Bruce Springsteen - Classic or Dud ?

several times, Howard apologized to Springsteen, which led me to try to remember what specifically he could have said over the course of the show that could have offended the Springsteen Organization/Landau

I remember Stern playing "American Skin" in 2001 and saying, "41 shots, what the hell does this sheltered guy know about being a policeman and urban violence", etc.

Not just a tired argument but a really tired bit of logic that's lazily trotted out whenever someone has a problem with a topical work by anyone famous. Regardless, "41 Shots" is great - especially the idea of marginalization being taught and passed down to one's children, the implication that we're less than these other people and you have to accept it and learn how to behave accordingly. Just one moment in the song and realized through a few narrative details.

What did Herman's Hermits know about being Henry the eighth?

What did Robbie Robertson know about working on the Danville train?

I sincerely doubt Jimmy Webb had worked on telephone lines

etc.

Some kind of fallacy maybe, forget which one though.

Yeah, Howard Stern not understanding anything shocker.

In other news, "Streets of Philadelphia" came on the radio the second I got home. Now I have to sit in the car. I love Bruce's post E Street dalliance with moody MOR/adult contemporary.

Caryn Rose otm:

Do you remember that 90’s movie, The Commitments? It was a bunch of Irish kids who form a soul band. (Glen Hansard was in it!) Anyway, the soundtrack was super-popular, but when I made a tape of the originals for people who adored the movie, they didn’t like it and they didn’t care. They liked the versions of the songs they heard in the movie. Only The Strong Survive is for those people, and there are more of them than there are of people like me.

That was grebt, thanks.

Am sure she’s fairly spot-on but

Years ago, Dave Marsh once told me, “You are the toughest critic in the fanbase that still gets what he’s trying to do.” It’s my job to pay attention and hold Bruce Springsteen accountable, and so, here we are.

This form of writing in music journalism is… trying

Yeah, I read that. OTM re: why Bruce, who could get anyone in the world to play on his records, if not his tried and true live in a room band, would entrust a tribute to classic soul to a soulless studio hack who wouldn't know grit unless it came as a plug-in. He should have had Steve assemble a crack band and then just cut the record live over a couple of weekends.

This may be the first Springsteen album I just don't listen to. Though I'm not sure I've heard all of "Human Touch," either.

a soulless studio hack who wouldn't know grit unless it came as a plug-in

The problem is there are so few musicians left who can convincingly pull it off. So many of the musicians from that era are gone or inactive, and the younger ones...I remember watching the Dap-Kings and thinking, "They are so close...but that's as close as they're ever gonna get."

Yes. Want to think good thoughts about this last but...yeah.

Eh, I think lots of people could do it. The key is to record it right. Raw and live and room sound.

They're not that new anymore, but two of Al Green's latter day albums (including one produced by Questlove) did a good job of capturing the vintage sound performance-wise - the actual recordings just miss simply because they're using modern gear that's never going to sound "right" but I don't think Blue Note would've been fine marketing a new album that truly sounded like an old recording they unearthed from the '70s.

FWIW, here's an interview with Jeff Beck where he discusses the Motown album he never put out:

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/jeff-beck-on-his-legendary-unreleased-1970-motown-album-111450/

Relevant excerpts:

My producer, Mickie Most, said, “We have to make an album.” I talked Mickie into going to Motown, the Hitsville house. It was one of the last sessions there. I was so privileged. We were more like tourists, kids in a candy shop. I took Cozy [British drummer Cozy Powell]. I said, “I gotta go to Motown, and you’re coming as well.” What the hell was I doing taking a rock drummer, with two huge Ludwig bass drums, into Motown?

They hated us right away. They didn’t want to know. But we loved it there, and they sensed it after a few hours. the first day. When Cozy sat behind the Motown drum kit and started playing like the Meters, they all went, “Oh!” and came flooding back to the studio. It was James Jamerson on bass that day — no rhythm guitar — and Earl Van Dyke on keyboards. That was it, a stripped-down thing. They kept saying, “Where are the dots?” [Meaning sheet music] I said, “There ain’t no dots.”

