Listen to an album you've never heard by an artist you never listen to and then tell us about it!

but also, listen to Terror Twilight.

Hmm… that’s not the Pavement album I would advise anyone to start with!

Also they unfortunately messed up the S&E mix on the expanded reissue (IMO), I would advise against listening to that version…

(I mean it doesn’t ruin the album or anything, but you want that thin wild mercury trebel-kicker sound, not some weird bass boost)

Terror Twilight has some jammage with heft and i thought that might make an appropriate gateway drug for some skronky metalhead like unperson. but lord knows with him. he can be an enigma of sorts when it comes to likes/dislikes.

Haha no I know some King Crimson. I know Court and the second one. I know Red and Discipline and weirdly Thrak. I like Belew as a singer. I haven’t listened to Aspic or Perfect Pair or Islands or whatever. Maybe I should. I’m not an immense fan.

In the Court, Red, and Discipline are the main ones IMO - once you've heard those three I think you get most of what the band has to offer. I like Larks' Tongues a lot, IMO it's their most interesting record, though it's not as metal as Red (except for certain sections which are incredibly metal). I dig Lizard too but it's not exactly a record I like recommending to people. Three of a Perfect Pair has some excellent pop songs on Side 1 but they're kinda like Belew solo material.

Personally when it comes to prog I like to recommend Gentle Giant and Van der Graaf Generator. GG I think is a good starting point because they appeal to people's inner band geek and their songs are generally short. They're not trying to summon demons or invoke fantasy landscapes they're just trying to put wonky melodies together in odd ways. VdGG on the other hand are pretty dark and theatrical and in Hammill they've got a true rockstar persona which the other bands don't really have. At prog night (which coincidentally I am DJing tonight) that's the band that gets the uninitiated to pay attention, for better or worse.

Pavement are two bands to me. Westing and S&E, then the latter albums. I like both modes. There’s something smarmy about SM’s songwriting voice that keeps me from loving them, but I like them, I like him.

It’s funny, when I was young (20? 21?) I recorded with my friend James. He had IAAOTS and Moon Pix out, on CD. He talked to me about how much he loved both albums. I borrowed them both and listened to them on the same day. Moon Pix became a landmark album for me, I always want drums and guitar to sound like that. One time I recorded with Shahzad, he brought Jim White’s snare with him, I was so excited. NMH left little impression in comparison, good band good album tho. It felt in retrospect like a moment of choice, “choose NMH or choose Cat Power to define your young brain” and I chose Cat Power.

gentle giant are so awesome. van der graaf i would think might be a challenge or a chore depending on someone's tolerance for a LOT of words. so many words. but they were awesome.

depends which track you play - I find "Arrow" and "La Rossa" get a lot of "what the fuck was that" reactions, which I think is what you want

i love Nektar. both early and late. i would recommend them to anyone. they rocked so hard. i'm a big Barclay James Harvest fan - and a big fan of that pastoral/rural Harvest prog stuff - but for some reason i never push them on people. they might be underwhelming if you aren't into them. but also a band i like early and late. i feel like people see them as an afterthought. 3rd tier. whatever. but they could be so beautiful.

I'm listening to Slanted & Enchanted because it's the shortest Pavement album. I don't hate the vocals. They don't make me feel anything at all. Fucking Lou Reed. He and his enablers in the rock press (and at the three major labels that subsidized his lame ass for 40 years) convinced multiple generations of white dudes that if they couldn't sing they could just recite their lyrics and it would be fine. It's not fine. My biggest fear with this record, honestly, was that the drumming would be as limp and dead as 99% of "indie" "rock," but this guy actually seems to be awake and aware that he's playing a song and that it should have energy and dynamics. The songs are unmemorable, but at least they're alive while they're happening, which is more than I can say for Radiohead post-2001, to pick one example.

