What's up with hating on the Doors?

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I mean, damn, I picked up nearly all their albums in HMV sale a coupla years ago in those neat mini 12" replica CD sleeves, and I was dead thrilled and all that, but when I got them home, the utter mediocrity of their back catalog became glaringly apparent. Plus, isn't jimbo a bit bloody pathetic really? I mean, his lyrics were actually pretty poor for the most part, and in the cold glare of ACTUALLY LISTENING TO THE REKKIDS, he was a bit MOR, apart from the cock waving and alcoholism etc. You shd listen to Spirit or Love FFS!!

Pashmina (Pashmina), Saturday, 12 June 2004 17:36 (nineteen years ago) link

they were just a shitty lounge band pretending to be serious and rock.

jack cole (jackcole), Saturday, 12 June 2004 17:58 (nineteen years ago) link

not much new to add: once you get past all the lizard king shite they're a good band with a k3wl sounding shitty old organ.

fcussen (Burger), Saturday, 12 June 2004 20:15 (nineteen years ago) link

Riders on the Storm, I decided, was their one and only good song.

David Allen (David Allen), Saturday, 12 June 2004 20:55 (nineteen years ago) link

Riders on the Storm, I decided, was their one and only good song.

Don't worry, you'll grow out of that soon.

Vic Funk, Saturday, 12 June 2004 21:37 (nineteen years ago) link

In that I'll realize that even that one isnt good? Or that I'll think the other ones are good for some reason?

David Allen (David Allen), Saturday, 12 June 2004 22:13 (nineteen years ago) link

you got it right the first time.

jack cole (jackcole), Saturday, 12 June 2004 23:04 (nineteen years ago) link

door hata's=radiohead fanatics maybe?

as a recovering "Door-o-phile", the only things one can say about them in defense is that for a while, they were by themselves. no one quite sounded like that (or since, thankfully) or took thier own press as seriously. beatles perhaps, but, i roundly dismiss the beatles, being that SOMEONE would've done exactly what they did, had they not.probably the stones, but, even they would've done it better.

i guess you have to look at where music was at the time, ie-1967. i still think the first 2 doors albums are total classics! a few mis-steps, but, still very listenable and recorded within 6 months. only CCR can step like that. cream, almost.

musically, the doors were solid, but, didn't liquify into murky jams too often. there's a zeal to it all, too. a youthfully naive sound, like someone who has yet to fail. which they managed to do soon after.
lyrically, i now cringe, but as a fella coming from metal into what i considered dismissable music (classic rawk) i was taken back by the lyrics. i can't say morrison was a god, or even that great lyrically, but he did (as was stated) hit some damn fine points in there. even if they're few and far between, they ARE worth it.

i guess the arguments against them far outweigh the fors'. because time and history have shown us the truth about the people involved and the mythology that still surrounds them, it IS harder to enjoy them as i get older. i still go back, but, it doesn't hold the mystery it once did. i'll be the first to admit, lsd did help, but ultimately i find i go back to the 1st+last albums the most.

the quicklist ranks=
1- s/t or la woman
2- strange days
3- morrison hotel
4- waiting for the sun
5- soft parade

runner up to albums is the live double disc, which has THE best version of "who do you love" evah!!!

eedd, Sunday, 13 June 2004 14:19 (nineteen years ago) link

more importantly, what's up with the phrase "hating on something"... surely it is grammatically incorrect? you hate something, you don't hate on something.

gem (trisk), Sunday, 13 June 2004 14:23 (nineteen years ago) link

Gem, language is fluid, not static. The phrase "hate on" is a recent development, but a very useful one. Try it out for a few weeks just in your daily internal monologue and I think you'll find it has a subtlety to it that "hate" all by itself lacks. I can "hate on" small thing that I don't actually-permanently-dismissively hate: to "hate on," it seems to me, is to express displeasure without claiming any permanence for the feeling. I might hate on an apple pie you brought me just now if I were not in the mood for apple pie. It would be rash & untrue to say that I hate apple pie, though. I like it fine. I just don't want one right now, hence why I hated on your apple pie. Sorry about that brah.

J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Sunday, 13 June 2004 14:49 (nineteen years ago) link

one month passes...
Who sing the song "dont rock the juke box" is it The doors?

peyton, Thursday, 22 July 2004 20:01 (nineteen years ago) link

No, apparently it's Alan Jackson.

Stewart Osborne (Stewart Osborne), Friday, 23 July 2004 07:33 (nineteen years ago) link

For f-cks sake get your book finshed Mark S! More threds like this please.

