DRAMA by Yes: Lost Classic or Justified Dud?

Holy fuck, how do you win songs your husband had a hand in? That's scary.

This is what Rick said to me about the situation in 2011:

I find it weird that Jon’s place in Yes has been taken by the former lead singer with a tribute band. There have been some strange episodes, but this is up there with the strangest of them.

When Jon was very ill, five or six years ago, the right plan would have been to wait until Jon was fit again, in two or three years’ time. But for reasons known only to themselves, three of the guys said: no, we’re going to go out. Personally, I think you can’t have Led Zeppelin without Robert Plant, and you can’t have The Who without Roger Daltrey, so how the hell can you have Yes without Jon Anderson? But they decided that they could.

I don’t have anything to do with it. As far as the classic line-up is concerned, that will never see the light of day again. Yes was always a special band, and now it has turned into a gigging band. It’s trotting around, playing as many shows as humanly possible, and it’s just a great shame.

Is there a sense in which you still feel like a member of the band, even if you’re not officially part of it?

It’s like saying: does Bobby Charlton still feel part of Manchester United, even though he doesn’t play? Of course you are. But as regards what’s been going on for the past five years, this doesn’t have anything to do with me at all. I’ve changed clubs, as they say.

I feel like Yes have been beefing throughout their entire existence. I remember Bruford saying that the sessions for Close to the Edge were just hell. But things definitely go to another level when the creativity dries up and the money stops rolling in. After Trevor Rabin got in the band essentially became "Yes, Inc.", making decisions like booting Eddie Jobson in favor of Tony Kaye so they could reclaim the Yes name (as they'd have 3 original members). I remember reading a fun essay from the producer of Union detailing just how uninteresting these guys were in making new music - the whole thing was basically pieces of a Howe solo album + the producer's own shitty tunes, and they had 9 guys on hand!! Love this band but nearly everyone in it seems like an insufferable dick. Howe preventing Peter Banks from playing one fuckin' song during the Union tour is such a shitty thing to do. Downes going after fans who rightfully called out Heaven & Earth for being total garbage is also shitty. Jon A. seems like a nice person in general but he's definitely a diva. Wakeman is a good dude I guess.

Man Chaki I don't know if Geoff Downes is the best fit for Yes, but he is an awesome keyboard player! I'm an Asia fan, anyway. But I have this double LP he recorded for Geffen of all things in the late '80s and it has some serious side long synth jams.

"Believe Again" from Heaven and Earth came up on a mix for me yesterday and sounded great even if it's not chops-oriented and progressive.

i mean in a yes live setting playing Rick's parts. sorry should have been clearer!

Geoff is a good keys guy but, yeah, he's no RW.

Listened to Downes' "The Light Program" today. It has its moments but mainly meanders.

I'm glad I caught the classic line up in '03. One of the best concerts I've been to.

This is pretty excellent. Love the extended end to "Hour Of Need". True YES.

Only tune where I prefer the previous versions is "Sad Night..."

What are people listening to? Downloads because they bought the CD?

It's on the t0rr3nt sites

is this it?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4iDzO2ZJfo

"Believe Again" from Heaven and Earth came up on a mix for me yesterday and sounded great even if it's not chops-oriented and progressive.

honestly I think a number of the songs on H&E are decent - I don't really mind how lightweight they are, Yes has always been like that

what gets me is how lethargic and strung out everything is. "Believe Again" is quite pretty but eight minutes is pushing it real hard. the tempos sound like they're 25% too slow. the members of the band sound like they're all 200 years old.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qBp1OP7j82E

Yes has always been lightweight?

I mean, they’ve always had that aspect to them. Obviously Yes at their best are heavy as balls.

To Be Over, bitches

Thanks for the youtube link. Liked this return trip a lot. "Bumpy Ride" still doesn't fit - if anything has gotten clumsier here - and "Fly From Here (Reprise)" failed to move me in this version. Otherwise, a successful re-boot. Well done, Mr Horn.

And...the link is gone.

Also, this post didn't date so well:

chris squire and keith richards will outlive us all

I'm listening to it now. This does sound really great, though to be fair I haven't listened to the original in about a year so I'm not sure how exactly this one is different. The best thing I can say is that you often forget you're listening to a later-day Yes album, it really does feel like it could've been released in 1981.

I have been listening to the 2011 release of Fly From Here a ton this week since I don’t have the new one and it isn’t on Spotify. And I have to say: it really rules. I don’t get the folks who are down on “Bumpy Ride” at all – it’s a nice little instrumental bit that sounds like it dates from the early 70s and at 2 min. pretty brief.

Also, read or saw somewhere that Trevor had laid down guide vocals in 2011 and instructed Benoit to follow them *exactly* – which makes me wonder how much Horn’s vocals from the new version are actually new or just cleaned up things he recorded back then.

I ASKED MY LOVE TO GIVE ME SHE-HE-HE-HELTER!!!

love this album. been on a big Yes kick this week - and weirdly found out my friends steve's dad co-engineered FRAGILE omg

my favorite yes album

xpost - woah what is his name?

I'm glad that over the past 25 or 30 years the reputation of this album has been elevated. I don't think anyone considers this a dud anymore.

