Are you guys at Seattle Weekly really that bad?

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Thanks, donut! Yeah, the Woodring thing is sad, but I've heard that there was a lot of internal angst about the comic section reduction at the Stranger. I think the way they handled it with the large guest section was a nice way to spread what little wealth was left.

Actually, Michael, the Hilton Kramer hiring makes perfect sense, given that the NY Post is now the newspaper of choice for the "Ann Coulter pinups on my wall" set.

Joshua Houk (chascarrillo), Thursday, 28 August 2003 17:59 (twenty years ago) link

th-th-there's a Jim Woodring WEEKLY DRAWING??

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 28 August 2003 18:09 (twenty years ago) link

What's even weirder about the Stranger/Woodring pairing is that I vaguely remember reading a Woodring article in the former paper that essentially concluded with (paraphrasing) "Jim, why don't you just draw your mother's vagina and get it over with, already? jeez"

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 28 August 2003 18:14 (twenty years ago) link

my town has a ridiculous FOUR alt-weeklies! the rivalry between them all has gotten pretty nasty in the past, which is whatever, but I think that sort of thing spilling over into print is so completely inappropriate and weak

s1utsky (slutsky), Thursday, 28 August 2003 18:41 (twenty years ago) link

it's really par for the fucking course at the stranger. sadly the alt-chumps in seattle (and especially olympia) probably see it as the stranger being engagingly gonzo in ye olde meltzer tradition.

strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 28 August 2003 18:45 (twenty years ago) link

that's the worst, when people are nasty and cheap under the guise of being brave and revolutionary

s1utsky (slutsky), Thursday, 28 August 2003 18:50 (twenty years ago) link

which is the classic way assholes in any given "underground" community justify their selfishness

s1utsky (slutsky), Thursday, 28 August 2003 18:51 (twenty years ago) link

Well, there's ILM rumbled.

Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 28 August 2003 18:57 (twenty years ago) link

Ha! Cheap calls cheap calls cheap ... I've started an infinity string ...

Chris O'Connor (Chris O'Connor), Thursday, 28 August 2003 19:06 (twenty years ago) link

Cheapness Will Eat Itself

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 28 August 2003 19:13 (twenty years ago) link

i still don't see how this paints an "unpretty" (to get all tlc for a moment and stick with the quotes above) picture of the weekly. a. stranger has lock on interview with ignorable indie rock band "forcing" matos to quote something already published that he himself wrote (last time i checked not a felony in king county), b. writer at stranger takes cheap potshots at matos' physical appearance, demeanour, and phone manner, c. matos shrugs off talking to someone from a paper with an obvious anti-weekly (and anti-matos!) agenda, d. matos fires aging, worthless rock critic who hadn't added anything to the medium in nearly two decades and who was allowed to piddle out 250 words a week in pity, e. writer takes pot-shots at seattle weekly events so obviously within matos' control because the stranger has the thousands of shitty indie punk bands in this city under its total control now that no one else will bother covering these walking corpses.

strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 28 August 2003 19:19 (twenty years ago) link

that shot at the music fest was particularly lame and desperate-seeming, it sounded like something the sales staff might come up with

s1utsky (slutsky), Thursday, 28 August 2003 19:21 (twenty years ago) link

it's so strange to see this, cuz before I started at the daily, I was at the biweekly here for four years, and even though I hate them because they owe me, I'm still quite fond of them and often tell publicists they should give so and so at such and such a call too.
But then again, when you're the king of your town, like I undisputably am, it's okay to be generous. That way, when you crush them, it's sooo much sweeter.

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Thursday, 28 August 2003 19:31 (twenty years ago) link

basically, all I learned from the article is that the writer loves her job and doesn't doesn't doesn't want to get fired.

Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Thursday, 28 August 2003 19:32 (twenty years ago) link

haha horace otm

strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 28 August 2003 19:33 (twenty years ago) link

Yeah, this woman does seem a little full of herself.

