The King Crimson studio album poll

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Why? Because I'm listening to Discipline and thinking it might be my favorite, even though the mid-70's incarnation of the band was clearly the best. What a confusing, nerdy band. God have mercy on your soul if you vote for a post-80's album.

Poll Results

OptionVotes
Red (October 1974) 16
In the Court of the Crimson King (October 1969) 12
Starless and Bible Black (June 1974) 8
Discipline (1981) 6
Larks' Tongues in Aspic (April 1973) 4
The ConstruKction of Light (2000) 3
THRAK (1995) 2
Three of a Perfect Pair (1984); 2
Lizard (December 1970) 1
The Power to Believe (2003)1
Beat (1982) 0
In the Wake of Poseidon (May 1970) 0
Islands (December 1971) 0


Davey D, Monday, 22 October 2007 20:31 (nine years ago) Permalink

Red - King Crimson

M@tt He1ges0n, Monday, 22 October 2007 20:32 (nine years ago) Permalink

Larks' Tongues in Aspic (April 1973)
Starless and Bible Black (June 1974)

cant decide between these two

chaki, Monday, 22 October 2007 20:33 (nine years ago) Permalink

red ftw

Edward III, Monday, 22 October 2007 20:34 (nine years ago) Permalink

So torn between Red and Larks'

Jon Lewis, Monday, 22 October 2007 20:36 (nine years ago) Permalink

Voted for Red, because I like that 80s live album better than the studio stuff

Jordan, Monday, 22 October 2007 20:38 (nine years ago) Permalink

My vote's for Red.

A. Begrand, Monday, 22 October 2007 20:39 (nine years ago) Permalink

starless

chaki, Monday, 22 October 2007 20:41 (nine years ago) Permalink

CONTROVERSIAL

Jordan, Monday, 22 October 2007 20:43 (nine years ago) Permalink

somebody likes live improv

Davey D, Monday, 22 October 2007 20:44 (nine years ago) Permalink

huh? starless is a favorite among music fans.

chaki, Monday, 22 October 2007 20:44 (nine years ago) Permalink

Islands or Lizards would be controversial, not Starless

Jon Lewis, Monday, 22 October 2007 20:46 (nine years ago) Permalink

Me being one of them! The majority of the album's tracks are live improvs though.

xpost

Davey D, Monday, 22 October 2007 20:46 (nine years ago) Permalink

I don't think I have any of the studio albums anymore. I sold them all in college meaning to get the remasters, and then lost interest and never did.

Lizards is a weird fucking record.

Jordan, Monday, 22 October 2007 20:47 (nine years ago) Permalink

"red" but i'm realising i've not listened to this stuff for so long that my mind might have changed.

grimly fiendish, Monday, 22 October 2007 20:48 (nine years ago) Permalink

Lark's Tongues here. Sailor's Tale is one of my favorite songs by them, but I hate the rest of Islands. Red is my 2nd choice, In the Court of the Crimson King is my 3rd.

rockapads, Monday, 22 October 2007 21:02 (nine years ago) Permalink

Lark's Tongue in a photo finish with Starless, Jamie Muir the deciding factor. That guy was wack.

ellaguru, Monday, 22 October 2007 21:05 (nine years ago) Permalink

oh shit. you're right.

chaki, Monday, 22 October 2007 21:05 (nine years ago) Permalink

Can't decide between Larks and Discipline.

Rock Hardy, Monday, 22 October 2007 21:06 (nine years ago) Permalink

I love Muir's work on Lark's Tongue's. Red just kicks ass though.

Bill Magill, Monday, 22 October 2007 21:08 (nine years ago) Permalink

I voted for Discipline as it was a kick in the head for me who was a punk rocker and heard something I never heard before when it came out. At the time no one sang or spoke like Adrian Belew did not even David Byrne. Today it does sound less exciting but at the time it was really oddball. It was not screaming, it was not singing, it was not spoken word. It was not even nervous in the style of Talking Heads or Devo. It was just this voice that bobbed up and down.

I did go back to listen to the 70s records and they are good. I do not get why everyone loves Red. It rocks. I enjoy it. But what does this record do that Black Sabbath or Deep Purple or even Genesis didnt do better years before?

Islands and Starless And Bible Black are more interesting than Red, which is fun the first few times but that is it.

Discipline is the one for me. Three Of A Perfect Pair comes close. If I had to chose a record side, Side B of Three Of A Perfect Pair would get my vote.

