Fugazi: C or D?

Message Bookmarked
Bookmark Removed
So, some bit of odd, pathetic nostalgia has had me reliving the indie rock 90s lately, and out came the Fugazi records...surprisingly, they hold up a helluva a lot better than I thought they would having not listened to them in about two or three years...maybe just the otherwise paucity of good rawk music these days...

So: Fugazi, classic or dud?

Jess, Sunday, 5 August 2001 00:00 (twenty years ago) link

Hey, that's not indie, that's EMO! I liked Repeater and that Waiting Room song, but most of it is not good. One song that sticks in my head goes something like, "(YEAH!)you're so beautiful, (YEAH!)so blahblahble, (YEAH!)you something something right through you." What song is that?

nUde SPock, Sunday, 5 August 2001 00:00 (twenty years ago) link

duplicate thread!

(the song, spock, is "margin walker.")

sundar subramanian, Sunday, 5 August 2001 00:00 (twenty years ago) link

Fugazi = "emo?" WTF????

These days the term "emo" is like the Blob/Borg, threatening to absord everything in its path: "I really like emo, you know, like the Beatles and Moby."

Nitsuh, Monday, 6 August 2001 00:00 (twenty years ago) link

How Fugazi can get called emo, when Superchunk (a group that sounds much more like those damn emo bands, though 1 bazillion times better) escapes such damning praise...

No, sir, I don't like it one bit.

David Raposa, Monday, 6 August 2001 00:00 (twenty years ago) link

"Margin Walker" is my favorite Fugazi song; I can't stand the vocals most of the time though. East coast emo was invented by the bands that invented Fugazi, so it's not much of a stretch to call Fugazi emo. That's what I'd call them, but then I don't like Fugazi.

Kris, Monday, 6 August 2001 00:00 (twenty years ago) link

Emo core?

Nude Spock, Monday, 6 August 2001 00:00 (twenty years ago) link

"Emo-core" = what people called it before they started using it to describe so many bands that it saved time to just say "emo."

I think it's the only genre term I've ever seen change completely over the course of 4-5 years. I suppose that can be blamed, in part, on the people making it -- the term started with just-post-hardcore bands like Cap'N Jazz and would up stuck on bashy- poppy-punk bands like the Promise Ring (members of Cap'N Jazz). Regardless, any term variously applied to refer to Mineral, Karate, and the Get-Up Kids is beginning to lack meaning.

But so the question now is: with the Cap'N Jazz guys reforming as the Owls, will "emo" go back to being what it was, leaving the Get-Up Kids as just "crap?" Or will the Owls play funk, leading us to start referring to Parliament as "emo?"

Nitsuh, Monday, 6 August 2001 00:00 (twenty years ago) link

since when are fugazi emo? huh? huh? did i sleep thru a new genre...i thought emo was rotten new skool punk rockers writing break up songs.

riff, Tuesday, 7 August 2001 00:00 (twenty years ago) link

fugazi are great until they start that tedious stop start shit. They tend to over use that one. However I can't think of many other bands that do try to push their melodic side, one of the best dual guitar bands around. I wish they'd change their drum sound, I hate that nu metal snare!

tom, Tuesday, 7 August 2001 00:00 (twenty years ago) link

The first band I heard get the emo tag was Fugazi, quickly followed by North of America who Fugazi were being used as a reference for me. I said what and she said Trueman's Water, Sunny Day Real Estate. I said I still dont know. Now I think Trail of The Dead qualify as emo but I dunno, its all Alt Country to me.

zacko, Tuesday, 7 August 2001 00:00 (twenty years ago) link

Fugazi: classic.

Emo: supposed to have started with Rites of Spring is my understanding, who led to Fugazi. Now the term is meaningless, for reasons laid out expertly by Nitsuh.

North of America: not emo at all. Math rock, pure math rock.

Matthew Lazowski, Tuesday, 7 August 2001 00:00 (twenty years ago) link

Math emo that is.

Sterling Clover, Wednesday, 8 August 2001 00:00 (twenty years ago) link

fifteen years pass...

