The Monster cover has taken on a certain baggage after decades of clogging dollar bins, but the new approach did seem cool & different at the time (and I do still like it).
― What's that Phish song that goes "Bag it, Tag it"? (morrisp), Saturday, 16 March 2019 18:05 (five years ago) link
Post-Around the Sun it's difficult for me to think of anything to do with Monster having "baggage" ...
― Le Baton Rose (Turrican), Saturday, 16 March 2019 18:25 (five years ago) link
I bought that on vinyl when it came out. Looks like there were more pictures in the CD booklet? Like the ones with the fake song titles and the furniture - I like those.
― timellison, Saturday, 16 March 2019 18:26 (five years ago) link
I thought those were all actual songs (or at least sketches of songs) from when they were making the album. Were any of those actually released? I lost track of the reissue program...
― What's that Phish song that goes "Bag it, Tag it"? (morrisp), Saturday, 16 March 2019 18:28 (five years ago) link
I would totally listen to 2 CDs of Monster outtakes; just those guys f’ing around with that cavernous gtr reverb
― What's that Phish song that goes "Bag it, Tag it"? (morrisp), Saturday, 16 March 2019 18:30 (five years ago) link
Looks like all the bonus tracks on CD and vinyl singles from that time were live tracks except for 808 State remixes of "King of Comedy."
― timellison, Saturday, 16 March 2019 18:58 (five years ago) link
What's wrong with it? I think it represents the album quite well.
I remember Stipe saying he was deeply involved with album art and wouldn't give it up for anything.
by no means am i font/typography design nerd, but the three different fonts on the cover are all awful (especially the "REVEAL", and especially especialy the track titles), the circles on the M in R.E.M. make no sense, the drop shadows all go in different directions, the spacing around the track titles are weird and unpleasing, and the combo of the awful font and awful drop shadows on the track titles combine to make some of the very worst track titles i have ever seen, literally worse than just about anyone could do with even a copy of microsoft word from microsoft XP days. unforgivably bad. the tones/colors on the photo aren't so hot either, but compared to the crap that was laid over the top 20 minutes before the file was due (and if it was put on there any earlier, and any significant amount of thought was put into it, that adds to the things that cannot be forgiven) it somehow comes out to the best part about the cover
― but i'm there are fuckups (Karl Malone), Saturday, 16 March 2019 19:19 (five years ago) link
The list of titles in the Monster CD booklet are a mix of titles, working titles and ideas for titles. For example: 'Yes, I am Fucking With You' was the working title for 'King of Comedy' - I suspect it's the contents of their "ideas wall" that they would have had in the studio.
― Le Baton Rose (Turrican), Saturday, 16 March 2019 19:21 (five years ago) link
I would guess 'Violent Green' was the working title for 'What's the Frequency, Kenneth?', 'You Give Good Head' was the working title for 'I Don't Sleep, I Dream', 'There's a Certain Feeling'/'Certain Feeling' was the working title for 'Circus Envy', various permutations of 'Revolution' are mentioned ...
― Le Baton Rose (Turrican), Saturday, 16 March 2019 19:26 (five years ago) link
I'm speculating now, but 'Pattern Shirt' looks to me like it could have been an early version of 'Bittersweet Me', and I'd be totally unsurprised if 'Soul Song' turned out to be 'Tongue' ...
― Le Baton Rose (Turrican), Saturday, 16 March 2019 19:27 (five years ago) link
I could swear that Buck or another one of the guys said at the time that there was a bunch of unreleased stuff in the can, but maybe I’m wrong.
― What's that Phish song that goes "Bag it, Tag it"? (morrisp), Saturday, 16 March 2019 19:53 (five years ago) link
Unreleased stuff from Monster? I suspect if there were any leftover ideas worth using, they used 'em on New Adventures in Hi-Fi. They were already performing 'Undertow', 'Binky the Doormat' and 'The Wake Up Bomb' on the tour, as well as 'Revolution' ...
― Le Baton Rose (Turrican), Saturday, 16 March 2019 20:01 (five years ago) link
I just skimmed thru this old interview; there’s some interesting stuff in it:https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/r-e-m-monster-madness-42635/
“I think we’ve got a few more records in us,” Buck continues. “If I said three records — that sounds kind of reasonable to me right now. Now we could break up before that or we could make 10 more records. At the rate we work, three records is a long time — it’s six, seven years. Of course, if we get to the point where we’re not popular anymore, then we could do whatever we want to! Some days I think it could last forever, and some days I think it won’t last very long.”
