Morrissey really seriously ill?

obviously the Olympics organization itself is an internationalist, not a nationalist, organization, so yeah they haven't done anything egregious that I know of. but participating nations have used the nationalist nature of their participation in racist ways

http://www.nytimes.com/learning/general/onthisday/big/0801.html

"I present to you this olive branch as a symbol of love and peace," he said. "We hope that the nations will ever meet solely in such peaceful competition."

Hitler, receiving it with obvious emotion, thanked him heartily and shook hands with him. The "Hallelujah Chorus" in a final great burst of melody and the recession of nations from the stadium brought this notable opening to a close.

In British terms, the Olympics are mostly inclusive these days. It doesn't really matter where you, or your parents, were born - if you are competing for GB you are considered British by all but the most cantankerous, exclusionary racists. Morrissey's commentary on contemporary Britain in much closer to the cantankerous, exclusionary racist vision than the Olympic one.

The reason black athletes wrapped in the union flag is a big deal is because of the way it was so closely associated with the far right for so many years. The Spice Girls were probably, in some way, trying to reclaim and detoxify it. Morrissey not so much.

lol yeah nothin racist about the Spice Girls nope

The dresses understandably made a lot of people uncomfortable at the time, as did Annie Lennox's union flag suit a few years before. There was definitely a strain of British triumphalism to the whole era but, at the same time, a kind of inept but well-meaning attempt to take the symbolism of British nationalism away from the far right and towards a more inclusive place. Not necessarily successfully.

you can be included, but we get to call you scary

*bookmarks thread in "cultural studies" folder*

you can be included but we get to call you posh

you can be included but we get to call you ginger

you can be included but we get to call you baby

you can be included but we get to call you minger

foodie idea: the posh nosh

When you read 20th century history books, if you get bored at the non-eventful stage of "eccentric" entertainers making racist comments without any opposition, just skip a few chapters to the more eventful death-camp/pogrom stage of approved mass murder where all this PC nonsense has been dispensed with.

pretty sure the spice girls participated in coming up with their own nicknames

foodie idea: the posh nosh

David's favourite dish

pretty sure the spice girls participated in coming up with their own nicknames

I thought the story was that they were nicknamed in a magazine article and everyone liked them, so the names stuck

"without any opposition"

I heard it was Andi Peters xpost

wiki sez: "Each member of the group received a nickname from the media. Brown was named "Scary Spice""

lol xelab so Morrissey is Wagner now ok

rubber ring cycle

I look forward to the mass murdering dictator that cites Morrissey as a formative philosophical influence btw, hopefully they will cite Freddie Mercury and Nico too

more to the-poster-formerly-known-as-Shakey's point:

As the girls become more popular, their images became as important as their music. In their early days of the band, the girls had a laid back and casual look, and maintained an image of everyday British young females. As their career progressed into a worldwide phenomenon, the girls and their manager Simon Fuller became more aware of the impact their images had. The Spice Girls soon became noticeable just by their clothes and hairstyles, and soon became icons of late 1990s fashion. In a summer 1996 issue of Top of the Pops magazine, editor Peter Loraine gave them nicknames for their images and personalities, and this soon had an impact on their fashion. In contrast to their early career, the girls soon began to differ their images from each other, and each girl had a unique look.

er his Spice Girls point, not the one where Morrissey is as relevant and omnipresent as Wagner

(the one he is rebutting that is, I am terrible at posting today)

More on the Spice Girls. They were in cahoots with "the media" (TOTP magazine LOL) re the nicknames.

July 1996

A feature in Top of the Pops magazine gives the Spice Girls their nicknames, Posh, Baby, Scary, Sporty and Ginger. Editor Peter Loraine suggests the names during lunch with the girls in Notting Hill.

"I simply said it would be a good idea if they had some nicknames. The girls liked the idea, so I had an editorial meeting back at the office and about four of us started thinking of names. Posh was the first one to be thought up because Victoria looks pretty sophisticated. The rest were pretty easy really because the girls' characters were already really strong. The names jumped out at us. We laughed the most when we came up with Scary. Jennifer Cawthron, who was also from Leeds, came up with that one because Mel B was so loud and had tried to take over our whole photo shoot.

"We ran the names for a couple of issues and the first time the girls saw them they thought it was funny. Then the newspapers started picking up on the names and they cropped up everywhere until they were fully accepted by everyone."

The reason black athletes wrapped in the union flag is a big deal is because of the way it was so closely associated with the far right for so many years

1)I didn't know it was a big deal
2)what is is your definition of black? Are you talking about the photo above?

It's a big deal. Lots of people from minority backgrounds wouldn't have felt comfortable being associated with the flag in the seventies, eighties and early nineties, many would still be uncomfortable with it today. Athletes from Thompson to Christie to Farah being positively associated with it, and increasingly seen as British first and black second (which wasn't always the case with Thompson's generation, or even Christie's - see Seb Coe's "jive talk" quotes) changes the way in which national iconography is perceived by some.

I'm not really sure a Morrissey thread is the best place to get into a discussion about whether the British-Jamaican Jessica Ennis is "black" or not.

shari vari otm - 2012 was definitely a turning point in what the union jack means, a big step in redeeming it. 1992 was a massively different story.

http://www.albamblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/daley-thompson-400.jpg

This one is particularly cute

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/07/14/article-2014877-002FD7DB00000258-870_634x456.jpg

jess ennis is a curious shade of black imo

Please elaborate

Shortly before the 2012 Summer Olympics, British athlete Daly Thompson made an anti-Irish statement on live television. When Thompson was shown an image of a runner with a misspelt tattoo, he said that the person responsible for the misspelling must have been Irish.

DT fitting right in with the UJ crowd.

she's very light skinned, black is totally inappropriate. also it annoys me when a person has one 'black' parent and one 'white' parent and they are immediately deemed 'black'. they are mixed race, but not black.

what is she was 3/4s black, or 7/8s? What is black enough before you stop finding it "curious"?

Very good, OutdoorFish

Very good

ilikewherethisisgoing.jpg

when would she be white?

OutdoorFish, are you white?

hmmmmmm good question

brown i'd say

cappuchino

Gentlemen, no uncomfortable discussion of racial theory here please, this is the Morrissey thread.

bit late now lol

or was that a joke?

You're frankly vulgar
Red pullover
Now see how the two colors blend, my friend
Won't somebody help?

Not really wanting to get into it but I am with Kitchener on this.

http://youtu.be/jnyMtml7k_w

Nobody is denying that there were black British Olympians competing under the flag in the eighties but Daley is something of an outlier. He's unbelievably right-wing. Whenever the Mail wants to tell black people what's wrong with them, he's the go-to guy for quotes to cover against accusations of racism. I've always wondered how competing for Britain in a racist environment contributed to that.

she's very light skinned, black is totally inappropriate. also it annoys me when a person has one 'black' parent and one 'white' parent and they are immediately deemed 'black'. they are mixed race, but not black.
― OutdoorFish, Thursday, June 26, 2014 6:35 AM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

This must be really annoying for you

extremely

http://www.nndb.com/people/649/000022583/colin-powell-sm.jpg