Velvet Underground Trainspotting Question

Message Bookmarked
Bookmark Removed
A couple years back a friend of mine gave me the deluxe banana album reissue with the stereo and mono mix. Last weekend I hooked up my hi-fi and decided to listen to it again. I've managed to misplace the mono disc and so put in the stereo version.

On Femme Fatale the Lou back-up vocals ("she's a femme fatale") are barely audible, it might as well not be there, and on Sunday Morning there's a guitar part that's missing (during the swirly instrumental break I swear there used to be a chugging "lead" or whatever you call it over top the backwards sounding bit). Anyway, the question is: Is this supposed to be like this or have I botched the hook up of my stereo and have only one channel playing through both speakers?

laurence kansas (lawrence kansas), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:03 (sixteen years ago) link

test your stereo with white light/white heat. If either the music or the story are missing from "The Gift" then your stereo is mono.

The Argunaut (sexyDancer), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:25 (sixteen years ago) link

argh, I don't have white light/white heat

laurence kansas (lawrence kansas), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:28 (sixteen years ago) link

Go out and buy white light/white heat. test your stereo with it. If either the music or the story are missing from "The Gift" then your stereo is mono.

Sonny, Ah!!1 (Sonny A.), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:34 (sixteen years ago) link

before quibbling about stereo/mono differences, you might want to check that one out.
it's good.

The Argunaut (sexyDancer), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:35 (sixteen years ago) link

You probably don't have "The Murder Mystery" either, but if you did, you could check whether you had different storylines coming out off either speaker.

Ken L (Ken L), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:35 (sixteen years ago) link

Wait, you can use the first few seconds of "Sunday Morning" - the glockenspiel or what-have-you is on the right channel and then the bass comes in on the left.

Ken L (Ken L), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:37 (sixteen years ago) link

Or just check the wiring...

W i l l (common_person), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:39 (sixteen years ago) link

One of your speakers is out of phase i.e. you have the wires in the wrong way round.

MGrout, Monday, 28 February 2005 16:42 (sixteen years ago) link

could be! I just threw the wires back there without any regard at all.

laurence kansas (lawrence kansas), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:44 (sixteen years ago) link

are you sure you're a trainspotter?

The Argunaut (sexyDancer), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:45 (sixteen years ago) link

Behind my receiver is a dark and lonely place- I'll have to do this by candelight because I have no flashlight. All of you will be in my prayers!

laurence kansas (lawrence kansas), Monday, 28 February 2005 16:53 (sixteen years ago) link

not even a spelunker!

The Argunaut (sexyDancer), Monday, 28 February 2005 17:18 (sixteen years ago) link

Agunaunt, I am defined by what I am not. My secret is out!

laurence kansas (lawrence kansas), Monday, 28 February 2005 17:28 (sixteen years ago) link

arg!

laurence kansas (lawrence kansas), Monday, 28 February 2005 17:28 (sixteen years ago) link

REVIVE!

UPDATE: My speaker wire was connected to the right main and right remote outputs. I fixed the problem.

I'd like to thank everyone who was with me from the beginning, without your help this project may have never been completed. I'm confident that with the teamwork displayed in the last couple of days our dream of sending an ex-member of the Velvet Underground to the moon will soon become a reality.

golden ears kansas (lawrence kansas), Tuesday, 1 March 2005 14:07 (sixteen years ago) link

EVEREST IS OUR FOOT STOOL

The Argunaut (sexyDancer), Tuesday, 1 March 2005 14:11 (sixteen years ago) link

I thought that was Everett?

mark grout (mark grout), Tuesday, 1 March 2005 15:00 (sixteen years ago) link

I go to school with J0hn C4le's daughter, 3d3n; she is kind've a twat.

Ian John50n (orion), Tuesday, 1 March 2005 15:29 (sixteen years ago) link

ian wins "post of the day" so far.

peter smith (plsmith), Tuesday, 1 March 2005 15:31 (sixteen years ago) link

xpost:
Who's the mom, B3+53y J0hn50n?

Ken L (Ken L), Tuesday, 1 March 2005 15:39 (sixteen years ago) link

No, some other silly tart, Rise?

Dadaismus (Dada), Tuesday, 1 March 2005 15:40 (sixteen years ago) link

four years pass...