Aw man that’s not fair. I listened to In Rainbows again after years away from it, literally yesterday, and it’s even better than I remember. I get what you mean about Lou Reed though. I think with Malkmus it’s more about The Fall. “Two States” he’s even doing the MES thing

"I like Belew as a singer."

my tolerance is pretty low. and he makes things into his own image and it doesn't sit right with me. too bad fred frith didn't join KC. or derek bailey! hahaha!

i know for a lot of people S&E is the best but i think they got way better as they went from album to album. i love that last album. i like them all though.

omg the thought of Bailey and Fripp working together

i love Nektar. both early and late. i would recommend them to anyone

curious what the good late-period Nektar albums are. I've gone up to Recycled.

my tolerance is pretty low. and he makes things into his own image and it doesn't sit right with me. too bad fred frith didn't join KC. or derek bailey! hahaha!

I get what you're saying but on the other hand he's kind of the only guy who could've made it work, both in that he could keep up with Fripp and also write songs which you kinda needed by the 80s. I don't think Frith or Bailey could've done that. the downside is 80s KC sounds absolutely nothing like they used to, outside of maybe parts of Side 2 of ToaPP. Yes and Genesis at least retained *some* aspects of their prior sound.

someone listen to a City Boy album. i love them. the poor man's 10cc.

What's wrong with reciting lyrics, Lou Reed (or MES) style? Anyway, who taught all those metal dudes who can't sing that it's "fine" to tunelessly bark or growl lyrics? It's not fine! (lol)

if they couldn't sing they could just recite their lyrics and it would be fine

we're talking about pavement? melodies are kind of their thing.

Yeah, "Zurich Is Stained" is playing right now as I type this... great tune

Great thread idea

I'd love to do an 80s or 90s country record that is considered a classic, if anyone wants to recommend one

Dwight Yoakam, Guitars, Cadillacs, Etc. Etc.

Sold! I'll get started on the way home.

i was gonna say garth brooks but dwight is cool.

I am going to listen to The Thievery Corporation - Sounds From The Thievery Hi Fi. I was suspicious of them at the time, I wanted all my trip hop/blunted beats people to wear puffy parkas etc

i never listen to whole country albums. i like comps. i see country like techno. singles rule. but i should try out an album too. it might be a bit much though. i listen to a lot of 50s stuff. hillbillies. the hillbillier than betterer. but i could go 80s probably. i like shania i a lot.

ooh yeah forgotten trip hop. that would be fun. probably.

you guys should bold your titles. i should have done that. so that we can see what people actually listened to. makes sense, no?

Pavement - Crooked Rain, Crooked Rain

My knock against them has always been that they're rhythmically slack and overly busy (isn't there a weird crossover with Pavement fans and jam band fans? My theory is that's why). I can hear why this never would have been my band at the time, I wouldn't have cared about the lyrics or the semi-detached aesthetic.

But this is sounding pretty good to me today, now that I have a lot more reference points for stuff that came before (Lou Reed and VU for sure, which is a recent thing for me) and after. The time is allll over the place, I still kinda hate the drums, but in 2024 it's refreshing to hear a big record that's this loose and live-sounding. The vocals don't bother me (was Thurston a big influence?). The guitars are nice. Tbh it all makes me want to listen to Sonic Youth, they have a great drummer.

I like the second half of Stop Breathin, kinda Radiohead-y for a bit? Gold Soundz is cool, I've heard that. 5-4=Unity is funny, for a band whose weak point is rhythm to do an instrumental where the rhythm is the whole bit. "I need to sleep" is a great lyric.

country does seem more like a singles music for the most part. Certainly with older country I'm more about songs. I love George Jones but I couldn't tell you about any specific George Jones "album" really. I assume by the 80s/90s it was a bit more album-oriented though?

I made it all the way through the Pavement album. There was some actual singing on it. Some of it was even OK. I understand why people thought he was imitating Mark E. Smith, but that was only one song out of 14 or 15 so I don't know why people fixate on it. The particular type of distortion on the guitars occasionally reminded me of the first Stooges album, which was a good choice, and as I said before the drummer was better than I expected him to be. I think ultimately metal has ruined this kind of music for me, because I just don't understand why anyone would write and perform songs that feel so...uncommitted, would be the best word. Like, Rob Halford and Ronnie James Dio and Bruce Dickinson (and their respective bands) gave fully committed performances at all times. And that kind of boneheaded theatricality is the minimum acceptable standard for rock performance, in my opinion. You don't even have to look to metal for comparisons, either. Think of Bad Brains. H.R. was fully committed, 100% from start to stop. This "indie" "rock" idea of acting cooler than the thing you're doing (singing a song), of mumbling and strumming and swaying slowly back and forth (whether they are or not, they sound like they are) is abhorrent to me. It sounded unprofessional in a deliberate way — like, it was sometimes mixed so that the vocals were buried, but not on every track, so the ones where they were seemed like mistakes that they didn't care enough to fix. I will never listen to Pavement again; they are Not For Me.

