Robert Wyatt: Classic or Dud?

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"Alifib/Alife" - progression from displacement/uncertainty (am I floating? Am I paralysed? Am I dead? Has the anaesthetic worn off?) to recognition of unconditional love (and isn't it about time btw that Wyatt gave Mike Oldfield credit for his guitar on this track?) and finally to raw sex and climax (Gary Windo's dualist sexy beast of bass clt/tenor sex sounds very horny), and, via closing Benge voiceover, back to life. Meanwhile, world outside continues on its silly oblivious way ("Little Red Robin Hood Hit The Road") so author seeks solace in the blackly chucklesome life of the inner mind (Cutler's laugh backed by Frith's viola screeches - set me free? What would be the point?).

Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Friday, 17 September 2004 09:10 (nineteen years ago) link

That's actually Robert Wyatt playing guitar on that track - compare the playing to the playing on "Moon In June"

Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 17 September 2004 09:12 (nineteen years ago) link

... I've always had the feeling it might be speeded up, Les Paul-style, however

Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 17 September 2004 09:13 (nineteen years ago) link

I find it an easier record to admire than love - it is very beautiful, it IS as great as its admirers say it is but it takes me to a place, emotionally, that I don't want to spend very much time. Yes, the theme is look-we-have-come-through, and you never doubt Wyatt's sincerity for a second - he really is a lovely man - but I still find listening to it a mildly depressing experience. Humanity cannot bear very much reality and this is too much of a certain kind of reality for me.

x-posts

frankiemachine, Friday, 17 September 2004 09:21 (nineteen years ago) link

It's amazing but I have never found this album to be even remotely depressing - not for a nanosecond

Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 17 September 2004 09:27 (nineteen years ago) link

no...i mean yes!

gaz (gaz), Friday, 17 September 2004 09:30 (nineteen years ago) link

You sure about that? I read an interview with Oldfield years ago where he was all pissed off about not getting a credit on that track.

*digs out dog-eared copy of End Of An Ear for comparison purposes*

Hmmm, I see your point. If it's Wyatt it's bloody good playing for someone who says he isn't that good at playing the guitar.

(either that or it's his funny Italian organ, or Hugh Hopper's bass speeded up?)

Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Friday, 17 September 2004 09:38 (nineteen years ago) link

CORREKSHIN: digs out "Moon In June" as opposed to End Of An Ear.

Interesting record, though, End Of An Ear; it's like an extended avant-scat variation on Gil Evans' "Las Vegas Tango."

Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid, Friday, 17 September 2004 09:40 (nineteen years ago) link

Funny, I wondered if it might not actually be a bass guitar speeded-up, so not so much Les Paul-style as Holger Czukay-style.

Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 17 September 2004 09:45 (nineteen years ago) link

... also Wyatt claims he can't play keyboards very well either but we know differently (xpost)

Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 17 September 2004 09:49 (nineteen years ago) link

also he can't sing!

gaz (gaz), Friday, 17 September 2004 09:51 (nineteen years ago) link

... but he can drum like a motherfucker

Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 17 September 2004 09:52 (nineteen years ago) link

it is one of the most life affirming record ever made.

gaz (gaz), Friday, 17 September 2004 10:07 (nineteen years ago) link

Absolutely

Dadaismus (Dada), Friday, 17 September 2004 10:09 (nineteen years ago) link

i want to add something to this discussion, because this album is so big for me, but amateurist's description of it is so fucking OTM, i cant imagine i have anything new to add.

peter smith (plsmith), Friday, 17 September 2004 12:21 (nineteen years ago) link


Rock Bottom is about someone finding their way back to the world and - vide closing Cutler recitative - learning to laugh again.

-- Donnie Smith The Quiz Kid (what_d...) (webmail), September 17th, 2004 5:02 AM. (later) (link)


i can see our "interpretations" being complementary, more or less. but i'm reluctant to describe this album as being "about" any one thing, especially something as cliché as "learning to laugh again." i don't think the album has a narrative per se, or an obvious forward progression. or at least i've never chosen to hear it that way.

amateur!!!st (amateurist), Friday, 17 September 2004 12:40 (nineteen years ago) link

>(and isn't it about time btw that Wyatt gave Mike Oldfield credit for his guitar on this track?)

I agree that's not Oldfield on that track, but it's definitely Oldfield on the final track 'Little Red Robin Hood Hit the Road', the huge soaring melodic line that turns into the 'can't you see them?' riff. One of my favorite moments of recorded sound in the history of our world etc.

Oldfield is credited as a musician on the back cover of the original vinyl, but I suspect Oldfield's saying he wrote that entire solo, the melody and riff, and deserved a co-authoring credit for the entire track (I would be obliged if you could find his exact complaint)... the riff is nearly identical to one of the sections of 'Ommadawn'. I still see it as more of a break in the middle of Wyatt's song, but it is certainly Oldfield's solo that pushes it over the top.

(Jon L), Friday, 17 September 2004 17:35 (nineteen years ago) link

One of my favorite moments of recorded sound in the history of our world etc.