Chris O'Connor (Chris O'Connor), Thursday, 28 August 2003 19:40 (twenty years ago) link

a. stranger has lock on interview with ignorable indie rock band "forcing" matos to quote something already published that he himself wrote (last time i checked not a felony in king county)

But Jess, there’s loads more journalistic integrity in palling around with bands so they’ll play your sponsored events and give you quotes than in approaching them with any sort of critical ear. (And you guys are lucky out there in King – in Cook Country just using a stringer carries a minimum of two years!)

scott pl. (scott pl.), Thursday, 28 August 2003 19:43 (twenty years ago) link

Jess, I'll grant you that the stuff on the SW festival is dumb and petty and that I'd hang up on her too is she was giving me crap, but that is kinda bad inserting your own old ass quote into someone else's piece without at first attributing it; don't matter if the editor was the author of the quote, that's just dumb ethics. And to so bluntly run off two very good writers in Meltzer and Reighley, even if Meltzer hasn't been edgy in decades, isn't a great reputation builder. So seems unpretty to me.

That said, yeah, I also adhere to the "consider the source" line. Her attempts at identifying the Stranger with the hip music is pretty damn laughable. No winners in this whole thing; the discussion it all inspires is what prompted the thread.

Chris O'Connor (Chris O'Connor), Thursday, 28 August 2003 19:50 (twenty years ago) link

And to so bluntly run off two very good writers in Meltzer and Reighley

first of all, metlzer hasn't been either good OR "edgy" in decades. which seems to warrant him being shit canned pretty well to me. i don't see anyone tossing xgau or marcus, mostly because they haven't been churning out repetitive, self-parodic drivel (okay that's up for debate, even though i don't personally think so) for the miserly $$ of the free weeklies of the world for the last two decades while still claiming to hate all music.

secondly, as i remember, reighley wasn't "run off" at all. he was told "no more columns about your boyfriend or dog" (and unless he's fucking his [male] dog, i don't see how that could be homophobic) because frankly no one I know wants to hear about his boyfriend and/or dog in the context of whatever crap he was peddling that week. he balked at this and walked.

thirdly, people don't normally fire the editorial staff of a music section and bring in someone with a completely different agenda if they're happy with the way the music section is being run. INCLUDING the writers published.

fourth, like you said, consider the source. the stranger is hardly going to be giving a fair and biased account. i mean, how exactly did they track down that email to meltzer in the first place?

the basic lesson is, indulge people for too long and they'll get all sorts of inflated ideas about what the public actually gives a shit about. if you REALLY want to write about your dog (or be meltzer) then save it for the chapbooks.

strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:00 (twenty years ago) link

fifth, there's no accounting for taste. matos let go of the writers he did because he didn't feel like they were adding anything to the paper. which should be the main priority, no? metlzer should have no problem finding some other aging editor to take pity on him.

strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:02 (twenty years ago) link

th-th-there's a Jim Woodring WEEKLY DRAWING??

click

Funk, Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:04 (twenty years ago) link

sixth, the bit about the unattributed quote seems a rather flimsy nail at best to hang this little diatribe on.

strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:05 (twenty years ago) link

And if any of you knew the actual quote in question, I think everyone would have laughed this story -- and hence this thread -- off several hours ago.

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:06 (twenty years ago) link

to wit: "In the last year, everything I listen to is coming out, maybe in the bass lines. The Cure, Siouxsie and the Banshees. That's the way we write songs; we're all influenced by different things and then cramming them on top of each other."

strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:09 (twenty years ago) link

granted, a quote is a quote, and a fuckup is a fuckup, no matter how incidental or not it is.

Still though.. TS:
* making comments about one's physical appearance and implying one is a homophobe
vs.
* being outed has having one's bass playing influenced by the cure and siouxsie and the banshees

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:17 (twenty years ago) link

(change "being outed" to "outing someone who")

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:19 (twenty years ago) link

isn't it kind of insulting that it's implied that the stranger is not interested in giving attention to anything other than the "big name indie bands" in seattle?

strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:21 (twenty years ago) link

i mean, she says "best", but obviously "best" means "allowed to play stranger events" means ??

strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:23 (twenty years ago) link

chaki, i like "speakers push air"*... take a listen to the panning guitars in the 2nd verse.

*i have never heard any of their other songs.

gygax! (gygax!), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:24 (twenty years ago) link

I've never heard pretty girls either, but again they seem kind of a lame duck "trophy." this area is really boring right now, musically. i WISH i could find stuff to write about.

strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:26 (twenty years ago) link

There are PLENTY of great bands/electronic acts in Seattle that neither the Stranger nor the Seattle Weekly has recently been parading. The Cripples, Last Waltz, Akimbo, Rip To Shreds, Cid & Eric, Teen Chthulu, Cold Sweat, Randy Jones, Sientific American... I could go on and on.

