Xgau Tastes Voice's Ax

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http://images.villagevoice.com/issues/0543/ann-xgau.jpg

Thought his association w/ VV would just fizzle and die; didn't think he'd have to suffer a pink slip.

Suzy Creemcheese (SuzyCreemcheese), Saturday, 2 September 2006 14:04 (seventeen years ago) link

USE THE SEARCH FUNCTION

http://ilx.thehold.net/thread.php?msgid=1726

mr. brojangles (sanskrit), Saturday, 2 September 2006 14:11 (seventeen years ago) link

fuck the search IT'S ANARCHY EVERY DOG FAR IMSELF

Alicia Titsovich (sexyDancer), Saturday, 2 September 2006 14:35 (seventeen years ago) link

all those Northern State raves did him in - karma, dude.

timmy tannin (pompous), Saturday, 2 September 2006 15:17 (seventeen years ago) link

I

Flopsy (Flopsy), Saturday, 2 September 2006 16:44 (seventeen years ago) link

Against I

timmy tannin (pompous), Saturday, 2 September 2006 17:06 (seventeen years ago) link

As a reggae band, they were a hardcore band with a change-up; as a metal band, they're a hardcore band with a great windup and no follow-through. The small problem is H.R.'s lyrics, which he's still smart enough to blur with the speed and attitude that make the lead and title cut their strongest song since "Pay to Cum." The big problem is Dr. Know, who's got a hundred Hendrix moves and no killer riffs. B-

Sang Freud (jeff_s), Saturday, 2 September 2006 17:58 (seventeen years ago) link

I was about to write "I read that as Xgau Tastes Voice's Ax" and then i realised that this would be a worthless post. As I paused to ponder the matter, I inadvertantly pressed return thru left-hand flailing.

Flopsy (Flopsy), Saturday, 2 September 2006 18:02 (seventeen years ago) link

actually, aiee, I meant to write

I was about to write "I read that as Xgau Tastes Voice's Ass" and then i realised that this would be a worthless post. As I paused to ponder the matter, I inadvertantly pressed return thru left-hand flailing.

Flopsy (Flopsy), Saturday, 2 September 2006 18:03 (seventeen years ago) link

stop. now.

PARTYMAN (dubplatestyle), Saturday, 2 September 2006 18:05 (seventeen years ago) link

:(

Flopsy (Flopsy), Saturday, 2 September 2006 18:07 (seventeen years ago) link

Does this decision even make commercial sense for them?

Sundar (sundar), Saturday, 2 September 2006 21:49 (seventeen years ago) link

if commercial means they continue to sell ads and now pay junior writers in cupcakes, yes.

Sterling Clover (s_clover), Sunday, 3 September 2006 00:44 (seventeen years ago) link

wh3rd.net search function doesn't show hold threads.

js (honestengine), Monday, 4 September 2006 21:27 (seventeen years ago) link

Sebadoh is fairly obvious.

i still love sebadoh. but it's been a while since i've heard anyone talk about liars.

Godfrzej Ljang (godfrzej), Tuesday, 5 September 2006 00:22 (seventeen years ago) link

oops, said that in the wrong thread.

Godfrzej Ljang (godfrzej), Tuesday, 5 September 2006 00:22 (seventeen years ago) link

decent take for the non-music geek on the man and why he's important

http://www.slate.com/id/2148997/

timmy tannin (pompous), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 01:22 (seventeen years ago) link

thanks tt

gabbneb (gabbneb), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 01:23 (seventeen years ago) link

Why doesn't this thread have like 60000 posts on it? All Robert Christgau threads normally do.

Mr. Snrub (Mr. Snrub), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 01:57 (seventeen years ago) link

Because the news came out right when the server died on Thursday.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 01:59 (seventeen years ago) link

maybe also because it's been looming since april?

blackmail (blackmail.is.my.life), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 02:08 (seventeen years ago) link

Wait, the Jody Rosen who posts here as non-geek? What a high bar for geekitude then (aside from chicken-head concerns).

js (honestengine), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 13:25 (seventeen years ago) link

RTFM

Eppy (Eppy), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 13:30 (seventeen years ago) link

And it's been mentioned elsewhere. And mocked by me.

If you miss Xgau so badly, he'll be at the Glendales Retirement Home complaining loudly about "that prog shit". But not after 3. Then it's dinner and nap time.

Eazy-Esteban Buttez (ESTEBAN BUTTEZ~!!!), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 13:30 (seventeen years ago) link

Because I can't do a search right now (running out the door), does anyone know if the experimental/contemporary music guy kept his job at the Voice? Kyle Gann is his name, I think?

trees (treesessplode), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 13:35 (seventeen years ago) link

Gann wasn't listed in the articles about Christgau, but maybe he was shoved out earlier.

x-post

I liked Jody's Slate piece but I don't think too many non-geeks will work there way through the whole thing (and yea that's a Jody who posts here sometimes, who does a blog on old old old music, and who has been writing for Entertainment Weekly lately--the guy is busy). I note that it refers to the "Jazz and Pop Poll" rather than the "Pazz and Jop Poll." I guess Slate copy editors were not geeky enough.