When Cozy started playing, it was great. James was locking up with Cozy’s drum pattern. Then I looked around — Cozy was wheeling the drum kit out of the studio. They’re going berserk. He has moved the sacred Motown drum kit out of the studio and wheeled this stupid double kit of Ludwigs in. The studio tech came up to me and said, “Didn’t you guys come in here for the Motown sound?” Yeah. “Well, it just went out the door"...

...I discovered what the real secret of Motown was. They were fantastic world-class players — best delivery, best drum sound. But if you take that Motown reverb away, you got nothing. It’s very nice, but it ain’t Motown. The whole thing was tuned to the vibe of that reverb.

The same guy who said that thing about the drums? When we walked out of the studio on the last day with the master, he said, “You’re not going to mix here? You just shot yourself twice.”

I just finished listening to the new Springsteen album. The first track they put out "Do I Love You (Indeed I Do)" was pretty good on its own - I still think it would've been an excellent B-side. But it gets lost in its underwhelming surroundings on this album. So much of this does feel like karaoke.

I wasn't that crazy about the Seeger album - it was a little corny-sounding for my tastes - but it felt like it had a strong reason to exist, like it was still responding to what was going on in the world. That feeling is at best sporadically there on this new album, but more often than not, I didn't feel like this was the type of thing that warranted a full-blown release. It's like the type of thing Bowie or Prince would record as a "private" tape and give it to friends, maybe even send it out as their Christmas card record.

FWIW, I have listened to Human Touch, and I would put that over this one. A thoroughly generic Springsteen record, but even unremarkable tracks like "Roll of the Dice," "57 Channels" and "The Long Goodbye" come off like classics in comparison. (To be fair, I do think the full-length album version of Human Touch's title track is a keeper - the guitar solo is really good, as if Springsteen had been listening to a lot of Richard Thompson.)

I can barely take some of the excesses of his shouty soul voice when used for his own stuff so can only imagine (until I listen to it) what it will be like in this context.

Josh

The key is to record it right. Raw and live and room sound.

Are you are familiar with King of America? That was literally the model for a lot of that record: get a man named T-Bone* to put Elvis's band in a semicircle around a microphone. Do two takes and cross-fade the highlights.

* = There were actually two T-Bones on that record (Burnett and Wolk). They tried to involve a third person named T-Bone, but under Californian rock safety regulations, you are only allowed to have two persons named T-Bone working on any given album. The law is the law.

Two T-Bones and a microphone

I think that was before T-Bone dropped his Froom-isms. Glancing at his production credits, I'd suggest Burnett didn't really go au natural until closer to the late '90s. c. Gillian Welch at al. Before that he still sounded pretty fussy to me, as much as I love some records he produced. But I'm thinking more of the kinds of hands-free stuff that Joe Henry did, or does. He had that streak of Betty Lavette, Solomon Burke, Aimee Mann, Allen Toussaint, and so on, all pretty no-fuss. The Dap-Kings, they had the right idea, at least. Play to the genre's strength, which is not slickness and gloss. Well, I mean, not the '60s and '70s at least.

Hell, "The Seeger Sessions" sounded pretty band-in-a-room great. Or even "Letter to You," for that matter. I can see why Bruce could be taken in my by tech, really playing to his perfectionist tendencies. Like, he'd probably think, why would I want any imperfections when this dummy I have producing can make everything clean and pristine and perfect? Meanwhile Neil Young and Bob Dylan are giving Bruce the side eye. Like, you're missing the point, Bruce!

Would have been great if this album were all '80s R&B, like Kool and the Gang's "Joanna" or Oran "Juice" Jones' "The Rain" or Dazz Band.

They're not that new anymore, but two of Al Green's latter day albums (including one produced by Questlove) did a good job of capturing the vintage sound performance-wise - the actual recordings just miss simply because they're using modern gear that's never going to sound "right" but I don't think Blue Note would've been fine marketing a new album that truly sounded like an old recording they unearthed from the '70s.

Not all modern gear. I remember when they made those records they made a big deal about pulling his old mic out of the cabinet, the same model maybe even the same one, he used way back when.

Committing to vintageness is actually not that difficult with modern gear - it just takes restraint.

Like, sure, bring out your old Neumann or whatev. But once you put it into a modern signal chain, you will be tempted to mess with it after tracking. Don't.

