Bob Dylan: The Bootleg Series

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A search reveals that these volumes have been mentioned all over the place, but have never had a comprehensive thread.

Since last week's compelling Dylanival and the long ILM thread about it, I have been driven back to the Bootlegs 1-3. Slowly working my way through: still only up to 'She's Your Lover Now'. But crikey, that track almost deserves a thread of its own! So thrilling to hear things come together and fall apart, piano hold steady while guitarist stops and starts again; like the 'Keep It With Mine' where the producer tells Bob to keep going.

Other big theme I wanted to raise: Great Unreleased Songs. 'Mama, You Been On My Mind' and 'Farewell Angelina', never on an LP - yet standards for years, and finally available here! What about those? How did they become standards anyway: through actual bootleg-bootlegs? Why did he leave them off LPs in the first place?

So much to say. And I have not heard Vol 7 yet.

the bobfox, Thursday, 6 October 2005 14:45 (seventeen years ago) link

search: blind willie mctell from volume 3.

kyle (akmonday), Thursday, 6 October 2005 15:06 (seventeen years ago) link

I like the 'Albert Hall' one very much. I think the tuning up is btter than most albums. I do a 'human beatbox' version of it. I do not like the 1975 one very much, apart from the solo performances. I have hardly listened to 1964 (but it is in my bag). I haven't heard or seen the latest one (but it is in the work DVD box in non-packaged format - maybe I will borrow it to make up for my disappointment at having taken home Rocky II and Car Wash only to find they were region one). I like 1-3, but I do not have it at home at present. I like Every Grain Of Sand better than the 'proper' version, and I like the Blood On The Tracks, erm, tracks.

PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Thursday, 6 October 2005 15:17 (seventeen years ago) link

I think "She's Your Lover Now" would have been the best song on Blonde on Blonde.

Mark (MarkR), Thursday, 6 October 2005 15:20 (seventeen years ago) link

* We need: more outtakes from the Basement Tapes.

* 1st song on Vol 5/1975 should shut up forever anyone who still thinks "Dylan can't sing"

* "Wallflower" - one of his most underrated songs, David Bromberg's version is great

Keith C (lync0), Thursday, 6 October 2005 15:21 (seventeen years ago) link

bootleg 1-3 was actually my first exposure to dylan, since i was staying with a dylan fanatic who had just bought it, and i really flipped for it. "she's your lover now" is really fantastic... i also very much liked the really fast version of "it takes a train to laugh..."... the concert bootlegs of "mama you've been on my mind" that i've heard have always been very jaunty; did he ever play it as delicately as he did on that set? lastly, the basement outtake "santa fe" is the one i sing the most, since it's got a great melody and incoherent lyrics

dave k, Thursday, 6 October 2005 15:41 (seventeen years ago) link

She's Your Lover Now and Blind Willie McTell are the stars of the Bootleg Series 1-3 box set. I'm also really partial to Nobody 'Cept You, an outtake from Planet Waves which would have been the best song on it.

kornrulez6969 (TCBeing), Thursday, 6 October 2005 15:44 (seventeen years ago) link

I didn't know people loved 'She's Your Lover Now' so much! I am excited.

I adore that vol 5 version of 'Tonight I'll Be Staying Here With You' - track one, even using the phrase 'Rolling Thunder'. Thrills!

the bobfox, Thursday, 6 October 2005 15:53 (seventeen years ago) link

I will isten to it again. I think there might be too many musicians, a la Concert For Bangladesh.

PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Thursday, 6 October 2005 15:55 (seventeen years ago) link

On the Royal Albert Hall bootleg series, I am NOT a fan of the acoustic disc. I find it slow and just kinda overly mannered. The electric disc, however, is some of the best rock and roll ever played.

If you want to hear great acoustic Bob, you can't beat the three songs on Before the Flood: Don't Think Twice, It's Alright Ma and Just Like A Woman. All three are the best versions of those songs, and beat the piss out of the Royal Albert Hall acoustic stuff.

kornrulez6969 (TCBeing), Thursday, 6 October 2005 15:57 (seventeen years ago) link

Haha yes! Before the Flood is occasionally great

Baaderonixx and the hedonistic gluttons (baaderonixx), Thursday, 6 October 2005 17:03 (seventeen years ago) link

the bear mountain picnic song gets me everydamntime...

i'm also happy for the recently uprooted love of "shes your lover now". i about break everytime it just quits like that. Vol. 7 proves that the blonde on blonde sessions, though interesting, don't quite pack the punch of the final versions. i can't imagine what would have become of syln. the vol. 2 version is rough, but warm. b o b has a late night frosty glow. it coulda been better or worse.

the vol. 2 version of santa fe is great, better than the genuine basement tape's makes you need to belt along with it.

i've gone on week long binges with each of the live records. Rolling Thunder got me to like "The Hurricane". The "It's Alright Ma" from 1964 brought back the almost crushing power of that song for me. And I still get chills with the 66 version of "Like A Rolling Stone".

all said, i love this series. i think it provides a brilliant look into how grand the dylan universe is.

bb (bbrz), Thursday, 6 October 2005 17:04 (seventeen years ago) link

The '80s stuff on the first Bootleg comp is first-rate. "Blind Willie McTell," "Caribbean Wind," the E Street Band-performed version of "When The Night Comes Falling From The Sky" are some of his greatest songs.

Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 6 October 2005 17:09 (seventeen years ago) link

Don't forget about Biograph:
"And I went back to find Isis just to tell 'er I love ARRRRRRRRRRRRRR!"

Old School (sexyDancer), Thursday, 6 October 2005 17:12 (seventeen years ago) link

re: the 1966 acoustic sets--I beg to differ. Those are among my favorite Dylan recordings of all time. So slow, sad and beautiful. I think Dylan's really digging deep--losing himself completely in the songs. He often sounds so otherworldy and lonely that it's a shock when the applause comes after the songs end. In its own way, I think those sets are just as radical as the electric set (which I also loooooove). And there's some of the wildest harmonica work of the man's career--check out the long excursion he takes at the end of Tambourine Man. I can dig the Before the Flood stuff, but it's a little bit too amped up for my tastes.

tylerw, Thursday, 6 October 2005 17:19 (seventeen years ago) link

As far as acoustic live Dylan goes, I've always loved his vocal on "Just Like a Woman" from Bangladesh. He sings his guts out.

Jazzbo (jmcgaw), Thursday, 6 October 2005 17:30 (seventeen years ago) link

how is that Gaslight performance that was just released?

kyle (akmonday), Thursday, 6 October 2005 17:43 (seventeen years ago) link

what i want to know is why "can you please crawl out your window", the glockenspiel version, was never released or used in the doc. it's easily in my top 5 dylan songs--as exuberant as live 65.

naturemorte, Thursday, 6 October 2005 19:06 (seventeen years ago) link

Crikey, yes, Urgent & Key: that was a 45 - but I'm afraid I have never heard it in my life, not that I can remember. What does it sound like?

the bellefox, Thursday, 6 October 2005 19:07 (seventeen years ago) link

I love the 1964 disc (vol 6). Dylan sounds so eager to entertain his audience, as opposed to the bitter stance he took during the next two years (both sides of him were captured so well in the Scorcese doc). He sings his guts out on songs like "Who Killed Davey Moore" and "If You Gotta Go, Go Now" with power that I didn't know he had in him before I heard this record.

MindInRewind (Barry Bruner), Thursday, 6 October 2005 19:26 (seventeen years ago) link

'Mama, You Been On My Mind' and 'Farewell Angelina', never on an LP - yet standards for years, and finally available here! What about those? How did they become standards anyway: through actual bootleg-bootlegs?

dunno about "FA" but "MYBOMM" was covered by a few people--as the Scorsese doc makes clear, his publisher made sure his songs got covered.

Matos-Webster Dictionary (M Matos), Thursday, 6 October 2005 19:33 (seventeen years ago) link

One night I discovered something totally insane. If you have the DVD disc that came with the Rolling Thunder volume then play Isis. When you see the part when the sweaty guitarist's eyes are all bulging from cocaine and he tries to bite Dylan's left-hand fingers, back it up a bit and play it in slow motion. That whole fucking weird scene played in slo-mo is truly mesmerizing and a bit disturbing.

Justin Farrar (Justin Farrar), Thursday, 6 October 2005 20:11 (seventeen years ago) link

Joan Baez put out "FA" first I think, and she made it famous.

I've had the the first box for a few years and been meaning to pick up vols. 4-7. Some faves from it that haven't been mentioned much:

Seven Curses (I'm sucker for mystical revenge/stolen virginity/evil lawmen/wronged man folklore stuff)
Sitting On A Barbed Wire Fence ("She's turnin' me into an old man/and man, I ain't even 25!")
If Not For You (It's prettier than the official version)
Nobody 'Cept You (Good call kornrulez)
Seven Days (Since i dig this and the rolling thunder biograph tracks, how urgent is it for me to pick up Vol.5? And also is the 1st version w/the dvd worth tracking down?)
Foot of Pride (The homesick blues, nearly 20 years of schoolin' later, and still on the day shift)
Tell Me (Bob can do Pop)

thanks for answering my question before I posted it. that sounds cool.

Marxism Goes Better With Coke (Charles McCain), Thursday, 6 October 2005 20:13 (seventeen years ago) link

'Mama, You Been On My Mind' and 'Farewell Angelina', never on an LP - yet standards for years, and finally available here! What about those? How did they become standards anyway: through actual bootleg-bootlegs?
dunno about "FA" but "MYBOMM" was covered by a few people--as the Scorsese doc makes clear, his publisher made sure his songs got covered.

-- Matos-Webster Dictionary (michaelangelomato...), October 6th, 2005.

Most notably and beautifully by Rod Stewart.

Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Thursday, 6 October 2005 20:18 (seventeen years ago) link

Another good one from The Bootleg Series box is the demo of Every Grain of Sand, which I prefer to the Shot of Love version...much more intimate without the Bobettes.

kornrulez6969 (TCBeing), Thursday, 6 October 2005 20:23 (seventeen years ago) link

Barking dog!

