Smashing Pumpkins: Fresh Fruit or Rotten Veg?

and two more

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mFYaUYce8jY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-yos6keKvQ

"wrath" is excellent imo but as established in this thread i'm a fan of synth-pop bc especially when the hooks sit right ("death from above," which is zeitgeist-era, is one of my favorite songs he's written in the last two decades)

i should adjust my language for other ppl's expectations: "wrath" is good for sp mk 2

Underwhelmed by these new tracks.

More enthusiastically, there's a new Jimmy Chamberlin Complex album/ep 'Honor' out and it sounds great.

Dare I say that 'Anno Santana' is probably the first SP song (Zwan excluded) in 20 years that sounds really good? I dareth.

I haven't heard that one yet, time to check it out!

Full tracklist floating about. I can't be the only one slightly disappointed to see a 72 minute Pumpkins record without a 9 or 10 minutes plus epic anywhere. Although I'm sure my hopes for any good "Silverfuck" style jam are long gone.

1. "The Colour of Love" 4:24
2. "Confessions of a Dopamine Addict" 3:14
3. "Cyr" 4:03
4. "Dulcet in E" 3:22
5. "Wrath" 3:46
6. "Ramona" 3:48
7. "Anno Satana" 3:50
8. "Birch Grove" 3:17
9. "Wyttch" 3:44
10. "Starrcraft" 4:10
11. "Purple Blood" 3:19
12. "Save Your Tears" 3:31
13. "Telegenix" 3:23
14. "Black Forest, Black Hills" 4:42
15. "Adrennalynne" 3:42
16. "Haunted" 3:11
17. "The Hidden Sun" 3:24
18. "Schaudenfreud" 3:02
19. "Tyger, Tyger" 2:50
20. "Minerva" 3:33

xpost

I think it's a bit meh. Oceania had a few really great songs, so I wouldn't say it's been a totally fallow 2 decades. (I also thought "Tarantula" was killer at the time, though my enthusiasm has waned over the years.)

yeah those very uniform track lengths are weirdly dispiriting xp

"adrennalynne" and "wyttch" lmao

i maintain that shiny & oh so bright is the only time they've occasionally sounded pretty good post-reunion

Mellon Collie was released 25 years ago today! Happy birthday. I was 13 and it opened up a cool world for me.

Billy announced a few things in a video yesterday:
1. He and Jimmy are in the studio working on a 33-song "sequel to Mellon Collie and Machina," the third in the "trilogy of stories involving a single character [ie, Zero, Glass, and now a third]". It's an "opus", "rock opera", etc.
2. Currently mixing Machina. Tracklist (minus extra cuts?) is "in the neighborhood of 50 to 51 songs".
3. They had planned to announce a "MCIS-themed" arena tour -- "a night built around that period of music...with a narrative arc...celebration of that time period...something with a conceptual base." Plan is to do that when possible.
4. Cyr (20 songs) is the next album, then the MCIS-Machina sequel, then the third Shiny album (10 songs) after that.

the mellon collie/machina sequel album will absolutely not come out in anything resembling the form described. either he'll completely scrap it or repurpose whatever they're currently working on into a completely different project before too long

also "the third shiny album"? what's the second? what turned into cyr was originally supposed to be volumes 2 & 3 but i figured he'd just completely given up on whatever the concept was there as usual

also the machina/machina ii combined reissue being ~50 tracks just for the album itself sounds nightmarish lmao. not that i have any confidence that'll finally come out either. how long has it been in the works now?

Fwiw he did describe Cyr as the 2nd part of the Shiny series.

It's an "opus", "rock opera", etc.

