Paul Simon

We don't seem to have a general Paul Simon thread on ILM; we have threads on Hearts and Bones, and on Graceland, and polls polls polls but how about a general thread of Simon talk in addition.

I'm listening through his oeuvre today, and just listened to Live Rhymin', from 1974. I wanted to remark on the version of "America" that ends the album. Someone in the audience yells something like "say a few words!" Simon replies "Say a few words? Well, let's hope that we're...let's hope that we continue to live." He then plays a slow, quiet, and sad "America"; it's missing half its life, resigned, but resignation was in the air in 1974. It's a remarkable performance.

I grew up with Negotiations and Love Songs on cassette

I think he's classic as a songwriter
when his prose doesn't get too purple & ponderous

a lot of his recordings sound dated because of the production though

I'm with you on his lyrics; I listened through the whole Simon & Garfunkel oeuvre earlier today, and I cringe at some of his lyrics, especially on PSR&T. But from Bookends on I think he came to understand his own voice better. In short: he was wise to avoid trying to write like Dylan, because most songwriters end up sounding silly when they do that (cf. early Springsteen).

dunno how dated his records sound, or if they're dated it's not to their detriment -- I mean, sure, something like "Still Crazy" is pretty quintessentially 70s, but in the same way that say, Steely Dan is quintessentially 70s. Production on the whole is pretty sparkling and gorgeous to these ears.

btw Paul Simon was my first genuine rock concert. The 1990 (or 1989?) "Born At The Right Time" tour. I was 11 ... It was excellent.

halfway through One-Trick Pony now (my first listen to it!) and the production on all the records through 1980 sound fine. My brother, though, refuses to give Graceland a chance on account of its "dated" production, by which he means gated drums, mostly. While I think he's nuts for dismissing Graceland, I do see how gated drums sound of their time.

I really must buy me some Paul Simon. I own none of his records, but I know them reasonably well from my parents' record collection when I was younger. I mean this 5-disc Simon and Garfunkel set costs next to nothing.

The 1990 (or 1989?) "Born At The Right Time" tour. I was 11 ... It was excellent.

One of my first shows. I've told the story in one of the other Simon threads: it's still the only concert during which the performer played a Big Hit Single ('You Can Call Me Al'), then said, "Woo! That was great! Let's do it again!" and proceeded to play it again.

Is the song "The Dangling Conversation" meant to be ironic at all ?

I suspect not. His pre-Bookends lyrics leaned way into the "depressed teenager in a turtleneck" territory.

One of my first shows. I've told the story in one of the other Simon threads: it's still the only concert during which the performer played a Big Hit Single ('You Can Call Me Al'), then said, "Woo! That was great! Let's do it again!" and proceeded to play it again.

Man, that kinda bums me out. I saw Simon on the Graceland tour - I think that puts it around 87 or 88. I was twelve - it was my second concert (1st was Jimmy Buffett). Anyway, he did the exact same thing when I saw him. The crowd went so nuts after he played "You Can Call Me Al" that he (I thought) spontaneously said "We can do it again!", to which the crowd went nuts again. Makes me a little sad to know that was a rehearsed thing on his part.

On the other hand, there's something kind of wonderful about him being so premeditated about his set list. "...okay, and then at this point we play 'You Can Call Me Al' two times in a row..."

I mentioned it on the Unplugged thread, but the extra tracks on the 2005 (2004?) reissues are worth buying as individual songs. Hearts and Bones has a terrific acoustic-guitar-and-voice demo for "Train in the Distance."

I'm a stan, and bought Surprise for a few bucks at a Half Price Books -- so disappointing. Maybe there are better demos for those songs that will be released later.

I think it's much too twee & teen angsty, then

xxp

& I am wearing a turtleneck fwiw !