Miza Din II, Monday, 22 October 2007 21:12 (nine years ago) Permalink

red is too samey sounding all the way through

chaki, Monday, 22 October 2007 21:13 (nine years ago) Permalink

Jamie Muir ruled. I blew a bunch of money on two of those KCCC live discs that have Muir on them, but it was worth it.

Jon Lewis, Monday, 22 October 2007 21:16 (nine years ago) Permalink

Yeah, Muir was dope. I like those 3 mid-70's albums to such a similar degree that I think it would be impossible for me to pick a favorite.

Davey D, Monday, 22 October 2007 21:17 (nine years ago) Permalink

I bought that "Great Deceiver" set in high school and my friends laughed at me. =(

Davey D, Monday, 22 October 2007 21:18 (nine years ago) Permalink

Starless just ahead of Red. Discipline and Court are great albums too though.

Herman G. Neuname, Monday, 22 October 2007 21:20 (nine years ago) Permalink

Red has great drumming, and sounds great too.

Jordan, Monday, 22 October 2007 21:21 (nine years ago) Permalink

Debut or controversial Islands choice for me.

Dan Peterson, Monday, 22 October 2007 21:53 (nine years ago) Permalink

They never got better than their debut, although "Lizard" comes close.

Geir Hongro, Monday, 22 October 2007 22:35 (nine years ago) Permalink

Argh too difficult. They all have superb material and boring material.

Too many distinct eras too. It's like presenting a car, a novel and a banana, and asking me which of those is my favourite thing.

Poseidon and Discipline are the only ones I can listen to without skipping much. Red's got 12 minutes of tuning, Crimson King's got 12 minutes of tuning, ConstruKction is excellent gym workout music but annoying in any other environment, and Larks' Tongues lacks something crucial but I can't pinpoint what it is.

If this were an Adrian Belew poll it'd be easy.

Autumn Almanac, Monday, 22 October 2007 23:09 (nine years ago) Permalink

Oh, this poll is soooo Larks' Tongues, baby.

Joe, Monday, 22 October 2007 23:10 (nine years ago) Permalink

Okay Red it is, pretending Providence never existed.

Autumn Almanac, Monday, 22 October 2007 23:10 (nine years ago) Permalink

G-Bflat-C-C#-Bflat-C
G-Bflat-C-C#-Bflat-C
G-Bflat-C....C#...C...
[clamoring Bruford snare/cymbal fill] F-F# etc.

Joe, Monday, 22 October 2007 23:13 (nine years ago) Permalink

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CrT2jEv_Yws

Joe, Monday, 22 October 2007 23:15 (nine years ago) Permalink

sadly i voted for ItCotCK, when I know RED or Starless are just as good

CaptainLorax, Tuesday, 23 October 2007 00:00 (nine years ago) Permalink

itcock

Autumn Almanac, Tuesday, 23 October 2007 01:03 (nine years ago) Permalink

disciplin

gman, Tuesday, 23 October 2007 01:37 (nine years ago) Permalink

in the wop

Autumn Almanac, Tuesday, 23 October 2007 01:43 (nine years ago) Permalink

construkction. simply because it's the only KC album I listen to from start to finish.

there's certainly some great stuff on the other albums, but they're not very consistent, and much skipping is required. I don't think KC have ever really worked in soft balladeering mode.

m the g, Tuesday, 23 October 2007 08:00 (nine years ago) Permalink

Matte Kudasai? Inner Garden I & II? One Time? Cadence and Cascade? I Talk to the Wind?

Autumn Almanac, Tuesday, 23 October 2007 11:51 (nine years ago) Permalink

I'm nitpicking, I know.

Autumn Almanac, Tuesday, 23 October 2007 11:51 (nine years ago) Permalink

Oh they haven't worked, not they haven't worked. I see what you mean now.

Autumn Almanac, Tuesday, 23 October 2007 11:53 (nine years ago) Permalink

Court or Discipline, just to be a cunt.

King Boy Pato, Tuesday, 23 October 2007 13:15 (nine years ago) Permalink

I picked "Starless & Bible Black", I like a load of their records about equally, I just went on which one would I want to listen to now if I had them all in front of me.

Pashmina, Tuesday, 23 October 2007 13:33 (nine years ago) Permalink

Going with Three of a Perfect Pair, but might've easily gone with In the Court Of.. or Discipline or Earthbound.

Alex in NYC, Tuesday, 23 October 2007 13:49 (nine years ago) Permalink

wait, Earthbound is live, never mind that one.