This seems as good a place as any to ask this question ... has anybody bought that new VU seven inch singles thing that Sundazed just put out? I don't really want to buy it, BUT: the mix of "I Heard Her Call My Name" is apparently vastly different. Would like to hear this ... mp3 anywhere?

tylerw, Saturday, 10 October 2009 00:16 (twelve years ago) link

haha I was wondering which thread to revive to discuss the "Nuns Are On The Seawall" blog...

i.e Velvets bootlegs S/D

the 'Ultimate Mono and Acetates Album' has some of those singles but not all. it does have the mono WL/WH which is really different at least on Lady Godiva's Operation, I guess I should listen to it. that may be the version of "Call My Name" you refer to.

also loving:

the Pre-VU Preview, all the demos of early 60's Reed/Cale pop music
Problems In Urban Living (Cleveland 68)
CDs from a certain minimalist composr who shall remain anonymous

sleeve, Saturday, 10 October 2009 00:24 (twelve years ago) link

Yeah, I've got that Ultimate Mono Acetates thing -- from what I understand, this mix of "Heard" is unheard until now? Less of Lou's guitar, more of the band. Or something ... But anyway -- yeah! Pre-VU is crazy, really incredible. Drop in some references to methamphetamine and "Do The Ostrich" could be on White Light/White Heat, easy. Crazy that, according to the Unterberger VU Day By Day book, there's a solo version of "Heroin" recorded during the Pickwick era. Probably sounds similar to the versions on the 1st disc of "Peel Slowly" but I'd still love to hear it.

tylerw, Saturday, 10 October 2009 00:30 (twelve years ago) link

I've got it on order, will let you know...

Mark G, Saturday, 10 October 2009 13:23 (twelve years ago) link

Cool!
Someone over on the Velvet Forum sez: "the mix of I Heard Her Call My Name is insane. At first I thought that there was a mistake in the pressing as Lou's opening vocals ("here comes count down...' ) are way down in the mix and actually sound muffled. Then they pick up a little with 'Ever since...'. Sterling's guitar is up and so it Cale's bass. For the first 30 seconds or so it sounds like a kind of lo-fi garage sound and then later the sound gets bigger with more of the impact we know. But overall the balance is restored so that you can hear Sterling's lovely rhythm guitar work and Cale's bass, which is really great. Cale's bass sound is amazing on this mix and then also makes you realised how low the bass is in the mix on most of the White Light LP."

tylerw, Saturday, 10 October 2009 16:02 (twelve years ago) link

Hmm
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0847833550/ref=pe_5050_13305760_snp_dp
$189
Little bit annoying that they're putting out all of this collector-bait stuff these days and not putting out unreleased stuff. Or barely any unreleased stuff.

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:16 (twelve years ago) link

A while ago, I did my own mix of "Heard Her Call My Name" with less Lou and more of the band just for fun, anyone can do it

The Prince's choice: making a brush. (Tom D.), Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:19 (twelve years ago) link

ysi?

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:20 (twelve years ago) link

From that Velvet Forum, here's a list of uncirculated VU stuff that seems to actually exist.

-The demo tape Cale took to England
-Summit High School tape
-Bizarre footage
-Delmonico´s tape
-Boston Tea Party footage(any news on this, by the way?)
-La Cave 68 tape
-Hippodrome 68 tape
-Nelson Video tape 70
-Rhode Island School of Design, Providence, Rhode Island
-May 11, 1965 Pickwick Studios, near Long Island City, New York
-Donald Jackson VU footage
-Danny Williams VU footage
-The Primitives tape
-Ronald Nameth Vu footage
-Matrix Tapes
-Seattle 69 tape

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:22 (twelve years ago) link

I don't know how to do that! (xp)

-The demo tape Cale took to England

I'd be surprised if this still existed! Very! The Matrix Tapes is what we want!!!!!

The Prince's choice: making a brush. (Tom D.), Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:24 (twelve years ago) link

xpost

what the hell is that? a 304-page hardback book, yeah, but what about the single with it?

hate it when Amazon has no info about the product.

and hey that Seattle 69 show is on the Nuns Are On The Seawall blog, it's listed as Retinal Circus. first new show (to me) to surface since the Gymnasium.

sleeve, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:24 (twelve years ago) link

!!! Had no idea ... Thanks! Is it good?

