(Disclaimer: I'm friends with a few people that either have played or currently play with him, so I should maybe disclose that.)
― hstencil, Friday, 29 August 2003 16:05 (twenty years ago) link
― Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Friday, 29 August 2003 16:13 (twenty years ago) link
Ya know what I mean?
― ben welsh (benwelsh), Friday, 29 August 2003 17:33 (twenty years ago) link
― hstencil, Friday, 29 August 2003 17:43 (twenty years ago) link
― Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Friday, 29 August 2003 17:45 (twenty years ago) link
― hstencil, Friday, 29 August 2003 17:47 (twenty years ago) link
― Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Friday, 29 August 2003 17:52 (twenty years ago) link
Anyway, in terms of his playing and composing, I like Vandermark a lot. If I had one complaint, it would be that his tenor playing is often marked by this kind of pinched tone that sometimes grates in large doses. I'm trying to think of who he reminds me of in that sense ... maybe Sonny Fortune on the Miles stuff? Or maybe someone like Carlos Garnett or one of those 70's soul-jazz fellows. I'm not sure, I suppose I just wish he had a deeper, more resonant sound. I love him on bass clarinet, though, where he really shines.
I second the recommendation for the first Caffeine disc. Anything released under the name of either of his two major groups as a leader - Vandermark Quartet and Vandermark Five - is going to represent him well and give you a good sense of what makes Vandermark's music uniquely his: the playful compositional sense; the integration of "heavier", rock-informed rhythms and textures; and the great groups of sympathetic sidemen he assembles and the way he democratically offers up plenty of solo space for them within his works.
I don't know if the Cinghiale cd Hoofbeats of the Snorting Swine is still in print, but that's a fun, off-beat disc of he and Mars Williams in reed duets.
If you like any of those, there is plennnnnnty more where that came from. If there is one thing Vandermark is not, it is underrepresented.
Oh, do I think he deserved the award? Sure, why not. It was worth it just for the way it pissed off all the moronic "purists".
Most deserving today? Hmmmmmmmm.... you'd actually have to remind me who's already received them. Braxton, Coleman and Taylor have, correct?
― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Friday, 29 August 2003 18:16 (twenty years ago) link
― hstencil, Friday, 29 August 2003 18:22 (twenty years ago) link
― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Friday, 29 August 2003 18:30 (twenty years ago) link
― hstencil, Friday, 29 August 2003 18:35 (twenty years ago) link
I'm a novice but Coltrane, Zorn, and Parker are where I always end up. That's just me tho.
― ben welsh (benwelsh), Friday, 29 August 2003 19:12 (twenty years ago) link
Dolphy's also one of those liminal guys who doesn't really neatly slot into "post-bop" or "free" lineages..
I don't hear much Coltrane in Vandermark...
― Mr. Diamond (diamond), Friday, 29 August 2003 19:20 (twenty years ago) link
Eric Dolphy is a guy I've never been able to get into. I have a very hard time listening to him.
― ben welsh (benwelsh), Friday, 29 August 2003 19:29 (twenty years ago) link
AylerPeter BrotzmannOrnetteColtraneDolphyArthur DoyleNoah HowardJoseph JarmanRoscoe MitchellEvan ParkerGlenn Spearmann
I don't like Vandermark as much as these guys but obviously that's no crime.
― hstencil, Friday, 29 August 2003 21:23 (twenty years ago) link
― John Bullabaugh (John Bullabaugh), Saturday, 30 August 2003 02:46 (twenty years ago) link
I also like the V5's 'covers' of 'Free Jazz Classics', available as a dbl CD from Atavistic.
― Andrew L (Andrew L), Saturday, 30 August 2003 20:38 (twenty years ago) link
― Dock Miles (Dock Miles), Sunday, 31 August 2003 03:30 (twenty years ago) link
Honestly, I'm no expert with jazz, far from it...have a couple miles records, ornette coleman at the golden circle, go see the world by david s ware..that's about it...so you guys are kind of arguing some serious jazzbo stuff that's way over my head.
that being said, this was one of the best shows I've seen in ages...really amazing playing, great lyrical knotty stuff right next to free-ish freakouts next to more groove oriented r&b/rock oriented stuff....anyway....I came away totally impressed.