"Surprise" sucked imo, Eno's ambient shit added nothing to half baked song sketches

Another case for Paul Simon with just voice and guitar:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dd8ePfu7_pg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1dlWmrRstc&feature=player_embedded

i think i've discussed this elsewhere, but his 1st "real" solo album (the one from 1972) is one of the great albums of its period.

and although i like much of the rest of his work (w/ and w/o garfunkel) it sort of towers above everything else.

his crappy lyrics pretty much go away after he broke w/ garfunkel. or at least the stratospherically crappy ones, anyway.

personally speaking, simon comes across like a bit of a dick, I think

If "dick" means "self-aware," sure. I can't accuse him of gratuitous cruelty to his lovers.

his 1st "real" solo album (the one from 1972) is one of the great albums of its period

I've been listening to this a lot recently. "Duncan" is a killer song.

Interesting to contrast "Duncan" with its demo version. "My wife and me took a home by the sea..."

Love this album. Sometimes I think Paul Simon's stuff from the S/T through "Graceland" (or sometimes if I'm feeling generous "Saints") is the best stuff ever. Once about every 5 years or so I go on a bender with it.

Then I get to feeling like an overstuffed couch and have to listen to some Misfits.

x-post Yep, Simon played the song twice at every stop. But who would complain, really? I last time I saw Joe Strummer, toward the end of the night, after he had already played "London Calling" and "White Man ...," he asked the crowd which of them they wanted to hear again. People voted "London Calling," and he played it again. Man of the people, that Strummer.

Funny this thread kicked in now, since I just took out my S&G albums to give them a listen for the first time. Them and Simon's solo albums are interesting to me, since scanning the back I know two or three songs per disc like the back of my hand, but few of the others - yet I know the song titles! Like "Dangling Conversation." I have no idea what that song sounds like, but I at least recognize the name. Weird.

I listened to One-Trick Pony last night for the first time, as I mentioned, and it was kind of a snoozer (granted, it was the 12th S&G/Simon record I played yesterday, haha). Any suggestions on what I should listen for next time?

Interesting to contrast "Duncan" with its demo version.

yeah, he tells a completely different story! weird, huh?

the s/t lp has some great singles and s&g-style BIG songs like duncan, mother&child reunion, me&julio, but i think the highlights are armistice day, peace like a river, and papa hobo. armistice day might be my favorite simon song, period.

my favorite Simon track just might be "Diamonds On the Soles of Her Shoes" from some deluxe version of Graceland, I think. It's totally stripped down, the only things on the track are Simon's vocals, Ladysmith Black Mambazo & bass

I meant to say "Diamonds On the Soles of Her Goes (Unreleased Version)"

Any suggestions on what I should listen for next time?

well "late in the evening" is so much better than the rest of the record that it doesn't need pointing out. but i like the title track too, and "long, long day." don't actually remember a lot else off the top of my head. i've never seen the movie, sort of curious about it.

I think She's The One is kinda underrated ... Maybe closest in tone/style to Hearts and Bones. Not Simon at his catchiest, maybe, but some good tunes/lyrics.

hmm, didn't he just do a bunch of reissues? http://artsbeat.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/11/12/here-comes-rhymin-simon-on-a-different-label/?src=twt&twt=artsbeat

The current reissues sound amazing. I doubt there's much they could do to improve them, nor is there probably much in the vaults of note that didn't make the current batch.

This is like the Stones reissuing/remastering on a different label every few years.

i should get those reissues probably. all of my 70s-80s simon is on vinyl. bonus trax are good?

most of the bonus material I could take or leave, with the glaring exception of the alternate version of "Gone At Last" with the Jessy Dixon Singers from Still Crazy.

They run from really good to never going to play that again. But the sound on all the albums is pristine. He had the best of the best backing bands and they sound like the best - warm, clean 70s studio sound. I only have the three 70s records (I never warmed to the 80s work outside of a track here and there), but I understand the remasters are equally great if you care for the material.

xpost

I love the "Duncan" and "Take me to the Mardi Gras" demos.

