pitchfork is dumb (#34985859340293849494 in a series.)

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Donald
Oh my God, what just happened at P-Fork
Mon Apr 1 07:08:25 2002
63.167.209.146

I'm not going to spew any elitist bullshit, but Alanis Morrissette, Kylie Minogue? Oh my fucking God. I'll stay for a little while to see if P-Fork still serves my needs, but with today's front page, I'm not counting on it. I understand the career move, but I just don't think it's going to serve me any more.

jess, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

stu Re: Oh my God, what just happened at P-Fork Mon Apr 1 07:41:08 2002 65.92.243.96

I wonder if it's going to serve anyone's needs. I don't think a web- only publication can attract readers interested in Alanis Morissette and Kylie Minogue. To my knowledge, no one actually hunts down information about such artists. People just hear about it on tv and that's it. Let's give Pitchfork a few months, until the corporate contributors pull the plug.

Mitch Lastnamewithheld, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I am very disappointed. Could they have made it any more obvious? COME ON, PEOPLE.

David Raposa, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't think a web- only publication can attract readers interested in Alanis Morissette and Kylie Minogue.

QUOTE OF THE YEAR.

jess, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

What makes me think that things will be back to normal by tomorrow? ;)

Sean Carruthers, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't know Sean... it would be April 2nd, which would make it one day after...

Andy K, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

You scalawags, you make me laff. Perhaps.

Ned Raggett, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Speaking of which, HEY NED! My Bloody Valentine are finally releasing their new album!

Sean Carruthers, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

We thought about that as one of the news items.

Dare, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

"i for one will not be returning to this site if you're seriously going to be reviewing alanis. like i can't read that shit everywhere and anywhere? the reason i had pitchfork as my home page was because i could actually find out about the shit i care about. i'm glad you can pay your rent now, it's too bad that you sold out your millions of readers for britney fans in body glitter to do it."

Dare, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

pitchfork as your homepage, classic or dud?

the first thing i thought (after, well, this is no all cure all the time) was that i wished they really had "sold out" (what the fuck, is this 93?), because maybe it would mean LESS GODDAMN PROG.

jess, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

he's calling you out, leone. FITE!

Todd Burns, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I think I'd rather read about Alanis and Kylie than most of the stuff they normally review.

Sean, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Their funniest joke came months ago.

Nicole, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't know what all you fools are talking about... I only WISH all of it were true.

Well, the Albini thing practically is...

mr. sparkle, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

We thought about that as one of the news items.

Makes sense, really.

Ned Raggett, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't know what all you fools are talking about... I only WISH all of it were true.

Well, the Albini thing practically is... huh???

Brock K., Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

LESS GODDAMN PROG

So, does that mean we'll write about the next Radiohead album, or not?

dleone, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

And that Flaming Lips thing actually is true. I think.

powertonevolume, Monday, 1 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Hein? Is the joke that Pitchfork reviewed some pop musik?? Even their KYLIE review was as dull as www.defra.gov.uk/farm/sustain/default.htm ARRRGHHHHHHHHH!! Then again Pitchfork = dull is a big shocker along the lines of Nelson in COLUMN!!!!!! shocker.

Sarah, Tuesday, 2 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

'On' column? 'HAS' column?! I can see him from my bladdy window but does that help my BRANE I think NICHT.

Sarah, Tuesday, 2 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Dom, how much of the Kylie review was farce? "The song exudes a catchiness that belies its inherent simplicity, so reassuring during an era when chart acts sound increasingly baroque and producers race to see who can ape electronic music trends first" sounds at least semi-serious.

Mitch Lastnamewithheld, Tuesday, 2 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

that is because kylie is, like sophie ellis bextor, going for a retro- mancuso/levan vibe, with all the classicism inherent in such an endeavour.

gareth, Tuesday, 2 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Actually, I did try to write about that record in the same way I would have for anything else at Pitchfork. I thought the gag would be better if people really thought we were changing styles, and Spin may be full of ads, but at least the reviews aren't jokes! As far as I know, anyway. Dullness wasn't intentional though.

dleone, Tuesday, 2 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

best e-mail address ever, eh starbar?

dudley, Tuesday, 2 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Dead right sir. Power shandies all round to the geezer behind it eh?

