what does this pfm song review thingy even mean anyway?

Message Bookmarked
Bookmark Removed
Not all messages are displayed: show all messages (245 of them)
I think this is a pretty decent review, though it's maybe not the most accessible bit of music writing in the world. I've liked a lot of things I've read on Pfork by Rachel Khong - she's pretty sharp for the most part.

Matthew C Perpetua (inca), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:01 (twenty years ago)

DUDE IS TALKING ABOUT PITCHFORK TRACK REVIEWS. It's not exactly an assault to history to use Nick as the best-known handy reference to that particular writing style in that section, which is edited by ... Nick.

nabisco (nabisco), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:02 (twenty years ago)

http://www.dogmacatma.com/images/050805_17.jpg

cancer prone fat guy (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:03 (twenty years ago)

That's like if someone said "you know those kinda chimy-guitar bands on the O.C. mixtape CD" -- you'd say "like Death Cab," not "like the Byrds."

nabisco (nabisco), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:03 (twenty years ago)

actually i'd probably do that "dog-with-its-head-to-the-side" stare

cancer prone fat guy (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:04 (twenty years ago)

true no one talks like the NYT but then, the tone i'm trying to describe seems to make some gestures towards the conversational. no intention of implicating nbs, but a lot of the reviews i'm thinking of try to come off like casually composed riffs. just thinking out loud, no biggie etc!!

the syntax is off-kilter and often hard to penetrate but the weirdness is calculated and the grammatic acrobatics finely tuned. it's not a new trick i guess (trying hard to sound breezy) but i guess it's just a little more obvious when you've got this self-conscious overuse of parentheses, abbreviations, and unexplained references. i understand they're trying to keep these little blurbs to word count but there's still something distasteful about writers purposely alienating readers and casting themselves as "insiders" too busy to explain what the fuck they mean.

Leon Neyfakh (Leon Neyfakh), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:06 (twenty years ago)

I find the over-the-top, drowning-in-references stiltedness of this particular review to be sort of funny in the sense that it reads like the kind of semi-parodic music writing you'd find in a piece of fiction. It seems kinda unreal.

Matthew C Perpetua (inca), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:10 (twenty years ago)

p.s. all that said it's pretty fun to read i guess and when the obscurity thing isn't pushed to its limits the grammar/syntax business is pretty effective in terms of communicating thrill/cool/whatever. it's way more entertaining than most "serious" music criticism, but it's never going to be as good as writing that manages to match exciting/innovative form with genuinely exciting/innovative content.

Leon Neyfakh (Leon Neyfakh), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:11 (twenty years ago)

Readers always assume that challenges in music crit -- say, heavy references -- are designed to prove that the writer is cooler than the reader. Consider the opposite: perhaps the writer is giving the reader a little credit. Or consider what's probably the reality: perhaps the writer is just aiming to the most initiated portion of the audience, aiming for the approval of his/her peers. Maybe disdaining the task of explaining the references as kind of boringly kindergartenish. I don't support this kind of thinking, but it seems a lot more like the reality than this idea that writers are just trying to be cooler than you. (Nobody reads Critical Inquiry or Artforum and says "these fuckers just have to pretend to be so much more sophisticated than everyone else" -- they're just shooting at an audience more initiated than you'd prefer them to.)

Again, for the record: it seems to me to be a better challenge for the critic to evade this issue entirely, and in fact I think the people lauded as top-notch critics usually do find a way to write that can be sophisticated and universally-understandable at the same time.

nabisco (nabisco), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:32 (twenty years ago)

I am steadily more convinced that readers of music criticism need to stop for a second and read books. Literature. Maybe even high-school English class staples. I can't think of any other way to remedy these constant complaints that people can't understand basic literary tactics like metaphor (simile, even!), use of images, personification, and so on.
-- nabisco (--...) (webmail), January 5th, 2006. (nabisco)

There's a problem of genre here. When people read music criticism (or at least, when I read music criticism) they want something along the lines of an IGN.com video game review or a newspaper movie review. Straight and to the point. It's utilatarian literature, they want the question "Do I want to hear this?" answered.

They aren't expecting something that looks like it belongs in the Norton Anthology of British Literature. Reading music reviews on sites like Pitchforkmedia, I often feel like opening a technical manual for my car to find out how to change the oil and finding the entire thing is wrote in haikus.

Mickey (modestmickey), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:34 (twenty years ago)

'the writer is cooler than the reader' by referencing phantom planet twice

'the writer is giving the reader a little credit' by referencing phantom planet twice

'the writer is just aiming to the most initiated portion of the audience, aiming for the approval of his/her peers' by referencing phantom planet twice

there must be an option d.

'Twan (miccio), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:36 (twenty years ago)

this is a pretty clear review for p-fork....what's the fuss? i've read way more confusing shit on p-fork than this.

M@tt He1geson (Matt Helgeson), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:37 (twenty years ago)

We weren't talking about that review anymore, doofusiccio.

nabisco (nabisco), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:38 (twenty years ago)

Oh whatevs, nabuttsco

'Twan (miccio), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:38 (twenty years ago)

Nutface aboobie

'Twan (miccio), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:38 (twenty years ago)

http://www.technotica.nl/board/html/emoticons/sex.gif already.