I think of this as the last album of the original prog-rock movement, before any revivals, reunions or neo-prog pastiches (I'd also entertain votes for Moving Pictures, which came out the next year). The sound of the album is already on its way to AOR, and (unsurprisingly, considering the lineup) contains a fair amount of new wave, but something about the energy and boldness of this record makes me feel like it was the last shot of the original "progressive" aesthetic that originated in the late 60s.
Discipline, Peter Gabriel III, and what I've heard of Abacab and the 80s Tull records feel like part of another genre rather than a natural development of progressive rock (although I guess real hardliners would say the last progressive Yes album was Relayer).

I'd argue it's Going for the One!

Yeah, GftO, which is also the last Yes album I listen to. Moving Pictures definitely seems like a different aesthetic than Aqualung or Pawn Hearts to me, no less than Discipline.

You don't have to like Tormato very much to argue that, generically, it still ticks the boxes as a prog-rock record (maybe except for "Circus of Heaven" and "Onward").
I haven't heard the first Asia album but I really doubt it contains as much guitar heroism as Drama does.

like I wouldn't argue Drama is the last of the original prog wave, but "Tempus Fugit" maybe the last prog *tune*...the rest sounds too New Wave hybrid to me, not too unlike a bunch of similar acts...Numan, Devo, Oingo Boingo, The Buggles of course

the thing about a lot of those 77/78 releases - Tormato, And Then There Were Three, Missing Piece, Quiet Zone/Pleasure Dome, Works & Love Beach, even Attahk (if that counts?) is that these bands all seem to be trying to transition away from prog, by simplifying things or writing shorter/hookier tunes. none of it pushes any boundaries. I guess you could argue that Trick of the Tail and GftO didn't push any boundaries either but they still felt like a full embrace of the prog sound - these albums "tick the boxes" because they didn't know what else to do

Full disclosure: I've never listened to Tormato.xps

UK were maybe the first newer band to transition from 70s prog to the looming 80s version - various Yes/King Crimson/Roxy Music alumni (plus Holdsworth) moving into late 70s pop-muso territory. Seems like a template for the Drama sound, although I'm not sure if they were a direct influence on Yes in that period.

Tormato's really bad

I'll stan for Tormato again, I love it. Very fun.

It's kinda cool how the tail end of prog and new wave dovetailed so nicely, and the early 80's second wave of acts had a healthy dose of new wave threaded through them.

Gentle Giant's 'Civilian' was one of the more successful prog-into-new wave efforts, not that it did them any good whatsoever. We can only be thankful ELP didn't attempt anything similar.

They went sexytimes, instead.

It's kinda cool how the tail end of prog and new wave dovetailed so nicely, and the early 80's second wave of acts had a healthy dose of new wave threaded through them.

Yeah, I sometimes want to wonder why Howe didn't just make e.g. instrumental folk or jazz fusion records instead of ... this stuff and Asia in the 80s but then I remember that they were actually mainstream pop stars when they were making the classic prog albums; makes sense that once you're in that orbit, you want to stay in it.

I guess I feel that, despite Horn and Downes, the new wave quotient on Drama is actually lower than on some of the other transitional records of the same era. I'd say hard-rock verging on metal is the dominant sound on well over half of it.
UK's first album is a very interesting example because, sonically, they are going in a stripped-down, radio-ready direction, but Eddie Jobson's compositional style is very oblique and far from catchy (explaining why the record didn't really take off). I would call them the last "new" prog band of the first era.

tormato is grebt bcz it inspired this post: The 120 Days of Shameless Bids for Publicity!

I only listened to Bill Nelson's 'Quit Dreaming...' for the first time the other day and it's fantastic, I know people talk a lot about 'Red Noise', but this was, to me, much more enjoyable and super new wave.

I've probably said it somewhere upthread but there's 2 tracks that really damage Drama for me, I really like the album but they're just filler. I honestly like Tormato a bit more, especially with the CD bonus tracks, there's some songs that ended up on Anderson's 2nd solo album that work amazingly well with just his vocals.

And YES to what Autumn says about Wakeman creating a great vehicle pileup in space!

The only Yes album I own or want to own, and absolutely a classic.

Yeah, I sometimes want to wonder why Howe didn't just make e.g. instrumental folk or jazz fusion records instead of ... this stuff and Asia in the 80s but then I remember that they were actually mainstream pop stars when they were making the classic prog albums; makes sense that once you're in that orbit, you want to stay in it.

its kind of hard to name artists who achieved that level of success who just fucked off and did what they wanted rather than chase sales. its pretty funny in the case of these prog bands who just suddenly became very uncool, massive respect to Genesis (and Trevor Rabin) for actually doing it. I also thought Gentle Giant's Civilian was quite good, but lets face it nothing was ever happening to this band, at best they get like 25% of the sales of Utopia

won't really defend Tormato much but I will say "Arriving UFO" is one of the most bonkers things they ever did

"Arriving UFO" was Jon Anderson making sure that Klaatu and Jefferson Airplane didn't get all the credit when the aliens landed.

every time I listen to this album it hits me how great it would've been had Yes just called it a day after this. they could've still done the 90125 stuff under Cinema or whatever the original name was supposed to be but to leave "Tempus Fugit" as the last song in their catalogue would have been perfect.

Atlantic Records wasn't going to let such a valuable trademark go unused.

they have several spots in their history when it would have been wise to stop: here; after 90125; after Big Generator; after Magnification; after Fly from Here. The only thing you can count on is that they will not stop and will continue to put out albums that half their fanbase detests

I still love this record.