Dave Matthews Band : Name Your Reasons Why They Are So Bad & Hated.

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oh come on now that's just silly

dave q, Saturday, 14 June 2003 17:34 (twenty-three years ago)

If you can acquire any live show that wasn't recorded for a DVD or CD and commercially sold, even if you scuttle haphazardly through songs, I'm confident that you will detect songs that demonstrate these qualities.  I'll get back to you on specific songs since I don't have my recordings at hand.
You do understand that, fundamentlly, you are saying violins don't merge well with woodwinds?  And you realize that there are about 102 million composers that wouldn't be in accord with that statement?  Just warning you...in case you get mugged by an individual clenching a baton, that may be their rationale.
I still can't grasp that people are so critical of such an eminent style music that they have no perception or knowledge of beyond that of a few CD's, singles, or unfounded information from unreliable sources.

allison, Saturday, 14 June 2003 19:58 (twenty-three years ago)

like your Linkin Park review?

James Blount (James Blount), Saturday, 14 June 2003 20:01 (twenty-three years ago)

I still can't grasp that people are so critical of such an eminent style music that they have no perception or knowledge of beyond that of a few CD's, singles, or unfounded information from unreliable sources.

Should it require more than a few CDs and singles to form an opinion of this band? If their readily available material (presumably the music the band felt most satisfied with to represent them) fails to create a favorable impression, why do you have such a seemingly damn hard time fathoming how -- for even a nanosecond -- that you may actually indeed be mistaken in your assertion that the DMB's music is anything other than bog-fucking-standard?

Alex in NYC (vassifer), Saturday, 14 June 2003 20:07 (twenty-three years ago)

cuz, unlike other bands (eg. linkin park), dmb require a thourough, constant, and complete familiarity with their music before you can begin to question their greatness (with the catch 22 being if you question dmb's greatness you haven't listened to 'enough' dmb).

James Blount (James Blount), Saturday, 14 June 2003 20:20 (twenty-three years ago)

Allison hurrah for you for fighting for the band you love! I mean that and am not being sarcastic. I do think, though, that James and Alex have a point: how much DMB does a person need to have heard before it's fair to say that he's got a reasonable understanding of their sound? I think it's a little silly to say "you haven't heard all their music" as if that were a good dismissal of criticism. Think of music that you think is ass: have you heard everything by the bands you think of as some seriously suck-ass bands, or do you hear at most an album or two and go "yeesh! shit sandwiches!"

J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Saturday, 14 June 2003 20:29 (twenty-three years ago)

No sir, I've drudged through a linkin park concert. My review was actually munificent when compared to what they produce. Honestly...do you think they deserve the praise they get?
I never said you have to hear everything in order to have an opinion of them, and I don't appreciate the amplification of every statement I make. AGAIN, I will say it. Listening to a band and determining that you do not like them is one thing. Criticising the band for technical, lyrical, or any other intangible factors when you aren't entirely informed is a totally different animal.
I can't argue if you just don't like them, it's your right to form an opinion. I'm not fond of a lot of bands, but if I haven't experienced them in their entirety then I do not pass jugement on them...particularly to their fans who obviously know more about them that I do.
I don't remember (and don't care to look) who posted earlier about the basic chord progression or something reminiscent of their compositions being musically undemanding or challenging. I've played guitar since I was 7 and I'm now a senior in college, majoring in music performance. There are still some of his riffs and chord changes that I still can't refine as well as he does. Some aspects of their music are simple, but that's to be expected when you take into account that they are typically a touring band.

Allison, Saturday, 14 June 2003 21:16 (twenty-three years ago)

I don't appreciate the amplification of every statement I make.

If you're not going to stand by statements, might I suggest you reconsider making them in the first place. What else have we to go on other than your own words in this debate?

At the very least, I think we can all safely, heartily and cheerily agree that Linkin Park suck from a big, greasy bag of cock, right?

Alex in NYC (vassifer), Saturday, 14 June 2003 21:31 (twenty-three years ago)

I like that "In The End" song. Needs to be a bit more Depeche Mode, though. (I will still take it over any DMB any day.)