This was probably the first time that I'd seen a "real" (i.e. someone that's I guess it sounds like respected in jazz circles as a recording artist etc)...I've seen jazz bands at restuarants or clubs or whatever, but I guess they're probably the equivalent of classic rock cover bands or something...It was a great experience and I'm so happy i got to see it....I need to see more jazz live, was totally blown away...
― M@tt He1geson (Matt Helgeson), Thursday, 26 January 2006 16:50 (eighteen years ago) link
I'm not gonna hate on the guy (and I don't think you are either) b/c he's not Ayler or Trane. He's Vandermark. And I think I agree with you, too, that sometimes on his own records, he seems to be holding back. But in person, and definitely when teamed with Hamid Drake, I find his music very well done.
One criticism I have of him, and it is one that I have to greater degrees with James Carter and with David Murray. They try at times (too hard it seems to me) to adopt the sound/style of other saxophonists, that their own voice seems less authentic, more chameleonic, sycophantic.
As far as the MacArthur grant, the reasons why one gets one are obscure, and I do not think that it (for the musicians who have received these in the past)is necessarily solely because of the musicianship. Having spoken with Vandermark on a couple of occasions, I think he has the intellectual weight to stand with any number of the other grantees.
― J Arthur Rank (Quin Tillian), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:27 (eighteen years ago) link
― Jordan (Jordan), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:41 (eighteen years ago) link
― mcd (mcd), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:53 (eighteen years ago) link
― mcd (mcd), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:09 (eighteen years ago) link
NYC: see a documentary about KV and get a solo set for free!
Look here.
(i am regular ilxor, usually on chicago thread, occasionally elsewhere, rarely post to ILM...in case you wondered)
― La Lechera, Wednesday, 5 September 2007 20:14 (sixteen years ago) link
HEY JAZZ DOUCHEBAGS I am not giving up on encouraging you to see this movie. It's quite good.
― La Lechera, Friday, 7 September 2007 19:16 (sixteen years ago) link
I concur.
― Jeff, Friday, 7 September 2007 19:19 (sixteen years ago) link
Great movie, and Vandermark is playing solo for about 20 minutes before each screening.
― Eazy, Saturday, 8 September 2007 12:43 (sixteen years ago) link
i picked up the used CD of vandermark 5 -- acoustic machine.
anyway, it's really good and they are a great jazz groop.
― M@tt He1ges0n, Wednesday, 23 April 2008 21:16 (sixteen years ago) link
that is a good album, though i haven't listened to V5 in a long time. burn the incline was/is my fave.
― Jordan, Wednesday, 23 April 2008 21:33 (sixteen years ago) link
Saw Vandermark with The Thing earlier this week (and also Hstencil's man Evan Parker). Mats Gustafsson: OH YEAH
Was not so much into the Parker combo, proving to myself that I like Free Jazz, but not free jazz?
― Dr. Superman, Friday, 27 June 2008 04:10 (fifteen years ago) link
MUSICIAN (movie mentioned above) is part of this elite 7 masterpieceshttp://www.movieline.com/2009/12/7-masterpieces-of-the-00s-youve-likely-never-seen.php?page=3
just sayin'
― figgy pudding (La Lechera), Monday, 28 December 2009 21:07 (fourteen years ago) link
I liked the film, but it kind of threw up more questions than it answered really. Mainly I came away wondering a lot more about how Vandermark makes the financial side of things add up. The blurb on the back of the DVD runs something like "commonsense tells you that it's not possible to make a living from playing avant-garde jazz, but Ken Vandermark does it." But what it doesn't do is explain how he does it.
I would like to know how much Vandermark gets paid for a gig and how that stacks up against his expenses - and you're welcome to say that's none of my business, but it was a glaring omission in a doc from a series that is about Work, and work is basically all about the exchange of labour for money. He certainly seemed to have a nice big house in (I'm guessing) Chicago. He also has a wife, of course, who may be the main breadwinner – again, the film didn't explore this. There was one brief moment of her opening what looked like a bill and sighing, but that was about it.
― anagram, Monday, 28 December 2009 22:31 (fourteen years ago) link
$265,500 from the MacArthur Foundation in 1999 helped. And I'm guessing there's some money from Europe. And his wife works.
― The Hood Won't Jump (Eazy), Monday, 28 December 2009 22:33 (fourteen years ago) link
But I answered hastily there, because I see what you mean about the work/labor exchange.
