man of our times is epic! could fit on the lamb even.
― kurt schwitterz, Wednesday, 25 July 2018 18:16 (five years ago) link
This album is a revelation. Soulful Phil vs Prog
― calstars, Sunday, 10 January 2021 23:44 (three years ago) link
It's way better than And Then There Were Three
― fish quits shock (Matt #2), Sunday, 10 January 2021 23:49 (three years ago) link
I think I posted on a different Genesis thread that this is really the best of both Genesis worlds.
― Josh in Chicago, Monday, 11 January 2021 00:01 (three years ago) link
yeah I really fell in love with this album this year, picked it up on vinyl for cheap on a whim
so good
such a weird record
like you couldn't be a band that made a record like this unless you'd already been one type of band and were turning into another type of band
but you couldn't start out or end up being a band like this (on duke and also abacab)
― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Monday, 11 January 2021 00:02 (three years ago) link
yes
― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Monday, 11 January 2021 00:07 (three years ago) link
omg i forgot i made this poll
― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Monday, 11 January 2021 00:08 (three years ago) link
Please don’t ask is so cringey, Phil exposing his feelings too much !
― calstars, Monday, 11 January 2021 01:45 (three years ago) link
I just listened to it for the first time and "Please Don't Ask" was the easy standout for me. I hate "Misunderstanding" tbh
― stylish but illegal (Simon H.), Monday, 11 January 2021 03:06 (three years ago) link
"Misunderstanding" has such great, simple drums.
― Josh in Chicago, Monday, 11 January 2021 03:36 (three years ago) link
Phil is amazing, so much range as a drummer. so few were with his insane chops would do that
― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Monday, 11 January 2021 03:44 (three years ago) link
Misunderstanding is post-Gabriel Genesis doing Supertramp yet I still love it.
― fish quits shock (Matt #2), Monday, 11 January 2021 10:29 (three years ago) link
Duchess is so amazing. Recommend me electronic music that sounds like the first two minutes of Duchess (esp the Three Sides Live version)
― SDFG SDFG SDFG SDFG SDFG SDFG SF (stevie), Monday, 11 January 2021 11:23 (three years ago) link
I think I had the CD long box of this on my wall back when I would save them as posters.
― Jimi Buffett (PBKR), Monday, 11 January 2021 12:53 (three years ago) link
XP - Maybe the first couple of OMD albums or some Monoton?
― Maresn3st, Monday, 11 January 2021 13:03 (three years ago) link
This album was a great disappointment to me after ATTWT, which is still one of my favourite Genesis albums. The songs that go to make up the Duke suite are excellent, but it was a real failure of nerve not to put them together as they should have been. Misunderstanding and Please Don't Ask are just dross and should have been saved for Collins's solo albums, where they would have fit much better. The problem was that both Banks and Rutherford had just made excellent solo albums and had used up all of their best material on those. This was the beginning of the end for my many years of Genesis fandom. Sad!
― joni mitchell jarre (anagram), Monday, 11 January 2021 13:04 (three years ago) link
"Genesis' Duke . . . anybody remember that album. Genesis' Duke. You're no ATTWT, one of the great Genesis albums. . . The Duke suite . . . songs are excellent, but they were such losers not to put them together as they should have been. Misunderstanding and Please Don't Ask were Very Bad! Banks and Rutherford used up all of their best material. Duke! More like Duchess! This was the beginning of the end for my many years of Genesis fandom. Sad!"
― Jimi Buffett (PBKR), Monday, 11 January 2021 13:23 (three years ago) link
vg :)
― joni mitchell jarre (anagram), Monday, 11 January 2021 13:28 (three years ago) link
In its original form, "Behind the Lines", "Duchess", "Guide Vocal", "Turn It On Again", "Duke's Travels", and "Duke's End" were one 30-minute track that told a story of a fictional character named Albert which had a working title of "Duke". The group chose this name because the fanfare melodies on "Behind the Lines" and "Duke's End" conjured an image of royalty.[16] The band decided against sequencing the tracks this way on the album, partly to avoid comparisons to their 23-minute track "Supper's Ready" from Foxtrot, but also to have certain segments of the suite, such as "Duchess" and "Turn It On Again", released as singles.
― fish quits shock (Matt #2), Monday, 11 January 2021 13:33 (three years ago) link
― fish quits shock (Matt #2), M
omigod
― meticulously crafted, socially responsible, morally upsta (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 11 January 2021 14:00 (three years ago) link
yeah that nails Misundestanding tbh
― SDFG SDFG SDFG SDFG SDFG SDFG SF (stevie), Monday, 11 January 2021 14:32 (three years ago) link
xxxxpost thanks maresnest!
