Morrissey really seriously ill?

yeah, this stereotypical view of right wingers overlooks so many other appealing beliefs

you missed my irony?

He expounded on many of his political views here: http://www.morrissey-solo.com/content/1037-Morrissey-interview-in-the-Legends-issue-of-Loaded-(Feb-2013)-out-tomorrow

No Alfred I was actually trying to get away from that kind of thinking, shakey was on some "in fairness to the lad, he isn't far-right, he's more *idiosyncratic* in his beliefs" which is a pointless avenue to go down imo - dude has been consistently, publically hateful, I don't give a fuck what newspaper he reads or his views on the royals or whatever the fuck

I mean apart from anything else, the shit this guy's been saying for as long as I've been alive has just been really really stupid, like he actually comes across as a bit dense. Not sure why ppl act like he's at all clever or interesting tbh

Because he wrote "How Soon Is Now?"

his lyrics were intelligent and interesting, as was a lot of what he said at the beginning. that's the whole point.

if you only heard what he said and produced from Quarry onwards, I can understand how this might seem ludicrous

Morrissey has made so many ridiculous or risible or stupid statements over the years it's hard for me to categorize what each comment means about the man. The only consistent hate I recall from the guy is toward Johnny Rogan, Mike Joyce and any person that eats meat. Everything else has been a one-off what did he say now shocker, right?

turns out you can write the theme to charmed and still be an idiot

healthy step for ilx to start believing you can tick lots of the right boxes and still be a cunt, vice versa belief to follow within a few years, then we can really start to mix it up

I'll take the word of posters above/in the other thread re skinheads etc at the time and in the scene, I'm still wondering if the union jack is a straight port to racism tbh?

as an interesting aside, not as a "maybe moz is just mozunderstood" gambit.

healthy step for ilx to start believing you can tick lots of the right boxes and still be a cun

seriously, shut up

he says he wants jon stewart or rachel maddow to be president of the U.S.

as far as i can tell...all his views are basically filtered through the lens of his own incredible narcissism and self-obsession...

so....he cares about animal rights, so he supports radical left vegan groups or Greenpeace

he hates when he has to pay taxes personally...so he supports the largely right wing "we need lower taxes" view...

he doesn't like UK losing its identity to Europe so he supports going back to sterling and some UKIP anti-Europe stuff

he suffered under Thatcher as a youth so he despises Thatcher

the Chinese have a poor record on animal rights so he sees them as "Subspecies"

American Latinos embrace him and his music, flattering him, and giving him a new audience and more money, so he embraces them

he likes watching Jon Stewart and Rachel Maddow, so he thinks they should be president of the US

he loves a bunch of fusty old English cultural stuff that no one gives a fuck about anymore, and he feels like no one does so he blames immigration for a loss of "English indentity"

none of this shit is consistent except through the idea that Morrissey can't see past his own nose

and is racist

we still use sterling to buy our blood sausage over here, old chap, but otherwise OTM

He has refused his Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

He has forbidden his Governors to pass Laws of immediate and pressing importance, unless suspended in their operation till his Assent should be obtained; and when so suspended, he has utterly neglected to attend to them.

He has refused to pass other Laws for the accommodation of large districts of people, unless those people would relinquish the right of Representation in the Legislature, a right inestimable to them and formidable to tyrants only.

He has called together legislative bodies at places unusual, uncomfortable, and distant from the depository of their public Records, for the sole purpose of fatiguing them into compliance with his measures.

He has dissolved Representative Houses repeatedly, for opposing with manly firmness his invasions on the rights of the people.

He has refused for a long time, after such dissolutions, to cause others to be elected; whereby the Legislative powers, incapable of Annihilation, have returned to the People at large for their exercise; the State remaining in the mean time exposed to all the dangers of invasion from without, and convulsions within.

he loves a bunch of fusty old English cultural stuff that no one gives a fuck about anymore

don't think it's necessarily either lolsome or racist to like long gone aspects of any popular national culture, and if Moz were American he might get more respect for being a cultural custodian of all sorts of interesting things. also, not everything he's championed has been 'fusty' and British (and some of the things he adores might still say something of our country and the way we once lived and presented ourselves to the world = valuable, worth preserving - eg New York Dolls, Nico, Klaus Nomi. of course moz falls into a pretty reactionary position when he bemoans a loss of these things - especially now that, thanks to dvd and other archival forms, they're actually more present than ever - On the Buses (a Moz tour bus fave, I was once told) is all around us!

ward - i'm not saying a desire to preserve or be a booster of stuff is bad, i just think he tends to see the decline of it as part of a "declining England" narrative or loss of Englishness that's has been a theme of his and i think at times has caused him to be racist (like "life is hard enough when you belong here" or "we are the last truly english people you will ever know" etc)

all his views are basically filtered through the lens of his own incredible narcissism and self-obsession.

