museums are great though
― famous instagram God (waterface), Tuesday, 9 September 2014 18:43 (nine years ago) link
the first takedown forks linked is incredible:
This is not an argument against jazz. This is an argument against capitalism. To deny its victims pleasure, expression, and selfhood in the name of the Left is as odious as the apparatuses of the state themselves...Leftist cultural criticism becomes tedious when its practitioners claim that any artwork that does not single-handedly dismantle capitalism is thereby reactionary. It seems to me that the field should instead be characterized by a spirit of empathy and debate, two ideals epitomized by jazz. John Halle should listen closer.
― love (the band) loves to love love (Treeship), Tuesday, 9 September 2014 18:50 (nine years ago) link
paragraph 2:
Any doubts on that score can be answered with a trip to the wall of corporate sponsors of jazz in Lincoln Center, followed by a visit to Dizzy’s Coca Cola club, the center’s flagship concert hall.
― the other song about butts in the top 5 (forksclovetofu), Tuesday, 9 September 2014 18:53 (nine years ago) link
Dizzy's is a dope place to see a show
― bozack horseman (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 9 September 2014 23:29 (nine years ago) link
Best set at Dizzy's is the aftershow, afterhours thing with the other band.
― Good Time Charlie Don't Surf (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 10 September 2014 00:55 (nine years ago) link
http://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/2771-the-eminem-show/
Just came across this old pitchfork review -- i'm fine with the casual style if there's substance behind it, but this seems pretty flimsy. Maybe if i read p4k more i'd get it, idk
― chilli, Wednesday, 10 September 2014 01:21 (nine years ago) link
you dun goofed
― bozack horseman (Whiney G. Weingarten), Wednesday, 10 September 2014 01:24 (nine years ago) link
idk. i think it was you who said that ilx is the old sow that eats her farrow.
― love (the band) loves to love love (Treeship), Wednesday, 10 September 2014 01:32 (nine years ago) link
is that review by glorious ilm saint and what?
― Now you're messing with a (President Keyes), Wednesday, 10 September 2014 02:01 (nine years ago) link
all this poor writing out of a dumb parody piece that only hardcore sonny rollins fans would understand anyway
― the other song about butts in the top 5 (forksclovetofu)
my thoughts exactly. i'm glad this thread is here to document the weird chain reaction that rollins satire piece generated.
― borntohula, Wednesday, 10 September 2014 02:04 (nine years ago) link
Apologies if so, i might not be in on the joke. But i don't think the homophobic stuff is really acceptable either, even for '02
― chilli, Wednesday, 10 September 2014 02:40 (nine years ago) link
i did some contract work for jalc and have seen numerous shows at all the rooms; dizzy's is a great place to see a show and the aforementioned afterparty is loads of fun.
― the other song about butts in the top 5 (forksclovetofu), Wednesday, 10 September 2014 03:21 (nine years ago) link
Apologies if so, i might not be in on the joke. But i don't think the homophobic stuff is really acceptable either, even for '02 --chilli
Hope you don't like Lil Wayne!
― bozack horseman (Whiney G. Weingarten), Wednesday, 10 September 2014 03:30 (nine years ago) link
I don't really, but that's not relevant. When i'm listening to rap, reading messageboards etc i have a different set of expectations than when i'm reading music journalism
― chilli, Wednesday, 10 September 2014 06:20 (nine years ago) link
oh, ffs...
http://johnhalle.com/outragesandinterludes/?p=149
― Montgomery Burns' Jazz (Tarfumes The Escape Goat), Wednesday, 10 September 2014 22:29 (nine years ago) link
lol @ chilli
― example (crüt), Wednesday, 10 September 2014 22:31 (nine years ago) link
https://medium.com/cuepoint/were-all-djs-now-8d94ee912c6d
― TracerHandVEVO (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 10 September 2014 23:18 (nine years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtLnies1IIw
― maura, Wednesday, 10 September 2014 23:25 (nine years ago) link
This question can be a superb segue to a conversation about a genre or artist, but also I get to size up the depth of a person’s music knowledge and the quality of his or her tastes. If the friend replies “Britney Spears’ wedding to K-Fed,” I know I need to be more selective about who I spend time with.
I feel the same way about writers who make a K-Fed joke in 2014
― da croupier, Wednesday, 10 September 2014 23:30 (nine years ago) link
Around 30 years ago I saw my first real DJ — the scratchy-scratch kind — and began to understand what music selection and turntable talent and rocking a party was all about.
― da croupier, Wednesday, 10 September 2014 23:33 (nine years ago) link
http://mic.com/articles/98310/scientists-prove-what-we-all-secretly-think-about-people-who-love-pop-music
― maura, Wednesday, 10 September 2014 23:47 (nine years ago) link
Oh, so creativity is a quantitative measure.
