"Empty" has long been my favourite BUT "Go Deep" is like the ultimate poolside party at a friend's place jam, while "You" is such a sharp funk workout (and pretty on-point for 1997, though that's not really the point), it feels wrong not actually voting for either of them.
And then I could still easily vote for "My Need", "I Get Lonely", "Anything", "Together Again", "What About", "Free Xone"...
― Tim F, Wednesday, 7 January 2015 12:10 (nine years ago) link
oh wow I just searched for a Velvet Rope thread and this appeared!!
I'm giving this a listen-through for the first time in ages and damn damn DAMN this is good.
― Jennifer 8.-( (Stevie D(eux)), Wednesday, 14 January 2015 17:28 (nine years ago) link
i've listened to this a couple of times since seeing this poll and each time i'm no closer to choosing one but more in awe of this incredible album
― lex pretend, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 18:13 (nine years ago) link
Same and
"got til it's gone" is not in the running
OTM
― my booty it clean (fgti), Wednesday, 14 January 2015 18:37 (nine years ago) link
i love "got til it's gone"? i'm not voting for it but
― emo canon in twee major (BradNelson), Wednesday, 14 January 2015 18:39 (nine years ago) link
When that song was big I privately had a chip on my shoulder about the uncrafty Joni sampling and didn't buy and listen to Velvet Rope as a result... a couple years later a friend expressed a similar feeling about "Hard Knock Life" and it sounded so ridiculous coming out of her mouth that I adjusted my attitude
― my booty it clean (fgti), Wednesday, 14 January 2015 18:45 (nine years ago) link
i felt like that about both at the time, just seemed really corny
i don't hate "got til it's gone" or anything now but picking it as the BEST on this album is an opinion that seems increasingly insane the more i think about it
― lex pretend, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 18:47 (nine years ago) link
Definitely the best video clip from the album tho.
― Vulvacura (Eric H.), Wednesday, 14 January 2015 18:54 (nine years ago) link
"Got Til It's Gone" sounds like magic, my #2 behind "Empty".
― The Reverend, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 19:35 (nine years ago) link
JONI MITCHELL NEVER LIES
― The Reverend, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 19:36 (nine years ago) link
i'd forgotten how great this is:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4_G1Yk5c9Y
― prolego, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 19:47 (nine years ago) link
TOP TIERYouGot 'til It's GoneMy NeedGo DeepEmptyAnything
STILL REALLY GOODFree XoneTogether AgainWhat AboutI Get LonelyRope BurnSpecialCan't Be Stopped
LESS GOODVelvet RopeEvery TimeTonight's the Night
― Vulvacura (Eric H.), Wednesday, 14 January 2015 19:49 (nine years ago) link
it kills me that she never did anything more with timbo at his peak. just imagine.
especially as aaliyah always said janet was her dream collaboration.
― prolego, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 19:49 (nine years ago) link
"Special" really on the fence between the latter two categories depending on my mood.
xp yeah, but Jam and Lewis could do faux-Timba better than anyone
― Vulvacura (Eric H.), Wednesday, 14 January 2015 19:50 (nine years ago) link
Two posts above yours. "TNT" = Tim n' Teddy.
― The Reverend, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 19:53 (nine years ago) link
imo "tighten up" sample in "free xone" is the best thing
― emo canon in twee major (BradNelson), Wednesday, 14 January 2015 20:01 (nine years ago) link
ALL OF THE SAMPLES IN "FREE XONE" ARE THE BEST THING
― The Reverend, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 20:14 (nine years ago) link
true that's just the one that gets me the most hyped
― emo canon in twee major (BradNelson), Wednesday, 14 January 2015 20:14 (nine years ago) link
along with "empty" this is my other fav fake-timbo joint of 1997:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEOmuWHXxf8
― prolego, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 20:20 (nine years ago) link
this is a thread for dope timbaland ripoffs from the late 90s ~bump--bump--bump-cack~
― The Reverend, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 20:34 (nine years ago) link
oh awesome!
― prolego, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 20:38 (nine years ago) link
― emo canon in twee major (BradNelson), Wednesday, January 14, 2015 8:01 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
― The Reverend, Wednesday, January 14, 2015 8:14 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
― emo canon in twee major (BradNelson), Wednesday, January 14, 2015 8:14 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
this exchange is otm
― Tim F, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 22:00 (nine years ago) link
I do love how this album feels like a total grab-bag of stylistic tricks (sample-collage! DJ Quik disco! slow jams! Timbaland jitters! neo-soul! shiny modern pop/r&b crossover! glutinous balladry! rock guitars! gay house anthem! "miambient" epic!) but still feels like it's got this really cohesive and deliberate meta-narrative, and is the work of a single controlling mind (albeit with helpers, who she is controlling).