Speaking of fired New York music writers/editors, is former Spin editor Sia Michel (spelling?) now a New York Times staffer, or is she just freelancing for them?

curmudgeon (DC Steve), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 13:39 (seventeen years ago) link

Gann keeps a bibliography of his Voice pieces on his site; his last column was this past December.

mark 0 (mark 0), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 14:57 (seventeen years ago) link

"Wait, the Jody Rosen who posts here as non-geek? "

Oy, where to begin?

different jody rosen ("ours" is jody BETH rosen)

i meant that the piece was useful for the non-music geek who is only vaguely aware of xgau

everyone who posts here is a music geek

timmy tannin (pompous), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 15:14 (seventeen years ago) link

I don't like much of Rosen's work in Slate, but thought he did a pretty great job on the Xgau piece. Even though I don't think it's necessarily a loss that Xgau got canned; I'm empathetic about it and all, but the guy will always be published. Crying over "the end of an era" type shit just doesn't really do much for me.

I liked this best: "The idea is to revel in the whirling of the critic's mind—and to argue with him." That pretty much sums up Xgau's appeal to me. Well, that and his luxury of listening to music all the time.

don weiner (don weiner), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 16:42 (seventeen years ago) link

when we stop looking at the village voice as some sort of holy institution that has been sullied, the healing process can begin.

gear (gear), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 16:52 (seventeen years ago) link

And wordcounts will magically increase.

Eppy (Eppy), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 17:18 (seventeen years ago) link

Don OTM on "all the time" -- I interviewed Christgau in April for a piece on Pop Conference, and he was eloquent while talking over a blasting record.

Rickey Wright (Rrrickey), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 20:46 (seventeen years ago) link

[/namedropping]

Rickey Wright (Rrrickey), Wednesday, 6 September 2006 20:54 (seventeen years ago) link

two months pass...
Robert Christgau's piece on the New York Gypsy Festival just went online at Salon. He has contracted to be a contributing editor at Rolling Stone and a music critic for NPR's All Things Considered. The Consumer Guide remains in limbo, although there's an excellent chance it will start up again shortly. Sometime in the next month, archival Consumer Guide material will become part of the editorial content at Rhapsody, Real Network's online music service, where he will also contribute a weekly playlist.

gabbneb (gabbneb), Tuesday, 7 November 2006 17:11 (seventeen years ago) link

rolling stone? eek

gear (gear), Tuesday, 7 November 2006 18:56 (seventeen years ago) link

how times change! xgau + rolling stone = mutual hate society for many years

m coleman (lovebug starski), Tuesday, 7 November 2006 19:13 (seventeen years ago) link

He's been writing reviews for them for years, though.

totph (Totph), Tuesday, 7 November 2006 19:37 (seventeen years ago) link

current RS music editor is his friend/protege. since the late 90s. before that, however, public enmity.

m coleman (lovebug starski), Tuesday, 7 November 2006 19:43 (seventeen years ago) link

look forward to reading xgau's revuettes on rhapsody. don't know if I'd want him in charge of programming tho

m coleman (lovebug starski), Tuesday, 7 November 2006 19:49 (seventeen years ago) link

how times change! xgau + rolling stone = mutual hate society for many years
I was gonna try to post a picture of Lou Reed inducting Frank Zappa into the Rock And Roll Hall of Fame, but couldn't find one.

The Redd 47 Ronin (Ken L), Tuesday, 7 November 2006 19:52 (seventeen years ago) link

(Now I am imagining somebody photoshopping that onto the mural montage with the flag and the eagle and jay blancmange)

The Redd 47 Ronin (Ken L), Tuesday, 7 November 2006 19:53 (seventeen years ago) link

Sometime over the summer/early fall, VV published a long rambling, Christgau-penned feature article attempting to document the fact that the MFIC still actually goes out to shows. Or something. Basically a losely connected series of incoherent rambles assembled around the feeling of old and the dropping of names. Drunken nostalgia? Senile dementia? Who knows, but it became obvious that the time was nigh.

Adam Beales (Pye Poudre), Tuesday, 7 November 2006 22:05 (seventeen years ago) link

how times change! xgau + rolling stone = mutual hate society for many years

From Dave Marsh, "The Critics' Critic, II" in the January 11th 1977 Rolling Stone

"Rock criticism is now often seen in many quarters as more important than rock itself. Many critics carry this one step further by superimposing their own, frequently arbitrary, standards upon performers.

