Throbbing Gristle: RFI

"Evocation"? Oh, shut me up already.

YOU DARE MOCK ME?

Hm...you could always look for the suitcase with twenty-three live shows on tape in it.

they shared a squat in Hull in the 70s with his girlfriend.

apparently they were a bit strange.

I also like "Grief" which seems to mostly be interviews with a young P-Orridge mixed together with various noises and funny sounding radio personalities, but I think this is probably not going to be of much interest to the casual TG listener.

If you're looking for something that akin to synthpop, but just "off" enough, then "20 Jazz Funk Greats" is the one to get.

Something in between? "The Second Annual Report" or the others around it.

I have "TG1", but I don't listen to it often enough to make a recommendation.

Though they did coin the term "industrial", please PLEASE don't think of Throbbing Gristle as anything that approximates, say, Front 242 or Nitzer Ebb or Front Line Assembly or that lot. Not that I mind the latter groups (or most of them anyway), but the early 80s Deutsch Amerikanische Freundschaft records are a more direct influence on 80s and 90s "industrial" dance music... or the Wax Trax! era, or what have you.

I'm having trouble sleeping. ("Our aim is wakefulness.")

the records :

2nd Annual Report -- arguably their most revolting record, except that TG communicate that feeling quite effectively and quite deliberately -- you may not need to hear that record more than once and arguably might not wish to be caught owning it, but it certainly explains the initial public fuss, while cutting to the chase -- really three very well realised music sequences

3rd Annual/DoA -- more bitsy and a truer "report" of "experiments" in "rock music", like the situationalist "Death Threats" (left by members of the public on TGs answer phone), or the borish found art "IBM" (sound of TG jamming with a computer tape), "Hamburger Lady" (comment/song as expoitation tabloid trash) -- also includes a piece by each member on their own, and since they all went on to do diverse/perverse stuff, some insight -- lots of ideas

20 Jazz Funk Greats -- one of the first deliberate and self-conscious cringe/camp records -- quite cool subverted song forms, as has been noted in thread -- again lots of ideas

Heathen Earth -- attempted "honest" live in studio record -- goes on a bit, and with none of the immaculate cut'n'paste of previous records in the name of said honesty, not their best gig -- i don't think the songs really cut it

Mission of Dead Souls -- like if you'd recorded Rotten's last Pistols gig, this'd be it -- a real bad gig, badly recorded -- the ultimate "bad live album" -- like, if you buy it you're a completist, dummy

and then the campy "Greatest Hits" collecting the wacky singles like Zyclon B Zombie, Subhuman, Adrenalin, Discipline etc. (how handy) -- the mute re-issues of the 5 "classic" TG records listed above appended most of these singles anyway, if you really need to ..

and then all the posthumous smelly corpse stuff -- out-takes, live successes, ie more of the same, but not concept albums, not part of the "classic 5", with the exception of "TG1", one of the very first "alternative" CDs released to the new and very slowly emerging CD market, and so collectible -- listening to it will drive you mad bored if you do not have ADHD -- flogging the horse via new format cash-in

all designed to present a truly alternative view of record buying and collecting fashions, fetishes, follies ...

all in all a brief (4 years I think) but well constructed performance art commentary on the record industry (studio name "Death Factory") naff seediness and useful/negative real rock music as commentary on Thatcher, sex crimes, some peoples lives are _really_ shitty etc.. -- like one of the more intelligent things to ride on the punk wave

industrial music -- TG coined the phrase in '76-'77, written on the notes to 2nd Annual Report -- mocking the big "industry" surrounding what's meant to be "art"

these days the "industrial" niche market represented at it's most cynical by Nine Inch Nails types is just frustrated-adolescent music and if it does say anything about "music", well it's already been said

conclusion: listen to TG records and CDs and the offshoots like Chris&Cosey, PTV, Coil at some rabid collector's house -- why have an art installation on permanent repeat in yr living room, especially if the "art" is so rooted in its times and the "truths" aren't so pretty ?

I own it on vinyl. I've heard it once.

