is why I didn't really want to mention Human After All because the follow-up to Discovery would have been huge had it came out in 2003. But The Fragile still sold boatloads.

frogbs, Tuesday, 7 August 2012 17:27 (ten years ago) link

^ ^

Malevolent Arugula (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 19 August 2022 14:49 (one month ago) link

Actually, For Those About to Rock We Salute You does have a hollow feel about it. It marks an inflection point of not only diminishing commercial returns, but diminishing inspiration. Back in Black is the last of their albums that I would listen to from beginning to end, and what's more, BiB in turn is not nearly as consistent as Highway to Hell. (Admittedly, I do say that as a diehard Bon loyalist.)

Vast Halo, Friday, 19 August 2022 15:37 (one month ago) link

Back in Black gets points for being a strong showing after Bon's death, but I agree, Highway to Hell is a much stronger album. Bon was a much better songwriter than Brian Johnson.

immodesty blaise (jimbeaux), Friday, 19 August 2022 15:43 (one month ago) link

"For Those About to Rock", the song, with the cannons and all, has one of the hallmarks of the NJ - a self-consciously anthemic anthem, with the formula starting to show through so it starts to feel hollow, even if it seemed inspired while the band were devising it.

Jaqueline Kasabian Oasis (bendy), Friday, 19 August 2022 15:58 (one month ago) link

Also, the album is probably little more listened to now than, say, Blow Up Your Video, and sales wise (at least in the US) the bottom really fell out for Flick of the Switch.

you can see me from westbury white horse, Friday, 19 August 2022 17:17 (one month ago) link

"For Those About to Rock" (the song) is like the ultimate victory lap, cannons and all. Like "Start Me Up," it's the rare late career definitive statement of purpose.

Josh in Chicago, Friday, 19 August 2022 18:04 (one month ago) link

For Those About to Rock def seems like it has NJ credentials. See earlier discussion starting here: Every huge artist has their "New Jersey" - a huge event album that ultimately feels a bit hollow & signals a career decline

Doctor Casino, Friday, 19 August 2022 18:04 (one month ago) link

One of my big takeaways from the later points of the thread IIRC was that some in the US see Hello Nasty as an NJ. Major point of difference here because it was easily their biggest album and only the second hip hop album ever to top the charts (after the NJ-ish Wu-Tang Forever). In fact their choatic UK chart peaks for each album are:
7 (Licensed to Ill)
44 (Paul's Boutique)
106 (Check Your Head)
10 (Ill Communication)
1 (Hello Nasty)

you can see me from westbury white horse, Friday, 19 August 2022 18:49 (one month ago) link

i'm from the US and wouldn't consider HN a NJ

Weltanschauung Dunston (Neanderthal), Friday, 19 August 2022 19:34 (one month ago) link

it was easily their biggest album

Not even close. Yes, it went #1 in the US, but so did Licensed To Ill, and LTI has sold over 10 million copies; HN has "only" sold 3 million.

but also fuck you (unperson), Friday, 19 August 2022 21:49 (one month ago) link

I think Westbury is talking about the UK (where HN apparently sold 3x as many copies as LTI).

Panda bear, my gentle friend (morrisp), Friday, 19 August 2022 22:02 (one month ago) link

Shit, you only have to sell 300,000 albums to go platinum in the UK. Those are, like, Canada numbers.

but also fuck you (unperson), Friday, 19 August 2022 22:32 (one month ago) link

how many Myrrh did it go

Weltanschauung Dunston (Neanderthal), Friday, 19 August 2022 22:36 (one month ago) link

"IMO it's not exactly a Fairweather Johnson but that late 80s/early 90s thing of well-promoted, very prolonged but now rather eclipsed follow-ups to still well-loved mid-80s albums, cf. The Seeds of Love, The Sensual World, Us, The Rhythm of the Saints et al."

That put me in mind of Yes' Big Generator, which came out four years after 90125 but didn't sell nearly as well. I honestly have no idea how it was perceived at the time though.

I have the impression most of the people who bought 90125 were only vaguely aware that Yes had been releasing records for years, and from their point of view Generator was just one of many unpopular follow-ups to huge 80s hits. Just like On Every Street up the thread - I've always assumed that most of the people who bought Brothers in Arms were only vaguely aware that the band had released music before that.

I learn from Discogs.com that Generator was recorded at "Lark Recording Studios, Caramati, Italy; Sarm East & West Recording Studios, London; Air Recording Studio, London; Southcombe Recording Studio, Los Angeles; Westlake Audio, Los Angeles; Sunset Sound, Los Angeles" so it obviously wasn't cheap. I assume each bandmember used a different studio because they were sick of each other. It was one of those enormous and probably cocaine-fuelled productions from a time when record labels had a lot of spare money.

I remember that the next album, Union, had something like nine keyboard players on it, in addition to Rick Wakeman, whose contributions were mostly mixed out. Why did they hate each other? I've never read a bad word about Jon Anderson, although he's prone to flights of fancy, and Rick Wakeman can at least put on a matey act. Bill Bruford seemed to genuinely enjoy playing the drums. Were they scared Trevor Rabin was going to put them out of a job? Was Chris Squire really mean? Was it Trevor Horn, taking revenge for being kicked out - but the band fell apart before he got involved. I just don't know.

