The Boo Radleys, Classic or Dud?

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this is the sound that defined, to my mind, the term indie in the 90's. this is the best and worst that can be said of giant steps. martin carr aspired towards brian wilson but ended up sounding like the wedding present with one extra effects pedal. a bit tragic as far as sonic advancement is concerned, but i admire the ambition,; however unrealised.

― edger stewert (edger), Tuesday, 29 August 2006 23:21 (nineteen years ago)

that's silly.

― keyth (keyth), Wednesday, 30 August 2006 00:53 (nineteen years ago)

i agree.

― edger stewert (edger), Wednesday, 30 August 2006 01:05 (nineteen years ago)

I also disabree.

Hey, I like that mistype!

Anyway, as I said on the "celebration" web page, I packed it after Giant Steps as it did everything I wanted to do musically. I note it did not inspire many bands to be as musically adventurous. How could you 'copy' being individual? Who could follow it?

― mark grout (mark grout), Wednesday, 30 August 2006 07:45 (nineteen years ago)

the Butterfly McQueen-Rodney King section is joyous beyond compare

OTMFM. Just this little section was enough to affect me enough as a teen to change the way I appreciate music for ever. You have no idea how much I love Giant Steps. As for "I've Lost The Reason", I always saw it as part of a triumverate of songs along with "Best Lose The Fear" and "Take The Time Around". For some reason these sound like they were written to sit next to each other.

It took me a long time to realise how sad and depressed the lyrics were to "Wake Up!" and I'm only just getting round to this fact with "Giant Steps". I guess GS is a concept album in nostalgia, uncertainty, being 23 - that stage between being a young adult and an adult when people won't take you seriously despite all your greatest ambitions. "Wake Up!" is a concept album about being 25 and being granted your independence and having the world as your oyster, but still feeling somehow unsatisfied with this pseudo-utopian setting, revealing itself to actually be a bigger burden than you had expected. And of course it's all set to the most wonderful offbeat psychedelic pop music.

― wogan lenin (dog latin), Wednesday, 30 August 2006 08:00 (nineteen years ago)

Haberdager - Everything's Alright Forever, despite being a fine album is very different to Giant Steps. Don't get me wrong, it's a great little shoegaze gem, but it only goes to show just how great Carr's tunesmithery and ambition had come along between the two albums. Great leaps and bounds indeed.

― wogan lenin (dog latin), Wednesday, 30 August 2006 08:03 (nineteen years ago)

Hargh! I'm so pleased people on ILX are discovering and enjoying this album even today. I was worried it would have aged or be slated for being naive or pretentious (as often it is) but I am really glad you guys liked it. I'm listening to it now just to celebrate. Really, I don't think anyone's done anything with the kind of pop ambition and scope since Giant Steps. Not the Beta Band nor Beck nor Animal Collective, they've all come close but never so beautifully blended, referenced and genre-hopped so effortlessly and at the same time written such heartfelt words as here and on Wake Up!.

― wogan lenin (dog latin), Wednesday, 30 August 2006 08:09 (nineteen years ago)

It's such a wonder I never tried to get any of my IRL friends into Giant Steps. I guess it's because I know their instant reaction would be "Wake Up Boo! Oh noes!" which if I didn't know better would be my reaction too. I think next time I have them over, I'm going to put this on and turn it up loud!!

― wogan lenin (dog latin), Wednesday, 30 August 2006 08:17 (nineteen years ago)

re: 'I've Lost The Reason'

Woops, my mistake, I thought you were talking about "If You Want It, Take It". No this song is a goodie and it kinda points towards how they'd sound on "Wake Up".

― wogan lenin (dog latin), Wednesday, 30 August 2006 08:46 (nineteen years ago)

"Baby's gone but there'll be more I'm only 23"

― mark grout (mark grout), Wednesday, 30 August 2006 08:58 (nineteen years ago)

"25, don't recall a time I felt this alive"

Heartbreaking reallly.

I should one day learn to shut my gob about the Boo Radleys.

― wogan lenin (dog latin), Wednesday, 30 August 2006 09:05 (nineteen years ago)

much closer to dud than classic for me, i agree with edger stewert in sentiment if not exactly in statement.

― bad hair day house (fandango), Wednesday, 30 August 2006 09:16 (nineteen years ago)

Up thread (more than 5 years ago scarily) I said C'mon Kids was their best record and that the Brave Captain stuff was all great. I'll retract both those now.