Dr .C, Friday, 23 July 2004 08:03 (nineteen years ago) link

seven months pass...
Darnielle's arguments aside, 'hating on' is somewhat embarassing, I think, precisely because of that air of lazy frat lingo. I'm kinda bummed I used it. But I heard "Back Door Man" the other day on a jukebox, which made me think back to this thread. It was fun re-reading.

Dare, Thursday, 17 March 2005 05:15 (nineteen years ago) link

'hating on' comes from black american slang, and it's more or less as John described but also implies the tint of jealousy(or sour grapes, more accurately, as it pertains to something inanimate like apple pie and yes it's meant to be slightly absurd turn of phrase in that case). It's wrapped up etymologically with "playa-hating" if that helps.

tremendoid (tremendoid), Thursday, 17 March 2005 05:35 (nineteen years ago) link

Haha that Darnielle post is fantastic.

deej., Thursday, 17 March 2005 05:42 (nineteen years ago) link

one year passes...

John Harris still hatin' on the Doors in the Guardian:

http://arts.guardian.co.uk/filmandmusic/story/0,,1949235,00.html

Soukesian (Soukesian), Sunday, 19 November 2006 19:04 (seventeen years ago) link

This thread is great for its tangential arguments on Echo and the Cure, and Darnielle's defense of "Hatin' On".

I gave The Doors a big chance in high school, when a few of my close friends were really into them. Unfortunately, someone recommended that I buy American Prayer first. That really put the focus on Morrison's retodded poetry, and then said friends kept raving about the whole Lizard King thing, and then I just stopped trying with The Doors. Also, I can't stand Ray Manzarak's style.

Zachary Scott (Zach S), Sunday, 19 November 2006 20:10 (seventeen years ago) link

LOTS of new Doors live stuff on their Bright Midnight label available now on iTunes.

Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Sunday, 19 November 2006 20:28 (seventeen years ago) link

And there is another point. No matter how spoiled, vengeful or self-indulgent any supposedly titanic talent may be, the true geniuses - Lennon, Dylan, Tom from Kasabian - always exhibit some thread of empathetic humanity

pscott (elwisty), Sunday, 19 November 2006 20:30 (seventeen years ago) link

hahahahaha

M@tt He1geson: Sassy and I Don't Care Who Knows It (Matt Helgeson), Sunday, 19 November 2006 20:32 (seventeen years ago) link

ACTUALLY LISTENING TO THE REKKIDS, he was a bit MOR

Norman's pretty much otm here, but his lounge crooner schtick is why I like them.

Billy Dods (Billy Dods), Sunday, 19 November 2006 20:50 (seventeen years ago) link

The thing that struck me about the Harris article is that he seems to think he's being iconoclastic: actually, I reckon the Doors' stock with critics and writers really couldn't sink any lower right now. Spewing bile on them is about as controversial as raving about 'Pet Sounds'.

Soukesian (Soukesian), Sunday, 19 November 2006 23:27 (seventeen years ago) link

Simon Reynolds give the new box set five stars in Blender.

Mark (MarkR), Sunday, 19 November 2006 23:59 (seventeen years ago) link

yeah but he has always been a massive Doors fan (to his credit.)

Stormy Davis (diamond), Monday, 20 November 2006 03:36 (seventeen years ago) link

i like "Waiting For The Sun" and "People Are Strange". Their songs aren't that bad FFs.

wogan lenin (dog latin), Monday, 20 November 2006 13:08 (seventeen years ago) link

Some of their songs are reasonable. It's Jim bloody Morrison who's the main problem.

Marcello Carlin (nostudium), Monday, 20 November 2006 13:14 (seventeen years ago) link

Yeah, they'd be a good band if not for Jim Morrison's awful lyrics and those organ solos that go on for half a day.

chap who would dare to welcome our new stingray masters (chap), Monday, 20 November 2006 13:16 (seventeen years ago) link

Exactly. They'd be almost as good as the Seeds!

Marcello Carlin (nostudium), Monday, 20 November 2006 13:18 (seventeen years ago) link

I've had "C'mon c'mon c'mon now TOUCH me babe" in my head for what must be two weeks now. It's insidious!

Euai Kapaui (tracerhand), Monday, 20 November 2006 13:37 (seventeen years ago) link

"Touch Me" is a good song too. They're always remembered fro really annoying dirges like "Light My Fire" and "This Is The End".

wogan lenin (dog latin), Monday, 20 November 2006 13:39 (seventeen years ago) link

http://adorocinema.cidadeinternet.com.br/personalidades/atores/michael-caine/michael-caine01.jpg

I thought I told you to turn the bloody Doors off.

wogan lenin (dog latin), Monday, 20 November 2006 13:40 (seventeen years ago) link

the production is really key for me. those records sound so amazing.

scott seward (scott seward), Monday, 20 November 2006 13:43 (seventeen years ago) link

why am i even defending the Doors? The only thing I own is a taped copy of LA Woman which I have listened to once and made me fall asleep.