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:27 (twelve years ago) link

more from that Velvet Forum:
-the full Gymnasium tape
-the cale/sterling/reed rehearsals from cale loft 1966
-uncut recent Factory 66 tape

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:30 (twelve years ago) link

here's a list of uncirculated VU stuff that seems to actually exist.

i'm still hoping that footage of them on Upbeat! shows up somewhere. Lots of clips from that show are in circulation, but considering they made a handful of appearances i'm surprised nothing's around. About one of the shows: "The Velvets performed live on the Upbeat TV show in June 1968 (not June 1967). Moreover, contrary to Sterling Morrison's recollection, they performed a blistering, buzzsaw version of Run Run Run. Their rendition of Run Run Run went beyond their alloted time: thus, Upbeat cut away to a commercial while the Velvets were engaged in feedback frenzy with Lou's back to the camera."

city worker, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:32 (twelve years ago) link

that would be awesome. There was some comment (I think from Moe Tucker) that she couldn't believe, with all the cameras the Warhol crew had going all the time, no one just filmed a straight ahead version of one of the EPI shows.

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:37 (twelve years ago) link

Is it good?

here's wl/wh:

http://www.sendspace.com/file/8j4j7c

it's a soundboard!!! the only one I know of besides those Matrix tapes. as a result the vox are too loud and the guitars a bit subdued, but the overall recording is much clearer. I still think Problems In Urban Living (Cleveland Oct. 68) is my favorite live boot, love the guitar sound on that.

sleeve, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:47 (twelve years ago) link

that's a flac btw

sleeve, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:48 (twelve years ago) link

Already downloading from The Nuns site ... So weird that this stuff just keeps showing up. One thing I'm super interested in (that hasn't seen the light of day afaik) is a studio version of "Beginning to See the Light" with Cale.

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:50 (twelve years ago) link

WHAT????!??!

The Prince's choice: making a brush. (Tom D.), Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:51 (twelve years ago) link

those Velvets Forum trainspotters mean business man.

sleeve, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:52 (twelve years ago) link

http://www.paulvates.com/images/gatwickshuttle.jpg

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:54 (twelve years ago) link

But yeah, the "Beginning" with Cale is mentioned in the Unterberger book - recorded at the "Mr. Rain" session apparently? With "fuzz bass"? There was talk of it appearing on a projected WL/WH "deluxe edition, I think. Which never came out obv.

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 15:55 (twelve years ago) link

LOL, yeah, obv.

The Prince's choice: making a brush. (Tom D.), Thursday, 15 October 2009 16:01 (twelve years ago) link

But ... maybe now that this singles set has come out, there's a chance of more VU material coming out officially? I think I read that Lou wasn't into having any more live stuff come out.

tylerw, Thursday, 15 October 2009 16:03 (twelve years ago) link

Hmmm, so I'm listening to this "Retinal Circus" VU show -- and I'm pretty sure some of these takes are the same as appear on Live 1969. Haven't a/b'd them or anything. It's an uncut tape of the show, though, which hasn't circulate as far as I know ... I think that those songs were thought to be from the Matrix, wonder what the deal is! MYSTERY. Sounds great, anyway.

tylerw, Friday, 16 October 2009 21:08 (twelve years ago) link

yeh, the wh/wh posted above is the same as the version on the live 69 album

zappi, Friday, 16 October 2009 21:21 (twelve years ago) link

er wl/wh

zappi, Friday, 16 October 2009 21:21 (twelve years ago) link

Yeah, same w/ "heroin", "what goes on", "new age" so far. it's funny to hear these songs w/ audience applause -- on 1969 they cut off almost immediately, sort of giving the impression that the VU was playing to barely anyone. But here they've got a totally enthusiastic crowd. And why not, considering the godlike awesomeness of this "What Goes On."

tylerw, Friday, 16 October 2009 21:26 (twelve years ago) link

borat voice: my WIRE

mark s, Friday, 26 November 2021 11:37 (four days ago) link

Autocorrect is a scourge

Legalize Suburban Benches (Raymond Cummings), Friday, 26 November 2021 11:38 (four days ago) link

it is but this was absolutely fat fingers

mark s, Friday, 26 November 2021 11:54 (four days ago) link

It’s my wire and it’s my lyre

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 26 November 2021 11:56 (four days ago) link

“Take my Wire, please!”

Legalize Suburban Benches (Raymond Cummings), Friday, 26 November 2021 11:58 (four days ago) link

Autocorrect is a scourge

https://warholstars.org/kiss-the-boot.html

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 26 November 2021 12:29 (four days ago) link

Before the scourge:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDm_cptMRNI

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 26 November 2021 12:29 (four days ago) link

I used to think Gerard was a joke with all that whip dancing, but I’m starting to warm up to him.

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 26 November 2021 13:58 (four days ago) link

I’ve decided I like Mary Woronov much better when she is talking about her own would-be boyfriends and dishing on the other Factory denizens rather than just shooting hippie Phfishes in barrels.