Introduction/ Very Friendly (I.C.A., London, 18th October 1976)
Forced Entry (Nuffield Theatre, Southampton, 7th May 1977)
Assume Power Focus (Rat Club, London, 17th December 1977)
IBM/ It's Always The Way/ Hamburger Lady (Goldsmiths College, London, 18th May 1978)
Mother Spunk (Industrial Training College, Wakefield, 1st July 1978)
New After Cease To Exist Soundtrack (London Film Makers Co-Op, 6th July 1978)
Introduction/ Whistling Song (The Crypt Club, London, 11th November 1978)
Weapon Training/ See You Are/ Convincing People (The Factory, Manchester, 18th May 1979)
Russ (Goldsmiths College, London, 13th March 1980)
Trained Condition Of Obedience (SO36 Club, Berlin, 7th November 1980)
Auschwitz (Rafters, Manchester, 4th December 1980)

Note how they drop off towards the end of the group's existence. Psychic TV were an embarassment. Coil and Chris/Cosey are merely dull.

"20 Jazz Funk Greats" is a fun album, very clever and eclectic - recommended for beginners while lacking the ferocity of primetime TG.

'heathen earth' is really good. kraftwerk's evil cousin.

This would seem to be the main thing a book about T.G. should struggle to avoid. Oh well.

c'mon jess...persuasion and hamburger lady get there too!

there's one way though, that you'll never convince people
and that's when you try to be someone who's not telling
and who's trying to compel, who is trying to tell you of what to be convinced of

I can't stop listening to 20 Jazz Funk Greats. I haven't heard anything else by Throbbing Gristle. DoA is next on the list, but what else should I check out by other groups? Did anyone else ever come close to sounding this good?

start with SPK's leichenschrei. there's lots of good industrial from that time period. early cab voltaire, test dept, einsturzende. there's gotta be a thread, no?

also, you need TG's very friendly.

all ILMers are courteously invited to attend:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2093/2416070319_f47d621bf8.jpg

this will be a Very Friendly DJ set and book reading.

Looks like a good gig, I wish I could attend.

I bought the DVD box :)

Ok, so everyone knows not to expect Front Line Assembly when they pick up TG. Still, inevitably in a discussion about TG, one gets the impression that they were just some proto-power electronics ugly pig-fucking noisefest. Even people who listen to them, or at least are familiar with the music, seem to carry this impression. I was glad to see the new(est) record destroy that legend- because even in the older material, there's as much Kraftwerk and Martin Denny influence as there is pipe-welding guitar and klangklang tape loops. My favorite record is probably DOA: The Third and Final Report. The solo tracks grew on me where they didn't catch me right away (especially "Weeping" - Gen's pathetic suicidal solo), there's the infamous weirdness of "Hamburger Lady," the solid pop of "United," the ceaselessly hilarious "Death Threats," along with the painful "Walls of Sound" and "Blood on The Floor." I mean, you just can't go wrong when you shutup and listen.

buddha gristle machine

http://cdn.pitchfork.com/media/gristleism215__.jpg

2010 dates!!

23rd OCTOBER LONDON VILLAGE UNDERGROUND, UK

30th OCTOBER PRAGUE ARCHA THEATRE, Czech Republic

2nd NOVEMBER BOLOGNA THEATRE ARENA DEL SOLE, Italy

6th NOVEMBER PORTO CASA MUSICA, Portugal

TG WILL PERFORM AN ALL NEW SET USING NEW EXPERIMENTAL ELECTRONIC EQUIPMENT,
SPICED WITH A COUPLE OF OLD FAVOURITE TRACKS.

THESE SHOWS ARE THE ONLY LIVE PERFORMANCES TG ANTICIPATE PLAYING THIS YEAR.

did anyone go to the london show?