Alex in NYC, Tuesday, 23 October 2007 13:50 (nine years ago) Permalink

I really like Providence, I don't think, it's just "tuning"

Bill Magill, Tuesday, 23 October 2007 14:01 (nine years ago) Permalink

thank you, thank you, thank you, dear kc thread! you've given me a fab new word -- itcockin'!

and as i'm 'ready here, might as well vote. as well.

done it. i'm all for starless. ('tleast today)

t**t, Tuesday, 23 October 2007 14:26 (nine years ago) Permalink

almost impossible to do one overall. i chose lark's because i'm boring but it could just as easily have been red, discipline, or beat

akm, Tuesday, 23 October 2007 16:44 (nine years ago) Permalink

lizard

kamerad, Tuesday, 23 October 2007 17:16 (nine years ago) Permalink

the idea that THRAK could be someone's favorite KC album is pretty amusing to me

I think that and TPTB are pretty good but anyone who likes them probably gets their head torn off by Red

Lizard I can see...despite its flaws it really is a truly unique album, and there's a VdGG-style abrasiveness to it that I dig

frogbs, Thursday, 13 July 2017 13:04 (one week ago) Permalink

I didn't know about the existence of this until today: a Michael Giles solo album recorded in 1978, but not released until 2002. Nothing earth-shattering, but an interesting listen.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVZQzXxhdkc

smug dinner-jazz atrocity (Dan Peterson), Thursday, 13 July 2017 15:09 (one week ago) Permalink

Am I correct that Michael Giles was considered/auditioned for one of the more recent iterations of the band? Or am I misremembering?

Naive Teen Idol, Thursday, 13 July 2017 15:25 (one week ago) Permalink

uh huh: in 1994, he was considered for the double trio. Pat M auditioned the same day, and asked if he could stick around to meet Giles. per the Sid smith book, in which RF says that in 1997 he suggested a quickie tour involving Giles, McDonald, Wetton and himself.

veronica moser, Thursday, 13 July 2017 15:35 (one week ago) Permalink

wetton was being considered for the most recent iteration as well but his illness intervened. there are some photos in fripp's online diary of wetton and him at Fripp's house or studio from a few years ago.

akm, Thursday, 13 July 2017 19:43 (one week ago) Permalink

too bad belew is busy with stewart copeland, fripp-summers style

https://consequenceofsound.net/2017/07/stewart-copeland-adrian-belew-more-form-supergroup-gizmodrome-announce-self-titled-debut-album/

reggie (qualmsley), Thursday, 13 July 2017 19:52 (one week ago) Permalink

I don't think Belew was invited to be a part of this

frogbs, Thursday, 13 July 2017 20:32 (one week ago) Permalink

i hope they invited peter hammill. "i may not have enough of me but i've had enough of you" ranks way up with his best vocals outside his solo albums and Vd(GG)

reggie (qualmsley), Thursday, 13 July 2017 20:55 (one week ago) Permalink

first time I heard Hammill was on that album and it convinced me that he was my new favorite singer

his vocals on "Chicago" are so bizarrely over-the-top. wish he'd sing like that more often

frogbs, Thursday, 13 July 2017 20:57 (one week ago) Permalink

for real. prefer daryll hall's 'third edition' vocals on "chicago" though. if he toured with crimson i might follow grateful dead style show to show

reggie (qualmsley), Thursday, 13 July 2017 21:01 (one week ago) Permalink

This will always and forever be Red for me. King Crimson were always the most menacing of all the prog bands.

The Anti-Climax Blues Band (Turrican), Thursday, 13 July 2017 21:17 (one week ago) Permalink

young woman at my camp orientation yesterday was wearing KC tshirt <3

weird woman in a bar (La Lechera), Friday, 14 July 2017 15:29 (one week ago) Permalink

part i for the win. part ii is cool but the final movement of bartok's fourth string quartet is cooler. parts numbered greater than two are unworthy of consideration. _particularly_ if adrian belew is writing lyrics.

The Saga of Rodney Stooksbury (rushomancy), Saturday, 15 July 2017 01:46 (one week ago) Permalink

belew was not invited, it's been a whole thing.

akm, Saturday, 15 July 2017 17:49 (one week ago) Permalink

fripp posted this today: https://www.dgmlive.com/diaries/Robert%20Fripp/Tuesday%2013th.%20July,%202017

akm, Saturday, 15 July 2017 18:15 (one week ago) Permalink

Huh

Naive Teen Idol, Sunday, 16 July 2017 03:33 (one week ago) Permalink

That's weird. So is that just passive aggressive stabs at Belew for making a deal out of playing his songs? Fripp's argument is that KC is an entity beyond whoever is in the band at any one time, and former members should just suck it up when they're not involved?