YES

amateur!!st, Friday, 17 September 2004 17:38 (nineteen years ago) link

(whenever someone makes fun of me for owning five Oldfield records I just point them towards that solo)

(Jon L), Friday, 17 September 2004 17:40 (nineteen years ago) link

'mostly fish... mostly porpoise...'

cºzen (Cozen), Friday, 17 September 2004 17:48 (nineteen years ago) link

anyone else here obsessed with the version of Little Red Riding Hood on the Henry Cow conerts cd?

Dan Selzer (Dan Selzer), Friday, 17 September 2004 17:48 (nineteen years ago) link

not obsessed, but that's good

amateur!!st, Friday, 17 September 2004 17:50 (nineteen years ago) link

the '75 Henry Cow/Robert Wyatt tour, they'd play the entirety of 'Ruth is Stranger than Richard' in sequence

(Jon L), Friday, 17 September 2004 17:52 (nineteen years ago) link

I love that "Little Red Riding Hood ..." side of the HC live LP, it's so propulsive. I've got to get it and Rock Bottom on CD so I can iPod it at work. I was just watching a multiple-generation video copy of a French TV interview/doc (from '93) and remembered there was an Italian video doc about him. Is this available on DVD now?

nickn (nickn), Saturday, 18 September 2004 06:19 (nineteen years ago) link

Robert Wyatt was a communist in the original Marxist sense, not a Stalinist. There's a HUGE difference, but that's something you're not told in America, where even LIBERAL has become a bad word, let alone socialism.
Wyatt is pretty funny about it though - he said Trotskyism was too shouty, so he wanted to go for something completely unfashionable and contemplative.
His comment about there being many, many good,kind people in the world, yet the leaders being utter bastards is sadly pretty spot on.
And his music is wonderful. Get over your silly hipster hatred of Weller and just enjoy it. I think the Jam are hugely overrated, but I've got to hand it to Weller, that slide guitar part on Free Will And Testament is sublime.

Stewart S, Saturday, 18 September 2004 08:51 (nineteen years ago) link

love him. his version of "I'm a Believer" is awesome. "Rock Bottom" is classic, and posters above have described it very well, I think. I also love his take on "Guantanamera" and Chic's "At Last I Am Free." And the song called "Grass." He owns "Shipbuilding," obviously. Also really liked, after some initial reservations, "Shleep." He's actually one of my heroes for a lot of reasons.

eddie hurt (ddduncan), Saturday, 18 September 2004 16:11 (nineteen years ago) link

Classic! Uhm, yep. Although his debut is a bit over the top sometimes.

strom (strom), Saturday, 18 September 2004 16:21 (nineteen years ago) link

nine months pass...
Revive...cuz I just bought Rock Bottom this weekend!

Wow...I'm lovin' it like a Mickey D's fruit walnut salad...

Really cool droney, crazy ol' man EZ listening prog or something....it's DEFINITELY something...that's for sure....Sea Song is just a heartbreaking love song...."Your madness fits in nicely with my own" is such a sweet like....I love the big droney songs called Little Red Robin Hood....

Great organ sounds....bewitching record.

M@tt He1geson (Matt Helgeson), Monday, 11 July 2005 16:01 (eighteen years ago) link

The only thing I don't really like is the end of the last song (Red Riding Hood II)...where he uses this wierd stupid "rasta mon" accent

M@tt He1geson (Matt Helgeson), Monday, 11 July 2005 16:11 (eighteen years ago) link

even that song will grow on you

kyle (akmonday), Monday, 11 July 2005 16:39 (eighteen years ago) link

"At Last I Am Free" is gorgeous.

Alfred Soto (Alfred Soto), Monday, 11 July 2005 16:52 (eighteen years ago) link

i picked that up used recently too...it cemented my love for mr. wyatt...

b b, Monday, 11 July 2005 17:10 (eighteen years ago) link

What else is good by this dude? Is he pretty solid overall? I want more.

M@tt He1geson (Matt Helgeson), Monday, 11 July 2005 17:16 (eighteen years ago) link

The only thing I don't really like is the end of the last song (Red Riding Hood II)...where he uses this wierd stupid "rasta mon" accent
-- M@tt He1geson (matt@game[remove]informer.com), July 11th, 2005.


That's Ivor Cutler and that's how Ivor Cutler sounds

chris besinger (chris besinger), Monday, 11 July 2005 17:19 (eighteen years ago) link

"Ruth is Stranger than Richard", "Shleep" and "Cuckooland" are excellent

chris besinger (chris besinger), Monday, 11 July 2005 17:20 (eighteen years ago) link

That's Ivor Cutler and that's how Ivor Cutler sounds

ah cool...that makes me feel better about it...I thought it was Wyatt copping an accent for some reason....

M@tt He1geson (Matt Helgeson), Monday, 11 July 2005 17:22 (eighteen years ago) link

I acquired Rock Bottom and Solar Flares Burn for You in March. Haven't listened to either in about a month but I'm fond of both, particularly the former (which Marcello's review inspired me to pick up).