Looks like it may have been their last, they have split up again

from twitter :

@chris_carter_ Chris Carter
⚡ ⚡ ⚡ we are about to make a SIGNIFICANT ANNOUNCEMENT REGARDING THROBBING GRISTLE ⚡ ⚡ ⚡

Raymond WHAT

you just need to start at the beginning with 2nd Annual Report and go in order, don't sleep on the singles

here:

2nd Annual Report LP (Nov. '77)
United/Zyklon B Zombie 7" (May 1978)
D.O.A Third And Final Report LP (Dec. 4 1978)
We Hate You Little Girls/Five Knuckle Shuffle 7" (May 1979)
20 Jazz Funk Greats LP (Dec. 1979)
Heathen Earth LP (June 1980)
Adrenalin/Distant Dreams/Subhuman/Something Came Over Me dual 7" release (Oct. 23 1980)

and then move on to the live stuff if you like this

other opinions may vary! "Thee Psychick Sacrifice" in its original 2Lp format is prob my fave live document

I only got into them a few years ago and this 2 disc comp was the perfect gsteway:

https://www.discogs.com/Throbbing-Gristle-Throbbing-Gristles-Greatest-Hits-Entertainment-Through-Pain/release/14103048

I'd take 2nd Annual Report over all their other records put together; they were one of these groups like Buffalo Springfield, whose members were pulling in so many different directions, that they started falling apart almost immediately. Their debut is the one where it feels like they all have a common goal - scary space music.

oh c'mon, Heathen Earth is just as coherent imo

Second annual report sounds pretty great so far

Are those anniversary 2cds from about 10yrs ago still available. Just occurring to me that I heard TG pretty much invented the limited edition in rock or industrial music. & those paired studio lp, bonus which I think included contemporary singles to whichever lp plus I think a relevant live set to each lp.

I'd take 2nd Annual Report over all their other records put together; they were one of these groups like Buffalo Springfield, whose members were pulling in so many different directions, that they started falling apart almost immediately.

That might be what happened with Buffalo Springfield but that's not what happened with TG and, whether it is or not, they both made great records anyway. TG's official four albums are great. The live stuff defines YMMV.

Don't think I've ever heard a note of TG to this day, despite being into (or having been into in the past) everything else you'd think would lead to TG fandom. I've always been put off by Genesis P-Orridge's obnoxious personality, to the point where I'd resent actually liking anything he'd ever been involved with so I avoid it. I'm determined to keep this state of affairs going until my dying day.

There's a lot to dislike when it comes to GPO but I can't imagine my life without TG having been in it. So much joy. So much! There is something for almost everyone and even my 84 year old stepmother is a bit partial to some "Heathen Earth".

I don't mind TG but joy is not at all the word I would associate with them.

They have given me so much joy was my point. But hey, if you ever get a chance to see Throbbing Gristle ‎Live At Oundle School, that is a whole lot of joy right there.

I'm sure there's a link above somewhere but I wrote about the 2011 reissues when they came out. Heathen Earth remains my pick.

A friend made me cdrs of various releases back around 2004 or so. I dipped a toe in but not much of an impression was made. Maybe I just wasn’t in the right head space then.

Would have been good to get some more perspectives as good as Art Sex Magic from those involved. Would also be great if that Wreckers Of Civilisation book had reappeared when it was advertised to do so.
Not sure how reliable a narrator Gen would be judging by Cosi's descriptio

so today I learned from Ugly Things that two 7" EPs of some "I Hear A New World" tracks were released in small quantities in 1960 as demo records for stereo shops, so CC could definitely have heard them later that decade

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0012950?fbclid=IwAR3q2xXunpXCosGV5JwPl7Tugj33Ole0sR3r0TT-Mi4JHYE28pGTMmQX2Z4

The credits on the page made me laugh - Sleazy as played by Mr Peter Christopherson

Surprised to see Spydee Gasmantell is still being played by Spydee Gasmantell though.

Shame it's the usual BBC 60 minute edit and not the full 80 mins runtime...

bump - tonight

no way to see the 80 minute version?

I enjoyed this. So many hairy people!

welp it's about time to jump in.

20 Jazz Greats, here we go

jealous. i'd love to be hearing it for the 1st time.

good choice. definitely in my wheelhouse.

what should I go to next?

either DOA or Heathen Earth imo

was this the first TG you heard? def interested in your thoughts

i'd go Heathen Earth next. also interested to hear your thoughts.

