RÓISÍN MURPHY

Ain’t gonna lie— never understood the appeal of her music, now even more reason to never listen to it!

Super-disappointing :(

Róisín Murphy follows a small amount of industry people on Twitter, so this follow sticks out like a sore thumb. Bari is editor of "The Free Press," a regular publisher of anti-trans stories. I suppose RM just "accidentally" followed her with "middle-aged clumsy thumbs," though? pic.twitter.com/3RFpjApxqm

— Aidan Comerford (@AidanCTweets) August 24, 2023

it seems like just total ignorance on her part caught up in the moral panic rather than malice but obviously opening with "please don't call me a terf" (which she isn't in any useful sense anyway) suggests she's already down the rabbit hole a fair bit.

but of course just bafflingly stupid of her of all people to feel the need to weigh in here

Santana walking it back pretty quickly

https://www.usatoday.com/story/entertainment/celebrities/2023/08/24/carlos-santana-anti-trans-comments-apology/70672438007/

I'm kind of baffled there has been radio silence from her & her team for the past two or three days since it broke out, given the fact that they're well aware of this making rounds on social media. Not even a half-assed notes app apology or some crisis management statement about her words being taken out of context or anything. She has two shows this weekend, I guess it's business per usual?

it's truly bizarre. based on other forums i've read about this, people are canceling their plans to see her left and right, and increasingly saying the same thing about her lack of a statement. she's got a gig tonight i think?

The thought of a refreshed Roisin taking to the mic mid-gig to address recent statements calls to mind that Michelle Shocked gig from about ten years ago. I think that ended with her manager running onstage to cut the power.

what happened with Mchelle Shocked?

oh ha, looked it up, I'd forgotten about that.

Thought I saw she'd been dropped from one of this weekend's gigs?

No it was like a DJ set of her tunes, like an album launch thing. She wasn’t actually meant to be there on the night per se. But that particular clubnight has links with her which go back years, so it’s quite A Thing for them to cancel something like that. Good on them I have to say. They did it quickly with a minimum of fuss.

she's supposed to play tonight apparently, in Lincoln.

And now I was reading that according to the festival website they pushed her to Sunday night at 6:00 p.m.

she's still supposed to play in Edinburgh tomorrow.

Still radio silent.

I mean, I have tix to see her in LA next month. Not sure I'd be inclined to sell them at this point, but maybe. As the parent of a trans woman, this is a pretty personal issue to me, but I suspect if I asked my daughter, she'd say, "Eh."

I mean, I have tix to see her in LA next month. Not sure I'd be inclined to sell them at this point, but maybe. As the parent of a trans woman, this is a pretty personal issue to me, but I suspect if I asked my daughter, she'd say, "Eh."

― immodesty blaise (jimbeaux)

i don't know that she's have any idea who roisin murphy is... though maybe i'm off-base on that and i'm just projecting my personal ignorance!

see the interesting thing here is that... i've seen this enough times, it's usually easy to guess when someone's a genuine bigot and when someone is genuinely confused... i think it's interesting honestly, because santana _wasn't_ "just asking questions", he just said something superficial, and when it was brought to his attention that what he'd said was superficial and ignorant he apologized. a lot of transphobes do the roisin thing where they feign ignorance, even though they've been retweeting bari weiss and so forth for years... cis people don't notice it or assign any significance to it but trans people know the transphobe Pipeline very well. they double down because there wasn't actually any question in their minds, it's all part of a strategy, a strategy to make their bigotry look reasonable. the conclusion was foreordained, and when it happens, trans people are blamed for not being sufficiently polite in our responses.

we knew rowling was a committed transphobe years before cis people were willing to acknowledge it... the "just asking questions" thing worked for a while, because they _looked_ like the questions a genuinely ignorant person could ask, the cis audience could _see themselves_ asking those same questions. which, again, is _entirely the point_, to ask those leading questions, questions based on faulty assumptions, questions that exploit the ignorance we all had for a long time, and by asking those questions publicly, draw people to those flawed conclusions.

i can tell you right now people who are committed transphobes but most people have no idea... there's a member of radiohead, for instance, nobody talks about him being a transphobe, but it's pretty clear. if radiohead ever does another album and tour, there are going to be Problems.

santana? santana really didn't know any better. cooper? cooper's a born again christian, of _course_ he hates queers. murphy? ahhhhh, now there's where you find the Mumsnet/Rowling pipeline in action.