Marxism Goes Better With Coke (Charles McCain), Thursday, 6 October 2005 20:24 (seventeen years ago) link

Although the 3rd disc of Bootleg Series 1-3 is kind of throwaway, and the 2nd disc has a lot of great alternate versions of album tracks, that first disc is very worthwhile; in fact, over the last 5 years, I've probably listened to that first disc more than anything else Dylan-related.

1st Disc Standouts:
"Hard Times in New York Town"
"House Carpenter" (Is this a cover or an original? It's become one of my Dylan favorites)
"Talkin' Bear Mountain Picnic Massacre Blues"
"Rambling, Gambling Willie"
"Talkin' John Birch Paranoid Blues"
"Who Killed Davey Moore?"
"Last Thoughts On Woody Guthrie" (if for nothing else, those ending lines:

"You'll find God in the church of your choice
You'll find Woody Guthrie in Brooklyn State Hospital

And though it's only my opinion
I may be right or wrong
You'll find them both
In the Grand Canyon
At sundown"

Suzy Creemcheese (SuzyCreemcheese), Thursday, 6 October 2005 21:03 (seventeen years ago) link

Am I alone in my complete awe of "Moonshiner"?

Sung with such beauty, control, and weight, I can't get over it. Devastates me every time.

Taylor, Friday, 7 October 2005 01:51 (seventeen years ago) link

xpost "his publisher made sure": yes, pinefox, his "Mama You Been On My Mind" and a bunch of other demos were sent around by the publisher, so Fairport took "Percy's Song" and others, and the whole Lo & Behold album, by Dean Coulson, McGuiness, Flint, and others, was from publisher's demos, I think, or most of it, anyway. Seems like the Brits jumped on more of the prime goodies than Americans did,initially, although of course Baez did a double-LP of his stuff soon enough (Any Day Now, right?)There were a couple of LPs of demos issued by the old TMQ (Trademark of Quality, with a pig-rubber-stamp as trademark) booters, although mostly they did comps from various sources too (So "Mama" and other demos are with Minnesota apartment tapes, Basement Tapes, Isle of Wight, etc. on the VD Waltz comp; I've never heard a whole album of demos, alas.)In some cases, it was a matter of just having too much stuff, not wanting to flood the market, and/or what he did last month too different from this month's, and this month, it's time for an album! Then in 70s, not wanting the 60s overflow to wash away the later stuff; plus, when he finally did a legit version of Basement Tapes, and it did well, he was surprised:"I thought everybody already had that!" The boots were popular and well-enough known, he prb thought legit issues would increase pressure by being seen as potboilers, at that point, even f they didn't upstage, so either way, they were a problem, until he needed the money and the cred bad enough, and had by that time become enough of a Historical Landmark that the Bootleg Series seemed only right and proper. Thing is, though, hearing the tracks left off the 70s-80s stuff, in favor of some of the crappier items that did make the cut, really show how unsure of himself he can be, for all the Bardic charisma, etc. So, in that respect, the songs of his fabled past are *still* a problem for his sense of credibility, which is why they've been so carefully rationed (still tons of things; it'll be like Hendrix and Trane and Miles issues, only moreso, cause more songs, not just 9000 versions of 900 songs)But basically, questions of judgement/crediblity are part of his history too, not so much of an issue (if he makes another bad album, and he will, big deal, cos the song-suply'll never end, til the world does, and when it does, his stuff will spill over to somewhere:the good, bad, great, and meh;I can see it, the probability of that now, even while this thought ends.)

don, Friday, 7 October 2005 02:57 (seventeen years ago) link

Regarding "She's Your Lover Now," the Dylan Scrapbook released in conjuction with No Direction Home has a lyric sheet for that tune. I'm not sure if the sheet is made to look authentic, or if it's a replica of the original, but the lyrics end where the song on the second Bootleg disc ends.
I always had the impression that the wheels just fell off, and that the song was meant to be longer.

Jason Dent (jason dont), Friday, 7 October 2005 03:31 (seventeen years ago) link

"you, you just sit around and ask for ashtrays... can't you REACH?"

100% WJE (Jody Beth Rosen), Friday, 7 October 2005 05:41 (seventeen years ago) link

"blind willie mctell" is very close to being his best performance, if not his best song, ever.

J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Friday, 7 October 2005 05:56 (seventeen years ago) link

It is Don't Look Back that is in the box at the work where we work, not No Direction Home. I watched a couple of minutes last night before deciding that it was best to wait till my karma had reached its optimum level and then watch it.

Listened to some Live 64, did not think much of it really. But I shall persevere.

Crawl Out Your Window is on Biograph, I think, Pinefox. Should you wish, I could copy it for you when I rescue it from "storage". I also have a J. Hendrix version recorded for the BBC Light Programme.

PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Friday, 7 October 2005 07:06 (seventeen years ago) link

yeah crawl out your window is on biograph but it's a a sub-par version--i'm talking specifically about the glockenspiel version. the one on biograph is a little laid-back, but the glockenspiel version is really energetic and crazy. when he launches into the third chorus he does one of those soulful nasal whines that only dylan can do.


naturemorte, Friday, 7 October 2005 07:37 (seventeen years ago) link

"House Carpenter" (Is this a cover or an original? It's become one of my Dylan favorites)

It's a cover - it's a ridiculously old trad song. A great version is on Harry Smiths' Anthology of American Folk Music.

Come Back Johnny B (Johnney B), Friday, 7 October 2005 07:38 (seventeen years ago) link

I don't know the glockenspiel version.

PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Friday, 7 October 2005 07:45 (seventeen years ago) link

"blind willie mctell" is very close to being his best performance, if not his best song, ever.

seconded; amazing song/performance, totally spellbinding

Matos-Webster Dictionary (M Matos), Friday, 7 October 2005 08:03 (seventeen years ago) link

Although the 3rd disc of Bootleg Series 1-3 is kind of throwaway

Madness. I can't really say if it's the best disc but it's definitely the one I've listened to most. 'Foot of Pride','Every Grain', 'Blind Willie McT', 'Angelina', 'Seven Days' = throwaway??

Baaderonixx and the hedonistic gluttons (baaderonixx), Friday, 7 October 2005 08:04 (seventeen years ago) link

"Well, God is in heaven
And we all want what's his
But power and greed and corruptible seed
Seem to be all that there is"

So classsssssic.
Also turned me on to "St James Infirmary", from which the melody is lifted. Checl out Bobby Blue Bland's version if you have the chance.

Baaderonixx and the hedonistic gluttons (baaderonixx), Friday, 7 October 2005 08:06 (seventeen years ago) link

crawl out your window is great, indeed ! (and yeah, the glockenspiel version is best).
it's easily amongst my favorite bob's trax.
guess i'm ready to grab the latest bootleg series now !

AleXTC (AleXTC), Friday, 7 October 2005 08:19 (seventeen years ago) link

I almost started this thread myself after doing a search for it last week! Surprised one did not exist til now, thx for starting.

Vol. 1-3 I heard before a lot of the albums, and it's the thing that made me obsessive about Dylan. Had a 90 cassette of tracks, mostly discs 1 & 2, that I completely wore out that summer and beyond. It started with "Last Thoughts on Woody Guthrie". Upon hearing the original version of say "If Not For You" without the "Ready George?" and a certain wobbly reckless energy of a lot of the tracks on 1-3, the originals sounded rather polished or staid. "Santa Fe" is another good example. Even "Idiot Wind" at the end of Vol. 2 is more biting and mean than the album vers.

Vol. 4 opened my eyes in a big way to the pre-'66 material, as I'm sure it did for a lot of people. I actually prefer disc 1, particularly the devestatingly sad "Desolation Row" and Dylan's expressive harp playing thoughout. Almost like he's testing the audience with his harp playing, similar in aggression to part 2 "Play it fucking loud". I find the guitar playing on disc 1 tattered, like he means it, it all fits the mood nicely.

Vol. 5 I bought when it came out and only listened a handful of times. Need to return to it. I remember it sounding very punk rock, though.

Vol. 6 is the 1964 disc, right? Never bought that.

Vol. 7 don't have yet.

mcd (mcd), Friday, 7 October 2005 12:54 (seventeen years ago) link

about she's your lover now--i thought the scrapbook lyrics sheet was weird too--because there IS a last verse. He sings it on the solo piano outtake of the song--which has yet to see official release. anyone who loves that song oughtta seek it out, though. it's incredible--extremely slow and wasted-sounding. with the release of the latest bootleg series, this is probably the major remaining outtake to remain officially unreleased.

but anyway, i love the bootleg series' one and all, but part of me wishes that Dylan (or Columbia) would do like Elvis Costello and just reissue the albums each with a bonus disc of outtakes/live stuff/etc. Of course they just did that big SACD reissue series a few years ago, so that's unlikely to happen any time soon.

tylerw, Friday, 7 October 2005 13:10 (seventeen years ago) link

Seek out: Lou Reed's cover of "Foot of Pride."

Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Friday, 7 October 2005 13:15 (seventeen years ago) link

Ah, there are two ways of doing this: a "Bootleg" series, and 'extra disc'..

The fall reissues have an extra disc, but as they mostly have Peel sessions, they are pointless if you have that "Ah, the Fall Peel Sessions box set, you guys" set.

mark grout (mark grout), Friday, 7 October 2005 13:16 (seventeen years ago) link

curious about that she's your lover now piano outtake...
there's another "song" i've been wondering about : it's a tune he plays on accoustic guitar at the end of "eat the document".
is this a proper song ? a demo ? a cover ?

AleXTC (AleXTC), Friday, 7 October 2005 13:22 (seventeen years ago) link

that's "i can't leave her behind". as far as i know, that's the only recording of the song. but it's amazing--vocally one of Dylan's most tender moments. You can get an mp3 of that (and the she's your lover now outtake and a whole bunch more) at

tylerw, Friday, 7 October 2005 13:38 (seventeen years ago) link

yeah, his singing, the melody, the guitar playing... beautiful indeed. so it's a song of his, then ? incredible that didn't get released !?
anyway, thanks !

