The POLLing Chair: 10,000 Maniacs Studio Albums

In My Tribe, but I never listen to any of them anymore. They wrote a few perfect songs and surrounded them with dross and a lot of sanctimony.

Our Time In Eden for three or maybe four songs that I think improve on their counterparts on my second choice, In My Tribe. I tried but never got into Blind Man's Zoo beyond "Trouble Me". Off Hope Chest, "Planned Obsolescence" is the one I return to.

I need to pick up a copy of Hope Chest; they're going for a penny on Amazon. Those early songs (ah, memories of the years when I was seeing them live) sound like a totally different band than the later albums, which I never pull out anymore.

See, for me it's like totally the other way round. I wasn't into them at the time of the Hope Chest recordings; going back to them later, I was struck by how brittle and provisional they sounded. They sounded like a group who were still very unsure of themselves; but knew they would do better. The presence of superior versions of several Hope Chest songs on The Wishing Chair is testament to that.

That sophomore album (a rank cliché, I know, but one very appropriate for such a college-affiliated group) is a giant leap forward, with hauntingly perfect melodies, a radiant sense of hope and those incredible word-clouds of some of the most literate lyrics ever composed. But In My Tribe just gets my vote for its awesomely punchy production, narrative verve and Merchant's most glowing, sensitive vocal performances.

Blind Man's Zoo was a backward step, somewhat stodgy and stilted in places, but Our Time in Eden was a sumptuous return to form. The band displayed an ever growing maturity and the splashes of soul and brass put the finishing touches to Merchant's emotionally devastating meditations on love, hope and loss. A perfect way to bow out.

In My Tribe, easily.

It was the first one I heard, I have totally sentimental memories of junior high school tied to this (funny to think this was considered "alternative" back then). And the songwriting still holds up, if you can get past the earnestness/idealism/sanctimony of the socially conscious lyrics.

"What's the Matter Here" straight through to "Verdi Cries" is a great listen. I still listen to it all the way through too. :)

Some great stuff on all the others, but this is the only "album" for me.

When thinking about how this band is "alternative", I think of Natalie Merchant's duet with Michael Stipe on "To Sir, with Love" at the first Clinton inaugural.

The "sanctimonious" charge just doesn't hold up for me. Leaving aside the various campaigns she associated herself with, how many "socially conscious" lyrics did she actually write? Off the top of my head I can think of one about child-beating, one about adult literacy, one about environmental damage, one about a single mother in poverty, a few anti-war songs (Dylan wrote plenty of those, but he never gets called "sanctimonious")... The point, however, is that those songs never preached. They were just perfect narratives, telling their own small stories in a modest, understated way.

Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

Hmm, I wonder why I failed to vote in this poll.

I pick Blind Man's Zoo, chiefly for Headstrong and Dust Bowl.

This is the ultimate "I used to listen to them in high school (junior high?) but then got over it" band. Luckily, I started listening closely post-college when I was in the market for faux highlife and ska that knew not its name rather than (clears throat) "emotionally devastating meditations on love, hope and loss." Which means Hope Chest is very easily their most interesting album (or collection or whatever) to my ears. Far from great, it nevertheless reveals that they could have evolved towards the scrappy eclecticism of a Camper Van Beethoven rather than stroke music for burgeoning liberals.

And I love this:

how many "socially conscious" lyrics did she actually write? Off the top of my head I can think of one about child-beating, one about adult literacy, one about environmental damage, one about a single mother in poverty, a few anti-war songs

Um, sanctimonious or not, that's about five. And that's off the top of your head. And that's too many (cuz, yeah, sanctimonious).

wishing chair is best, she is filled with a youthful spirit on it and she didn't sound middle aged yet oh and pete astor hadn't happened yet.

our time in eden was among the first cassettes i ever owned (i was maybe 8 or 9) and i was devastated when my little brother completely unraveled the tape inside of the cartridge. (it didn't come off the reel so i painstakingly salvaged it with the aid of a pencil.) i found it extremely affecting at the time (definitely remember tearz inspired by "how you've grown") and was so amazed that the band's lyrics were written out as fully formed sentences/paragraphs (!) in the liner notes (unlike what i was used to with U2 and other bands where they were just incomplete fragments), but i would probably hate it if i listened to it today. but i guess like most things i listened to in the "impressionable years" every so often a song or two of theirs pops into my head and i don't entirely balk at it.

possibly this is a case of "great band, shame about the singer"?

i may like the unplugged disc best of all actually, for that version of "jezebel"

the kerouac song makes me wretch though. okay i'm done.

stroke music for burgeoning liberals

Um, sanctimonious or not, that's about five. And that's off the top of your head. And that's too many (cuz, yeah, sanctimonious)

that's "child beating"

What about the one called "Hateful Hate"?

The idea that "Cherry Tree" (the adult literacy one) is sanctimonius is laughable on its face, unless any song that's, like, ABOUT something, maaaaaaaan, is sanctimonius.

Plus y'all are leaving out the one about an alcoholic spouse, "Don't Talk," which is megaultrafucking classic.

Also, Our Time in Eden is really a great album, and still sounds good today. The two songs with the Memphis horns area aces, "Gold Rush Brides" is one of her best melodies, etc.

I hardly think it's unreasonable for a song about human slavery to use a word like "hateful". Next up, "Why it's sanctimonious to condemn the Holocaust." xp

pancakes otm

"'Boy, it sure would be great if this lady could teach me to read?' Get off your high fucking horse, Merchant."

Now that we're on the subject, I appreciate Merchant's novel take on child abuse in "What's The Matter Here?" Her geographic and psychological distance from the situation dovetails with the song's choice of point of view; she doesn't pretend to be an expert, she's just tired of excuses and that boy and his father making noise in the apartment next door.

Luka Pt. II

so otm

This is the ultimate "I used to listen to them in high school (junior high?) but then got over it" band.

I don't know how I missed this poll -- would probably have put in for Hope Chest.

(There's already some long Natalie Merchant thread where I go on and on about what I think is great and valuable in her lyric-writing and general style, so I guess I won't repeat too much...)

You were pretty eloquent about HC once.

natalie merchant had a secret huge rack

uhrrm...okay then.

anyway, thread revive to say that the John and Mary album from '91 fits really nicely between The Wishing Chair and In My Tribe.

All these albums are good, but In My Tribe is best overall IMO.

Where does Jesus fit in

xp Don’t know why I said that—it’s totally Eden!

(I think I’ve gone on about it in another thread, but Eden sounds astonishingly good to me now… I realize that I actually under-appreciated it back in the day, and I liked it plenty then! Their early stuff still sounds great too. If anything, it’s Tribe and Zoo that maybe haven’t aged so well.)

from a natalie merchant thread-

Listening to Hope Chest I keep thinking that if Rob Buck were in some sort of critically-credible band he'd be considered one of the great guitar players of the 80s.

― nabiscothingy, Sunday, August 7, 2005 1:06 PM

i don't need the extra snark, but this post from the other day is on to something.

anagram has some quality posts ITT. Anyway, it’s all about Wishing Chair and Eden for me (how many other bands’ first* and final** albums are also their best?)

* not counting Secrets of the I Ching
** in their “classic lineup”

Btw, I recently learned that the surviving Maniacs have essentially merged with Sixpence None the Richer(!):

https://www.post-journal.com/news/top-stories/2023/09/10000-maniacs-add-new-singer-guitarist-to-perform-at-jcc/