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:31 (twenty years ago) link

4 jess

gygax! (gygax!), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:31 (twenty years ago) link

they sound like seaweed.

strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:37 (twenty years ago) link

Yeah, for what it's worth, I actually like that PGMG record.

jaymc (jaymc), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:37 (twenty years ago) link

thirdly, people don't normally fire the editorial staff of a music section and bring in someone with a completely different agenda if they're happy with the way the music section is being run. INCLUDING the writers published.

On this point, Matos and I are in the EXACT same boat (i.e. we both basically followed the same regime). So I understand the changes. I'm just talking about the bedside manner in doing so, that's all. Meltzer is still Meltzer, ya know?

Chris O'Connor (Chris O'Connor), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:38 (twenty years ago) link

haha rock'n'roll is all about honoring thy father and mother, right?

strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:39 (twenty years ago) link

tangent >>>>
is this the finest music mag from Seattle? ...but why are they anglophiles?
http://www.resonancemag.com/

DJ Martian (djmartian), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:43 (twenty years ago) link

if it is, then god help us all.

strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:43 (twenty years ago) link

seems a rather flimsy nail

Are you nuts? Credibility is king, and the fact Matos corrected that immediately on the Web site shows he gets it. Do you?

Chris O'Connor (Chris O'Connor), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:49 (twenty years ago) link

I like Resonance quite a bit, actually. But they're a monthly (if even that?) publication that you can pick up for free here in town. (I think you have pay for it outside Seattle, though, at your fine music retail shops).

But yeah, they're not exactly a weekly. (by definition, duh)

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:50 (twenty years ago) link

haha rock'n'roll is all about honoring thy father and mother, right?

We ain't rock n roll, dude. We're just dorks who write about it, which means we do adhere to civility if we wanna be respected.

Chris O., Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:51 (twenty years ago) link

I understand the changes. I'm just talking about the bedside manner in doing so, that's all. Meltzer is still Meltzer, ya know?

but outside of "by e-mail," the manner/circumstances of the firing aren't known. (The quoted excerpt reads like a response by Matos to a protestation by Meltzer, but that's purely guesswork.)

scott pl. (scott pl.), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:52 (twenty years ago) link

richard meltzer is hardly the master of civility!

also, keep your self-deprecation offa me.

strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 28 August 2003 20:53 (twenty years ago) link

Would you rather I just stuck to straightforward dissing? ;-)

Just kidding.

And good point on the email: That's presented as an out-of-the-blue missive, not as part of a larger argument. Something to reconsider on my part, then.

Chris O'Connor (Chris O'Connor), Thursday, 28 August 2003 21:01 (twenty years ago) link

did meltzer fuck your mother or something, strongo? feels a bit...personal

maltzos, Thursday, 28 August 2003 21:22 (twenty years ago) link

(i really hate people without the balls to post under their own name. or at least a pseudonym that's a known poster.)

what the fuck is "personal" about me defending the removal of a dinosaur farting hot air into the aether?

strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 28 August 2003 21:46 (twenty years ago) link

what the fuck is "personal" about me defending the removal of a dinosaur farting hot air into the aether?

Let's think about that one for a sec ... gun, foot, shoot ...

Chris O'Connor (Chris O'Connor), Thursday, 28 August 2003 22:00 (twenty years ago) link

well, let's see if i can't break it down for you:

- i'm not the editor of the weekly
- i'm not on staff at the weekly
- (the weekly hasn't paid me for three weeks haha)
- i don't know richard meltzer
- i don't know kurt reighley
- i write freelance for the weekly and for a number of voice media papers (that's the full disclosure law)

strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 28 August 2003 22:05 (twenty years ago) link

"A insults B" = "A has something personal against B"? I don't follow, Chris.

(For the record, I have no idea who Meltzer is or why he's important or not, and i've been reading a lot of music press for decades)

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 28 August 2003 22:07 (twenty years ago) link

(arg, xpost)

donut bitch (donut), Thursday, 28 August 2003 22:07 (twenty years ago) link


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