^^Not showing up for me. What is it?

JRN, Monday, 5 December 2016 06:05 (four years ago) link

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=guvwUUCvsKs

Kibbutzki (Jaap Schip), Monday, 5 December 2016 06:43 (four years ago) link

I love how Albini said for years that Fugazi was one of the few bands he respected so much he'd record them for free. And then he recorded them and they didn't use it.

Josh in Chicago, Monday, 5 December 2016 14:32 (four years ago) link

Hmm. I can sorta see why they scrapped this, but I say that as someone very, very familiar with IOTKT as it was released

Wimmels, Monday, 5 December 2016 14:39 (four years ago) link

But none of these versions are better than the album versions

(see also: First Demo. How many times have you listened to that one since you bought it?)

Wimmels, Monday, 5 December 2016 14:40 (four years ago) link

nine months pass...

Ian Mackaye of Fugazi/Minor Threat/ Dischord Records at the #JuggaloMarch pic.twitter.com/acrebJ4zCd

— #retiredpunk (@NickKarpPhotos) September 17, 2017

http://cps-static.rovicorp.com/3/JPG_500/MI0002/018/MI0002018821.jpg

JRN, Monday, 18 September 2017 19:36 (four years ago) link

Saw that! Watched Brendan Canty playing drums with Lizzi from GangGang Dance & guitarist Dana Vorhees at the Hirshhorn Museum Yoko Ono tribute. Canty & Joe Lally will be backing Daniel Johnston on his upcoming DC gig.

curmudgeon, Tuesday, 19 September 2017 14:01 (four years ago) link

one month passes...

Koolest Wizards jumbotron screengrab of all time? pic.twitter.com/XV6Xt4R8D1

— Chris _ _ Richards (@Chris__Richards) November 10, 2017

Josh in Chicago, Saturday, 11 November 2017 14:53 (three years ago) link

Also, had no idea Lally and Canty were in a new band together.

Josh in Chicago, Saturday, 11 November 2017 14:57 (three years ago) link

(With Anthony Pirog)

Josh in Chicago, Saturday, 11 November 2017 14:58 (three years ago) link

& Rites of Spring really surprised me

Universal LULU Nation (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Saturday, 11 November 2017 15:18 (three years ago) link

Welp, that rules.

he doesn't need to be racist about it though. (Austin), Saturday, 11 November 2017 17:28 (three years ago) link

three months pass...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0nFZe_e-qc

new canty/lally/pirog track

I want to change my display name (dan m), Wednesday, 7 March 2018 16:32 (three years ago) link

Another track here https://themessthetics.bandcamp.com/track/serpent-tongue

I want to change my display name (dan m), Wednesday, 7 March 2018 16:34 (three years ago) link

Messthetics album release is March 23. Brendan Canty is also gonna be busy touring with MC5 50th anniversary group with Wayne Kramer and others

curmudgeon, Wednesday, 7 March 2018 17:43 (three years ago) link

End hits fucking rules

kolakube (Ross), Wednesday, 7 March 2018 17:47 (three years ago) link

^otm

I want to change my display name (dan m), Wednesday, 7 March 2018 18:17 (three years ago) link

all fugazi albums rule

It's not delivery, it's Adorno! (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 7 March 2018 18:30 (three years ago) link

Steady Diet of Nothing doesn't imo but that's about it

albvivertine, Thursday, 8 March 2018 04:24 (three years ago) link

No, that one rules, too. A lot.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 8 March 2018 04:34 (three years ago) link

Steady Diet a lot better than End Hits - the former a much better showcase for the rhythm section, which is the band's strongest point.