Realised a few years ago that I was so wrong and Giant Steps was their crowning acheivement and I'll echo everything dog latin has said, brilliant record. It was Martin's lyrics that pushed them over into greatness for me though right enough. Also the whole thing of them dreaming of being pop stars and being on TOTP as kids, actually acheiving it then realising it was crap whilst writing about this in the songs. Brilliant.

I've lost track of Brave Captain though I did like the first few releases. Saw him live at King Tuts and got to talk to him a bit on his first solo tour and he was a thoroughly nice chap and happy to give credit where it was due to the other guys in the band, didn't seem to be any animosity. He also played an absolutely blinding gig. Mind you, also saw him a year or two later with a different (inept) band and he was shit and since then I don't think I've listened to any BC stuff at all.

― mms (mms), Wednesday, 30 August 2006 10:31 (nineteen years ago)

classic b-sides..."Foster's Van", "Touchdown Jesus"...still think "Everything's Alright Forever" was the watermark, though...

― hank (hank s), Wednesday, 30 August 2006 11:38 (nineteen years ago)

Dud (Hab 'C' dEva)

― dud Hab 'C' dEva (Dada), Wednesday, 30 August 2006 11:42 (nineteen years ago)

I totally forgot about Foster's Van. What a track!

― wogan lenin (dog latin), Wednesday, 30 August 2006 12:38 (nineteen years ago)

five months pass...

friday 23 february
1800-1900 est / 2300-0000 gmt
as part of wzbc's test pattern series
dj ning nong presents a one hour special on the boo radleys
listen locally on 90.3fm in boston, ma, usa
listen to live streams on www.wzbc.org

― the next grozart, Friday, 23 February 2007 14:52 (nineteen years ago)

Good old DJ Ning Nong!

― PJ Miller, Friday, 23 February 2007 15:09 (nineteen years ago)

"Wake Up, Boo" has kind of been done to death on oldies radio but it brings back good memories of the spring of '95, walking through Chiswick with Laura and thinking with a smile: yes, this is our time, despite the portent of mortality in the song ("for what could be the very last time"). Great B-side too ("Blues For George Michael").

The Wake Up! album wasn't quite as good as Giant Steps - a little too much moaning about Martin being stuck in Preston, perhaps, but even that struck a little chord with me, if just by making me grateful that my regular long-distance commute was only to Oxford, close enough for us to enjoy the best of both worlds.

I would agree that Giant Steps is their masterpiece and one of the best records Creation ever put out; although a big hit, I still think it's underrated in the wider scheme of things.

I tried and tried with C'mon Kids but could only really admire it rather than love it.

― Marcello Carlin, Friday, 23 February 2007 15:19 (nineteen years ago)

Blues For George Michael is their best and most deliciously ambitious song, hands down. Wake Up! is a concept album, in a way, about the loneliness and disappointment of being in your mid-20s I guess. It's been said before, but it's ironic that to passers-by the Boos were a happy-clappy sunshine pop band but even their biggest hit is deceptively sad.

― the next grozart, Friday, 23 February 2007 15:52 (nineteen years ago)

Giant Steps is an all time classic. Everyone should own this album.

The other albums all contain wonderful songs. It's the sheer ambition of the Boos that takes new listeners by supprise, especially those who have only heard a few of the singles. To lump this band in with other early/mid 90's underachievers is to do them a great dis-service.

A long time friend who claimed to despise the band after seeing them on the front cover of NME and mistaking them for Right said Fred but who loves MBV, the Beta band and Arthur Russell was converted in a sly manner by myself during an enhanced listening session.

I made sure he was coming up nicely then played him "Upon 9th and fairchild". "Spaniard" and "Run my way runway" in that order without telling him who they were by. By the third track he was convinced this was, like, the greatest music EVER.

When the time came to make him a compilation to ram home the point I struggled to restrict it to a double CD.

All music lovers must love this band.

― Luke Reinhard, Friday, 23 February 2007 21:03 (nineteen years ago)

Search: "Wake Up!" and most of the "King Size" album. Destroy: The rest other than the occasional great pop moment.

― Geir Hongro, Friday, 23 February 2007 21:20 (nineteen years ago)

Btw. the 1996 Eggman album was great.

― Geir Hongro, Friday, 23 February 2007 21:23 (nineteen years ago)

I've always liked Kingsize. I know most people don't.

― leavethecapital, Friday, 23 February 2007 21:42 (nineteen years ago)

not sure how salient this point is, but the Boos' demise was accompanied by an almost audible passing of the torch to SFA. 'giant steps' is to my ears a shoegazey prototype for 'Radiator' et al.