I don't appreciate the amplification of every statement I make

Understood, but I think this is happening because you're not answering a lot of specific questions in turn. Dan, for instance, has brought up a lot that you're not apparently dealing with. Saying that you're not being understood or that you're being treated too harshly when you're not willing to engage further with what's asked is a bit of a problem -- especially if you're so single-mindedly focused on getting US to engage further with a band you like. It goes both ways.

Criticising the band for technical, lyrical, or any other intangible factors when you aren't entirely informed is a totally different animal

If people are getting annoyed with the band BECAUSE of something technical, lyrical, etc. and say so, what more do you want? It can't be intangible if it is there and they're pointing to it.

I'm not fond of a lot of bands, but if I haven't experienced them in their entirety then I do not pass jugement on them

If you aren't fond of a band you have passed a judgment. It may be a temporary one or may be one that you are wanting to note is something based on only a few things that you've heard, but it's still a judgment.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 14 June 2003 21:50 (twenty-three years ago)

eg. Linkin Park

James Blount (James Blount), Saturday, 14 June 2003 21:52 (twenty-three years ago)

I'm tired of being articulate...hope no one minds that I return to my apathetic ways.
Because they openly said that they haven't listened to much more than just those couple CD's. Say your favorite band is...Backsteet boys (we all know it is) and people are going on about how awful they are, and also say that they've only heard one of their albums and the commercialized crap they see on TV. Now, you know they're much better than just the mercantile mainstream band they're made out to be, but no one will actually listen to anything else because they just form impervious opinions and suddenly become all knowing on the subject after listening to that one CD. Do you let them go on their poorly informed ways so they can infect others minds with fictitious information, or do you charge them with being tenuous then try to help them give the band their well deserved respect?
People aren't pointing to anything. I've yet to hear a specific example or song (that I can remember...prove me wrong if you can) that can't be argued by taste (other than Dave's voice which I will admit can be a bit tense at times) BECAUSE the amount of their music the majority has heard is very marginal.

Allison, Saturday, 14 June 2003 22:44 (twenty-three years ago)

I don't need to eat a whole shit sandwich to know I don't like shit.

oops (Oops), Saturday, 14 June 2003 22:48 (twenty-three years ago)

It's like talking to a wall!

J (Jay), Saturday, 14 June 2003 23:15 (twenty-three years ago)

But... what if that shit sandwich has cream filling in the middle and you won't know unless you eat a little more.

Your mom's a wall.

Allison, Saturday, 14 June 2003 23:17 (twenty-three years ago)

The tenacity of the DMB fan is a thing of wonder: let no one here argue this point.

Sean Thomas (sgthomas), Saturday, 14 June 2003 23:22 (twenty-three years ago)

(No, really, *please* don't argue it. We'll be here all week.)

Sean Thomas (sgthomas), Saturday, 14 June 2003 23:22 (twenty-three years ago)

This thread is caught in a loop.

My name is Kenny (My name is Kenny), Saturday, 14 June 2003 23:26 (twenty-three years ago)

can this just be dropped please?

H (Heruy), Saturday, 14 June 2003 23:35 (twenty-three years ago)

Sure...I'm bored now though. Going to give me something else to talk about?

allison, Sunday, 15 June 2003 00:19 (twenty-three years ago)

See the other threads!

J0hn Darn1elle (J0hn Darn1elle), Sunday, 15 June 2003 00:33 (twenty-three years ago)

nah =) I've grown quite fond of this one, tanks.

Allison, Sunday, 15 June 2003 00:37 (twenty-three years ago)

Your mom's a wall.

Best comeback evah.

J (Jay), Sunday, 15 June 2003 10:52 (twenty-three years ago)

I gotta agree with J; I'm still giggling at that one.