Sarah, Wednesday, 3 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

From: DWilliams@EQRWORLD.com Subject: NO, Just Admit You Like It Up There

You have completed your learning of life's lessons. Now, you suck ass just like all the other bores before you. Kylie, Alanis? Whatever, bitch. I am sure you already have the defense mechanisms in place so, this will mean nothing but, another exercise in...oh, who cares. Looking elsewhere for reality...or maybe I can pretend to be a rubber worm like pitchwhore.com...here big fishie, look, I rounded 'em up for you in a arrel. A whole demographic!

Not Funny

Dare, Thursday, 4 April 2002 00:00 (eighteen years ago) link

five years pass...

Y'know sometimes they really are asking for it:

"White Williams issues a debut album layered with impeccable influences-- including Roxy Music, Beck, and T. Rex-- and a sense of calculated disaffection."

Well shit SIGN ME UP.

lukas, Thursday, 1 November 2007 18:57 (twelve years ago) link

Yeah, that was a bit of a repellant blurb if I ever saw one.

Z S, Thursday, 1 November 2007 19:01 (twelve years ago) link

Wait, are you saying that doesn't seem accurate?

nabisco, Thursday, 1 November 2007 19:10 (twelve years ago) link

I read 'White' as 'While' and thought "The Saul Williams album sounds like that?"

Ned Raggett, Thursday, 1 November 2007 19:11 (twelve years ago) link

it's more that they used that as their _hook_

x-post

lukas, Thursday, 1 November 2007 19:20 (twelve years ago) link

The front blurbs are always stripped/condensed summary descriptions from the review inside -- in this case

His songs are thin and languorous, with impeccable influences and the sort of calculated disaffection that comes from an MFA in design and a good weed connection.

nabisco, Thursday, 1 November 2007 19:46 (twelve years ago) link

omg that is horrorshow

The blurb >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the article quote

HI DERE, Thursday, 1 November 2007 20:18 (twelve years ago) link

I assume that's an article quote; nabisco, if you just made that up then SHAME ON YOU.

HI DERE, Thursday, 1 November 2007 20:22 (twelve years ago) link

why would a critic ever try to guess where a song comes from?

Mr. Que, Thursday, 1 November 2007 20:23 (twelve years ago) link

I'm more bothered by beck as impeccable influence

dmr, Thursday, 1 November 2007 20:24 (twelve years ago) link

Wait, are you saying that doesn't seem accurate?

The description of "a sense of calculated disaffection", a combination of words that makes me imagine the shittiest band of all time, followed by "recommended" was repellant for me. I guess I like my disaffection to be natural, not carefully planned, so I would never recommend something like that.

Then again, I've never heard it so what do I know and so on.

Z S, Thursday, 1 November 2007 20:29 (twelve years ago) link

b-but someone at pfork said "hm, how can we get people to read this review? I know! we'll mention the artist's impeccable influences and calculated disaffection! that'll reel 'em in!"

RIP satire etc

lukas, Thursday, 1 November 2007 20:34 (twelve years ago) link

they could have collaged+mis-used _anything_ from the article, and they collaged+mis-used that

lukas, Thursday, 1 November 2007 20:35 (twelve years ago) link

The White Williams album reminds me much more of late 10cc and Bread than of Roxy Music. That bit was like the classic "Let's over-hip our influences" review.

I eat cannibals, Thursday, 1 November 2007 20:54 (twelve years ago) link

The description of "a sense of calculated disaffection", a combination of words that makes me imagine the shittiest band of all time, followed by "recommended" was repellant for me.

See, this sounds like the blurb WORKED for you -- i.e., efficiently let you know you would probably not like this act.