― The Hood Won't Jump (Eazy), Monday, 28 December 2009 22:35 (fourteen years ago) link
funny that this is one if the first things i see when getting online as just met him tonight as he spent the last week playing throughout Addis with Terrie and Andy Moor from the EX, Ab Baars (ICP) and Paal Nilssen-Love and as part of the ongoing EX Ethiopia project
Was not familiar with his previous work, stellar performance tonight that def made me want to explore much more, really bummed i had to miss the past week's work due to being stuck in wedding duties
and oh yeah, incredibly nice guy
― H in Addis, Monday, 28 December 2009 22:39 (fourteen years ago) link
there is the part of the movie where he divvies up the money after the powerhouse sound gig -- it's at schuba's, i think? -- and it's like "and here's an extra dollar for you because you drove" it was in jest, of course, but it was well under $100 per person, which includes their rehearsal time, etc. not a lot. surely more than most bands, but not a lot of money.
― figgy pudding (La Lechera), Monday, 28 December 2009 22:46 (fourteen years ago) link
I've seen him play here in Vienna many times over the past few years – like Brotzmann and all that crowd, he's a frequent visitor to Europe. His duo show with Nilssen-Love in a small jazz club was one of my shows of this year, no question. And as part of Brotzmann's Tentet and the reeds trio Sonore with Brotzmann and Mats Gustafsson, he always looms large. I kind of see him as the link between Ayler and Coltrane on the one hand, and the European guys on the other. He can really swing when he wants to, but his free improvising is as fierce and uncompromising as anyone's.
He just put out a pair of CDs of his duo with Nilssen-Love on Smalltown Superjazzz which are stunning. I also recently picked up a CD he did with Barry Guy and Mark Sanders called Fox Fire which is pretty awesome as well.
― anagram, Monday, 28 December 2009 22:50 (fourteen years ago) link
$265,500 from the MacArthur Foundation in 1999 helped.
I'm pretty sure a substantial amount of that money went into recording and bringing out the heavy hitters from Europe to be in his bands, which in turn cemented his reputation. This is from folks I know that know him - I don't think he saved/kept very much of that money.
― sarahel, Monday, 28 December 2009 23:18 (fourteen years ago) link
When I saw Vandermark in the Peter Brotzmann tentet+2, that was fucking amazing.
― Nate Carson, Tuesday, 29 December 2009 02:05 (fourteen years ago) link
Brotzmann is fucking amazing.
― sarahel, Tuesday, 29 December 2009 03:01 (fourteen years ago) link
I mean, I can imagine him playing with Pat Boone and it being amazing.
― sarahel, Tuesday, 29 December 2009 03:02 (fourteen years ago) link
ps feel like i should disclose that my husband is the person who made the aforementioned movie, hence my relentless hype(nate -- he is the one who was with me at the agalloch show fyi)
― figgy pudding (La Lechera), Tuesday, 29 December 2009 03:52 (fourteen years ago) link
pps i saw brotzmann solo once and it was pretty rad.
― figgy pudding (La Lechera), Tuesday, 29 December 2009 03:56 (fourteen years ago) link
I saw Vandermark in '96 or '97 at a tiny club. He was a beast that night. I mean that in the most positive way. It's like the endless stream of notes were fighting each other to get out of that horn first.
― nicky lo-fi, Tuesday, 29 December 2009 05:36 (fourteen years ago) link
his Marker album with Steve Marquette and Andrew Clinkman on guitar, Macie Stewart on keyboards and violin and Phil Sudderberg on drums is totally fab. It has tributes to Anthony Braxton & Bernie Worrell, Chantal Akerman, Pina Bausch and Cliff Richard. Well perhaps not, but it's titled Wired For Sound.
― calzino, Wednesday, 17 January 2018 10:24 (six years ago) link
... disappointed if there wasn't a tribute to Cliff Richard on that album.
Saw him playing as Lean Left (w/ Terrie Ex, Andy Moor, Paal Nilssen-Love) last night. Great gig, but on the short side. Ken struggled somehwat to be heard over two electric guitars and Nilssen-Love's drumming (he is one of the loudest drummers I've ever seen) but more than held his own. Andy Moor is an awesome guitarist btw.
― Scottish Country Tweerking (Tom D.), Wednesday, 12 September 2018 10:09 (five years ago) link
some of them ear blistering Scorch Trio albums featuring PNL with guitarist Raoul Bjorkenheim are pretty ace, particularly the 2002 s/t one.
― calzino, Wednesday, 12 September 2018 13:07 (five years ago) link