funny how little Englanders are the first to bugger off to California, Florida or Spain given half a chance

Residual colonialist instinct?

xxp OTM (also, I suspect, always latching on symbols for aesthetic reasons make him completely oblivious to the political meaning of his positions)

"If you walk through Knightsbridge on any bland day of the week you won't hear an English accent" - reckon he gets the kind of immigration he reads about online mixed up with tourism and the oligarchs buying up London etc. He thinks the view from his posh hotel is a typical British street scene.

lol

A typical London (if not Knightsbridge) street scene would have kids from Asian, African and Caribbean backgrounds speaking English in a variety of ways. Morrissey has decided that these accents are not English, regardless of the possibility that they come from English born kids - also ignoring the fact that he's a Manc and his accent is as removed from Knightsbridge as any.

Also, Knightsbridge has been populated by rich foreigners for, what, 50 years now?

Thing is, yeah, he's a lousy comedian.

the lens of his own incredible narcissism and self-obsession.

I loved the Smiths before I gave solo Morrissey a chance and found "Bengali in Platforms" on the first solo album I bought. I still like a lot of the Smiths' music but I sometimes have trouble seeing the lyrics the same way that I used to: much of the 'introspection' and the cynical worldview can seem more like "narcissism and self-obsession", as you put it, exactly the same sort of narcissism and self-obsession that is at the root of his xenophobic, essentially racist attitudes. (I mean, it could also partly be that I'm not 18 anymore.)

"...are at the root..."

Also, Knightsbridge has been populated by rich foreigners for, what, 50 years now?

Yes, but he hasn't been in Knightsbridge for 50 years. I think he is dumb enough to be comparing it to 1950s Manchester. Like most racists, I doubt he has spent any time close enough to "kids from Asian, African and Caribbean backgrounds" to gauge anything about them, including the variety of accents they might have.

Like most racists, I doubt

ignore the dangling modifier here by the way lol

I agree w m@tt's POV for the most part. p clear that as an American I'm missing a lot of UK nuances here.

didn't know the Union Jack was considered a racist symbol for example

http://www.feelnumb.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/def_leppard_union_jack_9522.jpg

http://www.feelnumb.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/gallery_pic7264.jpg

http://www.polyvore.com/cgi/img-thing?.out=jpg&size=l&tid=4933395

http://cdn.c.photoshelter.com/img-get/I0000wrIrlCcB9Oc/s/600/480/SFE-911001-001.jpg

http://assets.vice.com/content-images/contentimage/no-slug/d61d10fe62bc87884c244082e0e2e45c.jpg

i mean there's a lot more that a google search turns up, its just either on stormfront or it genuinely makes me want to vomit

like, i didn't know that the confederate flag was considered racist when i was a kid watching dukes of hazzard but...

http://i.imgur.com/fFQY8uy.png

http://i.imgur.com/fSZcudM.png

http://i.imgur.com/5jK8deV.png

https://mikescollection.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/mrpphotos211794-gl393094_geri-halliwell_union_jack_dress.jpg

like, i didn't know that the confederate flag was considered racist when i was a kid watching dukes of hazzard but...

not analogous

unless the Union Jack has explicitly been the symbol of a government that fought a war over the right to maintain a racial group as slaves. the Confederate Flag literally has no other meaning. It is the symbol of that gov't.

http://i1.mirror.co.uk/incoming/article1132959.ece/alternates/s615/Great%20Britain%27s%20Jessica%20Ennis%20holding%20the%20Union%20Jack%20Flag%20after%20the%20heptathlon%20800%20metres%20during%20Day%20Four%20of%20the%20IAAF%20World%20Athletics%20Championships

feel free to enlighten me on the history of the Union Jack tho

lots of flag posts itt

i did not know it was a symbol etc etc when i was watching a car draped in it on dukes of hazzard, you had no idea union jack had been appropriated by racist skinheads in 70s and 80s uk, potato potahto lets call the whole thing off

first hit when googling racist appropriation of union jack AND national front appropriation of union jack: http://www.morrissey-solo.com/threads/28727-Morrissey-s-use-of-the-Union-Jack-WAS-insensitive-and-racist

the statement "the Union Jack is considered a racist symbol" is somewhat reductive but it has a long history of prominent display by British far right groups, as per the photos above. my (limited and poss incorrect) impression of American white supremacist or w/e groups is that they don't use the American flag in quite the same way

http://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2012/08/the-tragic-decline-of-the-union-jack/261071/

(several xposts)