Heathen Earth seconded.

I really enjoyed it. Especially the noisier,more abrasive stuff, like "Still Walking". I'm a dude who used to enjoy listening to our old beat up lawnmower as a kid because of its weird buzzsaw sound so I like that angle.

More traditional tuneful stuff like "Hot on Heels of Love" and "Walkabout" were great too. And I like the stoney stuff as well. Definitely my wheelhouse (and def my first TG!)

Droney not stoney lol

decided to do both DoA and Heathen Earth

"IBM" is off to a great start

"Dead on Arrival", yes yes YESSSSSSSSSSSSS

"Hamburger Lady" is the thing of beautiful nightmares, that creepy quiet drumbeat underneath barely contained chaos. I guess this is one of their most famous ones?

surprised I slept on TG so long.

But now you understand the greatness. Anyway, read Drew's book now.

Something I've been wondering for a while now - how did they get away with the images of children on the sleeve and booklet of DOA? Now I don't know what the legal definition of child porn is exactly but I would not be surprised if it would be possible to make a case that those images count. As far as I know nobody's ever tried to stop them being distributed.

I got the 2011 reissue of this album when I was working in the civil service and had it posted to my work. Freaked out a bit when I got it home and realised that I'd just arranged for pictures of semi-naked kiddies to be delivered to a government building

it was the daughter of a friend of GPO iirc. i have the OG vinyl but maybe i'm missing an insert or something as there are no semi-naked pics in my copy.

looking on discogs i see it originally came with a calendar that contains aforementioned image. i guess whomever owned my copy originally kept that.

foiud online -

in a RE/Search book P-orridge remarks that he enjoys the idea that everyone has re-interpreted the photo as having a pedophiliac subtext because he didn't intend that when he took the photos. it fits well within their position on how art is subjective and says more about the viewer than the artist. "We're interested in information, and the fact that your view of things can totally alter depending on how you look at it, or by what people tell you about it afterwards."

found

oh yeah, i have that re/search book. it's the one with burroughs on the cover, split in thirds between burroughs, gysin and TG (really mostly about genesis)

snapped a pic of the relevant page w/ my phone, can scan the article if you like but assume this is prob enough for you

https://i.ibb.co/qxr7qWG/2-FF6847-F-11-F4-4-D37-9-B53-B1195-D0744-CF.jpg

Ta, I did know that the wee girl was a daughter of a Polish friend and that TG put them in to raise questions about context and interpretation and all that stuff. Just surprised nobody tried to ban the artwork or made more of a fuss about it

well, it was quite a small initiasl pressing - 3000 copies and 1000 of those were sold by TG directly, and only those 1000 contained the calendar image.

i must have bought this circa 1984 (second hand without calendar image, as previously mentioned) and it never crossed my mind at all that there was anything about it that was shocking. maybe that says something about my teenage naievety but i also think that was probably the general concensus at the time and also that the audience who would ever have even seen a copy would not be the types to go about trying to have it banned.

however, i do remember a friend showing me the og sleeve to the scorpions virgin killer album around this same time and being very shocked by it.

i think i may have devloped middle age dyslexia.

As confrontational as TG wanted to be they were never as shocking as Loverboy.

similar to stirmonster I had the DOA album in the 80s and never gave a second thought to it, lending it out to friends etc. maybe they were less naïve and thought I was a creep with my creepy albums!
the Hatsunekaidan album (a collab between Hatsune Miku and Hijokaidan) has a cover which parodies the Scorpions one
https://www.discogs.com/release/8171232-Hatsunekaidan-Noisy-Killer

Not seen that Scorpions cover before, fuck me

Amazing that weirdos will try to trick people into paying £7 for an AI-written essay, check the cover out though.

https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/61GNTsue6YL._SL1499_.jpg

gahhhhhh

Gen looking like an extremely ugly version of Mick Tucker from Sweet there.

... or Andy Scott, one of the two.