People who talk about music but don't own a record player: C/D

It's not the player that takes up the space, it's the records I'd play on it (currently dwelling in several trunks in my mother's basement out on Long Island and in a mini-storage space in Lower Manhattan).

That said, if you're talking about buying new albums on vinyl instead of cd, you're being an assclown. The prices are about the same so there's no specific listening advantage, unless you're planning on using the records to DJ. This thread would make a lot more sense if Paunchy had particular points instead of some vague notion of these vinyl discs holding some sort of magic. Make points! Defend them!

I'm going with "possibly classic" for the topic as a whole. Unless you're talking about "music" as some canonical concept where you need an understanding of EVERYTHING to have a good discussion (and I seriously doubt you've listened to everything!) then it's possible to talk about music from owning a radio!

In practical terms of the music (not the cultural significance of the record buying/historical/listening process), and to my (apparently solid-state) ears, and on my non-audiophile record player, unintentional artefacts are the primary difference. I guess I just don't hear the "warmth" of vinyl or the "flatness" of CDs. Educate me as to the other big differences.

Why do people buy "digitally remastered" vinyl?

Hahaha awesome. C/D: people who say, "yeah, I like music," but pretty much just listen to the radio/video?

I'd be willing to bet that the most (illegally, legally) downloaded music is the same stuff that's pimped on corporate radio--the "mp3 revolution" has only increased music geekery by 1 or 2 percent. ; )

Since I seem like I'm already set on creating some points that could have been used to support this thread...

Vinyl makes you physically interact with the recorded medium in order to continue listening to an album. In a way, there's an art of sequencing that's been diminished or lost in the introduction of long-playing (or in the case of mp3, nearly infinitely long-playing) albums. Any album that was originally well-sequenced for vinyl reproduction is going to have breaking points when you have to flip over the record. The same applies to tapes, multiple CD sets, etc, although length is less of an issue in those cases. Instead of listening to an album as songs and as a whole, you can quantify it as songs, sides, and as a whole. It's just another breakdown.

ask around town. maybe you can find someone with a good stereo and some good records that will let you into their house. you never know.

This is OTM. I'm talking about the sheer amount music available on vinyl that isn't available anywhere else. And the amazing economy of buying music this way -- even when it's rare vinyl, it's usually cheaper than a rare Japanese import CD.

And anyway, fuck all that. Walk into a shitty used record store and buy something -- anything. The Osmonds. The Carpenters. What-the-fuck-ever. You'll pay less than a dollar and learn something about pop, instead of paying $16 and learning nothing about whatever it is you think you're an expert in.

Talking with a friend elsewhere at the moment, she is putting forward (in a way that I take as earnest) the "romance factor" of buying music--old, or new--on vinyl (in addition to the "sounds better than CD" argument).

Anyone willing to stand up for the "romance factor" of vinyl, as something that would make you prefer to buy vinyl over CDs?

x-post

And anyway, fuck all that. Walk into a shitty used record store and buy something -- anything. The Osmonds. The Carpenters. What-the-fuck-ever. You'll pay less than a dollar and learn something about pop, instead of paying $16 and learning nothing about whatever it is you think you're an expert in.

I think I'm managing to listen broadly enough without wasting time/space on the Osmonds. Buying something just because it's cheap doesn't mean you've gotten value for your money; hearing something/anything is not inherently an expanding process. Discrimination is essential, as long as it's not a set-in-stone prejudice. But all that has little to do with vinyl, really. . .

For me, as a person who changes cities, even "cheaper" vinyl eventually becomes a very real consideration of the cost of moving/storing it all from place to place. I also don't use much air conditioning or heating--which, I assume, would not be good for a large collection of vinyl (or even the vinyl I have, probably).

Hahahaha. Ok, you weren't pretending. . .

ask around town. maybe you can find someone with a good stereo and some good records that will let you into their house. you never know.

Also, there is lots of good vinyl vs CD vs mp3 comparison/discussion on these threads:

How are Hi-Fi Magazines Dealing with MP3s?
100 albums that sound better on vinyl..

Personally, I have a slight distrust of anyone who claims to be a big music fan but doesn't own any vinyl or show any interest in it. It's kind of like meeting a guy who doesn't drink beer or watch sports ... maybe "distrust" isn't the right word, but it makes you think "OK, this is a bit strange, no?".

Surely, there's an ageist element here -- in another 20 years, maybe vinyl will be even less a part of the music-lover's vocabulary.

Audiophiles have classist overtones. The record store around the corner that sells anything in the world used, for next to no money -- that has nothing to do with class. That's all about getting music.

You guys like music, right?

X-post

It's kind of like meeting a guy who doesn't drink beer or watch sports ... maybe "distrust" isn't the right word, but it makes you think "OK, this is a bit strange, no?".

I don't drink or watch sports, but I don't feel the need to tell anyone else they shouldn't. Nor do I feel the need to respect anyone who feels the need to label me for not partaking myself. They don't have to associate with me, but they can also keep their mouths shut as do I.

-- Paunchy Stratego (fluxion2...), July 17th, 2005.

Everything is about class. And I only listen to The Fall.

i can assure you that in my case the cheaper prices are a major factor in my decision.

xpost: But do you listen to sports on the radio, at least?

i have friends that i've tried to encourage to buy record players, since i think it does open up another world music-wise, but some people are more "on the go" music listeners and don't have time to sit around and listen to the vinyl they've collected. hell, i don't have that time! so if people like records, cool, if not, cool.

I still relish time spent *just* listening to music--but even then, I like it to be literally just the music. Thre's not an emotional/nostalgic appeal to me in preparing the vinyl, flipping it over half way, etc.

x-post

i went back to the salvation army the other day and they had the same 20 vikki carr LPs they had before.

Well, in case you're ever uncertain whether you're meeting your "crap" quota, and your opinions may be in danger of unstable unreliability levels. . .

Fuck cleaning something everytime i want to listen to it.

All in good fun. Except maybe you?

http://www.yoursongscollectibles.com/item-542.jpg

hehe

Actually, if "people who don't know music theory who make music with people who do: C/D" were the question, I'd go big up C.

There's digital mastering and then there's digital mastering. Studios these days are using much better digital recording techniques than were available when the CD format was invented. The information often gets dumbed-down when it's mastered for CD. The vinyl, in these cases, could sound better than the CD.

"you'd have to ask someone on ilm who i have sent a tape to if they sound okay though."

They sound great!

In the sense that a record is like a high-quality negative and a CD is, at best, like a non-compressed digital photo---no matter how big the digital photo, if you soom in you eventually see pixels, whereas with a negative you can blow up a print to almost any size?

That makes sense--literal, perfect analogue should half "all" the information. But what record players/hi-fi's/listening rooms can fully take advantage?

That makes sense--literal, perfect analogue should half "all" the information. But what record players/hi-fi's/listening rooms can fully take advantage?

Except that physics limits the amount of information you can extract from a source. LEARN 1 INFORMATION THEORY

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Information_Theory

I've sold a lot of my LPs out of necessity, moving around the country and out of it. I keep a core collection of about 200 must-haves, mostly original classics from 1976-1987. I don't have a record player right now, but I do plan to get one eventually.

I know what all that old music sounds like on vinyl, but right now I'm content with MP3s for the sheer convenience.