Josh in Chicago, Sunday, 16 July 2017 04:33 (one week ago) Permalink

Whatever it was, it's gone now.

Three Word Username, Sunday, 16 July 2017 11:15 (one week ago) Permalink

Still on their FB page:

https://m.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=10156399199977519

KC twitter feed actually tweeted this out.

Naive Teen Idol, Sunday, 16 July 2017 12:09 (one week ago) Permalink

It's still around, maybe he rewrote it because I saw him repost it again today.

Earlier, he reposted all the communication he had with Belew around this situation, as in, his original email to him, etc, and make it very clear that Belew quit.

Weigel's prog book wasn't full of revelations but one thing that I did learn in it re: KC was that when Belew joined in 80, it was extremely important to him that he be allowed to have a solo career at the same time, and there was a full carve out in his contract to allow for such. And, later on, he was the one who quit (in 84, or later, now I can't remember). Fripp has stated that this time around he offered Belew a chance to remain as the shadow member, the way Levin had for many years while Gunn was in that seat; and Belew said no and quit.

akm, Sunday, 16 July 2017 14:28 (one week ago) Permalink

Lotsa gossip and quotes here:

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/king-crimson-with-belew-will-never-happen.576502/

Josh in Chicago, Sunday, 16 July 2017 15:55 (one week ago) Permalink

there must be more stuff happening recently to have caused fripp to write this, his mention of 'ex members and their de facto manager'; belew must have had his manager (if he has one? i can't tell) fire off some angry stuff regarding their playing neurotica and indiscipline and that set him off.

akm, Sunday, 16 July 2017 16:11 (one week ago) Permalink

because, other than the two comments that are re-produced in that hoffman forum, belew has been very quiet about this on FB from what I've been able to see.

akm, Sunday, 16 July 2017 16:11 (one week ago) Permalink

I'm sure that's it. They must have come to an agreement, by Belew's understanding, that Belew era stuff would not be played, then Belew was informed that Fripp had reneged. Hence, if I'm not right for the band and I'm not involved, then stop playing my shit.

Josh in Chicago, Sunday, 16 July 2017 16:24 (one week ago) Permalink

And Fripp's disingenuous response is hey, it's all KC, what can I do? It's a collective ensemble. As if he's seriously not making more than the other guys.

Josh in Chicago, Sunday, 16 July 2017 16:26 (one week ago) Permalink

it's not clear if he is or not. he states pretty emphatically that everything is being split 9 ways. He also does fucking everything for this band; he's gone far beyond what most people would do to sort out contractual stuff, royalty backpayments from EG, etc. If he wanted a quick payday, as someone said elsewhere (maybe that hoffman thread) he would have taken out a 4 person band, the overhead would have certainly been less.

akm, Sunday, 16 July 2017 16:46 (one week ago) Permalink

you know, belew's ask is kind of a big one. we're talking about more than 30 years of king crimson and he's saying "don't play my songs". well, they're all "his songs" because fripp, in his infinite wisdom, insisted in '81 that writing credits be split equally among the members of the band. it's a credit to fripp that when belew asked his response wasn't immediately "hahahaha, no", but overpromising and underdelivering is not a really great idea. at the same time there probably _weren't_ at any point lawyers involved and i can easily see a situation where fripp believed he was promising not to have anybody else sing belew's lyrics (though i'm sure it must have hurt him deeply that he couldn't get someone else to sing about a speck of lint on the penis of an alien), and belew thought fripp was promising not to play any songs he has a writing credit on (again, essentially every song written while he was in the band).

having said that i don't have any actual clue and am essentially guessing at things, and am probably completely and totally wrong about all this.

The Saga of Rodney Stooksbury (rushomancy), Sunday, 16 July 2017 17:31 (one week ago) Permalink

(though i'm sure it must have hurt him deeply that he couldn't get someone else to sing about a speck of lint on the penis of an alien)

I can think of maybe one King Crimson song that doesn't have lyrics that fall somewhere on the spectrum between laughable and horrifying - "The Night Watch." Their lyrics are awful.

grawlix (unperson), Sunday, 16 July 2017 19:43 (one week ago) Permalink

Seriously, if ever there were a "I read it for the articles" kind of band, it's King Crimson.