A classic, sad example is Robert Christgau, whose "Consumer Guide" in the Village Voice was once a model of cogent, witty criticism. Lately, Christgau has grown arrogant and humorless--the raves are reserved for jazz artists, while even the best rock is treated condescendingly unless it conforms to Christgau's passion for leftist politics (particulaly feminism) and bohemian culture. While he is too shrewd to let his dislike for apolitical or middle-class performers affect his A plus to E minus rating of them, the tone of the writing is now snotty--it lacks compassion, not to mention empathy, with current rock.

The Christgau example is particularly dispiriting because when he lightens up on the ideology, he remains one of rock's most perceptive analysts. There are any number of parallel vices: the punk-rock critics, led by Lester Bangs and Richard Meltzer, celebrate cultural garbage--televised wrestling, franchised foods, Quaaludes--and often wander into racism and sexism. Unfortunately for the punks, some mass culture artifacts are just garbage--Bangs and Meltzer usually know the difference but most of their followers and fellow punk critics do not, as a glance at an issue of Creem, their main outlet, quickly shows."

THE IRONY THE IRONY THE GOGGLES DO NOTHING, ETC.

Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Tuesday, 7 November 2006 22:12 (seventeen years ago) link

Bruce Springsteen, Born to Run [Columbia, 1975] A-

A Radio Picture (Rrrickey), Wednesday, 8 November 2006 01:11 (seventeen years ago) link

the punk-rock critics, led by Lester Bangs and Richard Meltzer, celebrate cultural garbage--televised wrestling, franchised foods, Quaaludes--and often wander into racism and sexism. Unfortunately for the punks, some mass culture artifacts are just garbage--Bangs and Meltzer usually know the difference but most of their followers and fellow punk critics do not, as a glance at an issue of Creem, their main outlet, quickly shows

This is kind of fascinating in that, just a few years later, Bangs was acknowledging/addressing this sort of thing in The White Noise Supremacists.

nabisco (nabisco), Wednesday, 8 November 2006 03:01 (seventeen years ago) link

(And that piece tends to fascinate me, because to me it kinda suggests Bangs maturing and acknowledging that a lot of the stuff people valorize him for might be dumb or hurtful or just ... well, it's this moment of acknowledging the seriousness of the world and importance of caring about it, and the idea that morals are more important than humor or style. I mean, that's something I'm glad Bangs came around to and wrote so eloquently about, and I wish a lot of the people who think he's so great would have the same realization.)

nabisco (nabisco), Wednesday, 8 November 2006 03:05 (seventeen years ago) link

Is "a lot of people" there a strawman demographic?

As a Bangs fan, by the way, I would say that I think he was always a fairly serious and fairly normal critic and I'm not sure how often the alleged inability to take serious things seriously was ever that characteristic of his writing as a whole.

Tim Ellison (Tim Ellison), Wednesday, 8 November 2006 03:16 (seventeen years ago) link

And that piece tends to fascinate me, because to me it kinda suggests Bangs maturing and acknowledging that a lot of the stuff people valorize him for might be dumb or hurtful or just ... well, it's this moment of acknowledging the seriousness of the world and importance of caring about it, and the idea that morals are more important than humor or style.

But, nabisco, even his Lou Reed essays/wrestling matches avowed the moralism of the Velvets over the easy chuckles of, say, Sally Can't Dance.

Alfred, Lord Sotosyn (Alfred Soto), Wednesday, 8 November 2006 03:25 (seventeen years ago) link

Alfred, I'm not saying that essay is the only appearance of those ideas, or that they were absolutely new to him! But really in all of his early-80s New York writing it feels like there's a recommitment to that kind of stuff. The earlier stuff still probably has more of a moral dimension than most music writing (even when its moral dimensions were wrong), but it's still interesting to see him once again wowed by the seriousness of it.

nabisco (nabisco), Wednesday, 8 November 2006 03:30 (seventeen years ago) link

isn't dave marsh impossibly sententious these days?

Amateur(ist) (Amateur(ist)), Wednesday, 8 November 2006 07:44 (seventeen years ago) link

isn't dave marsh impossibly sententious these days?

He's always struck me as a dull, predictable, and aesthetically conservative writer.
Yeah, and sententious, too.

opalescent arcs (Da ve Segal), Wednesday, 8 November 2006 09:10 (seventeen years ago) link

Marsh wrote a Musician piece in 1980 damning Christgau for embracing the avant-garde (Pere Ubu, B-52's) over Tom Petty.

A Radio Picture (Rrrickey), Wednesday, 8 November 2006 10:00 (seventeen years ago) link

In recent years Marsh has always tried to get his brand of left-wing populist politics into his own reviews and articles in his Rap & Roll Confidential newsletter, and elsewhere (his involvement with Springsteen), so his criticism of Christgau back then for injecting politics is interesting. Although Marsh is likely to claim his injection of his Detroit-born politics is different than Christgau's NYC version.

Musically, Marsh's taste has always been narrower than Christgau's.

curmudgeon (DC Steve), Wednesday, 8 November 2006 12:23 (seventeen years ago) link


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