Dan (Sheesh) Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:39 (twenty years ago)

xpost I think the writer generally just gets caught up in providing his own description of how the music sounds and forgets that other people might not understand what they're talking about. That's what I do, anyway.

Eppy (Eppy), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:39 (twenty years ago)

Not that I have weaknesses.

Eppy (Eppy), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:40 (twenty years ago)

Oh and

a lot of the reviews i'm thinking of try to come off like casually composed riffs. just thinking out loud, no biggie etc!!

This is certainly how I write track reviews.

Eppy (Eppy), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:40 (twenty years ago)

Eppy deeply otm

Dan too.

'Twan (miccio), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:41 (twenty years ago)

Mickey can you point to examples? The bulk of reviews I see contain literary and rhetorical tactics on basically like a high-school English level, which seems pretty appropriate to me. Who exactly is deploying such outlandish literary/rhetorical devices? How do they rate on a scale of 1-10, if 9.5 and above are reserved for like Eliot, Joyce, and Woolf?

(Also haikus are very clear and practical, not opaque.) (Also your haiku simile is an example of exactly the kind of literary tactic -- metaphor -- that I'm surprised people claim to have trouble reading.)

nabisco (nabisco), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:46 (twenty years ago)

my mom's russian is better than her english so whenever i try and fail to define a word for her, she reminds me that intelligent people aren't just good at knowing things, but explaining what they mean. critical inquiry is not analogous to pitchfork in terms of audience expertise, and even if it was-- even if everyone reading the site knew who the fuck Alex Greenwald is and why he deserves an "even" before his name-- the fact that it's indie rock they're talking about makes it just kinda nasty because it's a culture populated by people trying constantly to outcool each other. maybe that's not a fair association, and i guess pfm's current policy is better than the inevitable condescension that would come along with level-headed explanations. but there's no virtue in speed, and just because you talk fast doesn't mean you're saying a whole lot. it's like using italics to communicate emphasis: the best writers don't need to lean on form to make up for deficiencies of substance.

in conclusion it's nothing personal but rachel probably had to look up Phantom Planet on Allmusic.com before she referenced Alex Greenwald by first and last name. because any normal person would. that's reason enough to explain the reference, however briefly.

to reiterate, i might actually be more worried if she just knew it offhand.

Leon Neyfakh (Leon Neyfakh), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:47 (twenty years ago)

(Anthony I called you just "doofus" first but then there was an xpost and I didn't want anyone to get confused: thus doofusiccio, which sounds ... delicious, I guess?)

nabisco (nabisco), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:48 (twenty years ago)

WHATEVER, NUTFACE.

'Twan (miccio), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:49 (twenty years ago)

NUTFACE ABOOBIE

David R. (popshots75`), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:50 (twenty years ago)

I'm sorry, I have to go take a drug test now.

David R. (popshots75`), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:50 (twenty years ago)

watch out for those poppyseeds

cancer prone fat guy (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:53 (twenty years ago)

I'm afraid all the Nyquil I've been popping turned my pee into Mad Dog 20/20.

David R. (popshots75`), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:55 (twenty years ago)

there's only one way to find out

'Twan (miccio), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:56 (twenty years ago)

I.P. Sizzurp

M@tt He1geson (Matt Helgeson), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:57 (twenty years ago)

Polka party?

Eppy (Eppy), Thursday, 5 January 2006 20:57 (twenty years ago)

see, im dutch, right, i find this thread interesting cos i write for an english magazine and often i wonder if my style is too mediocre. just because i try to review an album based on what it sounds like without trying to think of cool metaphors.

rizzx (Rizz), Thursday, 5 January 2006 21:28 (twenty years ago)

Juelz Santana:
"For Realz, Forx"
genre: hip-hop

"WHATEVER, NUTFACE/NUTFACE ABOOBIE/I'm sorry, I have to go take a drug test now." Watch out for those poppyseeds. I'm afraid all the Nyquil [you've] been popping turned [your]pee into Mad Dog 20/20. There's only one way to find out. I.P. Sizzurp. Polka party?

[three stars]

Whiney G. Weingarten (whineyg), Thursday, 5 January 2006 21:39 (twenty years ago)

chris, we're pleased to offer you a staff position here at blender.

cancer prone fat guy (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 5 January 2006 21:43 (twenty years ago)

daver's pee =

http://www.marchofdimes.com/images/chapters/NY_greater_Chris-Russo.jpg

maura (maura), Thursday, 5 January 2006 21:53 (twenty years ago)

hahahahahahaha

If it's that easy Jess why was I told after submitting clips that Blender "would have no work to offer (me) but thanks for trying"?

Raymond Cummings (Raymond Cummings), Thursday, 5 January 2006 21:54 (twenty years ago)

OH SWEET JESUS NO WONDER IT BURNS

David R. (popshots75`), Thursday, 5 January 2006 21:58 (twenty years ago)

nabisco, I won't make the claim that there's a huge amount of music criticism that is ridiculously hard to understand and requires a significant amount of interpretation. I'm just claiming that music criticism is overly difficult for what people expect it to be. I want music criticism to be utilatarian. I want to walk home, drunk and horny. Masturbate to some porno, and then read a few reviews before I pass out and make a mental note of "sounds interesting" or "forget them." I don't want to have to think about it. That's what books are for, political commentary, etc.