― Herbie Handcock (Murgatroid), Wednesday, 10 September 2014 23:54 (nine years ago) link
Each summer, it’s like we dive into the pool in May and never clean the water from our ears. The Song of the Summer almost always sucks (except that one summer when, miraculously, Beyonce’s “Crazy in Love” beat out “Magic Stick” by 50 Cent and “Unwell” by Matchbox 20 to take the title); and yet we keep on breathlessly anticipating the Song of the Summer, as though by some miracle it will be made by Deerhunter this year.
Pro tip: Most people aren’t going to play Deerhunter at their kids’ pool party.
― maura, Saturday, 13 September 2014 15:07 (nine years ago) link
think you can be done for child abuse if you do
― Daphnis Celesta, Saturday, 13 September 2014 15:12 (nine years ago) link
I pity this "we"
― da croupier, Saturday, 13 September 2014 15:33 (nine years ago) link
But what really got people going nuts over Ryan’s sets was that he was playing songs from all these new bands that were emerging at the time. Most of these groups were coming out of the electroclash and NYC indie rock scenes, and many of them had “The” in their name. This prefix was how you could distinguish the cool new bands with the edgy new sound.
The Strokes, The Postal Service, The Hives, The Yeah Yeah Yeahs, The White Stripes, The Stills. The list goes on.
― maura, Wednesday, 24 September 2014 13:08 (nine years ago) link
those are some alarmingly bad sentences; also there's no "the" in front of yeah yeah yeahs.
― uxorious gazumping (monotony), Wednesday, 24 September 2014 13:20 (nine years ago) link
"the cool new bands with the edgy new sound"
― Re-Make/Re-Model, Wednesday, 24 September 2014 13:33 (nine years ago) link
The List Goes On were so overlooked
― I misuse (onimo), Wednesday, 24 September 2014 14:03 (nine years ago) link
The GAPDYs
― Now you're messing with a (President Keyes), Wednesday, 24 September 2014 15:10 (nine years ago) link
The List Goes On - Etcetera (Rough Trade, 2002)
― Re-Make/Re-Model, Wednesday, 24 September 2014 16:43 (nine years ago) link
Right around that time, there was a local band that was making noise in town. A friend who wrote in my high school ‘zine, Hey, Hipster, happened to play bass in the band, and Ryan was buddies with them too. Word was that they had been picked up by a big record label and they were going to do some shows in Europe. So we asked them if they would do one free show at our party before they left town. They agreed, and packed the house strictly through word of mouth, as for some reason we were not allowed to promote the appearance.
They entered the building already dressed like famous rock stars, wearing tightly-fitted sportcoats, black jeans with white belts and Reservoir Dogs’-esque skinny ties. They hit the stage and proceeded to rock the house, and shortly thereafter were quickly whisked away on a plane to the UK. The next time I saw them, it was on television.
That band was The Killers.
― LIKE If you are against racism (omar little), Wednesday, 24 September 2014 17:06 (nine years ago) link
and that's....
the rest
of the story
― Οὖτις, Wednesday, 24 September 2014 17:08 (nine years ago) link
GOOD DAY
and that little boy who nobody liked...
...was brandon flowers.
― LIKE If you are against racism (omar little), Wednesday, 24 September 2014 17:10 (nine years ago) link
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/oct/03/-sp-in-defence-of-iggy-azalea-on-racism-naivety-and-a-twisted-cluster-of-exploitation
"Further, the interplay between gender and race occurring here only makes sense when you view it through the lens of neoliberal capitalism. Azalea thinks she is making art; TI, and the various producers and heavyweights who are behind her may legitimately appreciate her performance and her songwriting, but they also know they’re making money."
― Re-Make/Re-Model, Friday, 3 October 2014 09:07 (nine years ago) link
even worse than that pretty bad piece is seeing the uk liberal media class honking about how no one's allowed to make jokes any more like some harrumphingly unselfaware latter-day "pc gone mad" brigade
― lex pretend, Friday, 3 October 2014 11:53 (nine years ago) link
Hey if you want to weigh in on my Facebook thread please do. Aren't you in the UK liberal media class?
― Re-Make/Re-Model, Friday, 3 October 2014 12:47 (nine years ago) link
Lex, I think the dominant theme of that Facebook thread is not "PC is stopping us making jokes" but "If you're going to write a think piece, display some evidence of having thought about the subject in hand."
― Unsettled defender (ithappens), Friday, 3 October 2014 12:53 (nine years ago) link
Although I'm now at the point where all the think pieces tossed off in 10 mins at some editor's behest – some of which I've written, some of which I've commissioned, some of which I've resisted (including a request for one this week that I outright refused on the grounds it would be the equivalent of writing 1800 about Agadoo in 1984) – have blended into one endless stream of Miley-Thicke-Twerking-Allen-Nudity-Rihanna-Sex-Azalea-Porn-Race in my mind.