Ashley Pomeroy, Saturday, 20 August 2022 22:10 (one month ago) link

"Love Will Find a Way" earned a lot of MTV play.

Malevolent Arugula (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Saturday, 20 August 2022 22:21 (one month ago) link

Bruford has been critical of Jon Anderson's business practices in interviews, saying that he liked making big money deals with the record companies that had negative consequences when chart success wasn't forthcoming (to the effect of "Jon is now trapped on the music business treadmill"). He suggested that when they were recording Union that they all paid more attention to the catering than the music.
Admittedly, Bruford also said that his middle-class concept of money differed from Anderson's working-class approach.

Halfway there but for you, Saturday, 20 August 2022 22:35 (one month ago) link

Anderson reportedly dodgy as fuck
Squire reportedly irresponsible as fuck
Howe reportedly a miserable git
Bruford reportedly a pompous ass
Alan White reportedly a nice guy
Ditto Wakeman, but with added ego
Rabin I dunno but it sure beat his floundering solo career

ban golf courses (Matt #2), Saturday, 20 August 2022 22:43 (one month ago) link

In reply to GM’s Freeek being possibly the first Channel 4 video premiere;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8M-bxpuinMA

piscesx, Sunday, 21 August 2022 01:19 (one month ago) link

Ah I meant the specific Channel 4 strand, with its own listing in the TV guide and what not, but I'm not sure exactly when those started. The Tube went so far with premiering videos they sometimes went out of their way to help make them.

you can see me from westbury white horse, Sunday, 21 August 2022 01:30 (one month ago) link

I’m sure ‘Thriller’ and ‘Blue Jean’ had separate premieres on Channel 4, not as part of The Tube. It was nearly 40 years ago so my memory is hazy.

Dan Worsley, Sunday, 21 August 2022 07:49 (one month ago) link

YouTube uploads suggest those were both The Tube too.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXMBBvQBIvI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x8TvNWVRxc8

you can see me from westbury white horse, Sunday, 21 August 2022 14:25 (one month ago) link

Yes, but they were a special show dedicated to the premier of them and not just a strand within the regular show. See Tube Show Extra for Bowie on 28th September 1984.

Dan Worsley, Sunday, 21 August 2022 14:40 (one month ago) link

Fair enough :)

you can see me from westbury white horse, Sunday, 21 August 2022 14:41 (one month ago) link

I remember coming back from the pub early to watch it. Should have stayed out 🥺

Dan Worsley, Sunday, 21 August 2022 14:44 (one month ago) link

I didn’t know Check Your Head only got up to #106 in the UK.

Mr. Snrub, Sunday, 21 August 2022 16:14 (one month ago) link

insulted that spotify thinks I want to celebrate 25 years of be here now, has it actually been reappraised as something other than shite lately or is this just marketing?

Left, Sunday, 21 August 2022 17:36 (one month ago) link

twitter suggests there are real people who exist who do think it's a masterpiece. takes all sorts

Left, Sunday, 21 August 2022 17:38 (one month ago) link

one month passes...

Have never been too sold on this as a total NJ (that's as I don't know what it's like in the US) but can any NJ deluxe 'beat' this..
https://superdeluxeedition.com/news/guns-n-roses-use-your-illusion-box-sets/

you can see me from westbury white horse, Thursday, 22 September 2022 14:26 (one week ago) link

I read about that, and laffed / eyerolled at the fact that you still can’t just buy a basic package of the two CDs (maybe w/bonus tracks for each).

Obviously Five Beliebers (morrisp), Thursday, 22 September 2022 14:40 (one week ago) link

Nor can you just buy a basic package of all the good tracks from the two CDs without the filler.

peace, man, Thursday, 22 September 2022 15:21 (one week ago) link

Even better!

Obviously Five Beliebers (morrisp), Thursday, 22 September 2022 15:46 (one week ago) link

They actually made a single-disc Use Your Illusion album for distribution at Walmart back in the day, but it notably omits You Could Be Mine!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Use_Your_Illusion

peace, man, Thursday, 22 September 2022 16:02 (one week ago) link

Wow – it also omits "So Fine"!

Obviously Five Beliebers (morrisp), Thursday, 22 September 2022 16:15 (one week ago) link

We had a collective crack at compiling a single-disc of the best cuts many years back

come and help make "the greatest rock record of the 90's" out of Use Your Illusion 1 and 2

piscesx, Thursday, 22 September 2022 17:27 (one week ago) link

Cool, thx – I'll post my tracklist over dere (I'm actually revisiting both albums right now & culling a playlist...)

Obviously Five Beliebers (morrisp), Thursday, 22 September 2022 17:28 (one week ago) link

(no way I'll be able to keep it to a single-disc length, tho... the long tracks are essential!)