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 26 November 2021 22:01 (four days ago) link

Swimming Underground: My Time at Andy Warhol’s Factory (the subtitle sometimes changes) is really well-written, for one thing.

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Friday, 26 November 2021 22:20 (four days ago) link

The sore thumb in the Greil piece is the Godard quote, which he really doesn't need: I've done it too, it's a crutch, it's overselling, it's a little touch of (I guess unwitting)self-parody (has he written so much about Elvis that he's a little touch off Elvis), it's too late to stage an intervention, but it's also the dues we pay to read his music, man, so be it.

dow, Saturday, 27 November 2021 03:04 (three days ago) link

But also, far as I know, it's the most vivid mult-d film review-as-tenacious-tracking shot since this one:
https://www.filmcomment.com/article/the-power-the-gory-martin-scorsese-taxi-driver-manny-farber-patricia-patterson/

dow, Saturday, 27 November 2021 03:15 (three days ago) link

it's a crutch a symptom of somehow feeling like you need one, no matter how good the rest of it is. Also a symptom of knowing you might be wrong about how good the rest of it is, aieeeeeeeee

dow, Saturday, 27 November 2021 03:18 (three days ago) link

also scraping the absolutism off godard is like stripping an insect of its exoskeleton: highly likely it stops doing the work you're requiring of it!

(which come to think of it may actually be GM's underlying half-intuited concept and he ran out of time to hit it more exactly and fashion it less thirstily)

(seeing as there's a haynes-ray connection -- with far from heaven -- that he doesn't make out loud)

mark s, Saturday, 27 November 2021 12:08 (three days ago) link

"just like nicholas ray said" <-- right there dude

mark s, Saturday, 27 November 2021 12:09 (three days ago) link

Couldn’t hit it sideways

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 27 November 2021 15:02 (three days ago) link

Always though of Far from Heaven as more Sirk, but yes, Ray fits as well.

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 27 November 2021 15:03 (three days ago) link

lol oops yes

mark s, Saturday, 27 November 2021 15:14 (three days ago) link

split slightly and caused little rhythmic sirks of red to pulsate gently in the morning sun <-- right there dude

mark s, Saturday, 27 November 2021 15:16 (three days ago) link

Doug Yule / Doug Sirk, what's the difference?

When Smeato Met Moaty (Tom D.), Saturday, 27 November 2021 15:18 (three days ago) link

David O. Selznick/Steve Sesnick etc

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 27 November 2021 15:20 (three days ago) link

ppl coming round to my way of critical thinking at last

mark s, Saturday, 27 November 2021 15:25 (three days ago) link

Another VU:

Michael J. Kramer
@kramermj
The new Todd Haynes doc tries to make the Velvet Underground into the Beatles, while the new Fab Four doc Get Back makes the Beatles into a durational Warholian VU experience.
8:15 AM · Nov 27, 2021·
Which was my impression of 1970 Lindsay Hogg making-of Let It Be doc, though I preferred Warhol or whoever made any Warhol-branded film up to that point (did indicate that Yoko was *not* the real prob).

dow, Saturday, 27 November 2021 18:02 (three days ago) link

this doesnt seem a very accurate review

mark s, Saturday, 27 November 2021 18:45 (three days ago) link

No, but I'd like to see him say more about the first part (since Get Back as endurance test or experience does seem plausible [however much it may or may not plausibly compare to Hayes/Warhol/VU], given my Let It Be experience, though it didn't help that I didn't give a shit about most of those songs in the first place, just went to see it because **Beatles**)

dow, Saturday, 27 November 2021 18:52 (three days ago) link

VU as Beatles, ? as Yoko, re "breaking up the band": was/is there such a figure, according to some fans?

dow, Saturday, 27 November 2021 18:59 (three days ago) link

lou reed iirc

mark s, Saturday, 27 November 2021 19:06 (three days ago) link

I trusted you not to say that! I meant not a member of the band, but some one too close by, according to some---

dow, Saturday, 27 November 2021 19:25 (three days ago) link

Sesnick!