AleXTC (AleXTC), Friday, 7 October 2005 14:08 (seventeen years ago) link

yeah it's one of his. the story goes that him and Robbie Robertson would stay up all night on the 1966 UK tour writing dozens of new songs--and then the next day neither one could remember them.

tylerw, Friday, 7 October 2005 14:14 (seventeen years ago) link

I am still working my way through 1-3 in order. Slowly. I am now halfway through 'You Changed My Life'.

Latest discoveries:

'Tangled Up In Blue' - a centrepiece of the set to me when I first heard it - is it in E, and the LP version in G?

'Call Letter Blues' is doing more for me than before: some poignancy in the words.

I have never loved 'Idiot Wind' but am now impressed by the relative tenderness of this (NYC?) version as vs the LP.

The bootleg 'If You See Her' is a lot better than the LP's, surely.

Is 'Golden Loom' the first time Bob and Emmylou H sang together? Assuming it's her.

It's funny how that is country, then 'Catfish' is blues. I have always thought 'Catfish' kind of unimportant, but actually I like the depth of its sound, the reverb around those slides and harmonicas.

Is the barking dog the reason that this 'Every Grain of Sand' was not used? I like this song a lot considering that it's religious.

The whole set is an amazing way to take a rapid-fire time-tour through Dylan's career, hearing the flavour of one year (those Desirous violins) for a track or two before the next sound comes along.

the bobfox, Friday, 7 October 2005 14:34 (seventeen years ago) link

Oh, yes - 'Nobody 'Cept You' IS good, isn't it: oddly it sounds to me like the Rolling Thunder sound, though it predates it.

Unlike PJM, I like Live 1964 a lot.

This glockenspiel rumour remains mysterious to me.

But christ, so many great things: 'Barbed Wire Fence', 'Train To Cry', '... Go Now' on bootleg 2. Peerless!

the bobfox, Friday, 7 October 2005 14:37 (seventeen years ago) link

completely out of chronological order Well, mostly around TOOM time, with little bit of filler fack back as '92---think Series of Dream jumped around more.
So I finally realized: tour-box-wise, we've had '66, Rolling Thunder, Trouble No More---but no '74 comeback tour box; fuckin why? Must have more like Before The Flood.

dow, Thursday, 24 February 2022 18:07 (nine months ago) link

two weeks pass...

anyone know what's up with these The Joker vol. 1-5 Early Years? released throug... "Wet Music"? Is it official? Are they releasing everything from 1962 because of some copyright thing?

corrs unplugged, Thursday, 10 March 2022 19:20 (nine months ago) link

one month passes...

Guess this is most appropriate BD thread for some shows mentioned herel which curator says you're never gonna be able to just go to the Center, and pull up in whole...
from Flagging Down The Double E's e-newsletter (which usually has show downloads):

An In-Depth Look at the Bob Dylan Center's Unheard Live Recordings
Talking Supper Club, Salt Lake '76, and more with co-curator Parker Fishel
Ray Padgett
I was lucky enough to spend the past weekend at the grand opening of the Bob Dylan Center in Tulsa, Oklahoma. The Center is terrific, a museum that, even while it would be accessible to the casual fan, offers plenty for the superfan to salivate over. One example among many: Even after I’d probably spent five or six hours there over two days, I suddenly stumbled upon a never-heard World Gone Wrong outtake, “I’ve Always Been a Rambler,” tucked away on a wall. It sounded amazing (time for an early ‘90s Bootleg Series?), and that sort of revelation is everywhere you look.

But the public-facing Center is only the tip of the iceberg (speaking of icebergs, you can also see handwritten early lyrics for “Tempest”). Everything that’s on display still only represents a tiny fraction of the full Dylan archives in Tulsa. So I wanted to learn what else they have.

Not the untold lyric sheets and studio sessions and photos and ephemera, though I’m curious about that too. Since this newsletter focuses on Dylan in concert, I wanted to get more information about their stash of rare and never-heard audio and video recordings of shows, and how fans can hear it.

So I sat down with Parker Fishel, Archivist and Co-Curator of the Bob Dylan Center, to dive deep. No matter how esoteric and specific my questions — and, fair warning, some of them are pretty esoteric and specific — he was a wealth of knowledge.

Again, I am only focusing on live material here, so if you’re looking for more of a broad overview of the Center and archives, I’d check out recent articles in the New York Times and Vanity Fair.

Okay, here’s my conversation with Parker, slightly edited and condensed.

dow, Monday, 9 May 2022 19:10 (seven months ago) link

Great article. Thanks. That 1981 Blowin’ in the Wind footage is incredible.

we only steal from the greatest books (PBKR), Monday, 9 May 2022 20:23 (seven months ago) link

Nice! Thanks dow!