Dwight Yoakam is playing near me (in Montana "near" means a two-hour drive) in July and I am thinking about going. Tickets go on sale this week. I've always wanted to see him.

def curious what hearing Thievery Corporation for the first time in 2024 is like (xp)

I would participate here — agreed on it being a good idea — but a friend of mine have been doing basically this same thing for the past 6 years (I've got him listening to Aquemini for the first time this week, while I listen to Sinatra's Watertown)

my big one in the coming month or so is to dive into the Bob Marley & The Wailers catalog. that's one of those artists where the people i knew repping it during my younger days had me put that on the shelf.

do yourself a favour and start at the beginning with Marley: the Studio One comp then the Scratch-produced stuff before you do the Island albums

Finally doing a deep dive into Marley a few years ago, after long putting it off, was something I found so rewarding. There is an entire alternate career that could be carved out of his body of work without touching a single fucking song on Legend (which isn't to say all of the songs on Legend are terrible, far from it, but my god he has so many incredible songs in his catalog that you never need to hear those overplayed warhorses again).

i dig the Pavement thoughts. even the negative stuff i get. for me it really is about the guitar sounds. they just hit on something that connects with me in a huge way. and i really like how their albums are produced. especially later. and there is very definite effort when it comes to their presentation and production. the slacker thing almost seems like a front to me from people who really do dig rock deeply and wanted to create something lasting. as far as Matador guitar rock goes, Pavement/Come/Unsane are my pinnacles. they always sound good to me no matter what.

I am obsessed with Mark Leckey’s sets on NTS. I have been listening to one a week and then investigating all this new music I’d never heard of. Everyone should listen to Mark Leckey’s sets on NTS. He is amazing

FGTI I dunno if you've heard it or not but would totally recommend listening to his guest appearance on the Digging With Flo podcast, wherein he plants potatoes and chats about his life. Really good and wholesome stuff:

https://open.spotify.com/episode/4UzCXiJuZhloApBPpWX1jM?si=K_nyLn7HRv6QlyyjGoTlJg

Flo has lots of other great guests on that too from the London music/arts scene, i love it!

*end of thread hijack*

I did this when someone ran a poll on the Libertines' self-titled album. I thought it was a self-indulgent mess. Did the same thing with Alice Coltrane's Ptah, the El-Daoud, thought it was tremendous. I would like to have more of the latter experience.

unperson – what do you think of the Germs, or Circle Jerks, or various other punk bands not fronted by H.R., which take some approach to performance (maybe involving a certain detachment, or irony) other than "fully committed" "theatricality"?

Moon Pix became a landmark album for me, I always want drums and guitar to sound like that.

imho Jim White is the greatest living drummer working within the rock and rock-adjacent field

trying to think abt what I should start with here and those Jane Siberry albums are tempting, otoh I already know I would prob like them

i think (GI) is as good as...hmm...name some art that came out in 1979. The Black Stallion? Apocalypse Now? a Cindy Sherman untitled film still? in that realm.

when Jim White came in my store the day after a Xylouris White show around the corner all i did was grill him about Nina Nastasia. he was cool with it. he loves her too.

I made it all the way through the Pavement album. There was some actual singing on it. Some of it was even OK. I understand why people thought he was imitating Mark E. Smith, but that was only one song out of 14 or 15 so I don't know why people fixate on it. The particular type of distortion on the guitars occasionally reminded me of the first Stooges album, which was a good choice, and as I said before the drummer was better than I expected him to be. I think ultimately metal has ruined this kind of music for me, because I just don't understand why anyone would write and perform songs that feel so...uncommitted, would be the best word. Like, Rob Halford and Ronnie James Dio and Bruce Dickinson (and their respective bands) gave fully committed performances at all times. And that kind of boneheaded theatricality is the minimum acceptable standard for rock performance, in my opinion. You don't even have to look to metal for comparisons, either. Think of Bad Brains. H.R. was fully committed, 100% from start to stop. This "indie" "rock" idea of acting cooler than the thing you're doing (singing a song), of mumbling and strumming and swaying slowly back and forth (whether they are or not, they sound like they are) is abhorrent to me. It sounded unprofessional in a deliberate way — like, it was sometimes mixed so that the vocals were buried, but not on every track, so the ones where they were seemed like mistakes that they didn't care enough to fix. I will never listen to Pavement again; they are Not For Me.