When Smeato Met Moaty (Tom D.), Saturday, 27 November 2021 19:53 (three days ago) link

^

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 27 November 2021 20:58 (three days ago) link

Just walked past signed picture of Jonas Mekas at Lincoln Center cinema. #One Thread

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 27 November 2021 21:38 (three days ago) link

Also

ppl coming round to my way of critical thinking at last

Ross Hunter/Moe Tucker

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Saturday, 27 November 2021 21:39 (three days ago) link

Compare use of split screen in the VU doc vs end of Jackson's "Get Back"

SQUIRREL MEAT!! (Capitaine Jay Vee), Saturday, 27 November 2021 22:49 (three days ago) link

Amazing

war mice (hardcore dilettante), Sunday, 28 November 2021 01:51 (two days ago) link

Can't see it, no account (have I) sorry thanks.
One last attempt to justify pasting that tweet:
VUare Bizarro World Beatles. Beatles impact: Hot! Fast! Massive! VU: Cool, slow-growing, infiltrating---as Beatley sounds become more niche, going to power pop etc., VU becomes less so, more of a given in punk, new wave, "post-punk"(which as mark says, could also be pre- and para-punk)(I'm paraphrasing).
Beatles stopped touring because things(girls) getting too massive and wild, discovered Epstein had sold off ancillary rights etc, had to keep cranking out records for income, but also overheard was no excuse not to keep slaving away to meet expected standards. also flooding the market no excuse because it didn't happen because they were the Beatles, prisoners of success.
VU made all their money playing out, records mostly sounded like bootleg. VU not prisoners of success.
Beatles media, incl. making movies and having press conference. VU multi- media when working w light show, only "movies" silent footage and Lou's Warhol "Screen Test," no press conferences per se that I know of, or that they were known for (I'm old, had contacts, would have heard about it).
More?

dow, Sunday, 28 November 2021 02:25 (two days ago) link

I meant *overhead* (not "overheard") was no excuse to slack: They could afford (the studio time it took) to keep slaving away, because they kept slaving away, and people bought fruits of their labors

dow, Sunday, 28 November 2021 02:31 (two days ago) link

Sorry, that link is to an article about The Velvets's first Warhol gig, an infamous event at Delmonico's for The New York Society For Clinical Psychiatry.

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 28 November 2021 02:34 (two days ago) link

Nice

calstars, Sunday, 28 November 2021 02:41 (two days ago) link

Apparently that was also pretty much the last time Edie hung with them. She sat there with Bob Neuwirth watching Nico sing ("I'll Keep It With Mine"?) and realizing it was over as she herself tried to sing along, at least according to Gerard according to Andy.

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 28 November 2021 02:45 (two days ago) link

I don't think it was one of the incarnations of Delmonico's restaurant, seems to have been the Hotel Delmonico, now named after someone else.

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 28 November 2021 02:48 (two days ago) link

Think that article neglects to mention Barbara Rubin and comoany going around the room shoving microphones at the shrinks to harass them with invasive questions about their love lives before the VU performance.

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 28 November 2021 02:52 (two days ago) link

And

The event is also covered by the New York Herald Tribune, for whom Seymour Krim writes: “The neo-Jungians, Harry Black Sullivanites, existentialists and just plain bread-and-butter head doctors got an electric shock treatment they’ll never forget…While blinding sun-gun lights bombed the dress-suited psychiatrists as they attacked roast beef and red wine, movie cameras ground away, the Velvet Underground rock outfit began pounding the beat as if it were fire-engine time, and underground film star Edie Sedgwick began to shake it while poet Gerard Malanga went into his Whip Dance. The first five Freudians left in a huff. Dr. Marcel Heiman, as striking-looking as any underground actor but very much a street-level gent with an office on Fifth Avenue, said, ‘I’m ready to vomit.’” The performance even gets a mention in Newsweek later in the month.

Oddly, Seymour Krim’s story suggests there are currently several vocalists involved with the Velvets. “Inside the ballroom,” he writes, “singers Nico, Jane Odin, and Chic Cicarelli added to the unaccustomed spire in the hardworking analysts’ lives by dishing up Bob Dylan-negro-blues-bossa-nova-type material while the Velvet Underground blasted the room with high-decibel sounds.” It seems most likely, however, that Odin and Cicarelli have joined in informally, as their names will not pop up again in the VU saga.

Unterberger, Richie; Unterberger, Richie. White Light/White Heat: The Velvet Underground Day-By-Day (Revised & Expanded Ebook Edition) (pp. 208-209)

Duck and Sally Can't Dance (James Redd and the Blecchs), Sunday, 28 November 2021 02:54 (two days ago) link

Bob Dylan-negro-blues-bossa-nova-type material while the Velvet Underground blasted the room with high-decibel sounds.” AKA what shrinks used to call BREAKTHROUGH--thanks James! And thanks, Seymour KRIM!https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seymour_Krim

dow, Sunday, 28 November 2021 05:11 (two days ago) link


You must be logged in to post. Please either login here, or if you are not registered, you may register here.