(what I mean is the instrumental-side of Fugazi is better in the context of short, tightly wound interplay where the bass/drums are at the forefront - 'jammy' Fugazi isn't the best Fugazi IMO)

Master of Treacle, Thursday, 8 March 2018 10:37 (three years ago) link

i'd call red medicine jammy, end hits i guess is playing-wise but towards much more frictive ends? anyway that era is my favorite of theirs, i think the rhythm section gets plenty of shine and the compositions especially on end hits hit a great balance of punch and spaciousness (both of which iirc steady diet lacks a bit i comparison to their other records variously, though it still rules)

lowercase (eric), Thursday, 8 March 2018 10:51 (three years ago) link

the argument hits that balance the most smoothly and so might be their best (it's a good record to end on as it ties together strands of their previous modes to creates its own). i listen to it less though bc i love their jammy mode

lowercase (eric), Thursday, 8 March 2018 11:08 (three years ago) link

There is a case to be made that The Argument=Red Medicine/End Hits. End Hits is the one I listen to the least, for no good reason.

In On The Kill Taker is the band's most aggro album. "Facet Squared" - an awesome rush, but why even bother with lyrics? Blaaaargh!

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 8 March 2018 13:56 (three years ago) link

...and their best, IMO. Probably their loudest album but also more dynamically nuanced than the earlier stuff. Plus "Sweet and Low" (an example of why I'm iffy about the longer, later material - they perfected the "this is a Fugazi instrumental" here)

Master of Treacle, Thursday, 8 March 2018 14:07 (three years ago) link

"Facet Squared" - an awesome rush, but why even bother with lyrics? Blaaaargh!

ah but Facet Squared includes one of my absolute favourite Ian lines - "We draw lines and we stand behind them / That's why flags are such ugly things"

papa don't take no meth (stevie), Thursday, 8 March 2018 14:08 (three years ago) link

I love the lyrics to Facet Squared. 'Cool's eternal but it's always dated' has the ring of a stolen revealed truth.

The shard-borne beetle with his drowsy hums (Chinaski), Thursday, 8 March 2018 14:29 (three years ago) link

Yeah, but did you catch any of those lyrics without a lyrics sheet?

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 8 March 2018 14:52 (three years ago) link

Steady Diet is the one that most consistently slays from beginning to end imo. Maybe others have higher highs but it's still my favorite to play in the car.

Fedora Dostoyevsky (man alive), Thursday, 8 March 2018 15:11 (three years ago) link

xp "Irony is the refuge of the educated" was a line ahead of its time imo

Fedora Dostoyevsky (man alive), Thursday, 8 March 2018 15:12 (three years ago) link

That and "I hate the sound of guitars" are the fugazi lyrics I think about most

Fedora Dostoyevsky (man alive), Thursday, 8 March 2018 15:13 (three years ago) link

three weeks pass...

Messthetics LP is awesome, gotta check out more music by this Anthony Pirog guy

Paul Ponzi, Saturday, 31 March 2018 14:46 (three years ago) link

Good podcast interview w/Ian about some of the music that mattered to him: http://wypr.org/post/essential-tremors-ian-mackaye

Fugazi rules. my first album of theirs was "Red Medicine" and i was shocked it was only $10. soon enough picked up "Repeater" and listened to those two a lot in my first year of college. kept up with them off an on and always enjoyed their stuff. i remember really liking the "Instrument" movie, which was the last thing i heard of them.

i got to see them play a show in early 2000s. it was of course a great show, and they stopped it midway through to throw out somebody in the audience who was being unduly aggressive. as a small person who always had to be cautious around mosh pits at shows, seeing this in action was very much appreciated!

Hazy Maze Cave (Adam Bruneau), Saturday, 31 March 2018 17:06 (three years ago) link

No one wants to discuss this Mesthetics record, huh? Quit living in the past!

Mostly kidding here. But this record is great and should be getting more attention.

Paul Ponzi, Saturday, 31 March 2018 17:15 (three years ago) link

Fuck it, I'm starting a thread

Paul Ponzi, Saturday, 31 March 2018 17:15 (three years ago) link

Didn't know that (nor do I have any recollection of the balloons)! I saw them again a few weeks later at the college I was attending in Vermont; it was VERY hastily organized, there were rumors that the band was pissed about the lack of publicity, the place was half full (maybe 250-300, if that)...and they apparently did better financially on that show than on a sold-out Aragon show.