― Tahuti Watches L&O:SVU Reruns Without His Ape (unperson), Thursday, 7 March 2024 19:14 (seven minutes ago) link

I feel like a lot of these reflections on indie rock as a whole are 80% an uncharitable caricature and 20% true, but I'm not going to be the guy to drag you kicking and screaming through indie recommendations. Also there are so many sounds underneath the vague "indie rock" umbrella that it's easy to make it mean whatever you want it to.

I've never listened to Moon Pix or a Cat Power album so maybe I will do that next.

xp Yeah I feel like unperson is taking “indie rock sucks” as a starting point, and then trying to retrofit based on that (which is part of what my earlier comment was getting at).

I used to hate Pavement but I came around on them a while ago. You have to let go of what you want them to be and let them be what they are. They don't "groove hard." That's not what they're about. Their rhythmic approach is more like a piece of driftwood on a creek, just lazing along.

unperson – what do you think of the Germs, or Circle Jerks, or various other punk bands not fronted by H.R., which take some approach to performance (maybe involving a certain detachment, or irony) other than "fully committed" "theatricality"?

I hate the Germs. I love the Circle Jerks (saw them on their 10th anniversary tour, which I feel like was billed as a farewell, ha ha). I have also seen Keith Morris with OFF! and would never describe him as uncommitted or ironically detached/distanced from what he's doing. He's a flamethrower.

Do the Pavement dudes come from money? Because I feel like there's a class-based element to my hatred of "indie" "rock", like the music lacks energy because the musicians can just go get jobs at their dads' investment banks if it doesn't take off. Whereas metal bands mostly come from nothing (yes, Lars Ulrich was a rich kid, but James Hetfield absolutely was not) and need the band to succeed if they're going to eat that month. And that tension is audible in the music.

i don't know if i'll talk about it here but i definitely want to listen to more 20th century classical that i haven't heard. i think i appreciate it more now. i used to think a lot of it was too tedious but now that i am old and tedious its just right for me. i've been listening to Elliott Carter all day. i just got some great stuff in. your berg and your webern and your wolpe. tons of those cats.

but i'll totally talk about taylor swift here. maybe.

Overwhelmed by the impossible loveliness of the production. These stereoized guitars!

Curious what you think of the production on the next album (which is basically all production iirc)...

Just took my first spin with Sahib Shibab and a couple others I'd never heard before, although did know NHOP from all kinds of places, incl. bluegrass, also familiar Alex Thiel(mainly from his work w The Savage Rose) It's mostly fluid, fluent, fun, w flute of Shibab sometimes making me think of Rashaan, going from shapely to gnarly and back again (also good on sax). Good clear you are there/they are here sound, though they did lose me for a bit during "Not Yet," but it was late and first listen. Teen NHOP a natural leader when Shibab is quite sensibly giving him, but not aggressive about it, just doing what he always does, ditto cool spare otm guitarist. This is from ORG Music for Record Store Day Black Friday, Nov. 29:

Sahib Shihab,

Sahib’s Jazz Party & After Hours

(2LP)

Sahib's Jazz Party is an album by saxophonist/flautist Sahib Shihab, recorded live at the Jazzhus Montmartre in Copenhagen, around the same time that he relocated there in 1963. Shihab is joined by flugelhornist Allan Botchinsky, guitarist Ole Molin, drummer Alex Riel, and 17-year-old bass prodigy Niels Henning Orsted Pederson. The recordings showcase Sahib’s diversity and dexterity as a player, including his openness to the avant-garde style, expanding on the bop era playing he is known for. The album is presented here in a gatefold jacket with a bonus LP, including three tracks not available on previous vinyl releases — what we’re referring to as the “After Hours”. The audio has been remastered by Dave Gardner and pressed on audiophile-grade vinyl at Pallas Group in Germany.
Tracklist:

A1 4070 Blues

A2 Charade

B1 Conversations, Part I

B2 Conversations, Part II

B3 Conversations, Part III

C1 Billy Boy

D1 Not Yet

D2 Someday My Prince Will Come

Teen NHOP a natural leader when Shibab is quite sensibly giving him room

Alex Riel, damn, sorry Alex!