― unfished business, Friday, 23 February 2007 22:11 (nineteen years ago)

I found (well, my daughter found) a 1994 Select cassette under our bed the other morning - it had a St Etienne remix of Lazarus on it which I'm not sure surfaced anywhere else. They turned it into a slow Italo-house groove. Underwhelming!

I was very fond of the Boos; they evoke a different sort of Merseyside nostalgia in me to, say, the Bunnymen - with Mac and co it's a sort of life-I-never-had other-side-of-the-river boho coolkid imaginary thing. The Boos came very much from my patch (references to Belvidere Road, for goodness' sake!) and my time, even though our experiences were very different (I remember Martin telling me how much he hated an old physics teacher of ours - he went to this teacher's house on some odd job while he was doing casual labour stuff after leaving school and got the whole "I knew you'd never amount to anything" vibe off him - whereas I just thought "not a bad guy - got me through my A level!"). I wish I'd kept in touch with them, though I'm sure they're not arsed.

I think "Whiplashed" might be their peak.

― Michael Jones, Saturday, 24 February 2007 13:56 (nineteen years ago)

three weeks pass...

now i have 'c'mon kids', all i can say as yet is OMG TITLE TRACK

― unfished business, Monday, 19 March 2007 21:55 (nineteen years ago)

You like that one? It's alright I guess... I liked the description above about it being a "fuck you" to Britpop.

― the next grozart, Monday, 19 March 2007 22:50 (nineteen years ago)

i went to see them loads at planet x in liverpool when the only other person was asleep in a pool of piss, this was not uncommon

1st3 lp's class, bit hit and miss after that

― spotter, Monday, 19 March 2007 23:24 (nineteen years ago)

> I found (well, my daughter found) a 1994 Select cassette under our bed the other morning - it had a St Etienne remix of Lazarus on it which I'm not sure surfaced anywhere else.

was on the double cd single lazarus re-issue thing. i remember them voicing disappointment with the augustus pablo remix.

still don't have that last lp.

― koogs, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 11:15 (nineteen years ago)

The St. Etienne, Stereolab and High Llamas mixes of Boos songs are all great.

― the next grozart, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 11:17 (nineteen years ago)

Yep.

― Mark G, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 11:19 (nineteen years ago)

still don't have that last lp.

you should correct that, a lot of hard-core fans are split between Giant Steps and Kingsize where i feel the last album was by far the best thing they have ever done.

― Bee OK, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 14:57 (nineteen years ago)

Kingsize has some nice moments but is totally and utterly the sound of a band at the end of their useful life. No offence but if you think it's as good as Giant Steps you're deranged.

― Scik Mouthy, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 15:14 (nineteen years ago)

no i'm not deranged! listen then listen again and again, it doesn't reveal itself until you are able to fully absorb it than it hits you over the head like a ton of bricks.

― Bee OK, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 15:19 (nineteen years ago)

http://www.ilxor.com:8080/ILX/ThreadSelectedControllerServlet?boardid=41&threadid=42297

I completely agree with Bee that Kingsize only reveals itself to be their best album after a fair few plays. I can understand if people give up before that stage, but it really is worth it. I was co-running the Boo fanclub at the time (had been since around the re-release of Lazarus), and I remember that for the first time, I wasn?t very taken with the early versions of the songs I was playing. The band didn?t seem too happy either, although I think they were just getting tired of a lot of things rather than being unhappy with the music. Up until that point, everything had seemed effortless for them ? they would breeze into a studio and knock things out at a fantastic rate. It all just *happened*. But Kingsize seemed like more of a slog.

When I check back, the finished album tracks were almost the same as the ones I was having a hard time with ? simple things like good sequencing brought the album to life a bit. Free Huey and Kingsize were grafted on as late additions (ironically the worst and best tracks). The early demo of Kingsize was drone-pop, and sounded like early Spiritualized, who Martin used to adore.

It was heartbreaking that they split on the back of such a great album. But if no-one is buying your records, what can you do?

Ian Edmond (ianedmond) on Tuesday, June 7, 2005 7:13 AM (1 year ago)

― Bee OK, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 15:23 (nineteen years ago)

I've heard it dozens of times! I listened to it loads and loads and loads when it first came out about 8 or 9 years ago. Its appeal has not lasted. It's good, but C'Mon kids is better, never mind Giant Steps.

― Scik Mouthy, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 15:24 (nineteen years ago)

[Removed Illegal Link]

― Bee OK, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 15:25 (nineteen years ago)

If that's who I think it is then I know Ian and his wife.

