there is not one album in existence that better on CD than on vinyl is there?

whooops xps i guess

i my case i used a tool called templategen and aligned my elliptical stylus until it couldn't be more perfect, and still got inner groove distortion. when i switched to the micro-linear stylus, it all went away.

in my case...

i mean, turntable alignment for me is a question of geometry. your needle is on a pivot and at some points during playback it is going to line up with the groove better than others. you can mitigate this with a small screwdriver and your eyeballs. when it comes to the other stuff i confess i don't understand quite as much what's going on to solve the problem.

is the idea that a more sensitive stylus isn't going to be as susceptible to friction created by the angle of the tonearm?

nvm i can just look into this myself. but feel free to talk about it here if you're inclined!

i was originally swayed toward the audio technica cartridge, embarrassingly enough, by this post on the hoffman forum:

https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/praise-for-the-at-vm95ml.938864/

but i think the basic idea is that the line contact stylus has a much smaller footprint and thus tracks the grooves better.

this stereophile column also has some nice words about that cart:

https://www.stereophile.com/content/gramophone-dreams-44-audio-technica-goldring-lp-gear-phono-cartridges

of course the punchline of that stereophile article -- and the reason he doesn't hear inner groove distortion with *any* of those cheapie cartridges -- is that he's mounting them on a $9000 turntable that's tuned to perfection. but still.

so what's the difference between the AT-VM95E and the AT-VM95-ML? besides about a hundred bucks, that is

and will they be any better than the one I've got now?

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0735LYRRT/ref=pe_825000_114657650_TE_item

I guess I'm willing to dump a hundo or so if it will really make a difference, but I'm afraid I won't be able to tell the difference

looks like yours has a spherical (conical) stylus, or at least that's what it says on the questions and answers section of that amazon page. the AT-VM95E is elliptical. the AT-VM95-ML is micro linear. they're all different stylus shapes. that stereophile article i linked to has nice blow-ups of the different shapes. i believe the ML has the smallest footprint, and in my experience it is best at eliminating inner groove distortion, at least in the low-end world that i inhabit. like i said, those with magnificent multi-thousand dollar turntables can probably tweak their system so that all of them sound great.

for whatever reason, my ear is particularly attuned to things like inner groove distortion, and i would cringe whenever the end of an album side was approaching. i found that switching cartridges made a very big difference on my system, which is a Pro-Ject T1 Phono SB.

how you making out, frogbs? I imagine the receiver phono beats the table's?

I dunno how any non adjustable phono stage accounts for the different volumes vinyl is mastered at, if at all? I'm using a Art DJ Pre 2.. it's cheap and seems great to me. I'm surprised how often i adjust the thing anywhere between 0 and +4 gain depending on the record. I guess my relatively low power speaker setup might be making the difference feel bigger to me than your average large receiver

i guess non adjustable would stay 0 :)
i think I've seen some records go into the red even there. Anyway it's a good cheap thing for sorting out any phono issues i guess

how you making out, frogbs? I imagine the receiver phono beats the table's?

hard to say, I relistened to some of the records that gave me trouble and they seem to have the same sort of issues. it does sound ~~slightly~~ better but it could just be a placebo effect

kind of get the impression that the stylus I have now is crap. I was thinking I should just get a cartridge but I was worried about mounting it myself, though on second thought it doesn't appear to be too difficult. if I upgrade to the AT-VM95E do y'all think I'd be able to tell the difference?

i can only speak for myself but it made a big difference for me. mounting the cartridge required a fair amount of patience, but in the end there was a sense of satisfaction that i had done it myself. as i said i used a template generator that you can find on the web (templategen.zip) and print out. some folks don't like using a paper one because who knows if the printer distorts its dimensions, and you have to be careful about placement of the center hole. but i am a cheapskate. you also have to know or measure the spindle-to-pivot distance for your turntable; other than that you can use the defaults. if you orient the cartridge so that the needle traces the whole arc (overhang), and the cantilever is parallel to the markings at the two node points (azimuth), you are golden. it is helpful to tape the turntable down so it doesn't rotate while you are doing this. also don't slide the needle against the paper.

oh and recheck the tracking force afterward. and make sure the turntable is level, blah blah blah...