Montgomery Burns' Jazz (Tarfumes The Escape Goat), Thursday, 7 January 2021 17:33 (eight months ago) link

And 3900 was "sold out" for Aragon shows until they started dangerously packing people in. I remember the '96 Sex Pistols show was shoulder-to-shoulder in the very back of the hall.

Montgomery Burns' Jazz (Tarfumes The Escape Goat), Thursday, 7 January 2021 17:34 (eight months ago) link

Left has already said they were just having some 'fun' with all of this. I knew Left must get some enjoyment out of life somehow somewhere sometime.

Eggbreak Hotel (Tom D.), Thursday, 7 January 2021 17:51 (eight months ago) link

what I wanted to take issue with was the implication that all this was something more/less than what it is, the idea (which is popular, maybe more popular at the time, in these scenes) that running an "ethical" business, doing benefits, not merchandising in an obvious way, adopting a vegan diet, etc... is not just a (better?) way of operating within the system but is actually substantially outside of or against it. this way of operating sometimes then becomes a standard of purity to hold others to, something they could also have achieved if they'd really cared (and that part is where the ideological distance from neoliberalism becomes less huge than it seems at first)

also, even if these things were really difficult and a lot of money was left on the table, I imagine it was easier for MacKaye to be as successful within his own terms as he was, than it would have been without his relatively privileged background (which is also where GoBW comes in... still no excuse, now or ever)

as#d,.F:ddz;,c#,;;,;,;,sdf' (Left), Thursday, 7 January 2021 17:59 (eight months ago) link

sorry to keep with the politics but the problem with the "bernie owning houses" thing is that it's raised by people who have no opposition to capitalism or to people owning as many houses as they like - as an attempt to own people who sometimes might be expected to have at least some. not that bernie (or ian) isn't really a capitalist or isn't really bourgeois, or that this kind of wealth is actually ok as long as you're woke enough

as#d,.F:ddz;,c#,;;,;,;,sdf' (Left), Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:09 (eight months ago) link

"this kind of wealth" - ROFLMAO

stay focused on the 1% dude, eyes on the prize

howls of non-specificity (sleeve), Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:13 (eight months ago) link

I've seen enough.... Ian MacKaye is Elon Musk.

Jersey Al (Albert R. Broccoli), Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:18 (eight months ago) link

Not even the richest DC punk rocker .

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:22 (eight months ago) link

sorry in what sense is this not wealth. I suppose he's less rich than a few guys

as#d,.F:ddz;,c#,;;,;,;,sdf' (Left), Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:30 (eight months ago) link

dude I'm probably worth $1 mil on paper and I have $2K in the bank and no retirement

howls of non-specificity (sleeve), Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:32 (eight months ago) link

(to be fair >50% of that is my wife)

howls of non-specificity (sleeve), Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:33 (eight months ago) link

upper middle class =! the 1%

howls of non-specificity (sleeve), Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:34 (eight months ago) link

I don't really understand the meaning of "ok" in that sentence. Socialism isn't kashrut, it's not a series of laws about what are "ok" individual choices.

longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:34 (eight months ago) link

(putting aside that one is his vermont residence, one is his DC residence -- something every member of congress needs -- and one is I believe a lake house his wife inherited from her parents. It's not like they're deliberately accumulating properties)

longtime caller, first time listener (man alive), Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:35 (eight months ago) link

"socialism" is full of normative judgments (eg exploitation is basically a bad thing), some of the theory crowd has always been a bit in denial about this

as#d,.F:ddz;,c#,;;,;,;,sdf' (Left), Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:48 (eight months ago) link

so the defensiveness is really not necessary and there is not really an "ok" level of accumulation including what I engage in. I suppose there are some fundamental differences of opinion about what constitutes being rich. the fact that someone is a capitalist (as in "I've got my own business") or that they own more property than most people ever will should not be controversial though

as#d,.F:ddz;,c#,;;,;,;,sdf' (Left), Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:53 (eight months ago) link

lol are you a Maoist?

howls of non-specificity (sleeve), Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:56 (eight months ago) link

that's like one step away from Cultural Revolution shit IMHO

howls of non-specificity (sleeve), Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:56 (eight months ago) link

THE LOCAL SHOPKEEPER IS THE ENEMY OF THE PEOPLE

howls of non-specificity (sleeve), Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:57 (eight months ago) link

Home ownership in America is somewhere around 65%.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:57 (eight months ago) link

And a home bought in 1981 or whenever in what has since become one of the most valuable real estate markets in the country is going to go way up, even if you never so much as mowed the grass.