They did roll the Duke songs together on the 1980 tour, with some introductory context - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5tt-TboWaQ
― Maresn3st, Monday, 11 January 2021 14:36 (three years ago) link
how the fuck did man of our times get zero votes
― ant banks and wasp (voodoo chili), Tuesday, July 24, 2018 11:08 AM (two years ago) bookmarkflaglink
― boz conspiracy by toby hus (voodoo chili), Monday, 11 January 2021 14:52 (three years ago) link
as a pre-tween Genesis obsessive I used to wonder if they cribbed Tonight Tonight Tonight off that refrain within the verses of Man Of Our Times
― SDFG SDFG SDFG SDFG SDFG SDFG SF (stevie), Monday, 11 January 2021 15:04 (three years ago) link
one thing that's cool about streaming is that it just took me like 5 minutes and now i'm listening to duke's suite as a playlist interesting to hear how it flows
― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Monday, 11 January 2021 15:50 (three years ago) link
as a big fan of the full abacab suite they edited down into "dodo/lurker," i'm sympathetic to ppl who think the duke suite should've all run together. however... "turn it on again" being isolated so they could release it as a single was totally the correct choice
― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Monday, 11 January 2021 16:11 (three years ago) link
This album was a great disappointment to me after ATTWT, which is still one of my favourite Genesis albums.
I might have to have another listen then, I think Duke is great and never remember a single thing about ATTWT besides the final track
― frogbs, Monday, 11 January 2021 16:13 (three years ago) link
ATTWT usually seems to be one of their least popular albums among fans and the band themseleves, definitely of their 70s output, reckoning they hadn't yet found their feet without Hackett. It was the one album I missed out on 30-ish years ago, so approached it with fresh ears and other than the weak Ballad Of Big, I don't really get the criticism - it sounds at once like the 'debut album' of the hit-making group and the swansong for their more traditional prog sound.
― PaulTMA, Monday, 11 January 2021 16:29 (three years ago) link
I haven't heard Duke yet, but the 78-83 era of Genesis is an unusual mix of often-beautiful melodies and striking chord progressions with some lame arrangements, wildly variable lyrics and Phil's over-singing.
Turn It On Again is probably the best of that era that I've heard, with Undertow.
― Halfway there but for you, Monday, 11 January 2021 17:17 (three years ago) link
i knew "Turn it On Again" had some complex meter stuff going on - especially for a single! - but this is wild
http://www.rebelmusicteacher.com/blog/2016/8/9/changing-meter-in-genesiss-turn-it-on-again
Analysis: The opening to the song is heard in inconsistent time signatures, including bars of 4/4 and 5/4, and when the initial riff is heard, the time signature alternates between 6/4 and 7/4 (which could be considered 13/4, although there is a sense of division as though there are two measures heard within the main riff). The chorus delves into cross-rhythm, moving into compound meter where the rest of the song is heard in simple (duple) meter.
― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Monday, 11 January 2021 17:33 (three years ago) link
xps I also prefer ATTWT to Duke, though "Duchess" is my favorite song on either album. I just love ATTWT's lush, glowing polysynth-saturated production and strong melodies throughout. "Deep In the Motherlode" in particular knocks me out every time. Abacab is the absolute peak of the Collins era though
― J. Sam, Monday, 11 January 2021 17:41 (three years ago) link
i can show youiii can show yousome of the meters in my life
― mellon collie and the infinite bradness (BradNelson), Monday, 11 January 2021 17:42 (three years ago) link
The coolest thing about "Turn It On Again" is that they make the tricky meter pretty inconspicuous. That's harder to do than it seems. The fact that the 13/8 signature can be broke down into more manageable (to the ear) pieces probably helps. The National is actually really good at this, like this song:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPIB3ojwqdg
I think it could be broken down as either alternating measures of 9/8 and 4/4 or one long count of 17.
― Josh in Chicago, Monday, 11 January 2021 18:17 (three years ago) link
I've never grokked Trick Of The Tail and I find a lot of Wind & Wuthering quite bleak and dreary - though I've grown to love the most bleak and dreary track, Blood On The Rooftops, since my Genesis-obsessed pre-tween years, and I've always loved Unquiet...In That Quiet Earth, and Afterglow is their best pre-stadium success ballad, IMO. I've always felt ATTWT to be a bit... wet. Like, for me Trick and Wuthering mark a kind of interregnum period - Peter's gone, and Phil's yet to become what he will become - and ATTWT is the interregnum of the interregnum: now Steve's gone, and they're sort of relieved, you sense, but they feel they still need some of that gloopy over-aware poeticism in there.