This is like the Stones reissuing/remastering on a different label every few years

dunno what this means. abkco series came out 20+ years after the original cd releases. the reamaining ones came out about a year ago. it's not like Elvis Costello who's had about 4 This Years Models since 1987

xxxxpost

^^^Bowie is the other one who does this

and Zappa - all three of those guys got the "Rykodisc treatment", too, coincidentally

Stones issued Sticky Fingers on cd in 90, 94 & 09. Costello issued This Year's Model in 86, 93, 02 & 07. One more time - what a huge difference! Point is, these artists that control their catalog have huge incentive to switch labels and reissue stuff whenever they can.

Hell, I've bought the Soft Boys' Underwater Moonlight four times on cd. I'm an enabler.

i was actually thinking of the Stones' early ones, which only came out once before they were done perfectly in 2001 or whatever it was. had to take exception 'cuz there's a night and day difference between the two issues.
sorry for derailing on Paul Simon's watch

I wasn't clear to start - those abkco remaster are great. The Stones don't own those though so can't milk 'em.

A really talented guy who since the mid 80s has done the mistake of letting other people control a bit too much of his sound and songwriting style. "Hearts And Bones" is fantastic, and seems to be his peak. "Surprise" was an aptly titled Eno collaboration though, just need to relax the rhythm section even a good bit and find back to his good, old pre-"Graceland" style.

New album streaming on NPR. Sounds pretty good, glad to hear him dabbling in Afropop again, the rhythms overall are stronger than anything he's done in a long time (and I think rhythm is really key to his best songwriting).

He's touring the US and doing mid-sized halls and some club gigs (930 club and others).

this sounds good!

"dazzling blue" kinda dazzling!

Haven't kept up with his new output since Rhythm of the Saints (other than hearing the ghastly Capeman). This is nice, in a pleasantly unassuming sort of way. Nothing jumped out me after one listen but it was solid throughout.

you're the one is worth hearing.... surprise has its moments, but some of those moments are not so hot.

either way I am impressed/delighted that my drunken Xmas morning throwaway surface-level response to the song brooked this

that said, I think we could both be onto something. I said 'deliberately' bad or self(-image)-sabotaging, you provided the contextual sauce. Idea; legwork and ingenuity, lol

Great stuff, thanks!

> my drunken Xmas morning throwaway

In this case, I must confess great minds drink alike. Merry Mimosas are to blame

Maybe I’m late to this lore, but that ^^ 5-hour Simon documentary has a section on recording The Boxer and how the crash at the chorus was made with a snare drum played next to an open elevator shaft.

Yeah, Hal Blaine loves to tell the story about how a security guard was startled when they did that, I think.

mig, that analysis makes me think of Simon's "Have a Good Time", where the singer's cynicism about unearned optimism is more obviously extended to the society around him.
I thought "Mama" in the "Kodachrome" chorus was an actual (if vaguely sketched) mother figure; he does say in the coda that taking away his Kodachrome would "leave your boy so far from home", seems more a child's plaint than a boyfriend's.

Has anyone sprung for “Miracle and Wonder” yet? I listened to the excerpt on Broken Record, and I felt like it was long on Gladwell and kind of disjointed, but maybe it was less of an excerpt and more of a trailer?

Since it’s “only” 5 hours long (most of the audiobooks I buy are 20+ hours, cuz I’m cheap), I’m a bit leery to spend $15 on it if it’s going to be more of the same.

I did spring for it, am about 3.5 hours into it, and loving it. Lots of Simon playing songs on an acoustic guitar and walking through choices in the music and lyrics. There's a Gladwell essay within it that creates an overall theory about Simon's songwriting (related to his being from Queens), but there's definitely enough Simon overall that Gladwell doesn't overshadow it.

That said, the except on Broken Record isn't so different from what follows.

Thanks, Eazy. I did enjoy the excerpt, a little more than I had characterized it. I’ll just chew up a credit on it, ffs, Simon’s songs have been part of my life since birth & a huge influence besides, & I dunno why I was being so flinty about it.

I had the same feeling at first, as someone who has enjoyed so many Broken Record interviews for free. This one is carefully edited and put together in a way that feels more like a five-hour documentary that happens to be audio-only, rather than just podcast interviews.