Josh in Chicago, Thursday, 7 January 2021 18:59 (eight months ago) link

thing is though, dischord just kind of *happened* like they put out their own 45s and then were like oh we should put out our friend's band and oh cool we broke even, so put out some more stuff and hey cool we made some money let's put out some more records

the idea that it was some kind of plan to be a capitalist and not just putting out music they thought should be heard that no one would put out - AND pre-internet when you had to get things manufactured and distribute physical products - seems ahistorical and unfair

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Thursday, 7 January 2021 19:02 (eight months ago) link

and like you actually have to live somewhere, is owning a home morally wrong when the only option is to participate in the rental market? putting money in the hands of some real estate company?

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Thursday, 7 January 2021 19:04 (eight months ago) link

Not everyone lives in America, believe it or not.

Eggbreak Hotel (Tom D.), Thursday, 7 January 2021 19:08 (eight months ago) link

To explain Left's perspective, not Ian Mackaye's living arrangements.

Eggbreak Hotel (Tom D.), Thursday, 7 January 2021 19:08 (eight months ago) link

I'm not a marxist-leninist but business owners are capitalists in the most literal descriptive sense and it's true that property ownership is a kind of wealth a lot of people won't ever see. I don't know what's so outrageous, is this still about mackaye or something else

as#d,.F:ddz;,c#,;;,;,;,sdf' (Left), Thursday, 7 January 2021 19:11 (eight months ago) link

well now that you've downgraded your blanket judgement from "most" to "a lot" I'd say I'm good

howls of non-specificity (sleeve), Thursday, 7 January 2021 19:13 (eight months ago) link

again this is like a pragmatist vs idealist debate, like a lot of ILX

howls of non-specificity (sleeve), Thursday, 7 January 2021 19:14 (eight months ago) link

yeah if I cared about more than dreaming I would get shit done, anyone can do it as long as they work hard enough and understand that in the real world you have to cut deals

as#d,.F:ddz;,c#,;;,;,;,sdf' (Left), Thursday, 7 January 2021 19:20 (eight months ago) link

being white / male with a college degree from that generation pretty much guarantees you this kind of net worth

dean bad (map), Thursday, 7 January 2021 19:23 (eight months ago) link

guilty of being (rich) white (male)

as#d,.F:ddz;,c#,;;,;,;,sdf' (Left), Thursday, 7 January 2021 19:25 (eight months ago) link

(from that generation)

as#d,.F:ddz;,c#,;;,;,;,sdf' (Left), Thursday, 7 January 2021 19:27 (eight months ago) link

guilty of being (rich) white (male)

these new song titles for the deluxe reissue lay it on a bit thick imho

stylish but illegal (Simon H.), Thursday, 7 January 2021 19:33 (eight months ago) link

Anyone with a net worth of a million bucks or more (and MacKaye is probably significantly ahead of that given his career and age) is in fairly rarified air. The median net worth even for Boomers is like $200k and that’s all tied up in their home equity.

It’s a big who cares here but weird to dismiss a rich guy being rich with some hand waving ‘well evvvvvverybody is like that.’

Joe Biden Stan Account (milo z), Thursday, 7 January 2021 20:20 (eight months ago) link

lol Simon

I suppose there are some fundamental differences of opinion about what constitutes being rich.

agreed

howls of non-specificity (sleeve), Thursday, 7 January 2021 20:24 (eight months ago) link

what is the right amount of money to have?