america has transphobia, and it's very bad, and it's hurting lots of people, but it's of the alice cooper variety. it's inextricable from other forms of bigotry and denialism endemic to people of that mindset. uk transphobia masks itself as "progressive" and "feminist" and as such is, i think, more of a problem, because of the way it's institutionally entrenched and ingrained in british institutions. all the major media organs, all the major political players, they're all committed to transphobia. if you're not, you're out on your ear, because of your "radical agenda".

the good news is that it _is_ a generational thing, i think, like scientology in hollywood. you get one person in the right place and you can shape the minds of a generation. that's what's happened in the uk, i believe. the bad news is that the Mumsnet Generation now is, well, poisoned, poisoned with hatred and bigotry, and trans people are the ones who are and will continue to suffer its effects.

fwiw she now appears to have unfollowed Bari Weiss

"See, I'm good, I stopped following her!"

it's only notable in the absence of any comment from her

i can tell you right now people who are committed transphobes but most people have no idea... there's a member of radiohead, for instance, nobody talks about him being a transphobe, but it's pretty clear. if radiohead ever does another album and tour, there are going to be Problems.

I’m going to assume this is Johnny Greenwood. I know his wife retweets crazy qanon bullshit.

Sorry submitted without finishing that thought… anyhow:

Yeah they’re separate people and we don’t know if he necessarily aligns with the same ideas as his wife but it’s still sus.

He also liked a transphobic tweet at some point and apologized saying it was “fat fingers” and liked by mistake and yet he followed the journalist before liking said tweet. So yeah as you said, the troublesome ones can be found by who they follow and interact with.

I think the US vs UK divide on this comes down to size, basically. The US isn't one country, like the name suggests it's basically 50 countries, and about half of them are governed by theocratic fascists or people who want to be and will be if given half a chance, but the other half aren't. And the US media is a patchwork, too, there's foaming-at-the-mouth right-wing media (mostly online) pushing a just-this-side-of-mob-violence anti-trans message but there's also trans defenders and people pushing back against that right-wing tide, and everyone's kind of siloed, reading and cheering for what they believe and occasionally hate-reading the other side. Whereas England is a little island with like 5 newspapers, all of which seem to have collectively adopted this frankly bizarre "the trans-es, they're coming to get us!" message, like people in a tiny rural village convinced that monsters are coming up the road, except the village is fucking London. Looking at it from outside it seems as if the entire British media culture (which again seems to be like 5 newspapers and 2 or 3 TV channels) has gone completely fucking insane.

the good news is that it _is_ a generational thing, i think, like scientology in hollywood.

Yes. Speaking as a 25yo I'm quite sure every single terf utterance I've seen has been by someone over, say, 40 or so. That's how it feels anyway.

She's playing at Connect festival just now, my pals who are there have just sent me a video of her on stage.

Absolutely incredible that she hasn't said anything yet. It's popping up everywhere online, and her career isn't strong enough to survive such a thing. And I don't believe a terfy fan base would be sustainable.

Lots of audacity to perform and not acknowledge what happened especially now that her social media is overrun by the worst sort of people. I guess she simply does not care at all.

If she said something dumb in “private” out of well-intentioned ignorance it’s much better to wait until she knows what she’s talking about before making any public statement about how she’s learnt and grown

not sure i understand what’s “well-intentioned” about her “ignorance”

it’s the same old shit these ghouls always spout

i am bitterly disappointed

It's extremely easy to see how hurt many of her trans fans are right now, and some of them are apparently getting attacked by terfy types in the comments of her social media. I haven't had the stomach to read any of that shit so I'm only hearing that through a couple other forums I've read. She should have been able to craft some type of statement by now even if it was a banal empty gesture.

it's never simple ignorance, it's never anything to do with age or being out of touch, bigotry is never a naive accident, it takes a microsecond of reflection to recognise when you're spouting hate

This post from the Popjustice Róisín Murphy mourning thread makes a great point really well. Not saying we can’t stan all our cishet main pop girls (I will follow CRJ and her sword into battle!), but how about saving a little bit of that passion for actually queer pop artists? pic.twitter.com/rA8kRi692j

— Jed (@thelowestbitter) August 26, 2023

I'm a Midwestern rube who happened to move to LA and wouldn't you know it I happened to meet some folks around my age who now have kids who are exploring their gender identity. And it doesn't faze me because I've improved over time from my extremely culturally isolated upbringing and have some empathy. And I can't even claim that I've spent much time around trans people at all. What's her excuse?