So, for an example, let me load today's Pitchfork reviews.

Okay, the first review I read was the Espers one, and it's exactly what I want a review to be. Great job. High five.

So instead let's look at this one:
http://www.pitchforkmedia.com/record-reviews/q/quintron/swamp-tech.shtml

Starts off simple enough, but then gets to shit like:

Dumb fun trumps brainy tedium, and if Swamp Tech were an RPG, it'd be all whimsical mini-games, no arduous stat-building.

I have no idea what that is supposed to mean. The rest of the review is fine.

http://www.pitchforkmedia.com/record-reviews/n/nadja/truth-becomes-death.shtml

Though timely, Truth Becomes Death risks being a marginal record, if only because it has a nature so huge some might take it as scenery

I'm lost. I understand that it is an experimental album and may not become popular, but how is it's "nature" "huge"? What does that mean? And what does it mean to be mistaken for scenery? Is this just supposed to sound witty? Is the album's sound "large" such as Mogwai (which was cited earlier) songs, and that is why it may become marginal? How does that make sense?

In this barbarously delicate sea, the crashing guitars and horror house vocals of "Memory Leak" wreck damage in some other nearby room.

Oh, another metaphor. Okay, the album's sound is huge like the ocean, and it sounds kind of scary and "barbarous" I guess. Okay, that's nice, but isn't there a much easier way to say that? The review already once cited before how "large" the sound is using allusions to nature.

Nadja's not obsessed or stuck on ideologies, which is why they sound like latecomers.

I have no idea what this means.

So, even if you do think it is only minorly difficult to understand what all that means, my stance is this: minorly difficult is still too difficult. I want a music review. Not creative writing. I'd read something else for that.

Mickey (modestmickey), Friday, 6 January 2006 05:10 (twenty years ago)

THE PAIN IT HURTS US

David R. (popshots75`), Friday, 6 January 2006 05:34 (twenty years ago)

I'm sorry dude, did the oddly thorough troll enworsen your pee-pain?

Eppy (Eppy), Friday, 6 January 2006 05:42 (twenty years ago)

Mickey if your reading comprehension is not up to the average record review, that's fine. And if you going to be disappointed that the average record review doesn't come down to a level that suits you, well, I suppose that's your prerogative. Me, I like good writing -- good, clear, stylish, sophisticated, non-opaque writing -- and I'd prefer not to see the reviews I read descend to some "utilitarian" Dick-and-Jane level.

nabiscothingy, Friday, 6 January 2006 05:51 (twenty years ago)

hey ILM put your dicks back in your pants

Nick Sylvester, Friday, 6 January 2006 06:07 (twenty years ago)

Mickey OTM

big words in the wrong hands = dangerous

front row, hand raised, Friday, 6 January 2006 06:08 (twenty years ago)

Yes, in such circumstances the risk of non-cromulence is palatinous.

ratty, Friday, 6 January 2006 06:14 (twenty years ago)

I am so going to douse my Pfork track reviews in long ass words and arcane sixteenth century historical references just so that all y'all obstupefact readers choke hard.

Mwahahahaha

Drew "chaotic evil" Daniel (Drew Daniel), Friday, 6 January 2006 06:18 (twenty years ago)

big words in the wrong hands = dangerous

Biggest words in Mickey's quoted material (by number of syllables):

ideologies
barbarously
latecomers
whimsical
marginal
delicate
scenery
arduous
tedium

Apart from maybe "barbarously" these are all pretty common words.

But a better retort to Mickey's post might be drawn from his own words: "I don't want to have to think about it." I suppose it's inevitable that there will be people who don't like thinking about stuff; I suppose it's inevitable that some of those people would nonetheless want to read music criticism (without thinking about it); I'm going to try and remain comforted by the idea that this is some perverse minority opinion. It's certainly the first time I've ever seen someone say he prefers writing that doesn't make him think.

nabiscothingy, Friday, 6 January 2006 06:47 (twenty years ago)

(Also for the record all of those common words are used properly, with the sole exception that someone might be averse to the poetic juxtaposition of "delicate" and "barbarous.")

nabiscothingy, Friday, 6 January 2006 06:49 (twenty years ago)

I want the writing to make me think about the music, not the reviewer.

deej.. (deej..), Friday, 6 January 2006 06:51 (twenty years ago)

Not that I'm neccessarily disagreeing w you, N.

deej.. (deej..), Friday, 6 January 2006 06:52 (twenty years ago)

I really like pretentious reviews.

Actually, this review totally put me in a bad mood. Mainly because i'm a die-hard (post movie poster) BoYo fan (common ways to say SSLYBY: the actual name, Boris Yeltsin and sometimes BoYo) I like saying SSLYBY (sly-bye) as well.

Tape Store (Tape Store), Friday, 6 January 2006 06:58 (twenty years ago)


You must be logged in to post. Please either login here, or if you are not registered, you may register here.