― What's that Phish song that goes "Bag it, Tag it"? (morrisp), Saturday, 16 March 2019 20:26 (five years ago) link
Oh right, I recognise this interview because of Kiedis at the beginning... it's in a book I have of R.E.M. articles/interviews from the beginning up to the Monster era...
― Le Baton Rose (Turrican), Saturday, 16 March 2019 20:50 (five years ago) link
Rolling Stone's crash-your-browser web site is something else.
― timellison, Saturday, 16 March 2019 21:45 (five years ago) link
a best-of with tracks from this era already exists, it's called up
look who bought the myth. Hope, Sad Professor, Why Not Smile, Daysleeper, chunk the rest.
― campreverb, Saturday, 16 March 2019 23:06 (five years ago) link
'Sad Professor' is one of my least favourite things R.E.M. ever did.
― Le Baton Rose (Turrican), Saturday, 16 March 2019 23:29 (five years ago) link
I like Up (I like all their albums), but it’s certainly not their most immediate set of songs.
― timellison, Sunday, 17 March 2019 00:24 (five years ago) link
xxxp Reveal sleeve heavily influenced by the David Carson / Ray Gun show-the-seams end-of-print aesthetic
― an incoherent crustacean (MatthewK), Sunday, 17 March 2019 01:26 (five years ago) link
I dunno, I just don't think it's aged particularly well, and their inability to advance its better moments makes those achievements seem like a bit of a fluke.
― campreverb, Sunday, 17 March 2019 03:23 (five years ago) link
"Suspicion" is probably my favorite. And since it's my favorite REM album, I think its one of their best songs ever.
― Robert Adam Gilmour, Sunday, 17 March 2019 16:19 (five years ago) link
"sad professor" is v good imo. up is prob objectively too long but i can't argue for excluding any track, everything builds on its singular sleepwalking mood and imo the length actually adds to that. also how lovely is "you're in the air"???
― jolene club remix (BradNelson), Sunday, 17 March 2019 16:23 (five years ago) link
their inability to advance its better moments makes those achievements seem like a bit of a fluke
I think it was a similar mode of songwriting to New Adventures even with the different instrumental approach - longer form, fictional, narrative. I remember being happy thinking that they were tightening the song structures up again with Reveal, enabling things like "The Lifting" and "Imitation of Life."
― timellison, Sunday, 17 March 2019 17:20 (five years ago) link
I had to look back at an old fanzine review I did of Reveal. I wrote, "One thing these lyrics do is to reduce the character sketch approach from storytelling back into more of a poetic form."
― timellison, Sunday, 17 March 2019 17:28 (five years ago) link
Listening now, I'm not so sure! I think the structures tighten up more with Around the Sun (and stay that way from there on out, ending with songs under three minutes on Collapse).
― timellison, Sunday, 17 March 2019 17:49 (five years ago) link
Reveal is a potentially great album marred by Stipe sounding so halfhearted, they sound like quickly recorded guide vocals half the time. Usually he's one of my favourote singers so what was going on in summer 2000? was he ill or just not into it?
― thomasintrouble, Sunday, 17 March 2019 17:50 (five years ago) link
"Beat a Drum" is fantastic.
― timellison, Sunday, 17 March 2019 17:58 (five years ago) link
Classic R.E.M.
“I’ve Been High” has great singing. Really that’s all I need from Reveal. Maybe “Beat a Drum”.
― L'assie (Euler), Sunday, 17 March 2019 17:59 (five years ago) link
"Beat A Drum" is my pick too, amazing song. Several of the others felt a little too anonymous to me at the time, like any band could have done "She Just Wants To Be" or "I'll Take the Rain." I should give it a relisten though.
― |Restore| |Restart| |Quit| (Doctor Casino), Sunday, 17 March 2019 18:03 (five years ago) link
"Imitation of Life," though. Like another Out of Time hit. That one was rad live.
― timellison, Sunday, 17 March 2019 18:07 (five years ago) link
absolutely, that and pilgrimage were the highlights when we saw them in '05
― thomasintrouble, Sunday, 17 March 2019 18:15 (five years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YlaOH_ovVg
reveal was... a little overcooked imo, as i think this superior demo proves
― jolene club remix (BradNelson), Sunday, 17 March 2019 18:32 (five years ago) link
xp yeah the Unplugged version of “I’ve Been High” from the Reveal era may reveal charms to the resistant
― L'assie (Euler), Sunday, 17 March 2019 19:06 (five years ago) link
er not xp!