I guess to me he's like "normal people rich" as opposed to like CEOs of big companies or investment dudes

like my job before this was at a small PR firm, like 11 employees including the owners, they are my reference for normal ppl rich

Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Thursday, 7 January 2021 20:28 (eight months ago) link

some good and interesting takes here but i'll still take the average imperfect and often ineffectual dyed-in-the-wool-cap MRR-style 90s leftist punk - who at least had their hearts and brains in the right place - over their modern counterpart who decries capitalism, corporatization, and wealth inequality while simultaneously sucking at the teet of Netflix, Spotify, Amazon, and Twitter

Paul Ponzi, Friday, 8 January 2021 00:24 (eight months ago) link

Rich vs wealthy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fA4ufNSE7l0

Van Horn Street, Friday, 8 January 2021 00:57 (eight months ago) link

thing is though, dischord just kind of *happened* like they put out their own 45s and then were like oh we should put out our friend's band and oh cool we broke even, so put out some more stuff and hey cool we made some money let's put out some more records

the idea that it was some kind of plan to be a capitalist and not just putting out music they thought should be heard that no one would put out - AND pre-internet when you had to get things manufactured and distribute physical products - seems ahistorical and unfair

― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Thursday, January 7, 2021 2:02 PM (five hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

and like you actually have to live somewhere, is owning a home morally wrong when the only option is to participate in the rental market? putting money in the hands of some real estate company?

― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Thursday, January 7, 2021 2:04 PM (five hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

otm and otm.

I probably spent something like 100$ on Fugazi/Dischord stuff over the past 10 years (with a 15% sales taxe, that's 15 for my two level of governments). That's why he has the net worth he does, that's pretty much it. I don't think there is anything sinister with that sort of transactions.

Van Horn Street, Friday, 8 January 2021 01:05 (eight months ago) link

How would you all rate dischord in the pantheon of record labels just in terms of shipping product, keeping things in stock, paying people what they're owed on time, etc...?

Philip Nunez, Friday, 8 January 2021 01:23 (eight months ago) link

A+ from all accounts

howls of non-specificity (sleeve), Friday, 8 January 2021 01:27 (eight months ago) link

eight months pass...

I listened to the 3hr Bandsplain episode on Fugazi on a recent long drive. I didn't learn a huge amount but Brandon Stosuy is good company and of course the tunes were great. Aside, but this daft Britisher is constantly surprised that Guy's name is pronounced (unvoiced G) Gee Pi-CHOT-oh.

Vanishing Point (Chinaski), Thursday, 9 September 2021 13:32 (one week ago) link

Ha. This American living in DC area sometimes heard his last name pronounced multiple ways

curmudgeon, Thursday, 9 September 2021 15:35 (one week ago) link

I'm reading the 33 1/3 In On the Kill Taker and it's really good. I've had a day listening to lots of Egg Hunt and Rites of Spring. My god what a talented scene.

Has anyone dipped into the live archive? I've not and was hoping someone would know where to start...

Vanishing Point (Chinaski), Saturday, 18 September 2021 20:31 (two days ago) link

This blog may help.

JRN, Saturday, 18 September 2021 21:43 (two days ago) link

Perfect, cheers.

Vanishing Point (Chinaski), Sunday, 19 September 2021 08:55 (yesterday) link

The first time I crossed the border from the North of ireland into the Republic was for the McGonagles gig that is talked about on the blog that is linked to by JRN. So 31 years ago last Friday. Thanks wouldn't have thought of that if i hadn't seen that.
& I think first time i came to Galway would be within about a week afterwards.

Stevolende, Sunday, 19 September 2021 10:43 (yesterday) link

I’m still so sad to have missed the initial release (and thus the physical CD editions).

Legalize Suburban Benches (Raymond Cummings), Sunday, 19 September 2021 10:51 (yesterday) link

I grabbed the physical editions of at least the first set at the time, and iirc I think they're just CD-Rs (that Joe burned?) with the same basic reused artwork. Though honestly I haven't taken out the actual CDs for years, so maybe they're not CD-Rs? That's how I remember them at least.

Josh in Chicago, Sunday, 19 September 2021 12:42 (yesterday) link


You must be logged in to post. Please either login here, or if you are not registered, you may register here.