I swear, if yesterday or something she'd come out with a statement that was really humble and a true mea culpa that might have done something to undo a lot of the damage and the hurt perhaps. I don't know, I'm not the one who is truly hurt by it. And who am I to forgive her anyway?

Was just thinking about how her fashion is such a big part of her appeal - or had been historically - and ofc it’s all piggybacking off people like Gareth Pugh who are actually outspoken members of the community, ugh ugh ugh

she wrote an entire song about paris is burning wtf is wrong with her, just makes it all feel like shit

Idk she kind of reminds me of the biggest narcissist I know in real life, not someone who's willing to accept criticism very well, nor show much humility and admit a mistake. For the sake of those she affected and as a pushback against some terrible people, I hope she still does say something. But again she's had plenty of time to say even just a single damned thing.

Maybe there should be a 77 thread to flag when people out themselves as transphobes, like the metoo threads. Today for example the film music historian Ne*l Br*nd retweeted some transphobia. But it's just all so depressing.

damn now i feel like selling my la tix. i just don't think i could enjoy it.

i don't know that she's have any idea who roisin murphy is... though maybe i'm off-base on that and i'm just projecting my personal ignorance!

I meant more asking her about her take on a musician I greatly admire who has said shit like this. Based on prior conversations, I think she'd probably tell me there are more serious threats to worry about.

On the other hand, at one time she adored Rowling's work. That's just heartbreaking.

not sure i understand what’s “well-intentioned” about her “ignorance”

I said if, and am only noting how empty a retraction would be right now.

for "if": maybe she's known and loved plenty of trans and gnc adults for decades, and has only just heard of the concept of puberty blockers, and has freaked out as a mum without learning anything more or thinking through why teens need the same support as anyone, not cotton-swaddling. (or maybe she's turned into a mumsnet tory ghoul all the way through. absolutely plausible.)

shutting up when you don't know what the fuck you're talking about is a policy that could behoove lots of public figures in lots of circumstances.
if she is really fully terforised, I'm fine leaving my interest in the Koze album fully cancelled until she reveals that or doesn't. if she's listening to better-informed friends who can explain that she's gotten some bad ideas from Bari Weiss, demonstrating that she's learnt and grown later on will mean more than a crisis-managed striped-loveheart-branded statement from a Ninja intern on her public facebook now.

she obviously profoundly doesn't understand what's wrong and gross and disappointing with the private post she made. a public statement counteracting it the next day would have been completely unbelievable.

well frankly radio silence sucks worse

again i'm not gonna look at her IG and can't see twitter, but my understanding from trans folks who are talking about it elsewhere is that the anti-trans types/terfs are coming out of the woodwork for her on there, attacking trans folks who are pushing back against her comments. it might be better to swiftly knock down all of that bullshit going on, vs ignoring it or taking a more strategic approach to her statement (if there ever winds up being one.) even something that indicates a better statement to come later, but for now would serve as a "back the fuck off" to the monstrous types who think she's an ally.

Yeah, the fact that she doesn't is telling.

shutting up when you don't know what the fuck you're talking about is a policy that could behoove lots of public figures in lots of circumstances.

i'd rather she just stays quiet instead of publicly doubling down and radicalising i guess, but still certainly not an ideal response. it'll probably come up again eventually in an interview though

personally i'm still expecting to enjoy the new album (although certainly not as much as i would have otherwise and i feel pretty jaded about it all) but wouldn't go see her live or anything now

gyac, I don't really know that much about Irish media, is it as TERF-infested as the UK?

No it isn’t.

That's good. I know Glinner lives in London and has done since the 90s.

regardless of whether she makes a statement admitting ignorance or doubling down, the thing I can't get over is that she made this comment in the first place. She is a very online popstar, in that she has cult following and critical acclaim without chart success, and in that she uses internet spaces beyond FB and Instagram such as live lockdown streams etc - there is no way that she could not have been able to predict this comment would be seen, screenshotted and shared. She could have put her phone down, and kept her misinformed opinions to herself and her private circle of in-real-life friends. She chose to type this out and hit submit because she felt strongly enough that it needed to be said. She felt that her opinion was valid and important and legitimate. That tells me how strongly she feels about this, and it tells me how little consideration she has for her queer fanbase which, let's be honest, in 2023 are a huge part of her sustained success.

https://www.instagram.com/reel/CwP-gMnIlz5/?igshid=NzZhOTFlYzFmZQ==

the comment she's pinned to this post, utterly abysmal. Any hope that she was just "taking time to educate herself" eradicated.