I agree, though, it looks kind of weird to have such a neutral-to-disparaging summary blurb on a recommended album.

nabisco, Thursday, 1 November 2007 22:04 (twelve years ago) link

I like how they gave the new Babyshambles, which is actually tuneful and a good all around album, a 4.0, but gave the first one, which is dreadful and hard to listen to / bloated, a 7.3,

Yeah, it was definitely TWICE as good as the new one. Fuckin' morons.

Erock Zombie, Friday, 2 November 2007 18:30 (twelve years ago) link

ugh, "impeccable influences" is really repulsive.

Hurting 2, Friday, 2 November 2007 18:46 (twelve years ago) link

(xpost) was that a parody or are you really getting worked up about an internet score for babyshambles

dmr, Friday, 2 November 2007 18:47 (twelve years ago) link

He was worked up?

roxymuzak, Friday, 2 November 2007 18:49 (twelve years ago) link

wait, i thought the grading scale was logarithmic. like 5 is twice as good as 4. somebody email ryan schreiber to find out.

elan, Friday, 2 November 2007 19:14 (twelve years ago) link

shit, now i need to reevaluate all my purchases of the last five years.

elan, Friday, 2 November 2007 19:16 (twelve years ago) link

It's actually modelled after the Richter Scale, hence the superlative designations of various well-reviewed albums as either "Reccomended," "Best New Music," or "Whole Lotta Shakin' Goin' On."

Alex in Baltimore, Friday, 2 November 2007 19:24 (twelve years ago) link

Apart from forcing me to re-listen to what is for me the Breeders' weakest album, the review adds historical context.

TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Sunday, 13 September 2020 20:08 (six days ago) link

6 of one half...

Like sussing out how much Black Francis vs Kim Deal is in "Lithium" is kind of a self-defeating exercise.

Mario Meatwagon (Moodles), Sunday, 13 September 2020 20:09 (six days ago) link

lol I remember the Pixies influence on Nirvana being a thing mentioned often at the time--as if the Pixies were some obscure '60s group and not a going concern back then

Muswell Hillbilly Elegy (President Keyes), Monday, 14 September 2020 00:27 (five days ago) link

They were obscure compared to Nirvana.

When I first heard Nevermind, my immediate thought was oh here's a band that is blantantly ripping off Pixies. There's obviously a lot more there too, but that was my first impression.

Mario Meatwagon (Moodles), Monday, 14 September 2020 02:23 (five days ago) link

Pitchfork gave a lot of love to this Lomelda album recently and I think i agree with them. Haven't heard much on here about it but it's been really hitting the spot lately.

gman59, Tuesday, 15 September 2020 20:58 (four days ago) link

and here's some more about Enya!

unpaid intern at the darvo institute (Simon H.), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 13:23 (three days ago) link

https://i.imgflip.com/4f5vw4.jpg

soaring skrrrtpeggios (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 13:33 (three days ago) link

the Goats Head Soup review is terrific

TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 13:37 (three days ago) link

It sure is. Can’t wait to listen to that reissue (and I wasn’t interested until reading that).

Can Butch Vig not do "dynamimcs"? (morrisp), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 14:01 (three days ago) link

Yeah, that's a very good review. Their transformation into Mojo is progressing smoothly...

but also fuck you (unperson), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 15:28 (three days ago) link

Joke's on you, Enya has already happened.

xps

hey, trust the fungus! (pomenitul), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 15:30 (three days ago) link

joke's on you you heard an (enya) bitin' ass crew

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 15:36 (three days ago) link

When I first heard Nevermind, my immediate thought was oh here's a band that is blantantly ripping off Pixies. There's obviously a lot more there too, but that was my first impression.