(Flugelhorn gets a little too "charming Billy" at one point in "Billy Boy," but the others actually don't)

I don't know how this happened, but I've never listened to Arthur Russell much. I'm sure I listened to World of Echo at least once or twice but never dug deeper, I don't know if I was saving it or feeling resistant to the hipster renaissance and seemingly endless reissues.

Today I listened to Picture of Bunny Rabbit and Calling Out of Context, and of course they're incredible. I don't need to go into it, everybody knows, but Bunny Rabbit in particular has such a consistent and intimate feel. It's so stark and stripped back and yet somehow never feels demo-y or like anything's missing, and sounds like it could have been made yesterday.

― Jordan s/t (Jordan)

He's amazing and his archival catalogue is a treasure trove. He had a very unique approach to songwriting and the amount of interesting musical ideas he left behind is astounding. It's so sad such a creative mind passed away at its prime. Listen to "another thought" next, it's mostly comprised of cello home recordings but it contains some of my favorite songs by him.

I was having a hard time finding that! Not on the reissue Bandcamp or on streaming (Qobuz), unless I just missed it.

Curious what you think of the production on the next album (which is basically all production iirc)...

I need to listen to it a second time, but on first listen:

- fragments and neologisms creating an unsatisfying cryptic crossword; but perhaps this is part of the appeal, lack of concrete meaning allows for listeners to project and project and project

- amazing sax production, like I could listen to hours of these players getting glitched

- extreme loveliness and unloveliness in the production, very appealing

- lyrics about "a cup of tea" and "the Ace hotel" were charmingly stinky

- fundamentally these songs (as chords and melodies) are really pastel, and at first left me feeling undernourished, but by the end of the album I felt more like I was listening to something sprung from folk/hymnal tradition, and I started to buy it

I listened to 2 more Iron Maiden albums - The Number Of The Beast and Seventh Son Of A Seventh Son. I did at least know a song from each of these (Run To The Hills and Can I Play With Madness obv). I liked both these albums more than Powerslave, which as I posted upthread I didn't like at all, although didn't really love either of them. I suppose I should listen to the pre-Bruce Dickinson ones next. or maybe Maiden Voyage by the other Iron Maiden, I like their song Falling

oh you will very definitely prefer the pre-bruce albums. of this i am almost certain.

Ty fgti (I'm friends with a few of those many sax players, there were some funny stories from those sessions)

On the Belew era Crimson music, if you like the studio albums be sure to check out the live album Absent Lovers. Belew and Levins vocals are very good live on that one, it is very impressive gig.

so I know Gong, but I am listening to Daevid Allen's solo LP Banana Moon for the first time ever, it's quite different!

love that album, never sure who to credit it to but it seems to be thought of as a DA solo LP these days. Just a classic "get a load of friends together and make an LP" thing.

I love *Seven Drones* by Daevid Allen.

I am a little late to this but Jordan, ‘Another Thought’ is my favorite Arthur Russell record, but it is also a record that i can hardly listen to anymore because even *thinking* about certain songs makes me well up. ‘A Little Lost,’ ‘Me for Real,’ and ‘Losing My Taste for the Nightlife,’ and ‘A Sudden Chill’ in particular— transcendent music.

and yeah, listening again, this and ‘All Hail West Texas’ might be my top two ‘i love this but i will weep openly while it plays’ records. (as for the latter, i can’t even listen to ‘Best Ever Death Metal Band’ without breaking into ugly tears).

my husband got me a tape of ‘AHWT’ as a birthday present gift and put it on while I was doing dishes and i had to ask him to turn it off because i couldn’t help but sing along but singing along makes me cry.