I did not say that violins and woodwinds can never be in tune with each other. I sing with the Boston Symphony; I hear violins and woodwinds in tune on a regular basis. What I said was that their violin player's timbre (which more often than not sounds like Irish fiddle) doesn't match well with the saxophone. It's a "unique" sound that never really rings, gels or clicks.

I'd also like to note that you STILL haven't pointed me at any specific songs.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Sunday, 15 June 2003 12:37 (twenty-three years ago)

"- The fiddle-timbre of the violin grates against the horns, making it nigh-impossible for them to play in tune together." hmm..hate to argue, but you did say they couldn't play in tune.
Songs that show you what? Can't remember what the criteria were, refresh my memory please?

allison, Sunday, 15 June 2003 13:41 (twenty-three years ago)

Quick question for the sake of perspective, Allison.....what other music do you enjoy?

Alex in NYC (vassifer), Sunday, 15 June 2003 15:45 (twenty-three years ago)

I've posted that twice..but I'll do it again. I like Tom Petty, The Cure, The Misfits, Rush, Plaid, Roadhaven, Bob Marley, Queens of the Stone Age, and Fury Monk to name a few. Although I'm not as obsessed as you, I do like Killing Joke. I'm a very firm believer that Jaz is God. Or...a least the second coming of christ.

Allison, Sunday, 15 June 2003 16:20 (twenty-three years ago)

love connection!

James Blount (James Blount), Sunday, 15 June 2003 19:33 (twenty-three years ago)

we'll be back in 2 and 2

oops (Oops), Sunday, 15 June 2003 19:53 (twenty-three years ago)

uh...what about 2's? Did I miss somethin?

Allison, Sunday, 15 June 2003 23:28 (twenty-three years ago)

You cannot compare Dave Matthews with the majesty of Yes or Rush.

The Atomic Rooster, Monday, 16 June 2003 00:10 (twenty-three years ago)

Allison: it's about beats. Ask your drummer.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 16 June 2003 00:12 (twenty-three years ago)

Who's comparing. I like DMB for an entirely different reason than I like the rest of those bands. I hate my drummer..I'd much rather you explain, please =)

Allison, Monday, 16 June 2003 00:15 (twenty-three years ago)

A quick and dirty lesson about time signatures -- all others can throw in here as they like.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 16 June 2003 00:19 (twenty-three years ago)

What's this in reference to?

Allison, Monday, 16 June 2003 00:32 (twenty-three years ago)

Allison is a red herring.

Jon Williams (ex machina), Monday, 16 June 2003 02:08 (twenty-three years ago)

Either that or is willfully stupid. I'd like to not assume the latter.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 16 June 2003 02:11 (twenty-three years ago)

hmm..hate to argue, but you did say they couldn't play in tune.

I said that Dave Matthews Band rarely plays in tune. I didn't say it was impossible to tune woodwinds. And really, it's only the songs where they really feature the fiddle and horns playing together that it really grates on my ears.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Monday, 16 June 2003 02:30 (twenty-three years ago)

800.

The name comes from the name of a song, One Sweet World, performed by the Dave Matthews Band (who they?).

http://www.ciao.co.uk/Ben_Jerrys_One_Sweet_Whirled__Review_5314913

disco stu (disco stu), Monday, 16 June 2003 03:21 (twenty-three years ago)

how come an IP search for allison turns up many many posts for one mr DAN PERRY? eh? EH???

jess (dubplatestyle), Monday, 16 June 2003 03:23 (twenty-three years ago)

Dan Perry in sexually-confused DMB Tyler Durden shocker

Millar (Millar), Monday, 16 June 2003 03:35 (twenty-three years ago)

But... what if that shit sandwich has cream filling in the middle and you won't know unless you eat a little more.

This may be the best reply I've ever gotten.

oops (Oops), Monday, 16 June 2003 06:10 (twenty-three years ago)

The first rule of DMB Club is that you don't talk about DMB club.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Monday, 16 June 2003 12:23 (twenty-three years ago)

I know about time signatures...music major, remember. I'm just wondering why you posted it. Also wondering if I should be offended by the "willfully stupid" comment... (here's where I'd post a picture of myself looking confused, but since I'm computer illiterate and no one wants to tell me how to do it =P)

Allison, Monday, 16 June 2003 12:36 (twenty-three years ago)

It seems there has been mutual confusion, not hard with me. I thought you were referring to questions of the beat but it looks like you were talking about Chuck Woolery's 'classic' smarm outro on Love Connection -- which is what Oops was quoting.

Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 16 June 2003 13:38 (twenty-three years ago)

Your mom's a wall.
Best comeback evah.

Hello, Wall.
If she had said "Su madre es una pared" it would've sounded 100x cooler and dirtier.

Lord Custos Epsilon (Lord Custos Epsilon), Monday, 16 June 2003 13:49 (twenty-three years ago)

Your mom's a wall.
Best comeback evah.

Hello, Wall.
If she had said "Su madre es una pared" it would've sounded 100x cooler and dirtier.

But... what if that shit sandwich has cream filling in the middle and you won't know unless you eat a little more.
Three words: Thats. Not. Cream.

Lord Custos Epsilon (Lord Custos Epsilon), Monday, 16 June 2003 13:51 (twenty-three years ago)

ewwww.

Allison, Monday, 16 June 2003 15:04 (twenty-three years ago)

My reasons for hating them, apart from whatever else has been already mentioned:

A guy by the name of J0hn L00 who tried to browbeat me into liking them years ago. In every single American high school and small college with a jazz band, the three 'cool guys' in the rhythm section (gtr/bs/drm) have an awful polite groovy rock band together and they inevitably will draft their one even 'cooler' poet/philosopher/rollerblader friend into playing acoustic and singing. This was J0hn L00. He was in the middle of MERELY EXPLAINING to me how 'techno' could never mean anything because it was TECHNOLOGY which could never TOUCH THE UNIVERSAL SCOPE or whatever the fuck he was saying, when (we were on a bus iirc) he asked if I liked DMB, to which I said no I most certainly do not. His respnonse: OH BUT DAVE IS JUST SO MUSICAL.

"hike up your dress a little more/ and show your world to me:" This line insenses me more than any other line from any other song ever. In any kind of just relations among the genders saying "hike...world..." would earn you derision, lawsuits, and a lonely life, and (yank away the curtain of poesy here) "LEMME SEE YOUR PUSSY" would be the gleeful playful die-rect request btw actual living bodied humans that I must believe it is. But alas that's not our world obviously, not yet, and this song isn't helping any.

I can't imagine a line more duplicitous, more violent, more ugly. It's not a world, dickhead! Yes I get it, he wants to nice-guy his way into this girl's pants, but with his cute lil met-a-phor he obliterates her subjectivity and says back to us over his shoulder "dude they're all sisters."

(god this song pisses me off) Anyone who calls your genitals "a world" is clearly a creep and pig and will never go down on you unless under extreme duress and will at that point be crap at it on purpose to spite you. You know that I am right.

(unless Dave is standing behind her which would complicate my er position a little.)

g--ff c-nn-n (gcannon), Monday, 16 June 2003 16:09 (twenty-three years ago)

That's a reason for hating them? That's a bit superficial if you don't mind me saying. First of all, when he wrote the song those lyrics weren't in it and that's not even what the song is about if you listen to more than that one line. It wasn't like he said 'hey let me write a song about looking at some girl's "world" because I'm a shallow, adamant bastard.' Dave was adlibbing, as he often does, during one performance before the song was even recorded, and people laughed. So..when they recorded it he just sang it that way. If you take into account that the lyrics in the rest of the close to 150 songs that he's written are completely respectable, I think they cancel out that one debatable line. Also..that's about 1/4 as imprudent as the bulk of music played on "the piece of shit that is MTV". That's a feeble excuse for not liking them.

Allison, Monday, 16 June 2003 16:55 (twenty-three years ago)

Allison, is your point that there is no good reason for not liking any band?

NA. (Nick A.), Monday, 16 June 2003 17:06 (twenty-three years ago)


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