― Mario Meatwagon (Moodles), Sunday, September 13, 2020 9:23 PM (three days ago) bookmarkflaglink

more Boston than the Pixies but the quiet/loud/quiet thing was def there.

it's funny when you first hear things that end up being iconic, saw the Strokes open for Doves in a small club and thought they were doing a Smiths ripoff

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 15:37 (three days ago) link

all up enya

Fuck the NRA (ulysses), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 15:42 (three days ago) link

"Enya is everywhere" is what we used to say while watching my sister's Moonshadows tape

swing out sister: live in new donk city (geoffreyess), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 16:11 (three days ago) link

extremely Mojo Nixon voice

Thoia Thoing, Maryland (Whiney G. Weingarten), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 16:13 (three days ago) link

for the record i just wrote then deleted a martha-related mojo enya joke

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 16:36 (three days ago) link

lol I remember the Pixies influence on Nirvana being a thing mentioned often at the time--as if the Pixies were some obscure '60s group and not a going concern back then

There was a little cognitive dissonance when I first realized the first Pixies album came out a year before the first Nirvana album and they were contemporaries at the time of Nevermind. Not saying the influence was absent but it was more like the influence of MBV on Smashing Pumpkins than the influence of Black Sabbath on Soundgarden.

The nexus of the crisis and the origin of storms (Sund4r), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 16:47 (three days ago) link

I'm from Ireland, and have thus been exposed to considerably more of Enya's music over the years than I might ideally have wanted. The sight of Pitchfork trying to turn her into some sort of Delia Derbyshire figure is absolutely hilarious.

does it look like i'm here (jon123), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 16:59 (three days ago) link

yeah Trompe Le Monde in rotation with Nevermind for sure

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 17:06 (three days ago) link

maybe it's common knowledge, but is the line from "Trompe le Monde": "We went to the store and bought something great
Which samples this song from Washington state" a Nirvana diss? Or does that not even line up chronologically?

tylerw, Wednesday, 16 September 2020 17:22 (three days ago) link

maybe it's common knowledge, but is the line from "Trompe le Monde": "We went to the store and bought something great
Which samples this song from Washington state" a Nirvana diss? Or does that not even line up chronologically?

― tylerw, Wednesday, September 16, 2020 12:22 PM (forty-three minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

wiki says TLM and nevermind were released on the same day!?

i can't imagine pixies worry a whole lot about bleach era nirvana

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 18:06 (three days ago) link

i think the pixies thing is overstated. they were just as much influenced by wipers, melvins, husker du. Pixies didn't have a copyright on creating the quiet LOUD quiet LOUD thing. Nirvana just polished up a combination of underground sounds with some particularly catchy melodies and a very pretty dude at the front?

Hmmmmm (jamiesummerz), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 18:11 (three days ago) link

Circling back to the Stones review —

“Criss Cross” is the sort of cowbell-clanging boogie that Royal Trux spent half of their existence chasing

– this is a good jam, but I don't particularly hear a lot of Trux in it... or even any cowbell (unless I'm going deaf).

Can Butch Vig not do "dynamimcs"? (morrisp), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 18:14 (three days ago) link

yeah idk about that but I did read somewhere in the past that goats head soup is Neil and/or Jennifer’s favorite stones album

brimstead, Wednesday, 16 September 2020 18:25 (three days ago) link

i think the pixies thing is overstated. they were just as much influenced by wipers, melvins, husker du. Pixies didn't have a copyright on creating the quiet LOUD quiet LOUD thing. Nirvana just polished up a combination of underground sounds with some particularly catchy melodies and a very pretty dude at the front?

― Hmmmmm (jamiesummerz), Wednesday, September 16, 2020 1:11 PM (thirteen minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

I've read the band was more concerned that "Smells Like Teen Spirit" was pretty much exactly the riff from "More Than a Feeling" by Boston

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 18:25 (three days ago) link

The rhythm and first two chords are similar. The third and fourth chords are totally different, though.

The nexus of the crisis and the origin of storms (Sund4r), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 18:37 (three days ago) link

you know who also did the quiet/LOUD thing before Nirvanna?

Beethoven

*leans way back in chair*

longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 18:38 (three days ago) link

so did my man JEHOVAH tbrr

rob, Wednesday, 16 September 2020 18:47 (three days ago) link

I’m just so glad that review highlights the brilliance of “Lime House”-maybe the best song Kim Deal has ever written

beamish13, Wednesday, 16 September 2020 19:21 (three days ago) link

Agreed re: Limehouse, god I love that track, even its problematic lyrics.

healthy cocaine off perfect butts (the table is the table), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 19:40 (three days ago) link

Beethoven was my fav grunge act aside from Mudhoney

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 19:52 (three days ago) link

“Criss Cross” is the sort of cowbell-clanging boogie that Royal Trux spent half of their existence chasing

I wonder if Stuart Berman actually meant to reference "All the Rage" (the preceding track)? That one sounds more Trux-ian, and has audible cowbell.