But most of that (1974) tour was recorded

This is especially great news. Except for certain numbers, I never liked Dylan's singing on the later shows, and for the most part that's where all the circulating soundboards have come from. (They're also the source for the official live album.) The earlier show had better performances from him and some better, more interesting songs too - the highlight would be Dylan's solo "Nobody 'Cept You," and if they have at least a soundboard recording of one of the best takes, that would be incredible.

birdistheword, Monday, 9 May 2022 20:41 (seven months ago) link

*earlier shows

birdistheword, Monday, 9 May 2022 20:42 (seven months ago) link

Also that's nuts about Supper Club and other "restricted" material - so we can't see the film/video re-issued until Dylan is dead?

birdistheword, Monday, 9 May 2022 21:14 (seven months ago) link

three weeks pass...

Somewhere in the coverage of this opening was a discussion of the "little red books" of early, revealing Blood On The Tracks lyrics: only a rumor at best for most followers, but the Center's got'em.

dow, Thursday, 2 June 2022 02:52 (six months ago) link

four months pass...

New Bootleg Series Vol. 17, "Fragments: The "Time Out Of Mind" Sessions (1996-1997)" will be out in January, 2023. The compilation will include outtakes and live material, as well as a completely remixed version of the album.

— Definitely Dylan (@DefDylan) October 31, 2022

the pinefox, Tuesday, 1 November 2022 19:07 (one month ago) link

Speculation on another forum is that the format for the 5CDs will be:

Disc 1 - Remix
Disc 2 - Outtakes and Alternates
Disc 3 - Outtakes and Alternates
Disc 4 - Live (1998-2001)
Disc 5 - Bonus Disc: Previously Released (assumption that this will be stuff from Vol. 8 and other places)

a superficial sheeb of intelligence (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Tuesday, 1 November 2022 19:11 (one month ago) link

Nice. Get that Lanois sound out of the mix! (just kidding... sort of)

Reese's Pisces Iscariot (morrisp), Tuesday, 1 November 2022 19:11 (one month ago) link

I love the Lanois sound but on reflection, I would like to hear the LP without it.

I'm not 100% sure if the content of that tweet above is genuine. Are others?

the pinefox, Tuesday, 1 November 2022 20:13 (one month ago) link

Well, the H0ffmanites (lol) are running with it and they've generally been otm with these when the early rumors start to leak. If not the exact details, they've generally always been correct about the focus and general content.

a superficial sheeb of intelligence (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Tuesday, 1 November 2022 21:16 (one month ago) link

I think Jim Dickinson might have sparked interest in a remix decades ago and it snowballed from there. He openly discussed how he didn't like the released mix and how it could've been a whole lot better, and given that it's Lanois producing, quite a few people have speculated what a remix would sound like. The earlier mixdowns of Oh Mercy songs on Tell Tale Signs definitely benefitted from less tinkering by Lanois, so I can see the same thing happening here.

birdistheword, Tuesday, 1 November 2022 21:29 (one month ago) link

think it was Auggie Meyers who heard time out of mind and said "that's not the record I played on!"

i like the lanois murk, but yeah, i also like the more open sound of the tell tale signs stuff, so I can see a remix being good. not a replacement for the original but good.

tylerw, Tuesday, 1 November 2022 21:34 (one month ago) link

I love the album, can’t stand Lanois, but don’t necessarily dislike his production here. There are moments when it feels extremely self-conscious and overbearing — if he’d dialed back the swampy slapback just a little it would be a major improvement. It’s telling that 30+ years after the launch of the Bootleg Series, this is the only time where Dylan’s all, “oh shit, we gotta remix that.”

Montgomery Burns' Jazz (Tarfumes The Escape Goat), Tuesday, 1 November 2022 21:40 (one month ago) link

I actually substituted three tracks from Time Out of Mind on iTunes, but in those cases, it was either a better song ("Red River Shore" over "Make You Feel My Love") or simply a much better performance and arrangement rather than just a remix ("Can't Wait"'s 'studio demo' on Disc 1 of Tell Tale Signs and "Cold Irons Bounds" from the later recording with Charlie Sexton et al on Masked & Anonymous).

Also, Rob Stoner posted something about Dylan on social media recently - apparently he heard an early version of "Make You Feel My Love" way back in 1978! It was one of Dylan's "B songs" - stuff he didn't want to record himself but tried to give to other artists, and what Stoner heard was Dylan playing it on a piano for Robert Gordon, who passed on it and everything else Dylan offered him because they didn't really fit him.

birdistheword, Tuesday, 1 November 2022 21:41 (one month ago) link

xp - Also that "graphic design is my passion" looking ass box is totally in line with recent sets.

a superficial sheeb of intelligence (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Tuesday, 1 November 2022 21:41 (one month ago) link

xp Ha yeah, I saw that. If it's true, that'd be pretty unique for Bob — a few exceptions aside ("Mississippi" for one) he usually leaves old songs behind. It'd be like if he decided to record "Farewell Angelina" for Empire Burlesque.

tylerw, Tuesday, 1 November 2022 21:44 (one month ago) link

I think Lanois productions can be pretty misleading. They're often a lot more "natural" and less tinkered with than people think they are. He's not as much of an Eno as his partnership with Eno would have you believe.