Love the "etc." here :)

I was sure to be the first in my local record store early morning to pick up MCIS. It came out on the 23rd but my local started selling it at Saturday the 21st already. Spotify's 'we're dumping the album here on Friday' just doesn't compare to the trve Release Day of yore!

if they’re mixing it i’ll bet the machina reissue comes out. the more songs the better imo

rest of those projects sound like billy’s usual bullshit

hoping that someone accidentally lost the masters for "heavy metal machine"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9NcVNOWjv1E

(this album's gonna be so weird, i don't really get where bc's going with any of it)

("wyttch" sounds kinda cool anyway)

I keep forgetting we still have another full month before this thing comes out. I am really excited for the Machina era stuff, less hopeful about another massive rock opera being any good.

oh shit, i just realized, "wyttch" is totally bc's attempt at writing a blue öyster cult song. pretty good!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcMR8JXnYgw

this is probably the song from the new record that's easiest to ridicule, it's zwan-esque in mood, but i... fucking love it. my favorite song bc's written in ages. the chorus is perfect

the whole first half of the record is basically out now, and i'm finding myself... really liking it? ugh lmao being a smashing pumpkins fan in 2020 i clown myself

yeah i feel stupid about it but i totally love this legit followup to thefutureembrace

lmao i fucking love this record

chorus of "starrcraft" reminds me of the anniversary

holy shit "save your tears" is the best pumpkins song i've heard since machina

I think Weezer and SP might have similar post peak hit miss ratios

idk i think weezer's white album is actually pretty comparable to their peak material, while sp have never gotten that close to their own higher peak.

ugh lmao being a smashing pumpkins fan in 2020 i clown myself

― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson)

i feel exactly the same. still have to hear the new one, is it any good? 'shiny and oh so bright' didn't win me over, but i really enjoyed corgan's cotillions, surprisingly.

its way too long, it needs jimmy drums, but its... pretty good

i thought jimmy was on this one

I like the background vox and harmonies on this one, surprisingly

i'm sure he's on it but you would never know.

jimmy played all the drums on the record

the record is def too long but i am so thrilled i don’t actively dislike any of these songs. they’re also all stuck in my head constantly :(

songwriting-wise i think it’s even stronger than oceania, and the production lacks depth but it comes super close to the adore sound anyway

I like the background vox and harmonies on this one, surprisingly

― it bangs for thee (Simon H.), Friday, November 27, 2020 6:48 AM (seventeen minutes ago) bookmarkflaglink

made me wonder if billy’s been listening to a lot of later leonard cohen records

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o7rvQBrL5A8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-Ht9_BA15M

these are my two faves

oh god i also really love "the hidden sun," the synth hook on that one is out of this world

Man, I wish I could share your enthusiasm Brad. There are indeed some big hooks and I was hoping for more out of a return to the Adore/FutureEmbrace sound, but I'm just not enthused after a first listen. The synth work feels really lazy (the really repetitive line in "Wrath" being one example that stood out), the backing vocals feel really out of place and I just cannot fathom bringing Jimmy back for him to imitate a drum machine for an entire album. It's not terrible, but it's not very good either, unfortunately.

lol listen, i already know that i'm alone here

i think the complaints about jimmy are silly though. as a drummer i think changing the emphasis of your playing to suit the texture of the song is... very difficult and admirable. also the moments where jimmy's regular pumpkins style breaks through really pop

I suppose that's fair, I guess I just really miss monster RAWK kit-bashing Jimmy. I guess we get some hints of that on say, "Wyttch", tho.

"Cyr" is growing on me -- just watched the Tonight Show clip and it isn't...so bad? Speaking of Jimmy, the guy looks like a million bucks these days.

He does look great, I'm really happy for him!

Listened to about half of this last night. I don't usually dip much of a toe into modern Pumpkins stuff, but I felt like I had to give it a try after reading an excerpt from Gerard Way's interview with Corgan in Alternative Press (you have to actually pick up a print copy of AP to read the whole thing, and I'm not certain where to even find it these days).

Anyway, I'm not floored by it, but still think it's pretty good. Really like Billy taking us back to the core, the heart music. I also think the background singers are great - reminds me of Leonard Cohen or something.

I do wish that it had more depth, more interesting little details. Everything seems to be very straightforward and immediately obvious. Also agree with those above who say that this may not have been the best use of a Jimmy Chamberlin. And when I took time to follow along with some of the lyrics it was like, what are you talking about?

I don't know - I'm definitely going to finish listening to it and will probably listen again. Makes excellent background music at least, and that's not a bad thing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ascLZN2iyZg

i do hope he continues writing songs like this one in particular

(purple blood)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=prI0dKB51Tw

haha whoa this is kinda rad!

Well that seemed really good to me, and I haven't vibed with anything Pumpkins since Adore.