But then you get Duke, and then Abacab, and it's like, the 80s are here, and Genesis are changing for the new decade - it's bolder, simpler, more pop, more sprightly, punchier and tighter. And I'm not crazy about the album that follows - some great stuff on Genesis, but loads that seems like bum notes, too - but then Invisible Touch seems the apotheosis of everything Duke and Abacab were leading towards, and then, inevitably, this brief balance of pop and prog that makes them a commercial behemoth cannot hold, they split, Phil's own solo career begins a slow decline, and so on. And Invisible Touch is possibly my favourite of the Phil era, but Duke and Abacab are close seconds, because they seem to be very much what they want to be, and have a vision of what they want to be.
― SDFG SDFG SDFG SDFG SDFG SDFG SF (stevie), Monday, 11 January 2021 22:56 (three years ago) link
I think my alignment is Abcacab > Duke > Genesis > ...And Then... > Lamb > some other stuff > Invisible Touch > still more stuff
― fade into bolivian (Ye Mad Puffin), Monday, 11 January 2021 23:43 (three years ago) link
Does anyone have an opinion on the 2007 remix of this record? Never having heard the original, is it different enough that I should avoid the remix?
― Halfway there but for you, Monday, 11 January 2021 23:58 (three years ago) link
I'm actually doing a lockdown cover of TIOA with my old school band buddies at the moment and I wanted to check out how the 'I....I...I...get so lonely" section was written out.
The sheet I’m using as a guide has it down as two bars of 3/4 one 2/4 two 4/4 then three of 3/4 one 4/4 and another three of 3/4 as it comes out of it and there's syncopated quaver tied over each bar line.
― Maresn3st, Tuesday, 12 January 2021 00:06 (three years ago) link
Hard to comment on the actual remixes because the digital mastering is brutal, they sound pretty horrible and unlike the originals IMO.
― PaulTMA, Tuesday, 12 January 2021 01:05 (three years ago) link
― fade into bolivian (Ye Mad Puffin), Monday, January 11, 2021 5:43 PM (two days ago) bookmarkflaglink
not having Foxtrot up in the top 3/4 is wild imo
― Blues Guitar Solo Heatmap (Free Download) (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Wednesday, 13 January 2021 20:51 (three years ago) link
I still think SEBTP is their best full album, there are just so many great passages in it
― frogbs, Wednesday, 13 January 2021 20:55 (three years ago) link
Anyone who ranks an album with "Just a Job to Do" over an album with "Firth of Fifth" has very different aesthetic sense than me.
― Halfway there but for you, Wednesday, 13 January 2021 20:55 (three years ago) link
seconded.
― Ray Cooney as "Crotch" (stevie), Wednesday, 13 January 2021 21:06 (three years ago) link
What is impressive is not just that the passages are great, but so many of them could seem random or disjunctive, but end up contributing to the whole. Take, for example, the long series of solos in the latter part of Dancing With the Moonlit Knight, or the ambient coda on that same song, or the Vicar sequence in Epping Forest, or the whole construction of After the Ordeal.
― Halfway there but for you, Wednesday, 13 January 2021 21:14 (three years ago) link
Thirded. It actually more or less permanently lives in my car's CD player for those times I can't find anything on the radio.
― Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 13 January 2021 22:01 (three years ago) link
noticed they just did a colored repress of this. great record but what shop doesn't have a half-dozen used copies of this already? why not make it a 2xLP rather than cram 55 minutes on a single? certainly the sound quality ain't as good as the CD - Collins sounds like he's behind the instruments
― frogbs, Friday, 12 February 2021 22:10 (three years ago) link
I think the people buying the $25 white vinyl 180g version at Urban Outfitters and the people flipping through the dollar bins are 2 distinct market segments.(also I hate the 2xLP's where there are 13 minutes of music on each side, so i'm happy to sacrifice a little sound quality to not have to flip the record every 3 songs)
― enochroot, Saturday, 13 February 2021 02:08 (three years ago) link
Loved the long-form review in Pitchfork today (was worried it was just going to be the history of the band without actually discussing the album, but he gets there, eventually).But then at the end, it says:
They had made better albums (nearly everything from the ’70s)
― enochroot, Monday, 1 March 2021 03:34 (three years ago) link
sure why not
― So who you gonna call? The martini police (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Monday, 1 March 2021 03:53 (three years ago) link
That review was like the equivalent of an epic side-long suite. Very on point.
― Josh in Chicago, Monday, 1 March 2021 03:57 (three years ago) link