I am currently working on a project where there two room mics and a DI and that's basically it. Whenever I think of going to the plugins menu, I instead drink some wine and walk around the block. When I come back, I realize that it was fine.

Chitlin Circuit Double-entendre -filled Soul 2004 (and onward) Theodis Ealey's "Stand Up In It" is a song of the year

Some folks on the Chitlin circuit southern soul thread could have helped Bruce too

Unrelated- saw Uruguayan, Spain based guitar pop singer musician Jorge Drexler at Lincoln Theatre in DC Friday night, and suddenly in one of his Spanish language songs, he added a bit in English from “Hungry Heart”

I was trying to recall someone I came across some years back who was considered the French Springsteen, or German Springsteen or something, and I found this:

https://www.bbc.com/culture/article/20190612-bruce-springsteens-of-the-world-unite

I would've picked Paul Kelly for Australia' Springsteen, but then again I'm not familiar with Jimmy Barnes. Anyone else know his stuff?

Only from The Lost Boys, lol. But yeah, Paul Kelly is totally the Aussie Springsteen.

Paul Kelly is a better comparison as he writes & sings & has that troubadoury general vibe

Barnesy does write songs himself but is more commonly known as singer i would say, more like a Steve Perry ie iconic big voice but a lot of fame tied to early band success

I too only knew Barnes from the INXS song “Good Times.” Then — maybe 30 years later — I heard another version of the song on the radio, which the dj announced was the original (there’s an original?!) by the Easybeats (I love the Easybeats!) Blew my mind. “But the guy on the chorus sounds like Steve Marriott!” Turns out it’s Steve Marriott.

Bruce has covered the Easybeats’ “Friday On My Mind” and INXS’s “Don’t Change,” so it’s all a rich tapestry.

Bruce is on Fallon show 3 nights in a row

Bruce @springsteen performs “Do I Love You (Indeed I Do)” 🎶

Watch the full performance ⬇️https://t.co/2bOv7WOSX3#SpringsteenOnFallon pic.twitter.com/7lImPmF4Sb

— The Tonight Show (@FallonTonight) November 15, 2022

A couple of people asking, why didn't he just get backed by the Roots? He likes the Roots, the Roots would have ruled.

He was on Graham Norton, too:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lx0GllhVJks

Ha I remember hearing Casey Kasem tell that story on American Top 40 in the ‘80s…and I also remember it being Denver, but evidently it wasn’t.

He’s no Tyrone Davis but his “Turn Back the hands of time” on Fallon is ok

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3ypTDSRVZs

I'd be interested in hearing him talk about the troubles he's had with his drinking but otherwise zzz

Love me some Tyrone Davis, afraid to listen to that.

xpost lol Didn't we do this already? There is no indication at all that Bruce has ever had a drinking problem.

Born to (D)Run(k)

Yeah, the only anecdote we have is when he was offered shots by some fans while riding around in that park one winter.

It would be tough to hide. Like George Harrison and Bob Dylan come to mind as two people who obviously had drinking problems that were easy to notice, from numerous anecdotes to the way it crept into interviews, etc.

Mister state trooper

Please don't breathalyze me

Where can I read about George and bob’s drinking ?

I don't know if there are any articles focusing on it, but it just comes up a lot. George even joked in an interview "I needed the hepatitis to quit drinking." (Rolling Stone, December 1976)

Dylan drank heavily for a good part of the '80s and the beginning of the '90s, his road manager at the time Victor Maymudes has gone on record about that, adding that Dylan "just stopped on a dime" and got sober in 1994. (IIRC he was supposedly seen drinking a lot when he toured with Tom Petty & the Heartbreakers in the '80s.)

haven't read her memoir myself but Psychology Today blog asserted :

Pattie Boyd's memoir, "Wonderful Tonight," describes Boyd's leaving her marriage with Beatle George Harrison after he became morose and uncommunicative, alternating between compulsive chanting and meditation followed by drug and alcohol blasts, to take up with Eric Clapton.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/addiction-in-society/200809/did-pattie-boyd-require-expert-explain-alcoholism

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoWwimT9qWI

Bruce did “Nightshift” for his 3rd night on Fallon show

I'm sure that's better than the recorded version, but I'm not going to bother. Here's a reminder of what Bruce is like doing a soul cover with his band:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jbkt0YIsdy4

And that's ignoring the medleys and epics he did earlier in his career.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_LJbKcihdTU

wtf there are like seventeen people there on stage (re: the Fallon show)

File under "ok but why?"