Finished this and would definitely recommend it. They spend as much time (or more) on Rhythm of the Saints as Graceland.

Only downside is having the "climax" of the documentary being Simon getting somewhat personal, when he clearly hates doing that in public outside of his songs. It reminded me of the Bill Cunningham documentary culminating in exposing this very private person, rather than letting him speak through his work and public life.

If this had been made earlier, it unquestionably would have been a holiday-ready coffee-table book Conversations with Paul Simon, and maybe it still will be.

As is, it's a really satisfying listen to dive into as we all hunker down for a bit.

What so many hats on his album covers

One man’s ceiling is a taller man’s floor

Rhiannon Giddens, accompanied by PS on acoustic gtr., did a great "American Tune" on that recent Simon tribute TV special (the only performance I saw).

Also like Willie Nelson's studio versions of that and "Graceland."

and Elvis's "Bridge Over Troubled Water," at Madison Square Garden ca. '71. When he gets to bridge of the song, especially.

was listening to this yesterday
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stranger_to_Stranger

The weird instruments are neat but they often just sound like either a synth or a crappy guitar - still it's interesting

Hmmm:

Paul Simon has announced the release of his highly anticipated musical work, Seven Psalms. Intended to be listened to as one continuous piece, the 33-minute, seven-movement composition transcends the concept of the “album” and will be released in its entirety on vinyl, CD and across digital platforms on May 19.

Glad he's not 100% retired yet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZiDc4DbFQZY

Hidden track:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=51Fn2r-8hHI

Preview of the new album, free NY Times article

“Seven Psalms” sounds like a last testament from the 81-year-old Paul Simon. It’s an album akin to David Bowie’s “Blackstar” and Leonard Cohen’s “You Want It Darker,” which those songwriters made as mortality loomed; they each died days after the albums were released.

…that’s quite the premonition.

Dang.

what the fuck!!!

Paul Simon won't die, he'll just be homeward bound

i don't think i could write that graf without following it up immediately with one about how he's not sick / dying, he still feels fine, he's healthy / productive, etc. (assuming those things are true.)

I'm reluctant to be one of those ghouls who speculate about strangers' health, but his facial appearance and slight hand tremor in the trailer suggest he is dealing with Parkinson's. He may be farewelling his performing days, rather than life. Seems like a beautiful record.

When he released Person to Person a few years back, he talked about having no new material and potentially wrapping things up, so it's been extra special that he made In The Blue Light (dense rearrangements of some of his neglected songs) and now this. Definitely agree the paragraph sounds ghoulish unless Pareles has inside info.

Of course we all remember the exactly 0 contemporary reviews of You Want It Darker or Blackstar which labelled them as premonitions of death (think there were one or two of The Next Day which may have hinted at this though)

I thought there were such reviews of Blackstar, but I’m notoriously revisionist in my recollections.

Can anyone recommend a good write up on Simon's lyrics and/or lyrical approach? I was listening to Negotiations & Love Songs and admiring what I perceived to be significant lyrical growth from the self-titled thru the late 80s.

Separately, I never listen to One-Trick Pony but "Late in the Evening" is such a monster track for him that really stands out in the context of that comp.

The Hilburn bio was, I thought, terrific about his lyric writing. He dedicates parts of chapters to how Simon (who participates) pared the lyrics to "Graceland" and "The Cool Cool River."

Is the Gladwell audiobook any good? I like the idea of the format but not sure I can cope with extended Gladwell-ese.

I don't relish repeating myself too much, but here I am again saying that the bonus "work in progress" tracks from Saints reflect a type of magic.

"My horse and my saddle and my gracious companions, we tripped over a mountain and we fell into a vast canyon."

That is a lyric that the dude THREW AWAY. He wrote stuff that nobody else could, and was just like, "Nah. Not good enough. I'll do something else instead."

It is a great blessing that we even have access to his discarded ideas. Imagine what life would be like if we could know about the stuff that Mozart or Bach considered and rejected.