wogan lenin (dog latin), Monday, 20 November 2006 13:46 (seventeen years ago) link

i think i did all my doors defending on another thread. some vu-vs-doors thread or something.

scott seward (scott seward), Monday, 20 November 2006 13:50 (seventeen years ago) link

lounge crooner schtick

yes, i think i neither like nor dislike the doors, but i kind of like this element

john harris' pieces are all kind of the same. "that zappa eh, he was a bit rubbish", um, you're going to make a whole article out of that? ok, if you like

as said above, the doors are an odd target in their stock isnt exactly high these days

Exactly. They'd be almost as good as the Seeds!

weirdly, the seeds stock isnt that high either, and they're like the best band in the world!

-- (688), Monday, 20 November 2006 13:57 (seventeen years ago) link

its just kind of weird and pointless. much like harris' other articles about how someone at school he didnt like was an eagles fan or something

-- (688), Monday, 20 November 2006 13:59 (seventeen years ago) link

Maybe he ought to start writing about gardening or something instead; he's clearly fed up writing about music.

Marcello Carlin (nostudium), Monday, 20 November 2006 14:47 (seventeen years ago) link

i always think the dumbest slam is when people say the dude wasn't a great poet. who is? auden has been dead a long time. and in that article the dude says, never mind the music look at this terrible pome!!! i don't read lizardhead's pomes. i just like the music. and i love lounge singers.

scott seward (scott seward), Monday, 20 November 2006 14:53 (seventeen years ago) link

What are "pomes"?

Marcello Carlin (nostudium), Monday, 20 November 2006 14:56 (seventeen years ago) link

a pennyeach

scott seward (scott seward), Monday, 20 November 2006 14:56 (seventeen years ago) link

groups as bad as Depeche Mode
groups as bad as Depeche Mode
groups as bad as Depeche Mode
groups as bad as Depeche Mode
groups as bad as Depeche Mode

Good-Time Slim, Uncle Doobie, and the Great 'Frisco Freak-Out (sixteen sergeants, Monday, 20 November 2006 14:57 (seventeen years ago) link

did jim morrison even inflict any of his (non-musical) poetry on the public before he died?

scott seward (scott seward), Monday, 20 November 2006 14:58 (seventeen years ago) link

Worth repeating:

the true geniuses - Lennon, Dylan, Tom from Kasabian

ONIMO feels teh NOIZE (GerryNemo), Monday, 20 November 2006 14:59 (seventeen years ago) link

PS For a long time, the extent of my knowledge of the Doors was:

- they didn't have a bass player
- they did that song "The End"
- a lot of people worship Jim Morrison as some kind of "totally deep poet, maaaaaaaan"

You can see how, based on this knowledge, I would think they were the worst group in the history of music. But then one day, I accidentally stumbled into a free show by a Doors cover band, and -- wonder of wonders -- it was actually pretty fun, rockin' music! Still haven't bought any albums, but it made me realize that maybe this was just another case of douchebag fans making good music look bad (cf. Pitchfork Kid A review that made me want to never listen to music again)

Good-Time Slim, Uncle Doobie, and the Great 'Frisco Freak-Out (sixteen sergeants, Monday, 20 November 2006 15:04 (seventeen years ago) link

I read No One Here Gets Out Alive when I was a kid before I had encountered much of their music, and my imagination conjured up something that sounded like Hawkwind crossed with The Stooges. Then I heard some actual Doors records and was like wtf.

did jim morrison even inflict any of his (non-musical) poetry on the public before he died?

Wasn't he focusing primarily on poetry when he was in Paris?

Edward III (edward iii), Monday, 20 November 2006 15:05 (seventeen years ago) link

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/An_American_Prayer

Wiki says An American Prayer was recorded during a 1970 "poetry session".

Edward III (edward iii), Monday, 20 November 2006 15:07 (seventeen years ago) link

but it didn't come out till after he died, right? i dunno. how much of the crap that has come out would he have put out himself. we all do cringeworthy things in our 20's.

scott seward (scott seward), Monday, 20 November 2006 15:11 (seventeen years ago) link

the kasabian line is a joek right?

benrique (Enrique), Monday, 20 November 2006 15:15 (seventeen years ago) link

More from Wiki:
Even though Morrison was a well-known singer and lyricist, he encountered difficulty when searching for a publisher for his poetry. He self-published two slim volumes in 1969, The Lords / Notes on Vision and The New Creatures. Both works were dedicated to "Pamela Susan" (Courson). These were the only writings to be published during Morrison's lifetime.

Edward III (edward iii), Monday, 20 November 2006 15:18 (seventeen years ago) link


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