is there a place you can take it to that services turntables?

oh i see, you said AT-VM95E, not AT-VM95-ML. No promises there, because i've never used one. but...if it turns out you still have inner groove distortion with the AT-VM95E, all you have to do is upgrade the stylus to an ML. i believe the cartridges are the same. so once it's mounted its mounted.

that seems extraordinarily complex, maybe I'll just pay the extra $30 and get one already mounted. though I do have an extra headshell/cartridge, maybe I'll just take it apart for fun

If you can just replace the stylus with a better one, or even the same one (might've worn out?), see about that. I'm on an Ortofon OM cartridge, which i could upgrade a lot by swapping styluses, apparently. And if you do get a new cart you can probably turn up a ready made protractor print for it (search the table's specs).

so, to get this straight...if I just swapped out one headshell for another, chances are it's not measured correctly?

tried to disassemble an old cheap one I had, the wires popped out of the headshell, doesn't look like I can get them back in there, so...going great so far!!!

get out the soldering iron!

i used mine for a few months just eyeballing it to be straight, it was ok but i guess that was just luck. I mean take whatever for a spin on a record that's not worth a load, before you perfect it.

yeah be careful with those pins. fremer suggests loosening them with a toothpick if they're too tight. by mounting the cartridge i mean adjusting its position using those two mounting screws. this video goes into detail. it does require patience and sometimes it feels like you could use an extra arm, but it is also relaxing and a useful skill.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WM-aIDwfrhc

ok, that helps!! I can't find the specs of my turntable and the manual doesn't say anything, but if I can just use the vinylengine protractor then I think I'm good.

luckily I managed to find the headshell that came with my turntable. my kids broke the stylus off it but I kept it just in case. anyway, this time the wires did *not* break off and I just mounted it by sight. probably incorrectly (are the two screws supposed to be parallel?) but it does seem to make a small difference. I did notice the headshell/cartridge kit has the screws all the way in the back, I'm guessing that's not right? is this gonna cause any damage to my records??

the two screws don't have to be parallel. what's really important is position of the stylus/cantilever as it tracks those null points like he says in the video. that's where the rubber hits the road, so to speak. not sure the effect on the vinyl if the stylus isn't tracking properly. but it's worth the extra minutes not to cut corners and get it as close as you can.

you can also search out michael fremer's turntable setup videos, which are more of an advanced class. his setup equipment costs more than my whole system, so it's more for entertainment value than anything else. but he is smart and you pick up a few useful pointers here and there.

alright I'll print it out and give it a shot. will report back

I did enjoy that vinyl TV video...as mentioned in the first comment, there's a very Bob Ross aura to that man isn't there?

haha i'm old and had to look up bob ross. good luck with everything!

whoa i was just reading something about your turntable on the vinylengine site and it appears to be a particularly strange beast. they're talking about "underhang," which i have to admit i've never heard of. most tonearms have an "overhang," i.e. their needles extend out a little further than the spindle. i'm not sure how much the traditional methods of aligning your cartridge are going to help you. there's this, but i don't pretend to understand it.

https://www.vinylengine.com/turntable_forum/viewtopic.php?t=74322

hmmm forget about my advice to try a micro linear or even an elliptical stylus. apparently the only type it's safe to use with that arm is conical like the one you have.

you're talking about whether or not the tonearm can reach the center? in that case, no, it's a little short. now I'm really not sure what to do, kind of sounds like I need to invest in a non-DJ turntable...

i've always hated on web forums when someone says "don't use that, use this instead." but...in this case...might not be a bad idea. or rather, i should probably just say i have no experience with your type of setup and can't really offer an opinion.

it’s such a shame the p-mount system died off - I know some people enjoy the tweakability of the trad half inch mount but geez sometimes it’s nice just to put a new cart in and have it work

frogbs, i'd strongly suggest looking into a new (to you) turntable if you're thinking of investing / upgrading your system. i just don't think putting a micro-linear stylus on one of those stantons will be the best use of your money.