I'm trying to think of other pop albums since that have done this nearly as well. Even for those albums that do pull it off (e.g. Britney's In The Zone) it usually feels like a total quirk of fate, like the songs accidentally forgot to be car-crashes or limp target market pandering or whatever.
Whereas The Velvet Rope makes a virtue of the entire approach: box-ticking on its very best day in heaven.
― Tim F, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 22:04 (nine years ago) link
The first Janet album whose album tracks consistently wowed me, including the Rod Stewart cover. The opening bars of "Go Deep" -- the synth farts, the percussion -- are as awesome as "Escapade"'s and "What Have You Done For Me Lately."
― guess that bundt gettin eaten (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 14 January 2015 22:08 (nine years ago) link
booming Tim F post
― The Reverend, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 22:09 (nine years ago) link
"Go Deep" was a single tho
― The Reverend, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 22:10 (nine years ago) link
yeah I should have made it clear -- hit an extra enter.
― guess that bundt gettin eaten (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 14 January 2015 22:11 (nine years ago) link
I also love how the guitars sound like they're mixed to sound as flat as cardboard. Janet and the percussive effects are the stars.
― guess that bundt gettin eaten (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 14 January 2015 22:12 (nine years ago) link
Also so many of these songs hit several of the boxes Tim outlined just within one song!
― The Reverend, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 22:21 (nine years ago) link
i think janet. might be even more diverse than the velvet rope? like i can't believe she throws in an opera solo at the end of "this time" and somehow makes it work ("you're dismissed"). and it sits coherently between the pounding house orgy of "throb" and that guitar bridge breakdown in "if". the stylistic ground janet and jam and lewis covered together throughout the 80s and 90s is astonishing.
― prolego, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 22:31 (nine years ago) link
love "This Time." I think I voted for it in the janet poll.
― guess that bundt gettin eaten (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Wednesday, 14 January 2015 22:33 (nine years ago) link
janet. doesn't hang together nearly as well tho
― The Reverend, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 22:34 (nine years ago) link
janet.'s problem is that is outstays its welcome. the final third of the album packed with syrupy ballads make the album feel 10 hours along ("anytime anyplace" being the classic 4eva exception). the first two thirds is just relentlessly incredible however.
xtina's stripped is the first that comes to mind. several girls aloud/xenomania albums as well, although packing 30 ideas into their songs became too much of their focus. also rihanna's rated r totally fits! and feels very much a part of the velvet rope/erotica lineage.
― prolego, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 22:49 (nine years ago) link
Yeah I thought of Stripped too after I posted, that may be the best example (and also as an album clearly takes a lot of cues directly from The Velvet Rope).
I wouldn't include Xenomania-related work though because there the deliberate kitchen sink every genre simultaneously approach is such a strong stylistic aesthetic that the songs end up sounding of a piece anyway.
I wonder if in part it's possible for Janet because, for someone who is considered to have a "weak" voice, she had spent her entire career working out ways to project presence in other ways, and in a variety of contexts. Perhaps the really distinguishing quality of The Velvet Rope's grab-bag approach is that it always feels like it's being delivered by the same very ~present~ person.
― Tim F, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 23:09 (nine years ago) link
To be clear, I love Janet's voice.
― Tim F, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 23:24 (nine years ago) link
haha this is true of khia's last couple of albums too, which - i've just realised - are basically very cheap versions of this; it's like someone was trying to recreate it with a budget of £5 and some prittstick
― lex pretend, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 23:48 (nine years ago) link
The J Dilla joint.
― Moka, Wednesday, 14 January 2015 23:59 (nine years ago) link
How come J Dilla is not credited in Got Til It's Gone? I'm pretty sure he was involved but I can only find traces of a 'revenge' mix he made (I'm guessing it's revenge since they stole his credit?)
― Moka, Thursday, 15 January 2015 00:03 (nine years ago) link
this'll sound strange but I hear Peter Gabriel's "San Jacinto" in "Empty."
― guess that bundt gettin eaten (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Thursday, 15 January 2015 00:08 (nine years ago) link
it makes me so so so excited abt life that there are still ablums like "The Velvet Rope" for me to discover
I had it when it came out but I didn't listen to the whole thing all that much and I threw it on my phone the other day after reading abt Tim F's love of "Empty" and I listened to it like 3 times today. I am already very obsessed with this.