Weird time for a revive, though -- I had a dream last night where I was playing "Sea Song" and my brother came in and said, "What the fuck is this crap? He sounds horrible!" and I was harping on about how he sounded better than any of The Beatles and how a lot of people think Green Gartside sounds a lot like him. I thought the discussion actually happened when I woke up until I remembered that he spent the night over at a friend's house.

Ian Riese-Moraine: that obscure object of desire. (Eastern Mantra), Monday, 11 July 2005 19:30 (eighteen years ago) link

I smashed up the telly with the broken phone.

Rastaman! (Eastern Mantra), Monday, 11 July 2005 19:32 (eighteen years ago) link

rock bottom, shleep, and the most recent one (cuckooland) are all exceptional. Rock Bottom is the best though. I also have Old Rottenhat, it's not bad.

kyle (akmonday), Monday, 11 July 2005 21:43 (eighteen years ago) link

i want it i want it i want it give it to meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

Amateur(ist) (Amateur(ist)), Monday, 11 July 2005 22:11 (eighteen years ago) link

also, to be pedantic (again!), it's "i smash up thee telly with remains of thee broken phone."

Amateur(ist) (Amateur(ist)), Monday, 11 July 2005 22:11 (eighteen years ago) link

get that ep's thing with his version of "i'm a believer"! the peel sessions version is fab too, he does one of his patented "voice imitating a coltrane solo" things.

i own the whole rbt wyatt discography, except for that 'solar flares' thing which i need to get and i guess the best-of which would be redundant. there's nothing bad in it. though i don't listen to 'dondestan' very much, i admit.

Amateur(ist) (Amateur(ist)), Monday, 11 July 2005 22:19 (eighteen years ago) link

Amateur(ist), do you know of this single i mentioned upthread where he's playing w/south african musicians? i never picked it up and now i kick myself.

i have almost everything also, and i think my favorite is an ep that was put out as Nothing Can Stop Us Now, with a few extra tracks on the reissue.

The Amazing Jaxon! (jaxon), Tuesday, 12 July 2005 01:32 (eighteen years ago) link

solar flares is WONDERFUL

my 2 oddities are the downloaded peel session where he performs with Slapp Happy and a 12 w/ UK faux-latin new pop types Weekend where he duets w/ Tracey Thorn.

Dan Selzer (Dan Selzer), Tuesday, 12 July 2005 02:48 (eighteen years ago) link

how could anyone mistake a scot for a rasta?!?!???!?

hstencil (hstencil), Tuesday, 12 July 2005 03:02 (eighteen years ago) link

Hate the communism (my grandfather was murdered by the Red Army, and my uncle died after being in a labour camp) but (perversely?) I love Stalin Wasn't Stallin! Love Shipbuilding, Carl Craig remix of Ultramarine, At Last I Am Free...

Definitely Classic.

Check "The End of An Ear"!

Telegram Sam, Tuesday, 12 July 2005 05:59 (eighteen years ago) link

"how could anyone mistake a scot for a rasta?!?!???!?"

How about if someone was extremely drunk and was trying to tell a joke that involved mimicking a Scottish and / or Jamaican accent, but wasn't actually very good at different accents?

I believe this sort of confusion is particularly common with Welsh and Indian accents.

Robert Wyatt? Classic, obv.

Stewart Osborne (Stewart Osborne), Tuesday, 12 July 2005 09:50 (eighteen years ago) link

Classic. Wonderful human being as well. Gorgeous voice, clever and unexpected melodic sense, lyrically at once naive and knowing (I'm not sure how many of his lyrics his wife wrote on the last record, but she wrote most of Shleep and Dondestan).

Best records best to least for me: Rock Bottom, Soft Machine vols. 1 & 2, Shleep, Dondestan (either mix), Ruth is Stranger than Richard, Old Rottenhat, Matching Mole, Cuckooland (enjoyed it but the cheap keyboards are starting to bug me - Leonard Cohen syndrome). I don't listen to Rock Bottom very often at all, because it's such a charged object for me; it'd be like having the Koh-I-Noor diamond lying around as a paperweight.

End of an Ear is a prog-jazz record which I enjoyed, but it has hardly any vocals on it. Solar Flares Burn for You is an odds-and-ends compilation which is notable for some Rock Bottom demos and 'Little Child' which is one step away from being Lil' Markie.

Brakhage (brakhage), Tuesday, 12 July 2005 14:02 (eighteen years ago) link

i didn't think shleep was to his standards; i prefer the new one i think. end of the ear left me fairly cold, it's most akin to some of the more noodly stuff on the matching mole records.

Amateur(ist) (Amateur(ist)), Tuesday, 12 July 2005 20:50 (eighteen years ago) link

nice to see some love for matching mole. i just heard little red record a couple months ago, expecting something mildly interesting but datedly noodly. there are some rough patches, but i was nicely suprised by how good it is.

wayward son, Tuesday, 12 July 2005 22:03 (eighteen years ago) link


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