Can Butch Vig not do "dynamimcs"? (morrisp), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 20:02 (three days ago) link

haha jesus christ

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 21:12 (three days ago) link

I mean the Pixies thing stems in large part from Kurt specifically saying he was trying to rip them off when he wrote SLTS, but maybe he was trying to throw people off the scent

Number None, Wednesday, 16 September 2020 21:19 (three days ago) link

He also said

“It was such a cliched riff,” he said. “It was so close to a Boston riff or ‘Louie Louie.’
and the band joked about the similarity by playing the Boston song before SLTS: https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/flashback-nirvana-play-a-bit-of-bostons-more-than-a-feeling-114519/

The nexus of the crisis and the origin of storms (Sund4r), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 21:47 (three days ago) link

Kurt was pretty generous about pointing out his influences

Muswell Hillbilly Elegy (President Keyes), Wednesday, 16 September 2020 21:58 (three days ago) link

Hey, what if there were multiple things that influenced him? Like has anyone here said that song absolutely was in no way influenced by Boston?

This whole teasing out of just what exact % does each possible influence contribute to this or that song is ridiculous.

xp

Mario Meatwagon (Moodles), Thursday, 17 September 2020 00:31 (two days ago) link

Success has a thousand fathers, but TAD is an orphan.

Scam Likely (morrisp), Thursday, 17 September 2020 00:46 (two days ago) link

This whole teasing out of just what exact % does each possible influence contribute to this or that song is ridiculous.

Hm? I wasn't doing that. I was making the same point as you, that multiple things influenced him, and also the video in the link is hilarious.

The nexus of the crisis and the origin of storms (Sund4r), Thursday, 17 September 2020 00:54 (two days ago) link

Well + that he wasn't trying to throw people off the scent.

The nexus of the crisis and the origin of storms (Sund4r), Thursday, 17 September 2020 00:56 (two days ago) link

Fair enough, I don't know why this particular topic agitates me. For some reason, the topic of Pixies influence on Nirvana is fraught. Not sure if it's Frank Black backlash or what. I think that the influence is extremely obvious, but of course there were many other influences as well. For some reasons these discussions quickly go from "Nirvana had many influence" to "actually Pixies weren't really a very significant influence. X, Y, or Z were much more important." That to me is just silly, especially when it involves parsing out to what extent multiple records featuring Kim Deal that came out in a span of two years had more or less influence.

Mario Meatwagon (Moodles), Thursday, 17 September 2020 01:21 (two days ago) link

wow this album rules

https://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/numun-voyage-au-soleil/

unpaid intern at the darvo institute (Simon H.), Thursday, 17 September 2020 13:48 (two days ago) link

Sounds cool. I wonder if the title was meant to mean 'journey to the sun' or some such? As it stands, it's more like a 'sunlit trip'.

hey, trust the fungus! (pomenitul), Thursday, 17 September 2020 14:04 (two days ago) link

ou est le soleil

Daniel_Rf, Thursday, 17 September 2020 15:01 (two days ago) link

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o1Qknahm4UM

No mean feat. DaBaby (breastcrawl), Thursday, 17 September 2020 17:03 (two days ago) link

Dans la tete.
Travaillez.

TikTok to the (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 17 September 2020 17:16 (two days ago) link

wow this album rules

https://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/numun-voyage-au-soleil/

― unpaid intern at the darvo institute (Simon H.), Thursday, September 17, 2020 8:48 AM (five hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

yeah, goddamn this is so good, a couple songs in right now....

partly reminds me of if Macha were Deadheads

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Thursday, 17 September 2020 19:31 (two days ago) link


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