― Jennifer 8.-( (Stevie D(eux)), Thursday, 15 January 2015 04:23 (nine years ago) link
Your koochie gonna swell up and fall apart.
― Vulvacura (Eric H.), Thursday, 15 January 2015 04:48 (nine years ago) link
ranking this hurt but here we go
what abouti get lonelygo deepvelvet ropefree xoneyouemptymy needcan't be stoppedrope burnspecialtogether againanythingtonight's the nightevery timegot til it's gone
― lex pretend, Thursday, 15 January 2015 18:14 (nine years ago) link
You're right, that ranking does hurt.
― Vulvacura (Eric H.), Thursday, 15 January 2015 18:31 (nine years ago) link
Listening to the album sequentially for the first time in a frickin ever and I think I've been underestimating just how much of a cool drink of water it is when "Together Again" finally rolls around.
― Vulvacura (Eric H.), Friday, 16 January 2015 14:56 (nine years ago) link
Would've been amazing if they'd held it until even closer to the end instead of pulling the old backloading-ballads trick again.
― Vulvacura (Eric H.), Friday, 16 January 2015 14:57 (nine years ago) link
cool drink of water after the rope burn
― guess that bundt gettin eaten (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 16 January 2015 15:02 (nine years ago) link
Even "Every Time" sounds pretty strong in sequence, or at least less like "Again, Pt. 2."
― Vulvacura (Eric H.), Friday, 16 January 2015 15:13 (nine years ago) link
Well, the first 15 seconds of "Tonight's the Night" are pretty good, anyway.
― Vulvacura (Eric H.), Friday, 16 January 2015 15:16 (nine years ago) link
Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.
― System, Saturday, 17 January 2015 00:01 (nine years ago) link
Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.
― System, Sunday, 18 January 2015 00:01 (nine years ago) link
Think I actually forgot to put in a vote. Make me "You"s sole vote.
― Vulvacura (Eric H.), Sunday, 18 January 2015 00:01 (nine years ago) link
Just bought promo 12"s of "Together Again" and "Got Til It's Gone" today
― Jennifer 8.-( (Stevie D(eux)), Sunday, 18 January 2015 03:14 (nine years ago) link
Oh and "I Get Lonely" with an instrumental of the Timbaland remix!!
― Jennifer 8.-( (Stevie D(eux)), Sunday, 18 January 2015 03:15 (nine years ago) link
Voted Got Til It's Gone because I love the J Dilla thing but Empty is mindblowing in context. Hard to believe that Janet Jackson would release one of the most forward sounding tracks of the 90's.
― Moka, Tuesday, 20 January 2015 08:13 (nine years ago) link
Hard to believe that Janet Jackson would release one of the most forward sounding tracks of the 90's.
― Moka, Tuesday, January 20, 2015 3:13 AM (5 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
lol c'mon dude no it's not
― Jennifer 8.-( (Stevie D(eux)), Tuesday, 20 January 2015 14:06 (nine years ago) link
1997?
― Moka, Tuesday, 20 January 2015 17:28 (nine years ago) link
I mean the trajectory of Control > Rhythm Nation 1814 > janet. is so forward-thinking and innovative that the fact that she'd release something even more forward-thinking and innovative is not a shocker. I mean, few people keep up so much momentum for so long so it's not like it was EXPECTED per se but I think it's a logical thread
― Jennifer 8.-( (Stevie D(eux)), Tuesday, 20 January 2015 19:23 (nine years ago) link
Looked up "velvet rope poll" wondering if Empty did well, proud to see it's #1. That song could come out today and it would still sound amazing
― josh az (2011nostalgia), Tuesday, 10 October 2017 01:26 (six years ago) link
My Need 1
what
this is my frontrunner atm (3 or so full-album listens in)
― imago, Tuesday, 18 August 2020 19:00 (four years ago) link
Surprised to see "Go Deep" tied for 5th here given it was 6th in the overall tracks poll.
― Get the point? Good, let's dance with nunchaku. (Eric H.), Tuesday, 18 August 2020 19:16 (four years ago) link
stoned listening to velvet rope on headphones d(((((((-_-)))))))b
― flamenco drop (BradNelson), Monday, 13 June 2022 17:58 (two years ago) link
Drum tones on “my need” are blowing my mind tonight.
― ✖✖✖ (Moka), Friday, 23 June 2023 01:35 (one year ago) link
Surprised it’s so low, it’s top 3 easily.
― ✖✖✖ (Moka), Friday, 23 June 2023 01:36 (one year ago) link
the "go deep" music video - janet has the hots for a possible minor!
― Western® with Bacon Flavor, Monday, 16 September 2024 05:44 (six days ago) link