I suppose a big reason for the change in studio approach after Berry left was that Berry and Buck tended to like to get things down onto tape quickly, whereas Mills and Stipe liked to labour over things a little more. When Berry left the band, the balance tipped in favour of Mills and Stipe, who were heavily into the details of the production, sometimes working on perfecting a couple of bars of music for hours. Up, Reveal and Around the Sun were all recorded with this type of approach, until they all agreed to go back to a more organic way of working. Stipe probably laboured over the vocals to those albums far more than their other records - which is probably why they may sound "half-hearted" to some.
― Le Baton Rose (Turrican), Sunday, 17 March 2019 19:42 (five years ago) link
But how do these albums make you *feel*? "Up" does what it says on the tin, despite some of the somber moments, overall it makes me feel positive and hopeful.
That's one of REM's secrets - their music often taps into your emotional core, making you feel *something*. As opposed to the later albums, which just don't make me feel much at all aside from a track here and there. Listening to any of their IRS-era material, the albums positively soar at times. That faded away for me after "New Adventures" and "Up".
― Gerald McBoing-Boing, Sunday, 17 March 2019 23:19 (five years ago) link
This is nice. "Bad Day" b-side, 2003, Magnapop cover.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9-g4cdSjvo
― timellison, Monday, 18 March 2019 02:24 (five years ago) link
Same disc, Mills, Three Dog Night
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TvttMIOPiT0
― timellison, Monday, 18 March 2019 02:56 (five years ago) link
My other conclusion listening to the second Complete Rarities today - they remained a good surf band ("Tricycle," "Surfing the Ganges," "165 Hillcrest").
― timellison, Monday, 18 March 2019 03:04 (five years ago) link
man i'm listening to reveal r/n and it's less good than i remembered. :( "beat a drum" is still fantastic" and "imitation of life" lands like someone just jabbed the album with a syringe full of energy. but after "the lifting," side A is just a prettily-produced wash of songs that are too basic to sustain the nth repetition of "all the way to reno... you're gonna be a star!" or "she just wants to be somewhere she just wants to be" (get it). i really don't like where stipe's good-advice/adult-wisdom songwriting mode ended up here and i agree that his singing is not great.
― |Restore| |Restart| |Quit| (Doctor Casino), Monday, 18 March 2019 18:08 (five years ago) link
"she just wants to be" is def one of my least favorite rem songs
― jolene club remix (BradNelson), Monday, 18 March 2019 18:55 (five years ago) link
wow just looking at the tracklisting i'm like "this is a very uneven album that i listened to constantly in high school for some reason?" i used to love "i'll take the rain" but now recognize it as the palest xerox of a rem ballad
i love "i've been high" and "disappear" (which sounds like it's broadcasting the second side of accelerate early) though
― jolene club remix (BradNelson), Monday, 18 March 2019 18:58 (five years ago) link
all of Around The Sun sounds like the part of a concert where your favorite band plays newer material and all the energy drains from the room.
― campreverb, Monday, 18 March 2019 19:06 (five years ago) link
'She Just Wants To Be' sounded much better live. Around the Sun starts off well ('Leaving New York', 'Electron Blue') and then it goes south.
― Le Baton Rose (Turrican), Monday, 18 March 2019 20:01 (five years ago) link
most of these songs sounded much better live. the around the sun tracks especially
― jolene club remix (BradNelson), Monday, 18 March 2019 20:19 (five years ago) link
around the sun songs i'll go to bat for:
electron bluethe outsiders before q-tip appearsi wanted to be wrongboy in the wellaftermathascent of man
― jolene club remix (BradNelson), Monday, 18 March 2019 20:20 (five years ago) link
"high speed train" is also great i think but it covers very little ground that "boy in the well" doesn't
― jolene club remix (BradNelson), Monday, 18 March 2019 20:21 (five years ago) link
I'm surprised DC didn't note "I've Been High" as one of the good ones! the electronics threaten to swallow the singing but if you don't like his singing here then that's a good thing. I think his singing on it is gorgeous and as I said even better on the Unplugged from 2001, where the sequence is "Disappear" -> "Beat A Drum" -> "I've Been High".
― L'assie (Euler), Monday, 18 March 2019 20:21 (five years ago) link
yeah idk with that one, it just kinda bores me. the lyrics don't land with me, i hear them as generic deep-thought stuff, the images and word choices aren't very unique. i don't fall in love with songs because they have unique words mind you - just trying to articulate what it is that's present in many other r.e.m. songs that's missing here.
― |Restore| |Restart| |Quit| (Doctor Casino), Monday, 18 March 2019 20:26 (five years ago) link