The good ones have taken the time to be more than think pieces, they've done reporting too – like Dorian's outstanding Blurred Lines piece. But so many do no more than say THIS IS WRONG. They do not debate or engage, they simply rage censoriously. They shut down debate by saying that if you disagree with the thesis you are yourself an oppressor, forgetting that the best way to oppress is not to say things, but to prevent things being said.
― Unsettled defender (ithappens), Friday, 3 October 2014 12:59 (nine years ago) link
oh i'm behind on my ilx usernames, didn't realise who re-make was. i did type a contribution to that thread but prob best for all involved that i deleted it.
on the one hand, thinkpiece culture is awful and even more than the tossed-off-in-10-mins pure reaction element, it really suffers from general cultural commentators wading in who neither know nor care about an artist's history or genre. how many of the endless miley/sinéad pieces last year mentioned either woman's music? (at least this piece seems to have attempted some legwork - i appreciated the bit about the political climate of '90s australia bc everything i've read about iggy focuses on where she doesn't come from but v little talks about where she does come from.)
on the other this isn't the first time i've seen british cultural commentators mock the very idea of taking a serious or political approach to pop culture and whinge about how they hate phrases like "check your privilege" and "problematic". i resent the idea that cultural commentators should aim to be light and jokey and never ever rock the boat. yay let's all become stuart fucking heritage (cf https://twitter.com/stuheritage/status/501651538562269184).
at times like this i very much feel like i'm not part of the uk liberal media class...
― lex pretend, Friday, 3 October 2014 13:06 (nine years ago) link
That's an entirely false opposition. Glib whimsy is not the only alternative to humourless, quasi-academic writing which shows no appreciation for the music it's discussing. Nor was anyone in that thread dismissing the idea of discussing pop culture seriously, far from it, only doing so with dead language and lazy second-hand ideas.
― Re-Make/Re-Model, Friday, 3 October 2014 13:11 (nine years ago) link
Personally, I wouldn't care if that piece was humourless as long as it was clued-up, rigorous and contained at least one decent line.
― Re-Make/Re-Model, Friday, 3 October 2014 13:13 (nine years ago) link
"dead language and second-hand ideas" could just as easily apply to half the jokey/let's-not-take-anything-seriously articles that slide past on a daily basis. "second-hand ideas" is pretty much the entire currency of most "funny" writing
― lex pretend, Friday, 3 October 2014 13:32 (nine years ago) link
Lex, I don't think anyone's saying bad funny writing is better than bad serious writing. Bad writing is bad writing.
― Unsettled defender (ithappens), Friday, 3 October 2014 13:35 (nine years ago) link
Yes. Let me make it clear. I am against bad writing. It is bad.
Glibness and pomposity are the two things I hate most of all in writing. If you can combine the two in one essay, oh boy.
― Re-Make/Re-Model, Friday, 3 October 2014 13:36 (nine years ago) link
no one's explicitly saying that, but there is SO MUCH bad funny/light writing around atm and hardly any of it gets called out in this way by that section of the uk media. (eg that terrible telegraph writer michael hogan, or indeed heritage.) yet bad writing that's attempting a political critique => ohhhh boy the floodgates of whinging about "check your privilege" open. (not just this thread, this is far from the first time i've seen these sentiments.) plus ofc the overall vibe i get is that funny writing is inherently superior to earnest writing.
― lex pretend, Friday, 3 October 2014 13:41 (nine years ago) link
Of course bad writing that offers a political critique is held to a higher standard than glib filler, because it's assuming the moral high ground and often making serious allegations. A protest song done badly gets more flak than a love song done badly.
― Re-Make/Re-Model, Friday, 3 October 2014 13:47 (nine years ago) link
Was writing this just as the above post was posted …
One reason for that, Lex, might be that no one expects a tossed off, unfunny piece to be important, and no one presents it as such. It's just a piece of crap, and people accept it as that (though Michael Hogan's pieces have had plenty of flak here, which is full of the UK media types who apparently don't criticise Michael Hogan). But a piece that presents itself as being serious and important deserves to be ripped apart if it's a piece of crap. In the same way that a shitty album from Jay-Z or Radiohead or whoever deserves to be ripped apart more than than a shitty album from Pigeon Detectives or the Courteeners.
But none of this gets away from the essential point that an awful lot of these think pieces are about shutting conversations down – "You have no right to say these things on this topic" – than about opening them up.
― Unsettled defender (ithappens), Friday, 3 October 2014 13:49 (nine years ago) link
it's often the casual, tossed-off stuff (whether entire pieces or just wannabe-funny asides) that really reinforces poisonous ideas and received wisdom tho.
i don't really think many pieces are saying "you have no right to think x/y/z". people have every right to think what they want, no one is going to arrest them for it. critiquing a song or artist for elements of racism or sexism isn't the same thing at all.
― lex pretend, Friday, 3 October 2014 13:57 (nine years ago) link