Bruce by committee.

The shock and awe approach.

Just a reminder that at the undeniable peak of their power the E Street Band numbered ... 7 people.

A lucky number in lucky town.

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/bruce-springsteen-covers-lp-fan-outrage-ticket-prices-1234632658/

-I’ve got to ask you about the ticket on-sale.

Sure.

-It caused a bit of an uproar in the fan community because some of the tickets used dynamic prices, and some tickets hit $5,000. Did you know in advance about those price points and dynamic pricing, and do you have any regrets about that?

What I do is a very simple thing. I tell my guys, “Go out and see what everybody else is doing. Let’s charge a little less.” That’s generally the directions. They go out and set it up. For the past 49 years or however long we’ve been playing, we’ve pretty much been out there under market value. I’ve enjoyed that. It’s been great for the fans.

This time I told them, “Hey, we’re 73 years old. The guys are there. I want to do what everybody else is doing, my peers.” So that’s what happened. That’s what they did (laughs).

But ticket buying has gotten very confusing, not just for the fans, but for the artists also. And the bottom line is that most of our tickets are totally affordable. They’re in that affordable range. We have those tickets that are going to go for that (higher) price somewhere anyway. The ticket broker or someone is going to be taking that money. I’m going, “Hey, why shouldn’t that money go to the guys that are going to be up there sweating three hours a night for it?”

It created an opportunity for that to occur. And so at that point, we went for it. I know it was unpopular with some fans. But if there’s any complaints on the way out, you can have your money back.

-As you said, the fans were pretty upset. Backstreets said it caused them to suffer a “crisis of faith.” They wrote an op-ed where they said that dynamic pricing “violates an implicit contract between Bruce Springsteen and his fans.” How did you feel about all that blowback against you?

Well, I’m old. I take a lot of things in stride (laughs). You don’t like to be criticized. You certainly don’t like to be the poster boy for high ticket prices. It’s the last thing you prefer to be. But that’s how it went. You have to own the decisions you have made and go out and just continue to do your best. And that was my take on it. I think if folks come to the show, they’re going to have a good time.

_Do you think in the future you’ll avoid using dynamic pricing, where the prices change in front of your eyes during the initial on-sale?

I don’t know. I think in the future, we’ll be talking about it, of course (laughs). It changes from tour to tour. We will be coming back. I’m sure we’ll be playing outside somewhat. That’ll be a whole other discussion when that comes around. I don’t want to say anything now, but we’ll see what happens.

A bunch of other nuggets in here, like no plan for a "BitUSA" box, but maybe a "Nebraska" box, and also this:

I have a box set of five unreleased albums that are basically post-1988. People have always wondered…People look at my work in the Nineties and they go, “The Nineties wasn’t a great decade for Bruce. He was kind of doing this and he wasn’t in the E Street Band…” I actually made a lot of music during that period of time. I actually made albums. For one reason or another, the timing wasn’t right or whatever, I didn’t put them out.

They’ve kind of gathered. I spent time over one of the past winters completely cleaning out the vault. I have a series of Tracks albums that eventually we’ll release. Some of it is older stuff that the band plays on, and some of it is newer stuff where I was conceptualizing during that period of time. It’ll give people a chance to reassess what I was doing during that time period. Also, a lot of the stuff is really weird. There’s going to be people that really…I can’t wait to see the response to some of it (laughs).

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/bruce-springsteen-covers-lp-fan-outrage-ticket-prices-1234632658/

ARGH! Well so much for that...it's weird because it's clearly in his contract with Sony (the one that leaked from that infamous hack) that he's supposed to deliver album box sets, but I guess the other things he's talking about fulfills that.

I think he basically says in the interview he would if he could, but all the good Born in the USA stuff ended up on Tracks, and they really don't have much left over except for lots of alternate takes, of which he is not a fan. Plus he says there is virtually no good footage of the tour, though he wishes there were.