― Scik Mouthy, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 15:25 (nineteen years ago)

There isn't a Boos release that I don't *like* but I have to agree with Sick Mouthy on this one, sorry Bee. Kingsize isn't so much a slog to listen to, but the band do really sound like they're trudging through a lot of difficulty. The lyrics are goofy in some ways, but whereas previously they'd come off as charming, they now sound a bit embarassing. A lot of the musical ideas (the drill'n'bass bit at the beginning) just reeks of tokenism which is Brave Captain's downfall too. I dunno... Wake Up, Giant Steps had this really intelligent and insightful songwriting vibe whereas on Kingsize (and perhaps a little on C'Mon Kids) there's this forced, awkward vibe going on as if they're too worried to just let it flow and have a good time making music.

At the same time, with Wake Up (and GS) the emotions ran so much deeper to me. Wake Up was just this incredible concept album about mid-20s disillusionment wrapped up in a psych-pop parcel, whereas the Kingsize songs feel like they're rubbing up against each other and jostling all over the place. Rubbish artwork too.

I still quite like it though, despite myself.

― the next grozart, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 15:52 (nineteen years ago)

I probably only listened to Kingsize a few times before selling it on, thought it was terrible. Oh well. But then I haven't wanted to listen to Wake Up or C'mon Kids for years either.

― Colonel Poo, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 15:56 (nineteen years ago)

I'd forgotten Kingsize even existed! That's how firmly it stuck in my memory...

― Marcello Carlin, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 15:57 (nineteen years ago)

Is it "Monuments For A Dead Century" that has the absolutely mental squelch breakdown at the end where the sound coalesces and spins and pivots upwards through the centre, the guitars disolved into electronics? Cos that bit kind of encapsulates the album for me - the song itself is, from a distance, typical Boo Radleys "room with many doors" type thing, twists, turns, and the ending is bonkers and silly and really sensually stimulating, BUT... the song itself is also really, REALLY tired-sounding and a little pointlessly "say something about the nation, Martin", to the extent of seeming lyrically trite, and the end bit though fun is also kind of stupid and unnecessary, like they found a mad synth setting or (I know it's before the days of) plug-in and used it for the sake of it.

― Scik Mouthy, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 16:04 (nineteen years ago)

Yeah, I really hated that song at first for the reasons you say. It seemed like a cop out singing about the milennium (and that bit where they spell it out, it sucks). I grew to it because of the quality of the music, but yeah. Another example is the scratching at the beginning of Heaven's At The Bottom Of This Glass - also stupid and unnecessary. Why don't I feel this way about the backwards singing on Find the Answer Within, or the weird noises at the beginning of Bullfrog Green, or the laughing/crying woman in One Is For? It's not like the Boos were actually doing anything different from being the Boos, but on here it seemed a bit pointless.

Jimmy Webb Is God would have been incredible had it not been for the yicky lyrics.

― the next grozart, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 16:11 (nineteen years ago)

It was the interview where Martin related depression at the thought of going out and promoting "Comb your Hair" as the third single that did it for him, where I thought "I can see your point yeah"

― Mark G, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 16:16 (nineteen years ago)

Did Martin mention his age on every album he did after Giant Steps?

GS: "Baby's gone but there'll be more, I'm only 23"
WU: "25, don't recall a time I felt this alive"
CK: ???
KS: "28 but I feel much younger, to this I'll attest, I'm a beautiful mess"

― the next grozart, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 16:17 (nineteen years ago)

And yet Sice sang them lines. Ah but they were classmates though.

― Mark G, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 16:18 (nineteen years ago)

It's on CK too, definitely. I forget which song, but he was 27 in it!

― Scik Mouthy, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 16:18 (nineteen years ago)

Giant Steps (July 1993) 23
Wake Up! (March 1995) 25
C'mon Kids (September 1996) 26?
Kingsize (October 1998) 29!

― Mark G, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 16:21 (nineteen years ago)

COMB YOUR HAIR? That's just Something Changed by Pulp covered practically note for note. What a bad idea for a single.

There's something terribly camp about Kingsize isn't there? There's all these mentions of finding God and leaning on your brother and being all palsy walsy with your best fwiends and crying because of a train leaving and putting on make up and stuff. It wasn't as if Carr hadn't addressed things like friendship and religion plenty of times before, but the twee factor is hitting the roof on that album. I can almost see Sice in some kind of ballerina costume with glitter on his eyes on some of the songs.

― the next grozart, Tuesday, 20 March 2007 16:21 (nineteen years ago)

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