As I understand it, on "Time" Dylan (and/or band) would often record in a room with a relatively clean amp sound, or at least with few effects. But then Lanois would also send the signal to a different room, or through a different amp, with different sounds and effects. And then he could pick and choose and mix between the different setups in the final mix. Something like that, which I imagine means a remix could be pretty fruitful.

Josh in Chicago, Tuesday, 1 November 2022 21:48 (one month ago) link

So, like, Dylan would hear it one way when he played, but it would sound a different way in a different room. Unless I'm confusing it with a different session.

Josh in Chicago, Tuesday, 1 November 2022 21:49 (one month ago) link

I'm not a Dylan fan, but I've really been enjoying listening to selected Jokermen episodes. And I was struck by how remarkably terrible Lanois' production was on some of those records.

Also I'm looking forward to the book, even though I don't write songs or listen to Bob Dylan.

change display name (Jordan), Tuesday, 1 November 2022 22:21 (one month ago) link

TOOM was the first one I bought in the store when it came out, so I'm not sure I can be objective. But do think Dylan's own production post-TOOM is far better.

sometimes you have to drink to kill the paranoia (PBKR), Tuesday, 1 November 2022 22:51 (one month ago) link

think it was Auggie Meyers who heard time out of mind and said "that's not the record I played on!"

Duke Robillard said something to the effect that he played guitar on most of the songs, but the only parts that made the record were bits that bled in from other people's mics. He later got Dylan's permission to record a cover of "Love Sick" using the arrangement they'd started with before Lanois started exercising his influence.

Got the Dylan book today. I like it, but it’s not something I can power through. I think i’ll do a song a day, listening to it first. It’s written in his Theme Time Radio Hour voice, which I appreciate.

Cow_Art, Tuesday, 1 November 2022 23:00 (one month ago) link

apparently he heard an early version of "Make You Feel My Love" way back in 1978! It was one of Dylan's "B songs" -

ha it's def. one of his B (I would even say C) songs

a (waterface), Wednesday, 2 November 2022 12:19 (one month ago) link

I don't care for the song or most of its covers, but the one Adele album I really like is 19 and "Make You Feel My Love" actually fits pretty well in there. Adele makes something of it and it's probably the only time I really enjoy that song from anyone.

birdistheword, Wednesday, 2 November 2022 13:56 (one month ago) link

the Uncut pieces on TooM some of the most hilarious and fascinating reads, hope more stories surface, could read a book on these recordings:

I mean, by that point, Jim Keltner is there playing drums, Brian Blade is there playing drums, and Tony Mangurian is there playing drums – three drummers going on at the same time, five guitar players, pedal steel, organ, piano, all these people. Dan had put together a band, and then Dylan had put out the call for these guys like Jim Dickinson, Augie Meyers, Duke Robillard, Cindy Cashdollar. Dylan brought in all these Nashvile people, and I think that made Dan a little mental having all these Nashville strummers strumming, it was a bit too much. As I’m sure Jim Dickinson has said, there were a lot of ingredients in there that you don’t actually hear on the record, because things were filtered down so we could take a cleaner path on some of them.

corrs unplugged, Sunday, 13 November 2022 15:30 (three weeks ago) link

Time Out of Mind set officially confirmed for release on January 27th.

an icon of a worried-looking, long-haired, bespectacled man (C. Grisso/McCain), Thursday, 17 November 2022 16:12 (three weeks ago) link

Am I correct that a lot of the outtakes already appeared on Vol 8? Or is the version numbering off - for instance on Red River Shore?

The Bankruptcy of the Planet of the Apes (PBKR), Thursday, 17 November 2022 16:40 (three weeks ago) link

Go through the link I posted - all of the Vol. 8 stuff is included, but it's all isolated on Disc Five. Except for one live cut that was used as a B-side, everything else is newly released content.

birdistheword, Thursday, 17 November 2022 16:42 (three weeks ago) link

I did, I just misread the dates of some of the versions and thought they were the same version on the same date. Not sure why they are using version instead of take here (maybe because it's not really a live take with all the protools being used).

The Bankruptcy of the Planet of the Apes (PBKR), Thursday, 17 November 2022 16:48 (three weeks ago) link

Yeah, the "version" tracking is really nebulous. It becomes really confusing with these follow-up releases that cover the same ground.

birdistheword, Thursday, 17 November 2022 17:27 (three weeks ago) link

Turns out that tweet and the speculation about the contents was pretty much dead on.

a superficial sheeb of intelligence (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Thursday, 17 November 2022 17:34 (three weeks ago) link

Jesus, $140 for the 5CD version!

a superficial sheeb of intelligence (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Thursday, 17 November 2022 17:54 (three weeks ago) link

I think that's pretty standard? That's what the 5CD Infidels set cost, which I bought (*checks old email*) around a year ago... tho I had Amoeba credit, and only paid $23.50 out of pocket.