i found this michael fremer video to be great and even a bit inspiring. i think it's neat how he emphasizes the "empowering" aspect of learning how to do these things for yourself in order to take the listening experience into your own hands (even if the stuff towards the ends is a little over my head):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7b75jmLaF8

this thing is 16 years old and missing a few parts, might be time to upgrade. for the time being based on what I'm understanding from your link I'm going to move the screws from the headshell to the cart up to the center, because they're all the way in the back now.

if you've got a good recommendation for a turntable with a decent stylus in it already...I'm all ears :)

i got my Pro-Ject T1 Phono SB because it's supposed to be as plug-and-play as possible, but like i said i wound up replacing their ortofon elliptical with my audio technical micro linear pretty quickly. for a little less, people seem to like those Fluence turntables.

here's fremer on that pro-ject:

https://www.analogplanet.com/content/pro-ject-t1-phono-sb-turntabl-born-frustration

i think you could worse than an entry level pro-ject or music hall turntable. for a bit cheaper you can look into uturnaudio.com

for a refurbished vintage machine at a modest price, you might get in touch with the folks at fixmydual.com

I remember hearing a while ago that you really want a direct drive at that price point, not belt, but I won't pretend to know the difference

it’s such a shame the p-mount system died off - I know some people enjoy the tweakability of the trad half inch mount but geez sometimes it’s nice just to put a new cart in and have it work

yeah, i've been frozen in my turntable shopping for ages because my old one was a P-Mount and i sort of can't imagine learning to adjust a cartridge/tonearm/etc., but obviously shopping for ONLY p-mount turntables is really limiting!

by the way how do you change the cart on that thing? looks like the headshell & arm are just one piece, as opposed to mine which just twists out and is connected by magnets

what do y'all think of this one

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07N3S4X3P/ref=olp_aod_redir#aod

that used one for $255 seems like a good bargain

i have no experience with that one but that fellow in my steve hoffman link did: "I upgraded to at ATLP120x over the holidays from an ATLP60. I realize the 120 is by no means a "high-end" turntable, but for my needs (and system) at the moment, the 120 is a superb option. What has been so worthwhile with the 120 is that it has given me the opportunity to really discover what goes into the hobby of vinyl collection and turntable setup."

however, he then finds he needs to upgrade his stylus from the 95E to 95ML...

https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/praise-for-the-at-vm95ml.938864/

frogbs I would steer clear of direct drive if you’re concerned about sound quality

I have this, it’s worked great for me except I had to mess with a potentiometer at the bottom to get the speed right.

https://www.denon.com/en-us/product/turntables/dp-300f

yea I've heard that direct drives sometimes pick up the sound of the motor but I've never actually heard this myself

tbh being unable to get my record player fixed and record shops being closed and no gigs has meant I have spent nearly nothing on music for a year.

dunno if it will last when I can actually get my record player fixed, I haven't converted to Spotify, I just play the mp3s/flacs I ripped from my record/CD collection and stuff I downloaded from my laptop plugged into the AUX of my hifi.

I like vinyl a lot, but I don't like having to deal with a broken record player, especially if getting the bastard fixed might cost me £££

I use my turntable mostly for my collection of post-punk, or for recent acquisitions from the cheap racks, and neither Pylon nor Foghat require super high fidelity to me. I use my CD player mostly for jazz and things that want lusher sonics. I just bought a thrift store copy of Linda Ronstadt’s What’s New, and even on my less than high hi-fi it sounds super nice. I already owned it on vinyl, but doubtful I will ever play that again.

TSF - is this the cart you have?

https://ttaino.shop/product/atvm95ml-dual-moving-magnet-turntable-cartridge_1209046.html?msclkid=2666ba16cf291f5e9b75da210b6166e3

it's $160+ everywhere else I look...

hold up this site has got to be a scam

one q for those of you who know things

I've heard the built in pre-amp on the AT120 (which I now have) is kinda garbage and that apparently a lot of people rip them out. I don't wanna fuck around with a soldering iron nor do I want to risk taking this thing apart but I have seen it suggested that something like the ART DJ Pre II (which is fairly cheap) can make a difference. if anyone has an external pre-amp, does it really make a noticeable improvement, or am I just chasing here? I assume I can just hook this up by switching to Line & plugging it into the Phono input on the receiver, correct?

(fwiw I think I might just pick up a micro-line stylus, which I assume would be a much bigger improvement)