Josh in Chicago, Sunday, 16 July 2017 20:01 (one week ago) Permalink

lyrics to exiles aren't bad

most of belew's 80's lyrics were alright. it's the 90's stuff where he got dreadful at times. I feel like he held back his better lyrics for his solo work

akm, Sunday, 16 July 2017 20:55 (one week ago) Permalink

sick burn. on "op zop too wah" he literally wrote a love song to his guitar.

pete sinfield's lyrics are ridiculously overwrought, but as ridiculously overwrought lyrics go not terribly bad, i wouldn't say.

The Saga of Rodney Stooksbury (rushomancy), Sunday, 16 July 2017 21:31 (one week ago) Permalink

'Starless' lyrics are also good

or at night (Jon not Jon), Sunday, 16 July 2017 23:52 (one week ago) Permalink

I have a very soft spot for Sinfield's lyrics. Palmer James had his moments. Belew doesn't really begin to bother me until the 90s. But Sinfield's lyrics were so ambitious, inscrutable and florid it's hard for me not to be in their thrall. Mach I was as much Sinfield's vision as Fripp's and I'm reasonably sure Fripp wouldn't disagree.

As for writing credits, I hadn't heard about the split four ways thing but if that's the case, I can almost see why Belew might be aggravated at this point. Let's face it: a number of songs from the 80s are Belew solo songs in all but name. The Hoffman thread goes into some detail there. But it seems a bit odd to me that Fripp has no problem with Belew playing KC songs with the Power Trio, it's a problem if he does so with KC.

Naive Teen Idol, Monday, 17 July 2017 02:39 (one week ago) Permalink

Petra Haden has covered "The Sheltering Sky" btw --
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YVAzvWToMRA

Cannibal Adderley (WilliamC), Monday, 17 July 2017 03:10 (one week ago) Permalink

Aaaaand ... tour continuing/extended into the fall. I guess a Fripp's gotta eat.

Josh in Chicago, Monday, 17 July 2017 15:10 (one week ago) Permalink

US continued into fall, Europe confirmed already for 2018, and US again hinted at for 2019. I think Fripp is going to keep this going for as long as he can.

akm, Monday, 17 July 2017 16:01 (one week ago) Permalink

after kicking myself for years for not going in 2014, and then being out of town for the recent new jersey shows i am overjoyed at the new dates

adam, Monday, 17 July 2017 16:34 (one week ago) Permalink

I'm giving some thought to the Halloween show in Newark. NJPAC is a much nicer venue than the Count Basie Theatre.

grawlix (unperson), Monday, 17 July 2017 16:47 (one week ago) Permalink

Can an nyer get there just using PATH?

or at night (Jon not Jon), Monday, 17 July 2017 16:54 (one week ago) Permalink

Definitely. You have to switch trains at Journal Square, I think.

grawlix (unperson), Monday, 17 July 2017 17:07 (one week ago) Permalink

I'm absolutely there again. Hoping to get good tix this time.

Naive Teen Idol, Monday, 17 July 2017 17:12 (one week ago) Permalink

jon there are two shows at the beacon theater! don't fall for his new jersey siren song

adam, Monday, 17 July 2017 18:09 (one week ago) Permalink

B-but Halloween

or at night (Jon not Jon), Monday, 17 July 2017 19:39 (one week ago) Permalink

hey man you want to take the PATH on halloween with 75,000 people dressed up like bruce springsteen and snooki be my guest. i for one will be taking a convenient, well-appointed MTA train uptown to enjoy an evening of progressive rock with upper west side cosmopolitans.

adam, Monday, 17 July 2017 20:15 (one week ago) Permalink

No no yr right

or at night (Jon not Jon), Monday, 17 July 2017 23:34 (one week ago) Permalink

Oh, I think I'll be able to see them in Boston in November now. This is the best news!

I really like how the words work with the music in "21st Century Schizoid Man" and "Fallen Angel" btw.

No purposes. Sounds. (Sund4r), Tuesday, 18 July 2017 01:30 (one week ago) Permalink

Petra Haden thing is cool.

No purposes. Sounds. (Sund4r), Tuesday, 18 July 2017 01:35 (one week ago) Permalink

had a dream last night that I saw KC live (maybe because they just announced a Milwaukee date?) - it was 7 dudes rocking out on a 40 foot long stage, with a bassist way off to the right doing Eddie Van Halen moves (despite his bass not being plugged in), and Fripp sitting on a chair with his back to the stage and his face three inches away from the kick drum

frogbs, Wednesday, 26 July 2017 14:13 (two hours ago) Permalink

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krsai3plmKw

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 26 July 2017 14:14 (two hours ago) Permalink

(EVH, Levin, Hammer and Jerry Marotta, pretty close!)

Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 26 July 2017 14:16 (two hours ago) Permalink


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