Reese's Pisces Iscariot (morrisp), Thursday, 17 November 2022 18:29 (three weeks ago) link

Maybe it is, but I thought I paid just around $100 for it, could be wrong. I usually tried to time these Dylan boxes with coupons at like Barnes & Noble or whatever. $140 even on Amazon just seemed high at first blush, particularly when one of the five is all previously released.

a superficial sheeb of intelligence (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Thursday, 17 November 2022 18:31 (three weeks ago) link

Unless you want vinyl, I would wait. All of his super deluxe sets eventually come down quite a bit on the secondary market, usually as much as half.

birdistheword, Thursday, 17 November 2022 19:20 (three weeks ago) link

I'm not familiar with the Australian "Highlands" performance that they included. The live version in general beats the album version.

Here's one that name-checks Annie Lennox instead of Neil Young:

birdistheword, Thursday, 17 November 2022 19:21 (three weeks ago) link

I’m pretty excited for the remix; Lanois’ mix is definitive but I’ve often wanted to push aside the murk. Such a pillar of his catalogue.

assert (matttkkkk), Thursday, 17 November 2022 19:39 (three weeks ago) link

xp exception to the rule:

corrs unplugged, Thursday, 17 November 2022 21:01 (three weeks ago) link

look forward to (more) alternate versions of Mississippi, Cold Irons Bound, Highlands

corrs unplugged, Thursday, 17 November 2022 21:04 (three weeks ago) link

price will come down, I'm sure. Looks good! And that "Love Sick" sounds sick! was revisiting Tell Tale Signs this week and it was definitely getting me fired up for more.

Sort of optimistic about the live disc maybe opening the floodgates for more curated neverending tour kinda things. Maybe it won't happen, but it would be cool!

tylerw, Friday, 18 November 2022 00:05 (three weeks ago) link

I hope so too but there's a Rolling Stone interview from September 2017 that suggested such a release may not be worth it because the bootlegs out there may sound better:

NEVER-ENDING TOUR: Future chapters of the Bootleg Series might chronicle [...] some sort of examination of the Never Ending Tour. The latter is a particularly challenging project since it involves over 2,800 concerts between 1988 and the present day. Dylan's road crew has been recording shows dating back to the beginning of the Never Ending Tour, but the quality of them up until the mid-2000's is less than stellar. "Some of them are recorded on DAT or other formats of the moment," says the source. "Who knew they wouldn't last? For a lot of years during the 1990s, there were these two fans and they would go and each would wear recording equipment in their hats and they'd sit in different sections so that the stuff would be stereo. Those tapes sound better than our board tapes." (September 2017)

On Tell Tale Signs, the stuff recorded after Charlie Sexton left in 2002 sounds GREAT, but it's telling that "Lonesome Day Blues" sounds like an audience recording with some additional processing.

birdistheword, Friday, 18 November 2022 04:30 (three weeks ago) link

for me Tell Tale Signs is the most revelatory and allround enjoyable bootleg series release since 1-3 (honourable mentions vol. 4 aka The "Royal Albert Hall" Concert and Another Self Portrait)

Love Sick version 2 perhaps a bit dragging but great sound! (not a big fan of the song itself hehe)

corrs unplugged, Friday, 18 November 2022 09:27 (three weeks ago) link

That Love Sick is fun.

TOOM was the first Dylan album to be released after I had become a superfan, so it made a big impact. I still didn't know his post-Desire stuff that well and the story was he had just nearly died from the heart infection, so I had pretty low expectations. Love Sick seemed like such a surprise gut-punch way to start the album - all menace, murk, and croak. I still remember where I was when my friend played it for me. I turned to him 30 seconds in and said, "who is this guy, Lazarus?"

The Bankruptcy of the Planet of the Apes (PBKR), Friday, 18 November 2022 12:41 (three weeks ago) link

His voice had been getting thinner and drier in ways which led everyone to write him off as a spent force, and then I heard this album and realised oh shit, this is a whole new kind of power. So many songs are all time favourites, “Not Dark Yet”, “Highlands”, “Can’t Wait”, “Dirt Road Blues”, “Cold Irons Bound”. And then the absolute turd in the soup, “To Make You Feel My Love“.

assert (matttkkkk), Friday, 18 November 2022 13:49 (three weeks ago) link

Lanois may deserve some of the credit, I know at minimum he used the exact same mic he used for Oh Mercy, but it really helps that Oh Mercy was the first "quiet" album Dylan had done in a while where the songs are hushed and he isn't singing over a band that's completely rocking out. (It's more impressive with Time Out of Mind because they had so many people playing at once.)

I really like his voice on these two tracks from that third disc on the deluxe Tell Tale Signs that cost way too much money - a lighter mix of "Most of the Time" that I would've preferred for the final album and the same take of "Ring Them Bells" without the shimmering overdubs:

birdistheword, Friday, 18 November 2022 15:15 (three weeks ago) link

"Some of them are recorded on DAT or other formats of the moment," says the source. "Who knew they wouldn't last?

My experience may be unique and/or super lucky, but I have DATs from 1995-2006 that I recently backed up, and out of 100+ tapes there were maybe 4-5 brief (less then a second) dropouts.

Montgomery Burns' Jazz (Tarfumes The Escape Goat), Friday, 18 November 2022 17:15 (three weeks ago) link

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