In the last few months many of us watched the frickin Beatles consider, then reject, various musical and lyrical ideas. That was a certain type of run but not nearly as sublime in my view.

How about the bio by Peter Ames Carlin, Homeward Bound?

my travelling companions are ghosts and empty sockets, I’m looking at ghosts and empties
and I’ve reason to believe we all will be received at Graceland

Ordered the Hilburn bio - thanks, Alfred. I do think the Gladwell audiobook is probably worth it in spite of Gladwell, and I should buy that. I listened to the first (free) one a year ago and enjoyed it. Will probably spring for that, too.

Ok I will say one more thing about the lyric writing of Simon is how honest he is about being embarrassed by his early output.

Ask him about "Call Me All" and he gives you a decently intelligent answer. Ask him about "For Emily" ("clothed in crinoline," etc.) And he is like "ouch, too early."

His assessment of his own work is refreshingly direct.

His lyrics on the new one are especially spare & elegant. On first listen, they remind me of Quebec folkie Myriam Gendron's album of Dorothy Parker poems.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VzfSWMzUA0

Is the Gladwell audiobook any good?

I loved it. Simon is up there with De Niro as far as giving evasive, shut-down interviews, and this one feels like him “opening up” just this once definitively for the record. He also has a guitar handy during the interviews, so there’s a lot of him demonstrating moments musically/lyrically by talking through the songs themselves.

I wonder if it's the same bit included in the 2013 reissue where he discusses the origins of "Graceland" and plays a couple of his guitar runs.

Separately, I never listen to One-Trick Pony but "Late in the Evening" is such a monster track for him that really stands out in the context of that comp.

― Indexed, Friday, May 19, 2023 9:51 AM (three hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

great album. 'nobody' 'oh marion' too

xp aw I love For Emily, and find it charming

xps I've never been a huge Simon & Garfunkel fan for that reason, though I guess it's remarkable how much he grew as a lyricist, steadily improving right into his solo career. The only S&G records I really want to listen to are the last two LP's, Bookends and Bridge, and even they have moments that I'm not too crazy about, where they get too precious or lean in too hard into self-pity, etc.

I was listening to Negotiations & Love Songs and admiring what I perceived to be significant lyrical growth from the self-titled thru the late 80s.

Separately, I never listen to One-Trick Pony but "Late in the Evening" is such a monster track for him that really stands out in the context of that comp.

FWIW, what's pretty remarkable about his solo output through One-Trick Pony and maybe even Hearts and Bones is that if you mix together the highlights, they all sound apiece, like they could be from the same incredible album. Individually they all clearly have their own identity, but until he did Graceland there's a strong stylistic unity to much of his solo work.

Listened to Seven Psalms and it played as fairly stuffy and serious. Maybe suitable for a career coda, but not how I'd like to think of Simon after he's gone (hopefully never).

The audiobook is on Slsk if that's your thing.

I am very much in awe of Seven Psalms. While it's essentially a lengthy poem over relatively sparse acoustic music, I still find it very lush with beautiful guitar playing and clever, intriguing lyrics.

Listened to Seven Psalms and it played as fairly stuffy and serious.

It's a half hour musing on pretty serious stuff, but there are also funny moments and relativation. For example: "Good morning, Mr Indignation / Looks like you haven't slept all night / In my professional opinion / Go back to bed and turn off your light".
I also really love this bit: "The Lord is my engineer / The Lord is my record producer / The Lord is the music I hear / Deep in the valley of elusive"

I'm reluctant to be one of those ghouls who speculate about strangers' health, but his facial appearance and slight hand tremor in the trailer suggest he is dealing with Parkinson's.

That would be terrible, I hope you're wrong there and I hope Paul's still got some time to go. Interesting to note here that the final 'Psalm' includes the following bit:
"Wait / I'm not ready / I'm just packing my gear / Wait / My hand's steady / My mind is still clear"

"in my professional opinion" is such a Paul Simon lyric... I haven't listened to this yet but I can hear him singing it...

xp you're right, though I was referring to the music itself, which I'm still having a hard time finding a way in to