Obviously Five Beliebers (morrisp), Thursday, 22 September 2022 17:29 (one week ago) link

(Unrelated to anything except my eagle eyes: At some point AMG have lowered II to a 3 while I is still a 4.5, the similar reviews remain, it's Sparkle in the Rain/Once Upon a Time all over again)

you can see me from westbury white horse, Thursday, 22 September 2022 17:33 (one week ago) link

AMG be ripping off the fucking kids while they be paying their hard-earned money to read about the bands they want to know about

Obviously Five Beliebers (morrisp), Thursday, 22 September 2022 17:58 (one week ago) link

My dad has a story that the local's jukebox, when there still was one, used to play songs at random in the early 90s if no one was using it and once it played Get in the Ring as a coach of OAPs came in for dinner, who all promptly complained that they were being told to suck my [page missing] and suchlike. For this reason alone UYI cannot tick the NJ 'vacant retread of its predecessor' box.

you can see me from westbury white horse, Thursday, 22 September 2022 18:53 (one week ago) link

I didn't end up cutting out enough "filler" to make my playlist notable (I really only knocked out a 3 or 4 tracks per album).

The bridge section of "Estranged," flowing into the next verse ("When I find out all the reasons..."), is so damn beautiful... it's such an wonderful piece of music.

"Cool ranch dressing!" (morrisp), Thursday, 22 September 2022 18:56 (one week ago) link

The live version of “you could be mine” that’s just been released on Spotify is such a mess. I wonder why they even released it!

AlXTC from Paris, Thursday, 22 September 2022 19:25 (one week ago) link

Gawd, these bonus tracks!

5. DRUM SOLO (Live in Paris – 6/6/92)*
6. SLASH SOLO (Live in Paris – 6/6/92)*
7. SPEAK SOFTLY, LOVE (LOVE THEME FROM THE GODFATHER) (Live in Paris – 6/6/92)*

"Cool ranch dressing!" (morrisp), Friday, 23 September 2022 02:23 (six days ago) link

i saw the UYI tour and still feel ripped off that Matt Sorum played an endlessly terrible drum solo when they could’ve played Night-Train instead

meat and two vdgg (emsworth), Friday, 23 September 2022 03:28 (six days ago) link

A while back when I was making the case for Run-DMC's Tougher Than Leather as a Veteran's Committee-level inductee into NJ status, I totally omitted one of its other links to the titlular New Jersey: Their bizarre inclusion of screaming comedian Sam Kinison!

Bon Jovi has him introduce their video for "Bad Medicine", while Run-DMC samples the conclusion of one of Sam's (multitude of) dial-the-homophobia-all-the-way-to-11 jokes in their otherwise great track "Beats to the Rhyme". I'm guessing he shouted his way into other artists' songs/videos, but I don't remember any of them, outside of an appearance with Poison during MTV's New Years Eve show in '88 (where C.C. DeVille had "SON OF SAM" written on his guitar, how hilarious).

Front-loaded albums are musical gerrymandering (Prefecture), Friday, 23 September 2022 17:26 (six days ago) link

Kylie Minogue sampled Kinison too

SincereLee 'Scratch' Perry (President Keyes), Friday, 23 September 2022 17:40 (six days ago) link

Were Guns N' Roses even any good live, back in their heyday? I never saw them, but I feel like they transitioned really fast from scary aggro hard rock to bloated showbiz monstrosity.

but also fuck you (unperson), Friday, 23 September 2022 17:54 (six days ago) link

I have fond memories - G&R were very enmeshed in my high school years, and I think I was consciously enjoying it as our version of an overblown 70s rock experience- Dazed and Confused had just come out maybe? Anyway 80,000 kids making a rock pilgrimage to a Western Sydney racecourse seemed pretty epic.

Musically yeah there were too many dumb solos, self-indulgent ballads, covers and “quotations” (eg Wild Horses, the Godfather theme). Matt Sorum seemed to get off on inflicting his terrible drumming on the audience. Axl had about 5 costume changes. But he was still a great frontman and the Appetite songs and the better Illusion songs still sounded awesome.

meat and two vdgg (emsworth), Friday, 23 September 2022 20:15 (six days ago) link

But judging by that 1988 Ritz footage, the OG lineup was pretty great live.

meat and two vdgg (emsworth), Friday, 23 September 2022 20:19 (six days ago) link

I saw the original lineup twice. Once opening for Cheap Trick in 1986 at the grubby Fenders in Long Beach and again at the infamous trainwreck/clusterfuck show opening for the Rolling Stones.

Honestly, at the time I didn't think that much of them. There were a few moments that were thrilling, but like another band I was into that year (The Replacements) I couldn't deal with their whole "we know we're a great band, but we're intentionally going to fuck up and self-sabotage anyway." This was the same year of Master Of Puppets and Reign In Blood and these junkies can't even get an Aerosmith cover right?

Elvis Telecom, Saturday, 24 September 2022 19:39 (five days ago) link

too many dumb solos, self-indulgent ballads, covers and “quotations”

I remember seeing them on TV, and Slash playing the "Voodoo Chile" riff at about 75% speed over and over, and thinking, "this wouldn't even impress anybody at a guitar store, and you're playing it in front of thousands?

Halfway there but for you, Monday, 26 September 2022 17:20 (three days ago) link


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